Tori Bates Courtship- Part 2

[formergothardite]

16 hours ago, Mela99 said:

Do we know what Bobby is studying in college or should I just assume it's either business or Jesus?

I'm not sure, but last year he was some sort of a pastor intern at a very fundie church, so I wouldn't be surprised if he went into the ministry. 

[Melissa1977]

4 hours ago, formergothardite said:

I'm not sure, but last year he was some sort of a pastor intern at a very fundie church, so I wouldn't be surprised if he went into the ministry. 

Maybe preaching is a good job in USA, but I always wonder if there's business enough for that many people working in ministry. I mean, in all that quiverful families there's at least one son studying for being a pastor. How can all these man have jobs? It seem too much. Or maybe it's a cultural things...seminaries (catholic schools for future priests) are empty in my country.

[JermajestyDuggar]

3 hours ago, Melissa1977 said:

Maybe preaching is a good job in USA, but I always wonder if there's business enough for that many people working in ministry. I mean, in all that quiverful families there's at least one son studying for being a pastor. How can all these man have jobs? It seem too much. Or maybe it's a cultural things...seminaries (catholic schools for future priests) are empty in my country.

They learn how to beg for donations professionally.

[lizzybee]

Can't get hired by a church? Build your own. Do lots of sermons about tithing. Promise congregation that God will bless them if they give and not bless them if they don't. 

Don't feel like building a church? Become an evangelist. Tell everyone God wants you to save Scotland or Las Vegas, and go on deputation. Speak at every church who will have you and take up "love offerings." 

Don't feel like you're making enough money at your current church? Decide God wants you to save Pasadena, buy an RV and go on deputation. Do the same as the evangelist above and save money until you can afford to move to a wealthier area for your soul winning church.  Go door to door there handing out tracts and fliers harassing wealthier people for Jesus. 

[Palimpsest]

5 hours ago, Melissa1977 said:

Maybe preaching is a good job in USA, but I always wonder if there's business enough for that many people working in ministry. I mean, in all that quiverful families there's at least one son studying for being a pastor. How can all these man have jobs? It seem too much. Or maybe it's a cultural things...seminaries (catholic schools for future priests) are empty in my country.

Anyone can hang out a shingle in the USA and call themselves a pastor - no training necessary.  A lot of these Fundie pastors don't rely on a salary or stipend from their home or store front "church."  They have part or full time jobs too.  

Real estate sales, construction, and landscaping are very popular.  We've also noticed before how many of them are used car salesmen.  Same skill set, when you think about it, and references aren't always required.

22 hours ago, GreyhoundFan said:

The Business of Jesus. Just Kidding, sort of. I have no idea.  These folks make Jesus seem like a business.

No kidding, I have the impression that Business and Ministry are quite common dual majors in Bible Colleges.  I wish I were joking but I've seen that too often when checking out Fundies who actually went to college!  

[SassyPants]

The home church- where every man can be a Pastor.

[Melissa1977]

1 hour ago, Palimpsest said:

 

No kidding, I have the impression that Business and Ministry are quite common dual majors in Bible Colleges.  I wish I were joking but I've seen that too often when checking out Fundies who actually went to college!  

I'm not a believer, but sometimes I think I respect more Jesus than most fundies. Business in the church...it's just the opposite of His beliefs!!!

[Palimpsest]

2 minutes ago, Melissa1977 said:

I'm not a believer, but sometimes I think I respect more Jesus than most fundies. Business in the church...it's just the opposite of His beliefs!!!

Yeah.  I seem to remember Jesus losing his temper and flipping tables over that.

[BeccaGrim]

At least 

On 8/10/2016 at 4:43 PM, Palimpsest said:

Yeah.  I seem to remember Jesus losing his temper and flipping tables over that.

At Alyssa and Erin married men with jobs.  Michael did too, but its basically setting him up for the same pastor path.  The Duggar girls marry nothing but. 

[Palimpsest]

1 hour ago, BeccaGrim said:

At least 

At Alyssa and Erin married men with jobs.  Michael did too, but its basically setting him up for the same pastor path.  The Duggar girls marry nothing but. 

Alyssa married a man who was working in Daddy's business and Daddy is steeped in IBLP.  Erin married a man who is working in an IBLP approved business and whose Daddy is a big shot at IBLP.  Michael married a man who is out-and-out working for IBLP.  

IBLP is, if not actually on the rocks, dwindling in power.

The Duggar girls appear to be marrying men of a slightly different stripe.  More Calvinist than Baptist but definitely Fundies.  Not all Fundies are IBLP/Gothardite.

So what was your point?

 

 

[Melissa1977]

8 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

Alyssa married a man who was working in Daddy's business and Daddy is steeped in IBLP.  Erin married a man who is working in an IBLP approved business and whose Daddy is a big shot at IBLP.  Michael married a man who is out-and-out working for IBLP.  

IBLP is, if not actually on the rocks, dwindling in power.

