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  1. Trigger warning for abuse of women and girls. This has been a horrible week. I've seen a number of fundie blogs and videos that address when women should be married, and what her status is in that marriage. I think some of these may have already been discussed, but I wanted to draw them together. I've seen some commentary videos about them on YouTube (Mr Atheist, and Suris the Sceptic who addressed these) as well. The first one was the Transformed Wife's video (posted on her blog 10 June 2019) on whether rape in marriage is a thing. She laughs, and says of course it isn't. She goes on a long and wobbly defence of something that is clearly rape, and the whole message is that women are literally just vessels for men to use as they like. The second was a video by Steven Anderson on consent and rape in marriage. I can't remember when it was posted (I think it was fairly recently but refuse to hunt amongst the sewage for it again). As far as he is concerned, saying 'I do' is consent for the rest of your life as far as a married woman is concerned. I've never felt sorry for Zoo until I saw this. Regardless of the terrible things she does and believes, she has almost certainly been a victim of assault in her marriage. I also feel so terribly sorry for the Anderson daughters, and what they are being brought up to expect from their eventual husbands. He thinks women are essentially vessels for men to use as they like. The final straw was a recent blog post from Biblical Gender Roles (on the BGR blog site posted 4 June 2019). This one really concerns me. This blogger posted a terrible piece about the benefits of marrying off girls as soon as they begin to menstruate. I get the feeling that TTW and PP would want what BGR wants as it feeds naturally into their world view of women in marriage. To me it appears to be a promotion of grooming and sexually assaulting minors. BGR wants to make it so that girls are essentially vessels for men to use as they like, and to be gotten hold of young enough to accept it. Surely this kind of writing is illegal? I know I tend to think of these fundies in isolation, and forget that they actually form part of a bigger pattern of abuse and misogyny. Reading these three together reinforces the idea that they don't exist in isolation, and someone who reads one blogger might well listen to another as well. It's horrifying.
  2. Once_Upon_A_Fundie

