Jinjer 58: Going for the DMIN

[CarrotCake]

To me it comes across as not only distancing themselves from IBLP for the upcoming documentary but also anticipating that the documentary will bring interest in the cult and therefore more sales for this book.

Sneaky.

[SassyPants]

5 hours ago, treehugger said:

The only thing a fundamentalist hates more than the ungodly heathens is a fundamentalist of a different denomination.  It’s why their wet dream of a Christian Nation would never work (definitely not the only reason).  

Christian on Christian hate is the absolute worst!

[noseybutt]

18 minutes ago, CarrotCake said:

To me it comes across as not only distancing themselves from IBLP for the upcoming documentary but also anticipating that the documentary will bring interest in the cult and therefore more sales for this book.

Sneaky.

Agreeing.

This is a theological take down. 

Back when I was attending homeschool groups in my corner of the world, there was precious little difference on the impact Piper/MacArthur v. IBLP had long-term on the kids. The former tended to be better educated and have more money but that tended to even out when kids graduated because the Calvinist crowd only paid for higher education at specific universities. Meaning the unbelieving offspring were no different than the IBLP kids when it came to launching to adulthood.

I wish Jinger well and hope she is living her best life. But it’s hard not roll my eyes at this particular move because it drips of holier-than-thou, image saving, profit making schilling. Wonder where she could have learned that…

Edited October 21, 2022 by noseybutt

[SassyPants]

Once Jerm entered the picture, and maybe for a time before, Jinger must have despised living at TTH and in Tontitown. I she likely believes that she’s hit the jackpot. 

[neuroticcat]

13 hours ago, treehugger said:

This is just my feelings, but the Calanists groups always strike me more as the Vision Forum type, more than Bill Gothard type.  Pretty packaging, usually better educated, rules for thee but not for me, and completely obsessed with power (both publicly and politically, as well as within their close circles).  Pseudo-intellectual men love it because it feeds their ego and they get all the things they wanted anyways, pretty and submissive wife, alcohol, prestige, very few rules for them, and way too much influence in the political sphere.  It’s a heady brew men are offered in those circles, and of all the Christian extremist men out there, I, as a female, find them the most terrifying.  
There are no checks or balances to the power the men have, and they tend to be wealthier (or at least give that appearance), which adds a whole different power dimension. And while initially I can have decent conversation with them, if I disagree with something, they will get condescending and make me feel stupid because in the end, it was a power game they like to play with women.  There is a streak of ruthless that is legitimately frightening.  
Again, caveat, not all Calvinist men, but I literally grew up around Calvinist Reformed men, and this is my experience with most of them. 

Exactly this. I remember once getting into a discussion about horrible patriarchical family life teachings with a theobro - I had kind of lumped Gothard, Voddie, VF and Doug Wilson in together and he was like: Impossible! Gothard is in the Arminianism camp. I mean, they all have garbage teaching, but, yeah, I think the hard-core Calvinists are the worse b/c their souls are so hardened. 

8 hours ago, treehugger said:

The only thing a fundamentalist hates more than the ungodly heathens is a fundamentalist of a different denomination.  It’s why their wet dream of a Christian Nation would never work (definitely not the only reason).  

So much this. If they were to achieve their dream, I fully believe it would result in a bloodbath. They'd be allies and then turn on each other in some kind of fundamentalist-game-of-thrones mashup.

[noseybutt]

17 hours ago, neuroticcat said:

Exactly this. I remember once getting into a discussion about horrible patriarchical family life teachings with a theobro - I had kind of lumped Gothard, Voddie, VF and Doug Wilson in together and he was like: Impossible! Gothard is in the Arminianism camp. I mean, they all have garbage teaching, but, yeah, I think the hard-core Calvinists are the worse b/c their souls are so hardened. 

So much this. If they were to achieve their dream, I fully believe it would result in a bloodbath. They'd be allies and then turn on each other in some kind of fundamentalist-game-of-thrones mashup.

It’s kind of amusing. The same sexism , racism, homophobia. But the line is drawn over free will. That, apparently, is the doctrine that enslaves.

