Trace Bates 2: Dating A Poor Persecuted Refugee with A Purpose?

[JermajestyDuggar]

Callie was also born after the biggest gap Kelly ever had. So she’s not close in age to Ellie and Addie. She’s closer in age to the little boys. But gender roles probably keep them from being BFFs. 

[CarrotCake]

I think seems more of a thing because she is the last girl.

I am not sure when Addee and Ellie started to be included in weddings and visits, it might just be that they are from a certain age and when Callie turns 14 she can visit sisters by herself. And she will probably be in the weddings from Isaiah down as well.

 

[CanadianMamam]

I think her age/gender do factor but she doesn't get included with Ellie and Addee or with Jeb/Judson (who often get lumped in with the grandkids), so it seems like a huge omission. 

[SassyPants]

It has to be doubly bad for Callie to be from a huge family and ginormous extended family yet to be isolated from having close relationships within. 

[CanadianMamam]

6 hours ago, SassyPants said:

It has to be doubly bad for Callie to be from a huge family and ginormous extended family yet to be isolated from having close relationships within. 

Yep, even the oldest niece that lives close (since Allie is in Florida) is 7 years younger. Jeb and Judson not only have each other, but they have Bradley and Carson (Bradley is only 2 years younger than Jeb). 

[Shouldabeenacowboy]

On 8/24/2022 at 7:33 AM, freethemall said:

I'm confused about the thread title - Lydia's family were immigrants, not refugees, right? There generally haven't been refugees from Germany in over 30 years. Asking this as someone who works in the refugee non-profit world if someone else who understands the difference could answer.

I don't know the legalese/what they were actually classified as, but in the media, they claimed to be refugees because they were being persecuted by the German government for refusing to send their kids to school and wanting to homeschool them, which I understood was not allowed in Germany. 

They are clearly nutcases. Of course the equally nutcase fundies here in the US supported these kinds of "refugees".

🤮

[irish_dancing_canadian]

Also the family could've moved to Austria instead, since Austria allows homeschooling. Would've been way easier with the language and the fact that they don't need visas to live there. 

[noseybutt]

Yes, there were several good options that the family had within the EU. However, they were close to Michael Farris and other HSLDA attorneys at a time when HSLDA was expanding into a global outfit. The Romeikes were the perfect poster family---the right kind of Christians, photogenic, and willing to immigrate. 

@freethemall-- The confusion is real because generally refugee/asylum status is conferred by membership in a class based on nationality, race/ethnicity, politics, religion, and social group.

The usual "social groups" that are grounds for persecution are typically gender, sexual orientation, tribes, family members of dissidents, etc. HSLDA was attempting to make "homeschooling families" a social group within asylum law.

That's why the family application ultimately failed. The government decided not to make homeschooling families a protected class. But, they did offer a loophole for this particular family. They were allowed to stay but their case could not be used as case law for future asylum seekers.

I have lots of thoughts about this, none charitable. To see what typical (black and brown) asylum seeking families to the US were going through at that time and compare the experiences was a breathtaking exercise in privilege, hubris, and racism.

I have a friend whose husband is German and they homeschooled for a time in Germany and she was extremely frustrated at how HSLDA meddled at the local level there. No homeschooling community is 100% in agreement as to how to handle legal issues, and she felt like there were loopholes and quiet ways to homeschool with tacit agreement of local education authorities. As soon as it became a more in-your-face issue, though, then it became harder for all. (For example, Germany long allowed homeschooling for kids with certain kinds of special needs.)

HSLDA is a nasty outfit and their mere presence in many European countries raises hackles because they lobby against the UN convention on the rights of the child and so much more.

 

[noseybutt]

Correction. The social group HSLDA was trying to create was "Christian homeschooling families." It was very narrow and specific.

Edited September 2, 2022 by noseybutt

[freethemall]

On 9/2/2022 at 9:49 AM, Shouldabeenacowboy said:

I don't know the legalese/what they were actually classified as, but in the media, they claimed to be refugees because they were being persecuted by the German government for refusing to send their kids to school and wanting to homeschool them, which I understood was not allowed in Germany. 

They are clearly nutcases. Of course the equally nutcase fundies here in the US supported these kinds of "refugees".

🤮

The accurate term would be asylum-seekers. Refugees is incorrectly used as a catchall term implying displaced migrants,  but is only correct if they were pre-approved before coming to the US for permanent resettlement by the federal government,  which did not happen. 

[zygote373]

I am still so curious what their plan is long term. The US could revoke her deferred status and choose to deport her at any time. Getting married to Trace won't automatically get her a spousal visa. My understanding is that you become ineligible for a lawful visa if you've overstayed previous visas or otherwise have cause for deportation. Does she have a path to permanent residence through DACA that may make her eligible for a spousal visa one day? Are they just hoping she'll never actually be deported since she's white? Are they planning to relocate to another country if she is?

Edited September 6, 2022 by zygote373
added a thought

[noseybutt]

1 hour ago, zygote373 said:

I am still so curious what their plan is long term. The US could revoke her deferred status and choose to deport her at any time. Getting married to Trace won't automatically get her a spousal visa. My understanding is that you become ineligible for a lawful visa if you've overstayed previous visas or otherwise have cause for deportation. Does she have a path to permanent residence through DACA that may make her eligible for a spousal visa one day? Are they just hoping she'll never actually be deported since she's white? Are they planning to relocate to another country if she is?