    My Marriage Fuck-Up

    I've shared a little bit on this site about my history in a semi-fundamental Pentecostal religion, but I've yet to really delve into the whole story to anyone outside of my therapist. Lately it's felt like my past has been haunting me -- nightmares, anxiety, the whole nine. I am writing this out in the hopes it will help me re-center and find peace again. I grew up in the PNW in the Church of God of Cleveland, TN, a church that exploded as part of the 1960's-70's Holiness Movement. Among the rules/belief systems were things such as "no mixed swimming" (women's bodies are shameful, sinful things that tempt boys into accidentally sinning), no makeup, no jewelry, no pants, footwashing (particularly women washing men's feet as a sacrificial submission), women make babies and stay home, you speak in tongues, and salvation can be lost. The result of this highly conservative sect of Evangelicalism is paranoia. I constantly felt like I was going to accidentally "lose" my salvation and go to hell, and I lived in such anxiety I developed agoraphobia and was unable to leave my house unassisted for several years. I had some anomalies in my family that contributed to a slow burn removal of me from the church--namely the shock of my parents divorcing following my mom's affair with the pastor. In the years after the divorce, I remained in the church as both parents elected to continue attending at different locations. Despite their teen marriage failing, I was still pushed to marry at 17 (boyfriend was 20), because they "refused to pay to send me to college to fornicate." Boyfriend was a guy I'd met online from across the country. He moved to WA State from Ohio, lived in the mother-in-law suite at my mother and stepfather's house, worked for my stepfather, and was groomed into our religion. Some aspects of this remind me of Zsu and PP's control over Solomon and the Saer situation. We loved each other but felt very young and unprepared. We wanted to go to college together and have fun for a couple of years before committing to marriage, but this simply was not allowed. For the sake of still being together (the ultimatum was get married or move on), we married. That marriage was full of high highs and low lows. We had two miscarriages, ran a business my step father helped us upstart (typical fundie line-crossing), built a home four doors down from my mother and step father, and essentially lived as extensions to the family home even into our 20's. It was to the point we couldn't go out to eat without permission, because my mom was extremely jealous and angry if we did things she had not approved or was not invited to. To break away from this, we eventually upset the family balance and moved cross-country to start anew, but I think the damage was done. The older we got the more we realized we were polar opposites. If you're familiar with the MBTI, I'm an INTJ and he's an ENFP. Although this is often considered a good pairing on paper, our extremes meant that we had a lot of contentious arguments. I was a stick-in-the-mud who was afraid/anxious, and he was a very flowery boho type. As we finally "grew up" in our later 20's because of the distance from family, we simply did not grow together. He would go through periods of "rejecting" the marriage, telling me we were over or he didn't want to be in a sexual/romantic relationship, we were only friends, etc. But he consistently refused a divorce, saying I was convenient. He essentially liked the controlling aspects of my fundie upbringing, saying he thought I was a "blank slate he could turn into whatever he wanted." Over the years, I suffered what I'd call light abuse -- some pushing, some shoving, some bruises, a lot of mental/emotional/psychological degrading (e.g. grabbing my belly and saying, "if you'd just get rid of this you'd be pretty...). It got to where I felt trapped and couldn't get out. I had an affair following one of his grand speeches about "we're done and married in name only because you cook and clean." I immediately told him about said affair, hoping he'd take the chance and finally sign divorce papers. Instead he held a gun to my head (literally), and I was forced to relent and crawl back into the hole of our marriage. More time passed, more things happened (namely the death of my dad), and I grew stronger as a person. I obtained an education, landed a good job, and eventually was accepted into a fully funded PhD program in England. I hopped across the pond, with him keeping his US job and "visiting" me so he could have what he thought was the best of both worlds -- his closely guarded "single" life on the road as a consultant, and a few weeks per quarter as the seemingly devoted husband visiting his wife in England. It was my out, and after I found out he was on Tinder and Bumble and meeting up with female co-workers on weekend stints, I told him not to come back to England and started dating. This final time was different, however. I think my ex realized I'd come into my own, so-to-speak, and the dynamics changed. By this point I was well into my PhD, working for the university, had accepted an adjunct position for another school in addition and essentially "lifing" on my own. He came back and moved into a flat in the city and got into a heavy drugs/drinking/gambling/party scene. Twice he tried to reconcile, and I almost left my then-boyfriend to....and twice he slept with other girls and came back saying, "never mind, they're better. " In the end, it was me who was weak, having felt jilted by being willing to go back to him, and him ultimately choosing a 20 year old recovering drug addict/casual prostitute over me. They were engaged within six weeks. I moved on and remarried a very kind, loving man who has brought immense peace to my life, but the last few weeks I've suddenly had massive anxiety over everything that went down over the last five years. I constantly blame myself for being a "bad" wife and think I could have done more. I idealize how he treated me me, I think of only the good things, feel profoundly bad about myself for him having chosen the skinny 20 year old over his weight-struggling mid-30's wife who couldn't give him kids. I feel sad realizing he's going to have kids with this young girl who could be his daughter and build a family and be all the things we weren't. I am SO ASHAMED of myself for this, because I love my new husband and realize I'm in a better place. I was in pretty intense therapy over the divorce (at its height as much as 3X's weekly), and I honestly thought I'd kicked it forever ago. But I think finding out they're gearing up for their wedding, and that asshole has chosen to migrate to England and will be living 20 minutes from me just has me pissed off. He wasn't even living here. He stayed in the US and partied away and sunk us into debt at the end of our marriage, but now he gets to just waltz into this European life with his child bride, and it just makes me hurt and hate all at once.
  3. https://www.hrw.org/news/2019/03/27/us-massachusetts-should-end-child-marriage-0
  4. Sacrilicious Twerk-a-Work