[OyToTheVey]

On 10/19/2022 at 11:37 AM, HarryPotterFan said:

Jokes on them, the Jewish people have been the chosen people for thousands of years! Chosen for what, exactly? Most of us would probably say “suffering.” But others of us would disagree

At least we suffer over a meal with friends and family. There's always food involved. We suffer then we eat. Tis the way of our people lol

[patsymae]

On 10/21/2022 at 7:50 PM, neuroticcat said:

Exactly this. I remember once getting into a discussion about horrible patriarchical family life teachings with a theobro - I had kind of lumped Gothard, Voddie, VF and Doug Wilson in together and he was like: Impossible! Gothard is in the Arminianism camp. I mean, they all have garbage teaching, but, yeah, I think the hard-core Calvinists are the worse b/c their souls are so hardened. 

So much this. If they were to achieve their dream, I fully believe it would result in a bloodbath. They'd be allies and then turn on each other in some kind of fundamentalist-game-of-thrones mashup.

The right-wing Catholic clergy are going to learn this. They've thrown in their lot with the evangelicals for various nefarious reasons, and seemingly have no clue that when Christian Nationalism becomes the law of the land, they are unlikely, to put in mildly, to have a seat at the table.

[noseybutt]

20 minutes ago, patsymae said:

The right-wing Catholic clergy are going to learn this. They've thrown in their lot with the evangelicals for various nefarious reasons, and seemingly have no clue that when Christian Nationalism becomes the law of the land, they are unlikely, to put in mildly, to have a seat at the table.

I’m not so sure about this. A decade ago I would have agreed. But look at how SCOTUS has gone. No conservative Evangelicals to be found and latest conservative justices either Catholic (Kavanaugh, Barrett) or mainstream Protestant (Gorsuch).  I think conservative evangelicals have an education problem that currently limits them and forces them to cooperate with other political conservatives. It’s an alliance of necessity, not because they like the Catholics (and Mormons).

[Father Son Holy Goat]

1 hour ago, noseybutt said:

I’m not so sure about this. A decade ago I would have agreed. But look at how SCOTUS has gone. No conservative Evangelicals to be found and latest conservative justices either Catholic (Kavanaugh, Barrett) or mainstream Protestant (Gorsuch).  I think conservative evangelicals have an education problem that currently limits them and forces them to cooperate with other political conservatives. It’s an alliance of necessity, not because they like the Catholics (and Mormons).

You mean school of the dinning room table is actually holding the movement back?

Spoiler

 

[noseybutt]

11 minutes ago, Father Son Holy Goat said:

You mean school of the dinning room table is actually holding the movement back?

  Reveal hidden contents

 

On a more serious note, it’s not just SOTDRT. It’s across the board. Majority of politically conservative Evangelicals have nothing to do with homeschooling and yet….

[Cults-r-us]

On 10/21/2022 at 3:55 PM, SassyPants said:

Christian on Christian hate is the absolute worst!

Too bad there isn't a way to turn these people on each other big time, so maybe they'd leave everybody else alone! 

[SassyPants]

11 hours ago, Cults-r-us said:

Too bad there isn't a way to turn these people on each other big time, so maybe they'd leave everybody else alone! 

This is the same thing I think about the people who love assault weapons and want everyone armed at all times. God I wish when these folks act out that they would only take out like minded people and leave the rest of us alone and unaffected.

[ven]

Haha all the theology talk makes me think back to my former collegues/work setting We had great lunches where the jehova's witness , the very sunni Muslim and the Catholic would end up into a debate... they never dared touching religion perse as a conversation topic because , nobody would win that. But the jehova's witness just couldn't hold back at inviting us , to one of the conventions 2x a year. And everyone thought , now it  is  game on during lunch! 

[SassyPants]

2 minutes ago, ven said:

Haha all the theology talk makes me think back to my former collegues/work setting We had great lunches where the jehova's witness , the very sunni Muslim and the Catholic would end up into a debate... they never dared touching religion perse as a conversation topic because , nobody would win that. But the jehova's witness just couldn't hold back at inviting us , to one of the conventions 2x a year. And everyone thought , now it  is  game on during lunch! 

