Jinjer 57: The Seemingly Infinite Seminary Rolls On

[Dominionatrix]

I'm putting the link under spoiler because the article includes child and spousal abuse and CSA, but a new lawsuit alleges that John MacArthur, the leader of Jeremy's seminary and the head of Jinjer's church in LA, publicly shamed and excommunicated a parishioner who tried to leave an abusive husband:

Spoiler

John MacArthur Shamed, Excommunicated Mother for Refusing to Take Back Child Abuser: https://julieroys.com/macarthur-shamed-excommunicated-mother-take-back-child-abuser/

 

Edited March 10, 2022 by Dominionatrix
clarity

[Idlewild]

@Dominionatrix that is shocking. There’s a pattern though isn’t there? Abuser admits abuse but the reaction is to try and pretend it never happened to the outside world and the victims become the vilified ones.

[Bobology]

The experience Eileen endured is truly nauseating. I think it is OK to post this one paragraph even though the document was rightfully listed under a spoiler. This Hardy guy had a MDiv from MacArthur's nasty seminary and it was noted that he had no actual counseling training even though he acted in the capacity of a real counselor. 

Here it is:
Hardy counseled Eileen to forgive David “even if he wasn’t repentant,” Eileen testified. “He would teach me over and over ‘the threefold promise of forgiveness’ . . .” she stated, “where you act as though it never happened, and you never bring it up again, and you never tell anyone about it.”

A truly wtf "promise" of patriarchy.

For those of you who did not read the article, Eileen did not take back her evil husband (who was employed by this very church) but instead reported the necessary complaints to proper authorities that resulted in charges, a trial and sentencing of the scumbag.

[GuineaPigCourtship]

I just finished the article and that is one of the most WTF disgusting things I have ever read.  I hope Jinger & Jeremy really love each other because she is in for a hell of a time if he is an abusive ass.  

[Idlewild]

Jinger refers to Jeremy as her ‘personal shopper’ again as they are out shopping. I wonder if she ever disagrees with his selections?

[patsymae]

5 hours ago, Idlewild said:

Jinger refers to Jeremy as her ‘personal shopper’ again as they are out shopping. I wonder if she ever disagrees with his selections?

So he still picks out her clothes? I could even kind of see it at first as she had no experience with fashion, was taught to let the headship decide the rules (I mean, if you only had frumpers, how would you know how far you could go with hemlines, shorts, body skimming?) and probably also no knowledge of what clothes cost or what their budget would allow. And yeah, when you're a newlywed you want to please the hubby, especially in terms of making yourself look hot. But its been how many years? Why is he still picking out her clothes (and probably styling her outfits, hair, etc.)?

[SassyPants]

WAIT… wasn’t Jinger the Duggar Girl Fashionista? Didn’t she pick out all the older girls’ outfits and make suggestions about shoes and accessories? Wasn’t she known for this in the days between the frumpers, jean skirts and flip flops and yearly weddings?

[patsymae]

1 hour ago, SassyPants said:

WAIT… wasn’t Jinger the Duggar Girl Fashionista? Didn’t she pick out all the older girls’ outfits and make suggestions about shoes and accessories? Wasn’t she known for this in the days between the frumpers, jean skirts and flip flops and yearly weddings?

I hope it's okay to post a link

 

[Markie]

I read the article about Jeremy’s church posted above and felt sick. I, like many on here, thought Jinger was getting a good partner. He chose to be mentored by those sick SOBs. I hope she is content in her Dolls House that Jeremy has designed. Will she break away?  Does she chafe at his controls? Does Jinger even realize she has options? 

[Mama Mia]

39 minutes ago, Markie said:

I read the article about Jeremy’s church posted above and felt sick. I, like many on here, thought Jinger was getting a good partner. He chose to be mentored by those sick SOBs. I hope she is content in her Dolls House that Jeremy has designed. Will she break away?  Does she chafe at his controls? Does Jinger even realize she has options? 

Of all the Duggar marriages, I think  her situation has the most potential red flags.

-She’s far from her family (problematic as they are, they are still HER family) —She has a very passive personality. Her husband has a very strong personality. She’s always looked for a leader, whether it’s Jinger or Jeremy. —-They live in an area of the country where people do not make it a habit to even know who their neighbors are, or ever make eye contact, let alone chat enough to pick up on abuse.
-Those Southern California mega-church fundamentalist cults are extra creepy, because they are polished and wealthy and fashionable and give off no clues to how out of step with society they are BUT they also know that any sort of physical anything isn’t tolerated in their area, so are extra secretive. 

I am not implying Jeremy is remotely abusive. They very well may stay perfectly happy, they are unlikely to have more children than they want, and their children will likely have advantages like private school and activities. Jinger gets to shop and hang out with friends in a city- Jeremy seems to encourage her to enjoy herself. 

BUT - if things go badly she seems the worst situated - by geography, standard of living, and personality - to get any support.
 

