Boyer Sisters Pt 5: Balancing Body Humors with YL Oils

[acheronbeach]

Let's assume for the sake of argument that Young Living is magically wonderful and cures everything imaginable.  

Their business model still wouldn't work.  

The market is already saturated with DoTerra and Young Living saleswomen.  Well before J and C started, there were tons of established sellers - Stacy McDonald, Lisa Pennington, and dozens more that I probably don't even know about - within their circle.  Not only that, but The Boyer Sisters seems to mostly appeal to younger, unmarried women.  Their audience doesn't control the purse strings.  If a good Christian family is going to "get oily", then Mom is going to buy it from one of her Christian Mom friends.  Mom isn't going to hand over forty bucks to her teenage daughter to buy it from her online friend.  And Jessica's been pretty honest about how oils have made her skin worse - and the "acne cure" route is the only one I could see appealing to young women.  

If it was something more related to younger womens' fashion, hair, or beauty products, they would've had a built-in audience to launch from.  But this Young Living stuff... they missed the boat, in more ways than one.  Though Brigid might abandon the Brijee website now that she has her wee baby, her business has always struck me as much more considered.  

[Jeronimo]

I bet J and C don’t need to hear again about Brigid having a more successful business than B well. 

That must sting.

[Lurky]

The thing that really makes me sad is that they really seem to believe this is a "start-up" and they're entrepreneurs - and they just don't see how an MLM is not the same as someone coming up with a new business idea and making it work.   Entrepreneurship is about seeing gaps in the markets and filling them, with new products, or old products done differently.   An MLM by its very nature isn't even about the product, it's about taking an existing model, and one where the money is made by the downline rather than the product.

It's like the difference between starting a café or restaurant serving one's own recipes, and starting a franchise of an existing chain.  Except in general, the overarching franchise company will do the research before starting a franchise, so they're not going to, for example, allow 2 MacDonalds on the same block, etc.

As @JermajestyDuggar says, MLMs are set up to fail.  For sure, the people at the top of the pyramid are making a ton of money, but that's from the people below them, it's not from the product.  And Essential Oils are something that have been popular for decades, and can be bought from all kinds of places, so selling the expensive ones are always going to be difficult.

And I think one has to really understand how to do research to be able to wade through the evidence about YL.  Of COURSE there are thousands of webpages with contradictory information about essential oils, and business models, but it's important to know which are evidence-based, and how to tell the difference between, for example, a respected medical or business website, and something someone has just put online. 

But Young Living is a company that lies to the extent that the USA Government steps in, and seems to actively encourage people to lie about what oils can achieve, and the way it sources its oils has been illegal and dishonest.  Evidence:

https://www.fda.gov/ICECI/EnforcementActions/WarningLetters/ucm416023.htm

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/essential-oils-company-sentenced-lacey-act-and-endangered-species-act-violations-pay-760000

 

[Palimpsest]

4 hours ago, Jeronimo said:

I bet J and C don’t need to hear again about Brigid having a more successful business than B well. 

That must sting.

Well they sting Brigid a lot.

Brigid has a better business model.  But almost anything would be better than an essential oil MLM in an already saturated market. 

We don't know whether Brigid's business is successful.  She still only has a single pattern - the Linden Lady - for sale.  I wish she'd get her "party dress" pattern out (the one she modified for her wedding dress) because that dress is lovely.

The sisters used to sell things they made on Etsy. They seem to have given that up.

[Carm_88]

Jessica and Charlotte don't seem to realize that they need to do things that they are good at. Brigid is at least having fun with pattern making, they don't even seem to enjoy YL. Why even do it? Surely there has to be something better. 

[elliha]

I really wish that fundies, if they are going to do this with only allowing women to be wives and home makers, could allow their daughters to be really good at this and to really provide a well-rounded education in this field. Like once you finish homeschooling you are expected to learn economics related to the home theory and practice, you go to other families and learn about taking care of the home and children at different times in life (from a young mom with a small family and few but young kids to helping an elderly couple with food and cleaning) and to develop one or several real skills that can be used for homeschooling kids or for a home business. I think charity work could also be a part, and should include different types of work that relates to this even things that are not that glamorous and can't be posted on instagram to brag about. Religious training could also play a part for example by reading books and understanding interpretation of scripture. They are supposed to give their children a religious upbringing and training so this should be important to them. Ideally I would want them to also learn about how to teach children at different ages but that would be a stretch that might be too far. If they cannot read real books about it they should be able to at least try teaching different ages and see if they do indeed know enough to provide a good education.

In the old days this would have been very common for girls from different classes to do so. A working class girl would probably do so out of necessity but even women in the nobility would learn how to cook and clean as part of their training to become ladies of the manor and so they could actually know if their servants were bullshitting them or not when they said that something could not be done or was done correctly. 

[acheronbeach]

I don't actually think Brigid's business is super successful, but I think that's her choice.  If she wanted to start a successful pattern business, and put in the time and effort, I think she'd have little problem.  Maybe I'm speculating, but it looks like she's focused on being young mother and wife, rather than her Brijee stuff.  She's only posted 5x since starting her blog 4 months ago.  

