Doug Phillips is a Tool and Vision Forum is Dead - Part 6

[debrand]

Hah! So true. Nathaniel is a sexist dipshit.

"Ooh, the ladies are just too emotional to believe. False sexual abuse allegations are worse than real sexual abuse."

Jesus, he would fit right in on reddit, if he's not already over there. What a tool. I'm glad he got dumped. No woman should have to deal with his sanctimonious bullshit.

He seems to have found the perfect way to absolve all sexual predators of being found guilty. Of course, there aren't going to be additional witnesses to the abuse but if more than one girl comes forward, their testimony can be ignored because of their emotion. My bet is that if a girl came forward and was calm in relating her abuse, he would dismiss her for being too cold and intellectual also.

The Law of God is structured so that if human error occurs, we err on the side of civil innocence. If Mr Gothard has done this multiple times over the years, as alleged, then it would seem someone would be able to get wise about a way to prove his guilt with adequate witness testimony. Remember that even an admission on the accused part will likely satisfy the second witness requirement.

What is Darnell asking for here? Is he suggesting that they not do anything until someone finds a plan to allow enough witnesses to watch Gothard assault the females in his employment?

He won't go on the site detailing Gothard's abuse either because he doesn't listen to internet gossip.

[WonderingInWA]

I agree with a previous poster -- I think Darnell knows something he's protecting. He's probably not ultimately on the line for knowing anything since he left the VF fold a long time ago and on purpose, but he is rigid in his rhetoric seemingly defending Gothard, which I don't understand. It may just be his attorney-speak coming out -- innocent until proven guilty -- but he doesn't respect women at all, obviously. If women were being harrassed and assaulted, but it wasn't directly observed, saying it didn't happen is like ignoring sexual abuse in children. You have to believe there's something going on, because to silence the abused just adds more to the crime.

[Marian the Librarian]

Nathaniel, honey, here's a valuable piece of advice I received years ago from a county sheriff regarding criminal behavior: if it looks like a duck, and it walks like a duck, and it quacks like a duck, it's a duck. An investigation of Gothard by the appropriate civil authorities is LONG overdue.

The more you persist with your orthopraxic nitpickery and Biblical bloviating, the more ridiculous you appear. Stop talking about something you clearly know nothing about.

[WonderingInWA]

Nathaniel, honey, here's a valuable piece of advice I received years ago from a county sheriff regarding criminal behavior: if it looks like a duck, and it walks like a duck, and it quacks like a duck, it's a duck. An investigation of Gothard by the appropriate civil authorities is LONG overdue.

The more you persist with your orthopraxic nitpickery and Biblical bloviating, the more ridiculous you appear. Stop talking about something you clearly know nothing about.

Amen, Marian! :clap:

[Loveday]

This two or three witness business. I don't think Darnell understands what those verses really mean. Witnesses in those references aren't people who saw the actual crime/sin as it occurred, but people who go with the person confronting the alleged perpetrator. They go along to 'witness' the confrontation, to verify that it was all done properly and in order. Some serious misinterpretation going on here, I think. :think:

[ILoveJellybeans]

The problem with requiring witness testimony for committing crimes, is that not all crimes have witnesses, in fact, most criminals try and avoid having witnesses. Its not like hes going to stick his hand up an intern's skirt in front of everyone, he knows that doing that will land him in jail, so he is careful about how he acts when people are around.

[debrand]

Darnell has some serious issues. He mentions that David and Solomon were men of god who had problems with sexual infidelities. When someone points out that neither David nor Solomon were accused of molesting minors, Darnell writes:

When does the Bible call people "minors"? How old do y'all think all of David and Solomon's concubines and wives were? Remember that in the Bible times people could marry in their teens.

:evil-eye:

Darnell is really going down the rabbit hole of crazy here.

He also doesn't answer this question by Muela

Is your point about minors that some how child molestation really isn't as bad as everyone is making it out to be?

Darnell is creepy and I don't know why anyone would continue to engage with him. Hopefully, Darnell is just so set on winning his argument that he doesn't realize that he is basically arguing that child molestation is okay in some circumstances.

David publicly killed Uriah and publicly took his wife. But the omniscient God was the one who condemned David for his adultery. God does not need any other witnesses to verify His judgment (He Himself is two and three). If any of you receive a direct revelation from God about Mr Gothard as did Nathan the Prophet, please let me know.

I don't get why Darnell is so intent on the number of witnesses and letting what is private stay private.

[Arete]

This two or three witness business. I don't think Darnell understands what those verses really mean. Witnesses in those references aren't people who saw the actual crime/sin as it occurred, but people who go with the person confronting the alleged perpetrator. They go along to 'witness' the confrontation, to verify that it was all done properly and in order. Some serious misinterpretation going on here, I think. :think:

^ What Loveday said. It seems to be completely lost on Darnell that this "two witnesses before you can accuse someone of sexual assault" is actually a tenet of...wait for it...some streams of Islamic jurisprudence. Yeah, one of the many religions the great reform Calvinist VF twits teach is of Satan. You can't build this kind of tool.