    Love Me

    I first saw 'Love Me' on Netflix back in 2014. It covers the topic of foreign marriage brokers and international dating, known more commonly as 'mail order brides'. I enjoyed this documentary as it did not portray the topic matter in a hokey or slanted manner. I like that there were perspectives offered from the American men and some of the Ukraine women involved. This opens many doors of "What is love?", how does American entitlement play into relationships, how do customs play into adult relationships? I know this used to be on Netflix, it is now on Amazon Prime Video and YouTube for viewing. SPOILER ALERT: interview with the director about the movie, including a comment on one of the men featured being kind of a creep. http://scenecreek.com/jonathan-narducci-talks-about-love-me/
  5. Looks like Daddy Mike's bullshit about his daughters not "yoking themselves to the government" has now gone out the window. According to her public IG account, Shoshanna & husband James have married legally:
  6. Continuing on from the previous thread Lists last updated 31 May 2018 Single Fundies In a Relationship Recently Married
  7. Continuing on from the previous threads: Lists last updated 17 October 2017 Single Fundies In a Relationship Newlyweds
  8. lawfulevil

    This Fucking Summer

    This fucking summer. This fucking year, really. So. My marriage, which limped along while I was super depressed because I just didn't care, is really rocky right now. I'm not sure he knows that it's total shit- I think he thinks everything is great. I mean, I finally stopped nagging him. I'm just really quiet all the time. I never ask him to do anything around the house anymore and just do it all myself. Because I'm fucking tired of having to tell a grown man, over and over and over again, that he needs to put effort into his own life outside of work. For the first time in a long time I'm thinking about the future and I'm just exhausted by the thought of however many more decades with him. I get one life and I'm not sure I want to spend it as someone's damn live-in help- there is no mystical property of a penis that prevents the owner of said genitals from cleaning the shower once in a fucking while, without being reminded six times, and without whining about it. It all came to a head when one of his friends (who, silly me, I thought was my friend too- hahaha, no) told him that he's avoiding me on purpose (we're next door neighbors, it was getting pretty weirdly obvious) because he's got some Mike Pence flavored asshole ideas about the world. Well, the dude didn't acknowledge his own Mike Penceness, just said that he won't be alone with his friends' wives*. Like, what the fuck, dude, I'm a PERSON. I'm a PERSON. I don't BELONG to my husband, and I don't just drop my fucking pants every time I'm alone in a room with someone! As a matter of fact, the vast majority of times I have ever been alone with another human being, I was wearing my pants the whole time. The whole time! *I'll note that this rule was clearly not in existence last year, before I lost 50 pounds. Believe it or not I swallowed my rage (it took some serious swallowing) and did not make him eat his own mailbox. See? Agency. Choices. Not ruled by my emotions/gonads/instincts. Almost like I'm people or something. Like, holy shit guys, I'm being treated like I'm an appliance with tits by basically all sides these days. This sucks and MANY things officially tasted better than thin feels.
  9. 0 kids n not countin

    Daddy Arndt on Marriage and God's Timing

    Couldn't pass up this gem on Dad's Diary: Those poor man-boys will be preparing until they reach their graves! Don't know if anyone else here reads the Dad's Diary, most posts consist of the following: Daddy talking about the weather and what scene they are filming for Vine Valley; Daddy mentioning which fastfood/chain restaurant any combination of him, Cathy, or the kids ate at; Daddy mentioning where any combination of the kids are at and what they are doing (including the ones who are in his presence at the time); Daddy spending time one on one with one of the kids and having meaningful discussions on "very important or pressing topics"; imo the diary is sort of creepy, the man-boys and Mary-Elizabeth will never have a life of their own because Daddy Arndt has to know where each and everyone of them is at all times and exactly what they're doing. WTF???
  10. Here's the previous thread: Here's our list of fundies - single, courting, engaged and recently married. Updated 25 April 2017 Single Courting/Engaged Recently Married
  11. The day is finally almost upon us. Tomorrow afternoon my fiance and I will say our vows in front of our immediate families and a small number of friends. All that's left to do is pack my overnight bag and have the shower to end all showers. It's been a road fraught with anxiety but I love Mr. Vex with all my heart and even though I don't think weddings are a big deal, it means a lot to me to commit to him. I never believed in soulmates, but I know that he's mine. Here's hoping that it's worth missing the live airing of the new episode of The Walking Dead for (: And ha. Beat Joy down the aisle.
  12. Vex

    Urk.

