Fore!!! Jinger courts the Jock

[louisa05]

On 7/3/2016 at 10:37 AM, Analytica49 said:

I'm wasting waaay too much time thinking about Jinger's situation. So here's another thing that bothers me.

First, some background: I was raised as a devout Christian, but am now a non-believer. From this perspective, I think about JV being a pastor and I just wonder what exactly qualifies him to play that role.

Maybe I missed something, but nothing I've read so far indicates that he has had formal training and education to be a religious leader. I certainly don't think his athletic experience, or his non-theological college education, qualify him.

So, if I were, for example, a middle-aged man, or an elderly woman, in his congregation, why would I trust him as a religious leader? What exactly does HE have to teach someone with twenty, thirty, or forty years' more life experience than he has? What makes him a religious expert? Why would anyone consider him to be especially godly?

And then that makes me wonder: What kind of towering conceit would a person have to have, to set himself up as a religious authority with so little background preparation?

 

A lot of evangelical and fundamentalist churches do not require training or seminary for pastors. In my time working in Christian school, this was a debate because those boys who wanted to pursue ministry were torn about how to do it. Some of the many denominations represented had seminaries or required bible college ministry degrees. Some totally eschewed education for pastors believing that seminaries destroyed faith and young men (only men, of course) needed only to be called by/filled with the spirit. Some of our boys who wanted to pursue ministry did not feel ties to any denomination but wanted to be pastors (hard to fathom, but common in that environment) so they did not know how to proceed after high school. 

One Assembly of God church connected to the school had a Master's Commission program (google that for a can of cultic worms) where kids just out of high school go commit themselves to living under control of the church, taking non-credit bible coursework and being unpaid ministry interns. Many of those kids would then be AoG clergy by age 19 or 20. A "stealth ministry" group from that church/organization came to the Catholic school I was teaching at later to present an assembly (no one would believe me about their agenda as Catholics can't fathom that level of manipulation in evangelization) and one of the young men in it told the kids that when he finished his "internship" with the unnamed group, he wanted to be a pastor. The older cradle Catholic school secretary sitting next to me responded (to me) "oh, how wonderful! He's going to study at seminary" as she applauded. I didn't try to explain to her that, no, he was just going to immediately be a pastor as long as some church hired him. 

[princessmahina]

I'm another one who is a little pissed about Cursed Child. I think a better way to do it would have been to have the opening night of the play the same day the script was released. It feels unfair that she asked all the play goers to keep the plot to themselves. I can't afford a trip to London, with hotel, meals, and play tickets. Why should I have to wait an extra month to enjoy the piece? 

And the plot... I read all the spoilers and I'm glad I did. I still have a copy reserved though. 

[xlurker]

Getting back to suicide/hell thing. I have been doing family research, and have found a direct relative committed suicide in the 1920's.  At that time you could not have a Catholic burial, or be placed in a church yard. Spent about 6 months looking for this person, or any notices regarding this person. Nothing.  Like they never existed. This makes me very sad :'(

 

[MatthewDuggar]

A new pic of the Jock from Pickles:

[eveandadam]

56 minutes ago, MatthewDuggar said:

A new pic of the Jock from Pickles:

Oh, come on! I mean: COME ON!

 

Well, at least Jinger and him have the same taste in jewellery :-)

[bingbangboom]

That fella is going to give TFDW a run for his money. 

[eveandadam]

As someone on on pickles said: I think this picture will end the courtship between those two. That is too much, even for JB.

[OrchidBlossom]

1 hour ago, eveandadam said:

As someone on on pickles said: I think this picture will end the courtship between those two. That is too much, even for JB.

Probably depends on when the photo was taken. Jesus forgives all... if you happen to be born a man.

[marmalade]

It came from the Instagram account of a teammate on the NY Red Bulls. The pic is 4 years old, which coincides with Jeremy's time on the team. I imagine it was rookie hazing, but whatever the circumstances, it's going viral now! 

And the whole internet has seen Jeremy topless before Jinger! 

[Buzzard]

I guess TLC didnt manage to scrub the whole internet!

[marmalade]

They'd have to go to every single teammate Jeremy ever had to get even close to scrubbing stuff like this. It's typical locker room stuff, especially when you're a rookie, and the vets make you do silly things. 

[twinmama]

I'm so torn between feeling bad for this guy who did something SUPER innocuous as a young adult and having it shoved back in his face as something to be ashamed of and LOVING the Duggars having to confront the reality that not everyone has lived their perfect innocent incident free lifestyle (which of course we know was full of non-innocent incidents we just never heard about and they like to minimize).

[EmCatlyn]

3 hours ago, MatthewDuggar said:

A new pic of the Jock from Pickles:

Four years ago, huh?  He was probably more fun back then.

 

[marmalade]

I posted deets about the when above. It was two years after The Drunk Tank. He claimed to have been in Fellowship of Christian Athletes in college, but we had that in my high school, and many of the kids were bigtime partiers. Who knows if Jeremy slowed down after that incident, or if he did, for how long?

He doesn't seem to have gone full-on fundie until he "retired" from the team in San Antonio a couple of years ago, but even then, he attempted a comeback before the team folded last year. How many fundie athletes are out there? Christians, sure, but Tebows, not really, unless you win the Heisman or are otherwise a sooper speshul snowflake like a potential Olympic gold medalist. And even then, I haven't heard of a lot of fundies. The uniforms alone would be verboten. 

