Jessa, Ben, and Spurgeon part 4

[foreign fundie]

3 hours ago, Mercer said:

I would just think Jessa would be bored if she's leaving stuff like that to Ben. She doesn't work outside the home, doesn't appear to have a regular volunteer commitment, doesn't ever seem to read, write, create art, or make any crafts. She appears to have few outside friends and little to no outside interests.

So if she's routinely skipping basic tasks in the home also... what exactly does she do with herself? That's the part I don't get. Most homemakers are plenty busy, but Jessa does not appear to be.

Well, I can hazard a guess. I do not own a hair dryer but once a year or so when I have my hair trimmed at the hair dresser, I am always annoyed at how long it takes to blow dry. If Jessa looks as groomed in normal life as she does on social media, that could take a considerable chunk of time out of her day.

Then she has to check what people say about her. With all the duggar fan and snark forums out there, and with the gossip magazines and social media, that is a huge job. I bet she and Ben spend a lot of time reading the evil media. FJers know an hour is nothing when you get into a thread.

Then there is the work of maintaining their social media image and preparing and filming for their show. That may not be a full time job, but it would keep them busy for a day or two a week.

With her large family, and close knit qf community, there are lots of social events. Birthdays, baby showers, anniversaries, engagements and weddings, where she will be expected to contribute gifts and food. And just general socializing and baby show off time at the TTH.

I bet they also have fan mail to read/ respond to. Appointments to book and admin to keep. Church visits, Bible studies, church events, ATI stuff and there is Spurge and the quality time as a couple. All of this may not seem a productive way of living, but I can see how they could fill their days....

[DuggarWatch]

6 hours ago, librarychick said:

She doesn't have to do any household tasks because she has plenty of J'Slaves at her disposal now that she is a "MOTHER" (insert harp music, angels and halos here).  Maybe she does whatever the hell it is that J'Chelle does all day.  (Bascially nothing).  

She is her mother's daughter and the apple doesn't fall far from that tree. 

[Defrauding Feminist ESQ]

11 hours ago, Bad Wolf said:

I wonder what she will feed Spurge when the time comes. Baby food in a jar? Canned peas while he's lying down? Baby food is so easy to make, and costs hardly anything.

Is baby food in a jar bad?  I'm genuinely asking - I don't have kids yet, and I always assumed that's what most parents of baby food-age kids fed them

[Apricot]

17 minutes ago, Defrauding Feminist ESQ said:

Is baby food in a jar bad?  I'm genuinely asking - I don't have kids yet, and I always assumed that's what most parents of baby food-age kids fed them

It has its uses but it's like eating ready meals every day of your life.  Its not as good as proper fresh food, those jars have use by dates of over a year generally so obviously have things added to keep them good for that long.  Not sure what they're like in the US but in the UK they are generally made artificially sweet using things like fruit puree in savoury meals which means sometimes babies who are used to them turn their noses up at normal home cooked meals that don't have the sweet crap in them. 

[DuggarWatch]

30 minutes ago, Defrauding Feminist ESQ said:

Is baby food in a jar bad?  I'm genuinely asking - I don't have kids yet, and I always assumed that's what most parents of baby food-age kids fed them

http://www.thealphaparent.com/2013/02/the-truth-about-baby-food-jars.html

If you have a food processor or a blender, you can make your own baby food.

[Defrauding Feminist ESQ]

10 minutes ago, Apricot said:

It has its uses but it's like eating ready meals every day of your life.  Its not as good as proper fresh food, those jars have use by dates of over a year generally so obviously have things added to keep them good for that long.  Not sure what they're like in the US but in the UK they are generally made artificially sweet using things like fruit puree in savoury meals which means sometimes babies who are used to them turn their noses up at normal home cooked meals that don't have the sweet crap in them. 

That makes sense!  I honestly just never thought about it.  Another thing to add to the list of things to learn about before my husband and I decide to have babies

[Apricot]

Just now, Defrauding Feminist ESQ said:

That makes sense!  I honestly just never thought about it.  Another thing to add to the list of things to learn about before my husband and I decide to have babies

In all honesty I didn't think about it until my eldest was close to weaning age.  Look up Baby Led Weaning - it's great,  My girls eat exactly what we eat - it's so much easier than messing around pureeing food and also means mum can eat her food while it's still hot! 