Reminds me of this guy from the UU Fellowship I attend. He married this Catholic woman and she converted to JV. One day he told me that he had known she was going to become a “witness” that’s what he always calls them, he’d have never married her. OUCH

[noseybutt]

On 10/27/2022 at 6:00 PM, SassyPants said:

Reminds me of this guy from the UU Fellowship I attend. He married this Catholic woman and she converted to JV. One day he told me that he had known she was going to become a “witness” that’s what he always calls them, he’d have never married her. OUCH

It’s a time suck. JW requires a lot of time.

[JermajestyDuggar]

37 minutes ago, noseybutt said:

It’s a time suck. JW requires a lot of time.

I remember and ex JW saying there was some sort of meeting 6 evenings a week. Some JWs just knocked on the door. I was pooping so I didn’t hear them and my husband was cooking. It was very obvious we were home but no one heard the door so we didn’t answer. I only saw them leaving and going to the next house when I realized they must’ve knocked. This was the first time since the pandemic. I liked the absence of religious people knocking at the door.

[GuineaPigCourtship]

I have curtains on every window in my house after a group of JW's came and saw me naked doing laundry (I had just stripped off my pjs and thrown them in).  They left literature but have not been back.

[neuroticcat]

The JWs used to come to my house. I would always talk theology with them b/c I felt so bad that so many elderly people were drawn into it. I used to just try and point out that they essentially were saying everyone in all of church history since the apostles had gotten it all wrong until their brand of Christianity, and they were like: pretty much.

The last time they came I had just gotten out of the shower and one of my kids answered the door. So I ran to it wrapped in my robe like: hi, please go away. But they still tried to talk. So I didn't talk theology at that time but said something more blunt like: I'm sorry, but I am already a Christian and believe you are in a cult. They did not like that.

I went to close the door and right as I was doing that this old lady poked her head in to say: but none of that will matter when you go to hell. It was wild.

I think some JWs tried to call during COVIDtide. I saw the Mormons out a few weeks ago, so they are back at it. 

I would invite them in, too, but the young men would never come in unless my husband was at home - haha. I just felt bad for them. Like, what are their momma's thinking sending them off to cult-evangelize at 19? I asked one of them about it once and I think he said they got to call home at Christmas Day and on Mother's Day. 

[Coconut Flan]

I now either grab a rosary or holy water and ask if I may pray for their immortal soul or bless them.  They run and stay away for at least ten years.  That's if I can be bothered to go to the door.  

[Mrs Ms]

The first time I ever encountered JW was shortly after I moved back to New Zealand. I was SO excited as I had been fascinated with cults since I was a teen. It was my day off and even though they woke me, I asked them to wait, dressed, made myself a coffee (😄), grabbed my cigarettes (😂) and sat down with them outside. After probably an hour they still hadn’t even begun to answer all my questions well enough, so I asked them for literature. They happily left me their pamphlets and left. (Hopefully I saved all the neighbours from being harassed that day!)

I knew there was no way I actually wanted to join and didn’t know what to do to keep them from trying to come visit weekly. So any time they did manage to catch me at home, I told them I had to catch the bus in a few minutes and to please leave me more to read. Then I thought I would be a genius and say I wanted to read it in German because my English reading comprehension wasn’t as good yet and I just wasn’t finding the information I was looking for. Living in rural NZ, that should flummox them… They had a German person in the congregation and now SHE tried to visit! I told her to please leave me more German reading material and that I was busy. The visits stopped and after a few months even the reading material did too! 

Believe it or not, I actually read everything they left with me and am still sad to this day that they think that it is deep, interesting, convincing, truthful and inspiring. Not sure if my plea for more reading material would still work in these internet times. 

[neuroticcat]

I know that all cults are exploitative, but the JWs bother me so much b/c I think they really prey on the lonely or housebound. It's so cruel.

[noseybutt]

3 hours ago, neuroticcat said:

I know that all cults are exploitative, but the JWs bother me so much b/c I think they really prey on the lonely or housebound. It's so cruel.

From what I have seen, they don’t do a good job caring for their own. Almost all resources are pumped into recruiting more people. Mormons recruit heavily too but they seem to put at least some of their resources (social services and the like) towards caring for their own.

 

[Nashville92]

Jinger's announcement for today was she's getting her own blend of coffee

[FiveAcres]

6 minutes ago, Nashville92 said:

Jinger's announcement for today was she's getting her own blend of coffee

Earth shattering!