It's hard to say when his actual conversion really happened. 

That said, a middle of the road Christian wouldn't have a problem with this kind of hazing in a locker room. A fundie would. So I would say that as of 2012, he may have been born again, but not totally off the rails. 

[Buzzard]

I kind of hope it was mardi gras or some other ebil katholiq holiday

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

I'm dying, I hope this guy still has some of this crazy fun loving in him.  You are supposed to do stupid shit when you are young and single. I would hope they would wait to have kids so Jinger can have some fun too, away from her crazy family. 

[sophie10130]

Oh man. That's not hazing. That's just being goofy! At least, that was what I thought when I saw it.

I went to fundie lite youth group from high school into college and there are TONS of dudes with pics like this. Just being goofy and silly. None of us were partiers. And sometimes it was even AT youth group that these pics were taken. We made up games and sometimes you get hyper and slap happy and a pop song comes on that's everyone's guilty pleasure and it would just get whacky.

Hell, they would even go skinny dipping. All boys, of course. Even the most horrible of all the fundie-lite dudes I knew who didn't kiss a girl until he got married at 26 (and called girls whores who kissed before they got married, for real) would go skinny dipping and put on skirts and do hula dances and shit. 

[marmalade]

This came from a soccer teammate, and Jeremy was a rookie. I know that hazing can get MUCH worse (in drag carrying veterans' luggage, dance routines in tutus that make Derick's stuff in Danger America look like Alvin Ailey), but I don't think religion has anything to do with this based on the Insta post. It was hazing "accepting [Jeremy] for who he is" was  part of it. 

Hazing has come a long way: this was put out on social media for the world to see. Far worse than taping it for your family to see how silly you were before kids. 

[Lillymuffin]

My first thought was that he was dressed as a Roman or some kind of slave for an Easter play or a random musical, possibly Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat. (I actually did that show in a relative's church as a kid.) Awful, I know, but I've seen a lot of truly awful fundie-lite "theatre." Accuracy in costuming is not high on their list of priorities. I have pics of my uncle as Pilate that would curl your hair. 

Is it wrong that I think he's kinda hot with his shirt off? I'll show myself to the prayer closet. 

[MatthewDuggar]

Seems like some pretty tame hazing to me, unless there was more to it.

I think it's hilarious and hope more of this sort of thing surface!

[Cleopatra7]

40 minutes ago, sophie10130 said:

Oh man. That's not hazing. That's just being goofy! At least, that was what I thought when I saw it.

I went to fundie lite youth group from high school into college and there are TONS of dudes with pics like this. Just being goofy and silly. None of us were partiers. And sometimes it was even AT youth group that these pics were taken. We made up games and sometimes you get hyper and slap happy and a pop song comes on that's everyone's guilty pleasure and it would just get whacky.

Hell, they would even go skinny dipping. All boys, of course. Even the most horrible of all the fundie-lite dudes I knew who didn't kiss a girl until he got married at 26 (and called girls whores who kissed before they got married, for real) would go skinny dipping and put on skirts and do hula dances and shit. 

The problem is that there's no room for being silly or goofy in Gothardism; it's being a pill for Jesus 24/7. 

[sophie10130]

28 minutes ago, Cleopatra7 said:

The problem is that there's no room for being silly or goofy in Gothardism; it's being a pill for Jesus 24/7. 

So true. But was he into Gothardism before got in with the Duggars?

I am interested to see if/how this plays out. It seems ridiculous that people are thinking this could end their courtship. Especially knowing about Josh's past. This seems so incredibly harmless to me, especially since he was a rowdy heathen to them back then and that he has admitted being with other girls and drinking.

[Cleopatra7]

4 minutes ago, sophie10130 said:

So true. But was he into Gothardism before got in with the Duggars?

I am interested to see if/how this plays out. It seems ridiculous that people are thinking this could end their courtship. Especially knowing about Josh's past. This seems so incredibly harmless to me, especially since he was a rowdy heathen to them back then and that he has admitted being with other girls and drinking.

I would think that all prospective Duggar spouses would have to be at least Gothard-curious and appear at Big Sandy and all the other Gothard events. Although Gothardism seems quite different theologically than the Calvinism Jessa claims be to following now, I would think that Ben would have to accept certain aspects of Gothardism to even be allowed to get his foot in the door.

[SportsgalAnnie]

56 minutes ago, MatthewDuggar said:

Seems like some pretty tame hazing to me, unless there was more to it.

I think it's hilarious and hope more of this sort of thing surface!

yeah, Just look at MLB Rookie Hazing, google pics. You'll laugh your booty off 

[lascuba]

1 hour ago, sophie10130 said:

So true. But was he into Gothardism before got in with the Duggars?

I am interested to see if/how this plays out. It seems ridiculous that people are thinking this could end their courtship. Especially knowing about Josh's past. This seems so incredibly harmless to me, especially since he was a rowdy heathen to them back then and that he has admitted being with other girls and drinking.

I don't think this would end their courtship at all...the Duggars live for the "saved by Jesus" trope and they love pretending they are totally accepting of people different than them. Plus, there's no bigger zealot than the reformed sinner, so Jeremy is perfect for them. However, they are so tone deaf to the nuances of people's criticisms of them that I soon expect a very formal statement from JB and Michelle about this "scandalous" picture and how it doesn't at all reflect his character now that he's committed himself to Jesus.