[Iokaste]

Is it normal and widespread to let your kid go through a babyfood-period in the US? 
I never see anyone use it here, unless they are travelling or something like that. My friends' kids seem to go from milk to milk/porridge to eating whatever the rest of the family eats, modified if necessary ofcourse. 

[Denim Jumper]

23 hours ago, anotherone said:

What's the difference really?  The both of them will just always wear baggy clothes and never be caught dead at the beach with a swimsuit, pregnancies or not. 

I must confess that's the one thing I'm a little envious of: they don't have to deal with the pressure of fitting back into skinny jeans or a normal bathing suit.

As far as snarking on post-baby bodies... especially with my last two, I worked out right up until I was practically crowning, and it still took time and effort to bounce back. So, I'm not going to snark on any new mom, because it is tough to get your body, and the fact is that (barring surgical help) some of those changes are permanent.

[quiverofdoubt]

49 minutes ago, Apricot said:

In all honesty I didn't think about it until my eldest was close to weaning age.  Look up Baby Led Weaning - it's great,  My girls eat exactly what we eat - it's so much easier than messing around pureeing food and also means mum can eat her food while it's still hot! 

I initially planned on making all my own baby food. Even had some prepped. Then I discovered baby led weaning and fell in love. We never did traditional "baby food" in any way.  Breast milk only till she was ready developmentally to eat food, then (safe) real food. So much easier, and there's no transition from mush to real food. 

[anotherone]

13 hours ago, divadivine said:

How could you live in a house with 21 people, be raised to be a Godly helpmeet and not know how to follow a recipe? Seriously, if you can read and follow directions you should be able to make a meal. It doesn't need to be super fancy. I like to cook, so maybe it's easier for me? But if you're pretty much raised to be a wife & a baby making factory, you should be able to cook a few things. Not just TTC or chickenetti. Hello, pin recipes on Pinterest or get things off the internet. Not hard. 

Maybe part of it is knowing math.  If you want to halve a recipe or double it, and it says 2/3 cup sugar, maybe they have trouble understanding what to do.  If you went to regular school you probably don't think twice about those things but maybe they get intimidated.

9 hours ago, Mercer said:

Maybe Ben does all the cooking in the family?

We definitely would have heard about that if it was the case.

[Denim Jumper]

All of my kids refused spoon-feeding and the typical baby fare of cereals and purees, so I didn't even bother with it. Once they were around 9 months or so, I started giving them little chunks of soft fruits and veggies (bananas, peaches, peas, carrots, sweet potatoes, etc), little shreds of chicken or turkey, small bits of ground beef, cubes of bread. Anything they could feed themselves and mash with their gums. This was before baby-led weaning was a thing, so I just kind of winged it. Much to the chagrin of my MIL, who (naturally) assumed I was just too lazy and negligent to spoon pureed foods into their mouths 3 times a day. Yeah, you got me figured out, lady; I just hand the baby some Cheetos, and kick back with a box of wine while I watch my stories.

[ksgranola1]

1 hour ago, Defrauding Feminist ESQ said:

Is baby food in a jar bad?  I'm genuinely asking - I don't have kids yet, and I always assumed that's what most parents of baby food-age kids fed them

There's always the worry that some baby food will be recalled. It happened twice when my first was born. Apple juice and peas. So I made my own. I had a hand grinder from Sears but now they have mini processors. at least I knew where that food came from & who had touched it. When my grandson was ready for real food I made his.

Something I noticed about Spurgeon. He was born w/a perfectly round head. First baby, really big too, and no molding whatsoever. I smell a rat. Could the whole home birth thing have been staged & she really had a section?  How would it look if both she & Jill had to have sections? In all the years I worked in OB, I never saw a fist time mother deliver a baby w/a perfectly round head.

Hmmmm.......

 

[Defrauding Feminist ESQ]

1 hour ago, Iokaste said:

Is it normal and widespread to let your kid go through a babyfood-period in the US? 
I never see anyone use it here, unless they are travelling or something like that. My friends' kids seem to go from milk to milk/porridge to eating whatever the rest of the family eats, modified if necessary ofcourse. 

I honestly don't know.  My friends don't have kids yet, and I can't remember what my nieces and nephews were fed (they live 3-4 hours away, so I don't see them all the time, and the babyfood period is fairly short, right?).  I hope that when I have kids I use it mostly only when traveling, or in a jam (if there's a weeklong snowstorm and I can't get to the store).  This list of things to think about/consider/prepare for before Mr. Feminist and I start looking into pregnancy/adoption is getting longer and longer.  And I'm 100% sure we will prep wrong and figure it out along the way - but that's how everyone does it, right? 