[Marian the Librarian]

Aaaannnnddd, here's Nathaniel Darnell pontificating on the subject of child sexual abuse on Nolan Manteufel's public Facebook page!

Interesting. So do you believe everything a child tells you?

Sarah, "many women" came forward to accuse Clarence Thomas when he was being considered for Supreme Court Justice, and none of the allegations were proven. Often people allege things simply to destroy what a leader stands for, and that has to be brought into consideration.

There are ways to get multiple eye witnesses or the equivalents thereof.

But we cannot assume everyone who claims to have been molested was molested. They have to prove their allegations just as any other alleged victim.

As an aside, this is why I think as a matter of wisdom unrelated or unmarried men and ladies should avoid putting themselves in situations where they are alone together.

OK - this gives me license to officially hate him. :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead:

[Mary C Doates]

Muela's had to close comments on that thread (there are close to 200 now). I'm sure the fight will resume elsewhere, though.

[WonderingInWA]

Aaaannnnddd, here's Nathaniel Darnell pontificating on the subject of child sexual abuse on Nolan Manteufel's public Facebook page!

OK - this gives me license to officially hate him. :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead:

OMG, me too. What a dick. Can you imagine him as your husband (well, obviously no one can) or, worse, your father?

[DomWackTroll]

Aaaannnnddd, here's Nathaniel Darnell pontificating on the subject of child sexual abuse on Nolan Manteufel's public Facebook page!

OK - this gives me license to officially hate him. :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead:

"And also because an icky girl might try to kiss me! Ewww!"

[Jane_Goth]

Darnell is a child abuse enabler. His now not future missus has had a very lucky escape.

[notablesquid]

Darnell is a child abuse enabler. His now not future missus has had a very lucky escape.

I imagine he has ideas of how a husband can behave physically towards a wife who doesn't want intimacy at a specific time and I imagine those are frightening ideas as well.

Keep all of yourself to yourself until you recognize that rape, incest, and sexual assault are always wrong, Nathaniel.

[Nobodysdoormat]

When are we gonna hear from Doug is a Tool? I need some cheese with my whine, I know, I'm sorry.

[Nutamole]

When are we gonna hear from Doug is a Tool? I need some cheese with my whine, I know, I'm sorry.

I feel the same way-- but the Film Festival is baaaack-- only a month late. christianworldviewfilmfestival.com/

New name, and DPIAT not on stage, of course. One commenter on Jen's Gems is promoting it and claiming it will have nothing to do with dat ebil tool Doug. But many in it USED to associate with him. He's now an unperson and they never knew him. They seem to have no second thoughts that, "Golly! Just maybe the whole thing is a bad idea! Maybe we should take a year or two off and pray about it!" No comment yet from Jen or Eston.

[thoughtful]

the Film Festival is baaaack-- only a month late. christianworldviewfilmfestival.com/

New name, and DPIAT not on stage, of course.

Oh, I think this deserves its own thread!

[Marian the Librarian]

Mercy! - there is more backing-and-forthing on Nolan Manteufel's public Facebook page this morning. Nolan, on an article about date rape drugs:

Homeschool Graduates tend to be incredibly naïve about evil intentions and capabilities. This makes Homeschool Graduates incredibly vulnerable to sexual Predators.

I highly suspect the Homeschoolers around Bill Gothard, Doug Phillips and Scott Brown are almost entirely unaware of Date Rape Drugs. Wake up, people. You live in a sinful world.

Understanding a Predator’s ability to drug his Prey is critical to the investigation of ALL child molestation claims.

TRUTH: Justice SHOULD NOT automatically assume “Predator is guilty”.

FACT: Child MAY BE unable to remember the actual event, let alone provide multiple witnesses!

Nathaniel Darnell's response:

It is naive for any of us to think that we can resolve man's problems with man's solutions. In doing so, we are like a person trying to mop up a muddy puddle with a muddy rag. The only solution to the real problems in our world (and in ourselves) is to follow the prescriptions God lays out in His Word for handling them. God, who is not at all naive about man's sin, knows supremely better than we do how to address man's sin.

And Nolan's response back to Nathaniel:

You are a pawn on Satan's Chess team.

:popcorn2:

[debrand]

First, I want the handle "A Pawn on Satan's Chess Team."

Second, my disgust with Nathaniel has actually increased.

[ThisOlGirl]

Pawn on Satan's Chess Team= New FJ post count title.

[Marian the Librarian]

First, I want the handle "A Pawn on Satan's Chess Team."

Second, my disgust with Nathaniel has actually increased.

He certainly isn't doing himself any favors in the "Marriage = normativity" department, is he??

[hoipolloi]

Wouldn't have believed that Nathaniel Darnell could say even more revolting things.

What a dickhead.

[thoughtful]

I am not a pawn -- I am the Queen of Satan's chess team (and shouldn't it be chess set, not team?).

I'll certainly take Nolan's side of this argument over creepy Nate, but their debating style and language made me do this:

[RosyDaisy]

Son of a bitch! I hope God addresses Nathaniel's sin by sending him to join Satan.

[Nobodysdoormat]

Doug Phillips is a tool and in my fantasy Feminists' Renenge Island he would wake up as SSM or maybe Lori...