OTOH, Jessica and Charlotte are obviously putting a lot of time and effort into b.well and they've been honest about the struggle.  I suppose they're being comforted by their belief that it's a ministry, but I wish they'd just step back, assess their own strengths, and try something else.  They're capable young women.  They could be successful in business, if they tried something that wasn't stacked against them.  

 

(On another note, I thought Papa Boyer was also a businessman?  Am I remembering wrong that he runs a car dealership?)

[NachosFlandersStyle]

I feel so bad for them reading that post. MLMs make their profits by convincing people like the sisters to stick with it even while they're hemorrhaging money--and their idea that the business is a "gift from God" and "He will provide" couldn't be better tailored to keep them sending money up the line. I'm sure that's part of the reason these schemes flourish in evangelical and Mormon communities. They're reluctant to do anything that might betray a lack of trust in God's plan. I just want to shake them by the shoulders like "wake up, girlfriends! You aren't at the table, you're on the menu!"

[jozina]

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Holding that tiny life in my arms, and grasping just how untainted he was, how fresh & new his little life really struck me. I wanted to help protect him from ever being exposed to toxins, and I hope & pray he will be one of the many children from my & my sisters’ generation that grows up wondering what on earth is Windex, or fluoride.

From the B Well blog.  I see they're hoping wee Fireman will have the science education of the Boyers.  What on earth is fluoride?  If only I knew some basic chemistry!! And he's been exposed to toxins in the womb.  He makes them.  Your sister's body makes them and passed them onto him via her placenta.  They're what he (and you twits) have kidneys, a liver, lungs, bowels and skin for.

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#2 Cut Out the Sugar

This one is harder than the first, most definitely. Cutting out sugar doesn’t just mean candy or dessert. It means Starbucks frappes, granola bars, even some dried fruit! Sugar sneaks into so, so many of our foods these days it’s scary. ...Start by cutting back, before you cut out. Maybe have fruit for dessert instead of ice cream. Stop buying those sugary granola bars, and opt for a no-sugar-added option. Don’t get Starbucks every week, and instead limit it to once or twice a month....It’s possible to cut out sugar, it just takes conviction & determination. Habits take time to solidify, taste buds & gut bacteria take time to readjust.

 

Oh sweetcheeks - sugar is in fruit.  And milk. And comes from every single carbohydrate you eat once your body has broken it down.  Again with that basic science education thing.  It is not addictive and it is not the demon you're making it out to be, it's just flavour of the week to demonise by the scientifically illiterate. You literally need it to live. Your body cares not one whit what source that sugar is coming from, be it fruit or a cookie.

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Every oil you use is a toxic chemical that you are throwing to the curb.

Fixed it for you.  Everything can be a toxin - the dose makes the poison. And all that snake oil you sell is definitely included in that.

[dripcurl]

YL just gives SAHDs something to do because they aren't allowed to do anything else. They make no money and gain no real business skills while isolating themselves further by crushing people under their feet trying to get to the top of a pyramid scheme since every person is viewed as a potential vendor. While many non-fundies fall into the MLM trap, I grieve for these girls who are so limited because they don't have enough self agency to figure out simple economics and what a profit actually is. Someone I know who is deeply entrenched in YL always tried to make me a consultant, she could never just let me buy some wintergreen by it's lonesome.

[anachronistic]

I don’t get them. They’ve eliminated sugar from their diet but honey and pure maple syrup are alternative sweeteners? It’s like 2+2=4 for them but 1+3=5. No sense whatsoever.

Also, my favorite way to deal with acne is to do nothing, eat what you want, pop the occasional one because it feels so good, and realize that absolutely nobody but you cares how you look.

[dripcurl]

1 hour ago, anachronistic said:

I don’t get them. They’ve eliminated sugar from their diet but honey and pure maple syrup are alternative sweeteners? It’s like 2+2=4 for them but 1+3=5. No sense whatsoever.

Also, my favorite way to deal with acne is to do nothing, eat what you want, pop the occasional one because it feels so good, and realize that absolutely nobody but you cares how you look.

They should say refined sugar, not just "sugar". I looked it up and pure maple syrup is actually the better of the two (less fructose, more glucose and sucrose than honey). 

[hoipolloi]

Speaking of MLMs & pyramid schemes, it looks like another scam beloved of many fundies, Lularoe, is being sued by some of its sellers but the company's owners say the legal complaints are just "uneducated opinions":

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A recently-filed lawsuit seeking $1 billion claims "tens of thousands of other consultants never even made a profit" because LuLaRoe, they allege, is a "pyramid scheme" that "only profited a few and only made payments to consultants based on how much product those consultants and their recruits purchased on a regular basis." 

"What that is is an uneducated opinion. They haven't looked at who we are because we sell product through to a consumer, and it's highly-desirable product. That is not a pyramid scheme," Mark said. 

 

[Palimpsest]

@hoipolloi, ugh.  Not uneducated opinions just uneducated people who fell for a pyramid scheme and got burned.  The Boyer sisters should take note.