 

[Jinder Roles]

I knew Jeremy wasn’t shit from I saw he was heavily influenced and linked to John McArthur (one of the biggest Calvinist assholes to ever exist). 
 

While he is well-spoken and more media savvy than other Duggar spouses he has terrible beliefs, is extremely pompous and several of his sermons/statements have racist undertones. 
 

I find Jeremy to be more dangerous because he blends in better.

[imokit]

Jinger's situation and full of red flags, but they are all vulnerable.  Do you think any Duggar would support someone leaving due to abuse?  What was written from Jinger's church is no different from what the Duggar's believe.  Most of them would encourage couples to stay together and the victim to pray harder and change themselves in cases of abuse.  Look at Anna, there's no evidence that she's been abused by Josh, we don't know either way, but we know that Josh has been abusing others and cheating and she's been under pressure to stand by him.  The wouldn't treat a daughter differently.  Look at the Paine girl who married a known rapist.

Proximity wouldn't necessarily help Jinger.

Jinger does have some advantages over some of the siblings, she isn't producing baby after baby.  They aren't going to have 10 kids (or even 6),  The fewer children she has, the easier it is to leave as you need less recourses to manage the children both clothes/space in a shelter/money etc.  Its easier to leave with 2/3 children with you then 10.

LA is big, there will be more resources to help vulnerable people, more charities to support her.  More people, more potential social groups.

LA is big, if she were to divorce people wouldn't be recognising her and gossiping about her behind her back, the way they would in a small town such as Tonitown.  Sometimes anonymity can be helpful.

All of those women in the cult are scary vulnerable, Jinger would have different challenges than her sisters should she want to leave, but I don't know that they would be more difficult, just different.

[Idlewild]

The thing with controlling behaviour is most women start out like Jinger- thinking it’s wonderful that their husband is so into them that he will come shopping and help her choose clothes- tell her what she looks beautiful in.

In an environment where she got to choose from used clothes and had little attention given to her as she was simply one of many, that is probably very attractive.

The problem is if the control goes beyond that- many years ago I had to deal with a domestic abuse case (I’ve probably mentioned it before ) where the woman was a lawyer and the husband was a senior police officer. It started out as their joke- he was her ‘personal shopper’. It developed to him ordering her clothes online without any input from her and telling her what she should wear each day and becoming angry if she pushed back. And then the rest of the control, who she spoke to, where she went, how she spent money and eventually the violence. It wasn’t until she ended up in hospital with broken bones that she made a complaint. She had been trained in DA in her job, yet this was so slow and pervasive she didn’t even realise it was happening for a long time.

Im not saying Jeremy is like that - just that this type of abuser is very clever and in it for the long game.

[SassyPants]

I do think that Jinger has the best fashion sense of all the girls. Jana is not too bad, but the rest, awful. And I don’t dress up much either, but I know how to match clothing/shoes/venue etc. Jessa and those horrible, brown, flat sandals that she has even worn several times when she was a bridesmaid…just awful.

[AussieKrissy]

I thought this was jill until I read it…. 
oh why stand in the fuckin sun and read… 

[Idlewild]

So who took the photo? Couldn’t Jeremy take an hour away from posing and being clever to give Jinger a break?
Reading is obviously such a novel concept for a Duggar that they have to announce it.

[socalrules]

So Jinger just happened to be reading in front of the window and Jeremy just happened to take a picture? Sure Jan. “Parenting is hard”, yet Jinger is the one doing the parenting while Jeremy does whatever Jeremy does, which always seems to be nothing earth shattering. 

[Idlewild]

4 hours ago, socalrules said:

So Jinger just happened to be reading in front of the window and Jeremy just happened to take a picture? Sure Jan. “Parenting is hard”, yet Jinger is the one doing the parenting while Jeremy does whatever Jeremy does, which always seems to be nothing earth shattering. 

Yes, and yet one of the comments is they should have a show on TLC, which I’m sure stroked Jeremy’s ego. Just what TLC needs - a show about people in subsidised housing who are determined not to get a job for as long as possible? 

[SassyPants]

The humpers default to history. The Duggars had a TV show because they were the first, non mainstream Christian denomination, religious, mega family with parents that were willing to sell their family’s privacy, anonymity and lives away to the highest bidder. The story was about nothing aside from a sneak peak at the crazy. Well, the Vuolos offer none of the crazy element beyond refusing to work at jobs commiserate with their skills and knowledge in order to support their family. Heck, they have decided to not include their children, which is really the only reason that JB had a TV show to begin with. The only thing I could see that might make an interesting show is following people who seem to live a rather upscale life (fine dining, constant dates, sporting events and golf) in a very expensive area of the country, without having jobs or other successful endeavors.  Sure they’ve tried non-traditional revenue streams, but never for any credible length of time( how Duggar). And Jinger is very hit and miss on the influencer front. I know their rent has to be either low or zero, but how do these folks survive? That would /could be an interesting, although destructive show.