    I thought it might be a good idea to have a place to write about what's going on in my life, since big things are rapidly happening. First thing is that I'm getting married April 2016. Possibly even March. It's happened pretty fast but there's really no reason to wait since we don't want a party or a big wedding, and the sooner we're married the sooner my fiance can apply for a spouse visa and live here full time. I'm so happy and excited to marry him, I wish we could do it even sooner. I really couldn't hope to find a better partner than him <3 Second thing is that I'm disabled and live with chronic pain. I've finally managed to get in to see a pain clinic that offers comprehensive treatment. That comprehensive treatment means 5 hour sessions with everything from psychologists, psychiatrists and surgeons. Three five hour sessions. That's going to be really hard for me. I hate talking to strangers, especially strange doctors because doctors have been so fucking useless to me for the past 15 years of my life. My fiance will be able to come to my final appointment with me (thank god), and my mother will come to the first (you have to bring a relative/partner to certain appointments) but I know she's going to say stuff that will humiliate me because she has zero fucking tact. I'm also going to have to work on fixing up my apartment that I haven't lived in for 2 years so my fiance can move into it with me. It's going to be a bit of an adjustment, going from living by myself, being on my own all day to living with a partner full time. He has a job lined up (not that he can be paid until his spouse visa is approved) that means in a few months when his tourist visa expires he'll be out of the house most of the day. I never really saw myself as the stay at home wife type, but here I am. Hopefully we can both finish up our degrees and one day I'll be in a position to work. I don't want him to have to be the breadwinner, that's too much pressure on top of having to move half a world away. He's prepared to do it because he's wonderful, but it's not what I want. So yeah, got to fix up the apartment. Needs tons of cleaning (which I can't do, but my family is helping). I'll have to sort a lot of my shit into boxes and put the boxes... somewhere. God knows where. It's a lot going on at once for me and it's a bit overwhelming. On top of all that I'm really sick at the moment. Like, can't get out of bed for more than a trip to the bathroom or kitchen for a glass of water. If anyone actually reads this (which I doubt), don't worry. I'm sure I'll be on to bitterly eviscerating episodes of A Game of Thrones in no time at all. God damn, the writing on that show...
  13. Starting this thread at the request of a new member, @true believer so as not to disrupt another thread.
  14. http://www.foreverymom.com/she-only-said-yes-once/ This man doesn't like how schools are teaching consent because he thinks it shouldn't be necessary. He compares it to how his wife only had to say yes once, at the altar. Is anyone else actually kind of disturbed by this? It kind of implies that a husband always has the right to have sex with his wife, which is unfortunately something a lot of fundies believe. Also, I found it amusing that this is his idea of "graphic." That's right, people who used to be children are hearing about sex! The horror!
  15. A young fundie-lite relative shared this on Facebook. I don't even know what to say about it. Summary: Woman was annoyed with her husband, out in public with kids looking tired and frustrated and a man she didn't know said something nice to her (which was not in the least bit suggestive, mind you). Apparently, this made her think immediately of having an affair and ruining her marriage. Or it could make her think of that. Or she thought that the man spoke nicely to her because he wanted to have an affair. I'm not sure. But she realized that when strange people of the opposite gender speak nicely to her, it could ruin her marriage. Thus, this blog post which warns us all about falling into "quicksand". The quicksand apparently being polite strangers. For your reading pleasure: http://beckythompson.com/2016/03/21/beware-of-quicksand-how-one-strangers-comment-changed-my-marriage-forever/ And as a bonus, I love the comment from someone married 35 years who declares that "marriage is a battlefield, constantly". Her home life must be delightful.
  16. Do you see many problems? Do they seem happy? Are they gradually pulling away? These people were born and breed to portray their lives are "perfect". Josh and Anna seem to be falling apart in spite of the "brave" face. Jill and Jessa are definitely in control of their marriages. Ben and Derik are still "star struck" and content to follow along. Long term happiness when the spotlight finally fades...... hum.... I don't know... The married Maxwell sons. Well, their wives do smile adoringly at them. Anna Maxwell has 2 siblings who married and have left the fundie lifestyle.
  17. Can Kentucky become more of the butthole of america? http://progressky.com/2016/03/senate-blocks-interracial-interfaith-marriages-sb-180/
  18. It's self explanatory, mate!
  19. Polyamorous groups can get civil unions in Brazil: http://www1.folha.uol.com.br/internacional/en/brazil/2016/01/1733546-couples-of-three-or-more-may-obtain-civil-partnerships-in-brazil.shtml I always find the issue of polygamy very interesting because it carries the potential for such overwhelming abuse and oppression, but it also has its normal proponents just like everything else. What do you think? Can polygamy foster romantic happiness in the modern sense, or does it not work now?
  20. Check out this blogger's advice for the wedding night. It is just so awkward (an sterile). And oh, while she doesn't really say it she's also judgmental af about pre-marital sex. Oh my... http://intentionaltoday.com/10-things-every-bride-should-know-before-her-wedding-night/ I especially love the little tidbit about girls who don't like to shower. You really should know that once you're married, you gotta shower to not turn your husband off. I mean, in all seriousness, what is this?
  21. JenniferJuniper