**I'm starting to get serious baby fever, so every time I see something I hadn't really considered, I fall down a rabbit hole

20 minutes ago, ksgranola1 said:

There's always the worry that some baby food will be recalled. It happened twice when my first was born. Apple juice and peas. So I made my own. I had a hand grinder from Sears but now they have mini processors. at least I knew where that food came from & who had touched it. When my grandson was ready for real food I made his.

Something I noticed about Spurgeon. He was born w/a perfectly round head. First baby, really big too, and no molding whatsoever. I smell a rat. Could the whole home birth thing have been staged & she really had a section?  How would it look if both she & Jill had to have sections? In all the years I worked in OB, I never saw a fist time mother deliver a baby w/a perfectly round head.

Hmmmm.......

 

That is terrifying.  Did you freak out?  I can't imagine how scared I would be.

[JesSky03]

We married at 20 years old so I had limited cooking knowledge. My parents cooked very basic meals like pork chops and canned peas (yuck). The first year of our marriage we ate a lot of hamburger helper and boxed meals, and lots of spaghetti, but hey at least I was cooking. I slowly started trying out new recipes and now 5 years later I can't remember the last time we made a boxed meal. Follow the directions of a recipe and it's not hard. Eventually you learn to play around with adding different spices or vegetables or whatever to the dish. 

[Iokaste]

2 minutes ago, Defrauding Feminist ESQ said:

I honestly don't know.  My friends don't have kids yet, and I can't remember what my nieces and nephews were fed (they live 3-4 hours away, so I don't see them all the time, and the babyfood period is fairly short, right?).  I hope that when I have kids I use it mostly only when traveling, or in a jam (if there's a weeklong snowstorm and I can't get to the store).  This list of things to think about/consider/prepare for before Mr. Feminist and I start looking into pregnancy/adoption is getting longer and longer.  And I'm 100% sure we will prep wrong and figure it out along the way - but that's how everyone does it, right? 

**I'm starting to get serious baby fever, so every time I see something I hadn't really considered, I fall down a rabbit hole

And here I thought I was in a relationship with Mr. Feminist! :-P 

Preparing for feminist-parenting seems to add a whole new level of unforseen bases to cover, doesn't it? 

 

[ksgranola1]

10 minutes ago, Defrauding Feminist ESQ said:

I honestly don't know.  My friends don't have kids yet, and I can't remember what my nieces and nephews were fed (they live 3-4 hours away, so I don't see them all the time, and the babyfood period is fairly short, right?).  I hope that when I have kids I use it mostly only when traveling, or in a jam (if there's a weeklong snowstorm and I can't get to the store).  This list of things to think about/consider/prepare for before Mr. Feminist and I start looking into pregnancy/adoption is getting longer and longer.  And I'm 100% sure we will prep wrong and figure it out along the way - but that's how everyone does it, right? 

**I'm starting to get serious baby fever, so every time I see something I hadn't really considered, I fall down a rabbit hole

That is terrifying.  Did you freak out?  I can't imagine how scared I would be.

Yeah, I totally freaked. The peas were reported to have too hi a sodium content so they stopped putting salt in all the foods. So they were blah. When I made my own, I put a small pinch in.

[Defrauding Feminist ESQ]

1 minute ago, Iokaste said:

And here I thought I was in a relationship with Mr. Feminist! :-P 

Preparing for feminist-parenting seems to add a whole new level of unforseen bases to cover, doesn't it? 

 

Kind of, but I was raised by such a feminist household (and in large part, so was my husband), so it just seems normal to me.  My mom is a powerhouse lawyer, and my dad moved his office into our house so he could take us to school, etc.  We also had a nanny some of the time because my dad sometimes had really long work trips (as did my mom), but my dad worked to make sure he could be home.  He earned less than my mom, did the laundry, and it was just never weird to me.  It was also never weird that my mom kept her maiden name, or that my dad has never worn a wedding band (he hates all jewelry/watches). My husband was mostly raised by his mom, his aunts, and his grandparents.  They're southern, and many are very conservative politically, but they're surprisingly feminist.  The women always ran the show.  And it's probably no different for him now LOL.