The Duggar girls appear to be marrying men of a slightly different stripe.  More Calvinist than Baptist but definitely Fundies.  Not all Fundies are IBLP/Gothardite.

So what was your point?

 

 

Chad works in a metal factory and John works both in an air conditioning and a cleaning business. No matter the business owner is a relative or a IBLP member, these men are not working in a ministry but in a secular work. It doesn't make them better than other fundies but at least they'll be able to get a job if the cult fails or they leave it, plus these earnings are more reliable to maintain a family than ministry earnings (I'm sure Chad and Erin will never live in a tent as Schaders). Lots of people work in their relatives/friends/neighbours business, people tend to employ people they know and trust.

Maybe Zach prays about his job before going to patrol, maybe he preaches to the arrested people, but it doesn't make him a pastor, he's a policeman with his earnings and his medical assurance and his future retirement payment.

So yes, having a secular job makes things different than being a pastor. No matter how much fundie you are or your boss is.

(I know some pastors make good earnings, but I see in internet lots of fundies trying to live on ministry and being extremely poor).

[season of life]

To me, the difference is that some fundies choose a career path that is relatively stable. Zach works for the police, he can continue doing that. John and Chad don't seem to be struggling. Other fundies rely way too much on stuff like print shops or church assistance. 

[BeccaGrim]

13 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

Alyssa married a man who was working in Daddy's business and Daddy is steeped in IBLP.  Erin married a man who is working in an IBLP approved business and whose Daddy is a big shot at IBLP.  Michael married a man who is out-and-out working for IBLP.  

IBLP is, if not actually on the rocks, dwindling in power.

The Duggar girls appear to be marrying men of a slightly different stripe.  More Calvinist than Baptist but definitely Fundies.  Not all Fundies are IBLP/Gothardite.

So what was your point?

 

 

I guess this was because we were talking about all the pastors--how all of them are trying to be pastors. And I was thinking that in terms of the Duggar girls.  That the Duggar girls are marrying men who want to do that and that Erin and Alyssa's husbands don't seem to be on that path.  I'm sorry if I wasn't clearer. 

[SassyPants]

The only Duggar in laws are Anna, Derick and Ben, and beyond the TLC gig, none of them is currently employed as far as I can tell. Perhaps they all provide a service for JB in exchange for some tangibles, but that's about it. Admittedly, I'm not really sure about Derick. IMO, he quit WM to sign on FT with TLC and unfortunately, with the scandal and show cancellation, he had to do something else for money. I think the ministry piece was a bailout favor called in as neither of the Dillards had the qualifications to become paid for mission workers and did not even have the language skills necessary to live in a Spanish speaking country.

In addition, Josh, Jessa and Jill do not have paid jobs independent of TLC either.

Compare that to the married Bateses (adults and their spouses)...not even close, folks.

Basics to basics comparison. Start with A job, that is NOT TLC or daddy funded. A living space that is not daddy or GM funded. A car that is not daddy supplied. 

[sunshine]

It is possible the JB may fund his children marriage, but I wonder if it has to do with that he doesn't want them to struggle like JB and Michelle did when they were married and possible the concern that they will need to postpone having babies. If this is the case, it is a part of grown up that young couples will struggle for awhile but it build character and makes them depend on one another. Giving them an easy life, what does that teach? Then, again, I am sure the wealthy to ultra-wealthy do the same for their kids (ie. stay at one of my many homes until you get on your  feet.).

[OyToTheVey]

BTW I see nothing wrong with working for a family business. I'm the manager at my dads business. I'm practically running this place and being my own boss. A lot of my family is in family business. My dad trusts me and it's ridiculously hard to hire good people. Plus all the money is in the family. Why pay someone when a family member needs a job? Also why would I want to work for another boss in a management position when I can make my dad money and he gives it to me. 

 

So I can't really fault John or Chad for helping their family business. However, I do think Ben needs to wake up and not be a JB mooch. He'll be sorry when he has 12 kids he can't support and a father in law that ran out of money.

[LawsonBatesEgo]

I think the difference is that John Webster works for an actual legitimate business (and being air conditioners in Florida, I imagine they do well) that just happens to be owned by family member, while Bin cleaned a toilet for Jim Jong Boob so JJB could try and claim on TV that Bin does paid work & can support Jessa. 

It sounds better than the truth: This 19 year old with 0 employable skills is about to marry our sheltered uneducated daughter. We're going along with it because she's sassy and a bit desperate to get out of the house, so hopefully she'll be pregnant ASAP so she can't go rogue. Of cource, we'll be paying for everything with this sweet TLC money....thanks for watching btw!'. 

 

[faraway]

The air conditioning business is owned by congressman Daniel Webster, it's where he employs his uneducated sons. I doubt they make a lot of money, John wouldn't be cleaning on the side if things were great. I also think they're renting, so no free houses like in Duggarland and in a more expensive area.

I'm sure financially Ben is much better off, simply with the TLC money. He got lucky.