    Arndts really sad about gay marriage

    Says Daddy, "I feel the same distress today that I have felt in the years since abortion was legalized. (It happened in January of 1973, during my juinor year in high school.)" (Note the need to always insert some detail about himself no matter the topic.) But the Softball Classic (Brought to us directly by Jesus!) will serve as a healing balm. "We are convinced that the FamTeam Day retreats and Softball Classic events have also been brought to birth by Him. We continue to sense that we are called to stand firnly and calmly, that we are to remain on 'offense'(in the sense that Jesus did in His earthly ministry), and that we are (as the saying goes) to 'light one candle rather than curse the darkness.'" I think the Manboys are scared they will be asked by a gay couple to photograph their wedding and they'll get sent to prison if they refuse.
  22. I hadn't ever actually seen any of the engaged Josh/Anna hand sex so I watched a couple of videos. One showed Anna talking shortly before her wedding. She mentioned that her mother took her aside and talked with her about being intimate with her husband. She said she is glad she didn't get that information until she needed it. I know Jim Bob had a talk with Josh and gave him a book. So are these kids completely in the dark until that time? I honestly can't remember a time when I had no clue at all about how things work. It seems like it would be almost terrifying if you had no clue about your spouse's anatomy until the minute you were supposed to start baby making! FTR, I felt almost embarrassed watching the hand sex! I wanted to get them some rubber gloves to prevent a hand pregnancy!
  23. I was thinking a lot today about Jill and Derrick, and how Jill, before marriage, seemed a lot more outgoing and happy and free-spirited (to the extent she could be) and independent (again to the extent she could). But then she got married, moved out, and now is so clingy on Derrick that it makes ME feel suffocated. Do you think that Jill, and other fundy women since they never get privacy and always have chaperones, know how they're likely to be? Like do you think Jill knew she would up clingy? What do you think must go through the head of the husband who finds that the woman he thought he married is really very different once she's out of her parents' house? I think it has to be scary to find out a side of yourself exists that you didn't know was there, and that it's got to be scary and frustrating for the husband to realize he couldn't possibly have known his wife as well as he thought he did.
  24. There have been allusions to Jessa being stubborn and somewhat headstrong. A lot of people wondered why they allowed Ben to court her when he was so young and not really settled in a job, but I wonder if some of it was because Jessa was starting to show signs of rebelliousness and they were worried that if they didn't marry her off quickly, then she might do something that would blow up in their faces. I noticed a lot of eye rolling and side-eyes that she gave her parents while courting and there was the comment about eloping some mentioned. I think she's been chomping at the bit to get away and maybe was making life difficult for them. I think she was wanting male attention and they figured this might be a good solution. Even with the wedding she clearly was making some choices that I'm not sure Michelle and JB were happy with, but I think she's pretty headstrong and will continue to make her own choices. (As opposed to Jill who seems to still be drinking the koolaid and acting like the model child following the M & JB's plan with the immediate pregnancy and talking points). What do others think?
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