 

I expect the hardest part will be dealing with others' comments/responses to me.  Not doing enough in my career for the feminists (a couple of people told me I have to "give back my feminist card" bc I changed my name), and doing too much in my career/not being home enough for non-feminists.  The idea of never being able to "have it all" or strike the right balance for me is terrifying. 

 

What unforeseen bases have you run into @Iokaste?  I'm curious!

[justmy2cents]

33 minutes ago, ksgranola1 said:

Something I noticed about Spurgeon. He was born w/a perfectly round head. First baby, really big too, and no molding whatsoever. I smell a rat. Could the whole home birth thing have been staged & she really had a section?  How would it look if both she & Jill had to have sections? In all the years I worked in OB, I never saw a fist time mother deliver a baby w/a perfectly round head.

Hmmmm.......

 

Did we see his head without a hat on right after birth?  In any case, my one and only came out with a perfectly round head so I know it's possible.

[nst]

something struck me last night - in most episodes of 19 kids even when she was not engaged or engaged Jessa sat in the living room of TTH - now she does it in her own home with her kid.  I get the impression that all she had to do was pack for trips and teach (instruct) the howlers in education. 

i think she led a pretty easy life - opposed to the others 

as for not cooking - she was always at the TTH when she was married - you see it in every ep - so why would she cook at her own home 

she can't leave - that is why she was always at the TTH - and they did take out her and Ben 

so next week's episodes of her on a date - is another random filmiing scene. 

[Iokaste]

8 minutes ago, Defrauding Feminist ESQ said:

Kind of, but I was raised by such a feminist household (and in large part, so was my husband), so it just seems normal to me.  My mom is a powerhouse lawyer, and my dad moved his office into our house so he could take us to school, etc.  We also had a nanny some of the time because my dad sometimes had really long work trips (as did my mom), but my dad worked to make sure he could be home.  He earned less than my mom, did the laundry, and it was just never weird to me.  It was also never weird that my mom kept her maiden name, or that my dad has never worn a wedding band (he hates all jewelry/watches). My husband was mostly raised by his mom, his aunts, and his grandparents.  They're southern, and many are very conservative politically, but they're surprisingly feminist.  The women always ran the show.  And it's probably no different for him now LOL.

 

I expect the hardest part will be dealing with others' comments/responses to me.  Not doing enough in my career for the feminists (a couple of people told me I have to "give back my feminist card" bc I changed my name), and doing too much in my career/not being home enough for non-feminists.  The idea of never being able to "have it all" or strike the right balance for me is terrifying. 

 

What unforeseen bases have you run into @Iokaste?  I'm curious!

My parents were pretty feminist too: no shared name, lots of litterature by female authors, political discussion at the dinner table, etc. and I'm sure they'd swear they'd raised us equal, but no they didn't, I was generally raised to take on a lot more responsibility both practically and emotionally than my brother, even if we are very close in age. 

To me bodily autonomy is a big thing and an interesting subject when dealing with child rearing, how do you combine the parents responsibility (showers, dental hygiene, clean clothes helathy food), with raising a child with a firm knowlegde and sense of "My Body, My Choice"?

Gender expression, how do you keep your own blind spots in check, so you don't push a "princesses are bad"-feeling on a princessy-child? Or stop them from forming a "boys-activities are cool, girls-activities are icky and sissy" worldview, when the rest of the world seems to push it?

How do you teach a child to be at once firm in it's sense of selfe, yet accomodating and peaceseeking? (to me that's feminist, it might not be to others)

How do you teach by example and make sure to not pass on unrealised prejudices towards gender, race, ability and class? 

Do you strive for gender-neutrality until the child is old enough to express gender?

That's just some of the things I'm trying to sort out, I'd love to hear your ideas and input :-) 

 

 

[RootBeerFloat]

1 hour ago, quiverofdoubt said:

I initially planned on making all my own baby food. Even had some prepped. Then I discovered baby led weaning and fell in love. We never did traditional "baby food" in any way.  Breast milk only till she was ready developmentally to eat food, then (safe) real food. So much easier, and there's no transition from mush to real food. 

We've done BLW with all 4. I have to say the pouches that came out between my #2 and #3 are damn convenient. Unsweetened, 100% fruit that can be thrown in the bag and taken along to all of the big siblings' events is brilliant. The reusable pouches are great too for self-feeding homemade applesauce or yogurt or smoothies. 