[Smoochie]

20 hours ago, socalrules said:

So Jinger just happened to be reading in front of the window and Jeremy just happened to take a picture? Sure Jan. “Parenting is hard”, yet Jinger is the one doing the parenting while Jeremy does whatever Jeremy does, which always seems to be nothing earth shattering. 

Hey now... someone had to take the picture!

[Idlewild]

At the moment I think the Vuolos are getting by on whatever their book earned and they name check everything they do and everything they eat so I guess they get quite a few freebies. For example, Jeremy is doing an infomercial on his stories about portraits he had done of the family as I give fir Jinger, it’s on Jinger’s account which has far more followers, so I suppose he didn’t pay.

Other sources of money - anything they made on their house in Laredo? They’d be nuts to spend that as at some point they’ll need to buy a home- but if Jeremy wants new Nikes, needs must.

I also think that after Derick sued JB, Jeremy came to an ‘arrangement’ with JB whereby he agreed not to sue for a payout. While Jinger and Michelle still seem close, there’s no sign of JB ever visiting them.

[SassyPants]

15 hours ago, Idlewild said:

At the moment I think the Vuolos are getting by on whatever their book earned and they name check everything they do and everything they eat so I guess they get quite a few freebies. For example, Jeremy is doing an infomercial on his stories about portraits he had done of the family as I give fir Jinger, it’s on Jinger’s account which has far more followers, so I suppose he didn’t pay.

Other sources of money - anything they made on their house in Laredo? They’d be nuts to spend that as at some point they’ll need to buy a home- but if Jeremy wants new Nikes, needs must.

I also think that after Derick sued JB, Jeremy came to an ‘arrangement’ with JB whereby he agreed not to sue for a payout. While Jinger and Michelle still seem close, there’s no sign of JB ever visiting them.

And who takes care of their kids when they are on these seemingly endless, kidless dates? It’s not like an auntie can be dispensed or the kids dropped off at the TTH to be ignored by their grandparents. Does the free housing come with free, endless babysitting?

I assumed that the Vuolos received $$$ from JB to buy their Laredo house. 

Edited March 20, 2022 by SassyPants

[feministxtian]

On 3/14/2022 at 6:30 AM, imokit said:

inger's situation and full of red flags, but they are all vulnerable.

I don't think Jill is anymore. From what I've seen and read, she seems to be coming into her own, with her own opinions and ideas that seem to be quite different from the rest of the family. Yes, she's still a conservative Christian, BUT...using birth control (even if its non-hormonal?), kids in PS? Talk smack to Derick (she can be quite sarcastic and teasing with him)? She's definitely not J'chelle part 2. 

I am concerned with the age and power difference with Jinger and Jeremy. He does seem rather domineering. We'll see what happens. 

[imokit]

Jill is as vulnerable as the others.  Her social group is mainly threw Derrick and the children.  She is the most estranged from her own family.  She still has no decent qualifications to support herself outside of Instagram/influencer status.  Her husband is a lawyer who could decide to object to her using the boys as a source of income (which is what they do on Instagram).

We have no idea what's going on behind closed doors.  I've seen worrying things from Derrick too especially towards the start of the relationship, chasing a cat on a sled.  Much of the relationship has been about him, his missionary work, his rants against TLC, his decision to go to law school.  We don't know who drove the distance between Jill and her family whether he supported her or leaned/manipulated her to it/alienated JB to create the distance.

Even if he's not doing dodgy things, people grow apart, relationships fail.  Jill may find it more acceptable to divorce Derrick, she may find it harder.

She's differently vulnerable to Jinger, she and Jinger are in turn differently vulnerable to Jessa and Joy, but she is still vulnerable.

[Father Son Holy Goat]

On 3/14/2022 at 12:54 PM, Idlewild said:

The thing with controlling behaviour is most women start out like Jinger- thinking it’s wonderful that their husband is so into them that he will come shopping and help her choose clothes- tell her what she looks beautiful in.

In an environment where she got to choose from used clothes and had little attention given to her as she was simply one of many, that is probably very attractive.

The problem is if the control goes beyond that- many years ago I had to deal with a domestic abuse case (I’ve probably mentioned it before ) where the woman was a lawyer and the husband was a senior police officer. It started out as their joke- he was her ‘personal shopper’. It developed to him ordering her clothes online without any input from her and telling her what she should wear each day and becoming angry if she pushed back. And then the rest of the control, who she spoke to, where she went, how she spent money and eventually the violence. It wasn’t until she ended up in hospital with broken bones that she made a complaint. She had been trained in DA in her job, yet this was so slow and pervasive she didn’t even realise it was happening for a long time.

Im not saying Jeremy is like that - just that this type of abuser is very clever and in it for the long game.

My abusive relationship started out similarly. He even dressed me and I still wear some of the clothes and bras he picked out (I’m barely scraping by so I can’t buy a bunch of new ones). I remember being forbidden to wear animal prints since he didn’t like them.