[HereticHick]

35 minutes ago, faraway said:

The air conditioning business is owned by congressman Daniel Webster, it's where he employs his uneducated sons. I doubt they make a lot of money, John wouldn't be cleaning on the side if things were great. I also think they're renting, so no free houses like in Duggarland and in a more expensive area.

I'm sure financially Ben is much better off, simply with the TLC money. He got lucky.

Counterpoint: Why couldn't John be cleaning on the side because he has a strong work ethic, and is saving money to say, buy a house?  I'm sorry, but I'm not going to snark on John for working two jobs--or for being an A/V tech. I'm not going to snark on Alyssa for working with him on his side business, either.

[faraway]

I wasn't snarking the least about him working two jobs, that does show good work ethic indeed. I was just speculating that it probably didn't pay too well.

I was just saying that unemployable Ben makes probably more cash than equally unemployable John. Before moving to AR, Ben worked fixing windshields with his dad, seems pretty comparable to John's situation. Bin got financially lucky with his courtship and wedding. If John had that kind of cashflow from UPTV, maybe he would quit his dayjob too, who knows.

 

[LawsonBatesEgo]

1 hour ago, faraway said:

The air conditioning business is owned by congressman Daniel Webster, it's where he employs his uneducated sons. I doubt they make a lot of money, John wouldn't be cleaning on the side if things were great. I also think they're renting, so no free houses like in Duggarland and in a more expensive area.

I'm sure financially Ben is much better off, simply with the TLC money. He got lucky.

What I meant was that there will always be a market for installing and repairing air conditioners in Florida so they (as in, the family business) likely does well in terms of always having business/clients/work to do, especially in the summer months. 

They're equally undereducated, but John at least has learned the ropes of the family business and has a 'real' job that isn't being Gil Bates Bitch. And I think it is a good thing he is willing to get in and do cleaning jobs to bring in extra money. Can you picture Bin and Jessa going and cleaning buildings after hours to bring in money for Spurg? Because I can't lol. 

 

 

[HereticHick]

15 hours ago, faraway said:

I wasn't snarking the least about him working two jobs, that does show good work ethic indeed. I was just speculating that it probably didn't pay too well.

I was just saying that unemployable Ben makes probably more cash than equally unemployable John. Before moving to AR, Ben worked fixing windshields with his dad, seems pretty comparable to John's situation. Bin got financially lucky with his courtship and wedding. If John had that kind of cashflow from UPTV, maybe he would quit his dayjob too, who knows.

 

So working as an HVAC technician = "unemployable"?  

I'm sure you don't mean to do so, but your comment comes off as a pretty broad-based snear at anyone not working a white-collar desk job.

[Kira]

For some reason I" love" defending Ben Seewald 

Ben is not unemployed. He works for Discovery. He gets paid thousands of dollars an episode.

 Ben is not undereducated(I don't understand why people keep saying this) or unemployable. He had two jobs when he met Jessa( fixing windows and insurance agent) I think he quit those jobs because of JB TLC money. For some reason reality stars get hate for not having "real jobs" (including the millionaire Kardashians), so he says he works for Jim Bob. Jim Bob does have real estate so it is possible that Ben works for JB .  I think for now they're relying on the TLC paychecks.  I do wonder if Ben will become a pastor after he graduates. After looking at Derrick's recent social media activity, I'm starting to think he has a job lined up after he and Jill are done with their missionary work. I think Ben and Derick(and Jeremy) will be fine. They have educations and work experience. The "problem" is that they're getting paid a lot of money to do "nothing". I'll judge them if they are unemployed after TLC.

 

 

 

[Shouldabeenacowboy]

We can argue about the level of education (or lack thereof) of John, Ben, and all others who have been educated Duggar/Bates style, but purely focusing on the jobs they hold, working as a HVAC technician and cleaning in the evenings is nothing to snark on.

I find plenty to snark on about (1) getting paid to lounge around Duggarville with money that's coming in purely because your in-laws spent 20 years reproducing (Ben); (2) leaving a solid, full-time job to go tell other people that they need to believe in your Jeebus (Derick).

Joshley I can't even.

[LawsonBatesEgo]

3 hours ago, Shouldabeenacowboy said:

We can argue about the level of education (or lack thereof) of John, Ben, and all others who have been educated Duggar/Bates style, but purely focusing on the jobs they hold, working as a HVAC technician and cleaning in the evenings is nothing to snark on.

I find plenty to snark on about (1) getting paid to lounge around Duggarville with money that's coming in purely because your in-laws spent 20 years reproducing (Ben); (2) leaving a solid, full-time job to go tell other people that they need to believe in your Jeebus (Derick).

Joshley I can't even.

Yes! I'd rather see someone fix air conditioners by day and clean in the evenings (John Webster) than someone quit their solid full time job with benefits when they have a baby to go to a very dangerous country and tell Catholic heathens in Central America that they are doing Jeebus wrong......when their country has far bigger problems to deal with than how they praise Jeebus. 

Poor Jilly Muffin.....she probably thought she'd married the smart and reasonable one with a respectable career until the lord called him to throw it all in and stop bathing.