[RabbitKM]

9 minutes ago, Iokaste said:

My parents were pretty feminist too: no shared name, lots of litterature by female authors, political discussion at the dinner table, etc. and I'm sure they'd swear they'd raised us equal, but no they didn't, I was generally raised to take on a lot more responsibility both practically and emotionally than my brother, even if we are very close in age. 

To me bodily autonomy is a big thing and an interesting subject when dealing with child rearing, how do you combine the parents responsibility (showers, dental hygiene, clean clothes helathy food), with raising a child with a firm knowlegde and sense of "My Body, My Choice"?

Gender expression, how do you keep your own blind spots in check, so you don't push a "princesses are bad"-feeling on a princessy-child? Or stop them from forming a "boys-activities are cool, girls-activities are icky and sissy" worldview, when the rest of the world seems to push it?

How do you teach a child to be at once firm in it's sense of selfe, yet accomodating and peaceseeking? (to me that's feminist, it might not be to others)

How do you teach by example and make sure to not pass on unrealised prejudices towards gender, race, ability and class? 

Do you strive for gender-neutrality until the child is old enough to express gender?

That's just some of the things I'm trying to sort out, I'd love to hear your ideas and input :-) 

 

 

I am by no way a child expert, nor do I have any kids of my own, but I think just the fact that you are asking yourself these questions means you are doing a great job!  There are no "correct" answers to your questions, especially bc every child is different so what works for one isn't going to work for another (even in the same family). 

[SnazzyNazzy]

I'm lazy as all get out, and managed to make my own baby food. I would throw whatever we were having for dinner, into the food processor, and then put it in ice cube trays to freeze it (insta baby size portion). 

I bought the jar baby food too, for when we weren't eating at home. It's always fun, to give your kid, baby food prunes, right before you go to the inlaws....

[Defrauding Feminist ESQ]

2 minutes ago, Iokaste said:

My parents were pretty feminist too: no shared name, lots of litterature by female authors, political discussion at the dinner table, etc. and I'm sure they'd swear they'd raised us equal, but no they didn't, I was generally raised to take on a lot more responsibility both practically and emotionally than my brother, even if we are very close in age. 

To me bodily autonomy is a big thing and an interesting subject when dealing with child rearing, how do you combine the parents responsibility (showers, dental hygiene, clean clothes helathy food), with raising a child with a firm knowlegde and sense of "My Body, My Choice"?

Gender expression, how do you keep your own blind spots in check, so you don't push a "princesses are bad"-feeling on a princessy-child? Or stop them from forming a "boys-activities are cool, girls-activities are icky and sissy" worldview, when the rest of the world seems to push it?

How do you teach a child to be at once firm in it's sense of selfe, yet accomodating and peaceseeking? (to me that's feminist, it might not be to others)

How do you teach by example and make sure to not pass on unrealised prejudices towards gender, race, ability and class? 

Do you strive for gender-neutrality until the child is old enough to express gender?

That's just some of the things I'm trying to sort out, I'd love to hear your ideas and input :-) 

 

 

For the "my body, my choice" thing, I want to make sure my future kids are ALWAYS able to say "no I don't want to hug that person" even if it's grandma or something.  Teaching kids from a very young age that no means no in all situations regarding personal touch is important, I think.  Touch will never be a punishment.  I think this is at least equally important for boys, so they don't see touching as a method of punishment/control from day one. 

I think it will be really hard to not push some gender stereotypes (i.e., wearing pink vs. blue) on children when they're really young, but I don't think that's a bad thing, as long as they always know that they can change their expression.  I'll likely have a different style of nursery for a boy or a girl, dress the girl in more dresses/girly outfits as a baby, etc.  But as soon as she says she wants to play basketball, or the boy says he wants to ice skate, that's fine!  And if they want all princesses all the time, that's fine too.  I literally went from princess to tomboy as a young kid, and I think that's common - it's all about encouraging them to be curious and "try on" different activities/behaviors. 

I also think one way to avoid the "boys activities vs. girls activities" is to encourage as many co-ed playdates.  Teach them that all activities are for everyone.  They can play princess tea time or play soccer.  Hopefully participating in a variety of activities with both boys and girls will show that anyone can have fun with either activity, and that there's nothing inherently right/wrong/superior/inferior about the activities or boys/girls participating in a specific activity. 

 

How do you think you'll be similar/different?  I'm loving this discussion, by the way