My understanding is that the family was granted the right to live and work in the US. There was no path to citizenship. As individuals they cannot vote, will be subject to deportation if convicted of certain crimes, and may not qualify for certain forms of loans and grants. 

So, yes. She will have to go through the spousal visa process just like anyone else and it will be time consuming and cost money. She likely will have to return to Germany at some point to file paperwork with the consulate there and be re-admitted. (This likely will not be a problem for her but can but a huge issue for people who come from a country that is barred entry or have a health condition such as HIV+ which can be grounds for refusal.)

DACA grants right to remain in the US and to work but is also not a path towards citizenship. I highly doubt she has applied for DACA because it would not offer her any more than what she has already.

Odds of any of them being deport are very low provided they don't get convicted of anything.

 

[front hugs > duggs]

2 hours ago, noseybutt said:

She likely will have to return to Germany at some point to file paperwork with the consulate there and be re-admitted.

From my experience I’m not sure this is true. As long as you’re legally allowed in the country you should be able to apply for the green card without having to leave the country. It is expensive though! And she’ll need to get a number of vaccinations if she doesn’t already have them. 

[noseybutt]

15 hours ago, front hugs > duggs said:

From my experience I’m not sure this is true. As long as you’re legally allowed in the country you should be able to apply for the green card without having to leave the country. It is expensive though! And she’ll need to get a number of vaccinations if she doesn’t already have them. 

That makes sense. Most of my experience is with people undocumented (and the occasional stateless person).

[SassyPants]

20 hours ago, zygote373 said:

I am still so curious what their plan is long term. The US could revoke her deferred status and choose to deport her at any time. Getting married to Trace won't automatically get her a spousal visa. My understanding is that you become ineligible for a lawful visa if you've overstayed previous visas or otherwise have cause for deportation. Does she have a path to permanent residence through DACA that may make her eligible for a spousal visa one day? Are they just hoping she'll never actually be deported since she's white? Are they planning to relocate to another country if she is?

My nephew married a woman who had entered the US legally for work, but overstayed her Visa. My BIL spent a great deal of time and money to remedy the issue. My niece now has a green card. IIRC, she was unable to leave the US during the process which took 2years.

[JDuggs]

Feeling kind of bad for Lydia and Trace. It’s supposed to be a wet dreary weekend in East Tennessee. High of 62 degrees F on Saturday, the predicted after effects of Hurricane Ian.

[HereticHick]

On 9/28/2022 at 3:18 PM, JDuggs said:

Feeling kind of bad for Lydia and Trace. It’s supposed to be a wet dreary weekend in East Tennessee. High of 62 degrees F on Saturday, the predicted after effects of Hurricane Ian.

Yup, I have a distant family member also getting married in East Tennessee tomorrow--and it was supposed to be outdoors. : (

[JDuggs]

The weather forecast  is looking a little better for Knoxville on Saturday: cloudy in the afternoon/evening but still chilly, low 60s. As long as it’s not wet, it should be fine.

[Keys]

It was cloudy on our wedding day, and our photographer actually said that overcast weather makes for better pictures/lighting compared to sunny weather  

[Tdoc72]

Probably didn’t fit Kelly & Gil’s modesty rules, but I really liked Lydia’s rehearsal dinner dress. The shoulder pearl things were cool. 

[JanasTattooParlor]

7 hours ago, Tdoc72 said:

Probably didn’t fit Kelly & Gil’s modesty rules, but I really liked Lydia’s rehearsal dinner dress. The shoulder pearl things were cool. 

It looked so nice I thought she was wearing a wedding dress on first look. I always find it interesting when the men and women look so mismatched in what they’re wearing. She’s wearing a gown and Trace is wearing a fleece vest in some pics, a brown leather jacket in others and jeans. 

[Smoochie]

Trace & Lydia are married with an exclusive story in People with details, no pictures yet, here's the link!

 

ETA: I've checked Insta, no pic slips yet, at least by the family. May be some other culprits, but, I don't know all the players.

Edited October 2, 2022 by Smoochie

[Tdoc72]

26 minutes ago, Smoochie said:

Trace & Lydia are married with an exclusive story in People with details, no pictures yet, here's the link!

 

ETA: I've checked Insta, no pic slips yet, at least by the family. May be some other culprits, but, I don't know all the players.

Not sure why People would go to press/internet without pics. That seems dumb. 

[AussieKrissy]

28 minutes ago, Smoochie said:

Trace & Lydia are married with an exclusive story in People with details, no pictures yet, here's the link!

 

ETA: I've checked Insta, no pic slips yet, at least by the family. May be some other culprits, but, I don't know all the players.

Yeah who was it that slipped Lawson’s with the couple in the background. I remember posting it but I can’t remember who it was 

[Smoochie]

17 minutes ago, AussieKrissy said:

Yeah who was it that slipped Lawson’s with the couple in the background. I remember posting it but I can’t remember who it was 

Don't remember either and I'd look over at Reddit, but it's too much work LOL. I'm good with most technology, but, dang that site is clunky!