I think Lularoe came up on a Boyer thread before.  They had those astonishingly dreadful leggings with the design of chihuahua heads peeping out of vaginas that I was SEVERELY tempted to buy and donate to @Curious.  A whole lot of people said that Lularoe clothes just fall apart on first wearing. 

[Carm_88]

I just can't deal with MLMs, Lularoe and their ugly leggings, all those essential oils, scentsy, so on and so forth. Makes me ill and also feel bad because people are being taken advantage of, but god forbid you say anything! 

[hoipolloi]

2 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

A whole lot of people said that Lularoe clothes just fall apart on first wearing. 

Or, apparently, the very few patterns that look good are in extremely short supply so buyers aren't happy & sellers are stuck with an eff-ton of ugly that no one will buy.

Fairness note: while Lularoe & the other MLM scams seem to be dominated by fundies, I've seen Lularoe offers float across my FB feed from friends who, I'm pretty sure, are not fundie. In any case, they've fallen victim to a scam.

[Georgiana]

I think the reason that MLMs often seem to be dominated by fundies is because they present themselves as an "alternate career" for people who need to make money, but are not willing or able to work a regular job.  Fundies are dis-proportionally represented in this because they tend to have large families AND prohibit women from working outside the home.  So MLMs become one of the few sanctioned ways for these families to try and bring in a second income, which they probably require.  

The non-fundies I know who subscribe to MLMs are pretty much in the same boat: live above their means, only one income, non-working party is looking for ways to AVOID going out of the home for whatever reason.  

It's a major market in America these days. 

[dramallama]

 

[hoipolloi]

@dramallama -- well, whatever with the YouTube clips but you must know that it's totally NOT a pyramid scheme when certain people do it! 

[Palimpsest]

It's totally NOT a pyramid scheme.  It's a MINISTRY.  They are HELPING people.

[EowynW]

You can only protect yourself from toxins to a point in today's society. I was reading a study the other day about how even cord blood from newborn babies is showing pollutants at a high level. We have toxins and poisons in everything in this country. It sucks but it is what it is. 

I do think we consume too much processed sugar and foods, with disasterous results in this country. I know we harp on fundies for being health conscious but they do have a point about some of these things. Many secular drs and people are saying the same thing. My dr wishes more people would take this seriously, as what we eat & put on our bodies affects us more than many people think. 

 

Yea my crazy Doterra lady thinks she's an "entrepreneur" too. *eye roll*  

[seraaa]

On 11/2/2017 at 10:12 PM, Carm_88 said:

That's truly depressing. I mean logically that the lives of most people involved in MLMs, it's not easy. They should really try something different. 

Yes. They're good at social media, and I think they'd be able to make a go of something non-MLM related. I understand why they are popular, because they connect you with a community of like-minded individuals and purport to enable you to help people - but those features can also be found elsewhere.

[Palimpsest]

2 hours ago, EowynW said:

I know we harp on fundies for being health conscious but they do have a point about some of these things.

Do we?   No sarcasm, just a genuine question.  I hadn't noticed but I don't read all the threads by any means.  I'm rather crunchy granola myself so I tend to agree with much of what you said above.  Pollution is a big problem and so is an unhealthy diet.

I've noticed far more snark about really unhealthy Fundie diets (think weens, cream of crap soup, and Hodnett's fish 'n chip habit) not the more health conscious ones.  I reserve most of my criticism for the anti-vax, anti-mental health care, high-risk pregnancy wanting home birth, pro-alternative medicine that has been proven to be snake oil, anti-heath insurance and preventive care Fundie types.

The Boyer sisters aren't being health conscious although they may think they are.  They are obsessed with fad diets and toxins at the moment, certainly, but they are falling for a lot of pseudo-science.  All the essential oils in the world won't solve all their problems.  

If they really want to follow through with this line of thought they will move off the grid and stop driving.  Gasoline is toxic and so is car exhaust.  More so than fluoride I think.

 

[seraaa]

On 11/3/2017 at 11:30 AM, Lurky said:

But Young Living is a company that lies to the extent that the USA Government steps in, and seems to actively encourage people to lie about what oils can achieve, and the way it sources its oils has been illegal and dishonest.  Evidence:

https://www.fda.gov/ICECI/EnforcementActions/WarningLetters/ucm416023.htm

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/essential-oils-company-sentenced-lacey-act-and-endangered-species-act-violations-pay-760000

This New Yorker piece gets into some of that, iirc. The writer does not seem to be a fan.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/10/09/how-essential-oils-became-the-cure-for-our-age-of-anxiety

My problem with it all isn't even with the oils - I'm a great believer in eucalyptus oil's ability to clear a blocked nose, for example - but the MLM model is uncertain. 

[formergothardite]

20 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

A whole lot of people said that Lularoe clothes just fall apart on first wearing. 

Someone bought my oldest daughter a pair and while they are super soft, they are also thin and faded a lot after two washes. They aren't cheap and if I pay that much for ugly leggings they better last me for years!