Now back to your regularly scheduled Alexanders...

[formergothardite]

I honestly don't get Lori. She bashes people for having nannies when she said her nanny was sent from God and bashes men for working constantly when not only was Ken gone most of the time the children were young because of his job, when he was home he avoided being with them. She rivals Raquel when it comes to lacking self-awareness. She does not and never did practice what she preaches.

[usmcmom]

I honestly don't get Lori. She bashes people for having nannies when she said her nanny was sent from God and bashes men for working constantly when not only was Ken gone most of the time the children were young because of his job, when he was home he avoided being with them. She rivals Raquel when it comes to lacking self-awareness. She does not and never did practice what she preaches.

Plus, very recently she said that if a family needs more than one income, the husband should work multiple jobs sot he wife can BE HOME WITH THE KIDS. She is counseling young fathers to work two or three jobs and then complaining that they are not home enough.

I think Lori's problem with her blog is that she writes about the same topic all the time; therefore giving herself too may opportunities to be inconsistent.

[Firiel]

I think Lori's problem with her blog is that she writes about the same topic all the time; therefore giving herself too may opportunities to be inconsistent. she's really, really dumb.

There. Fixed that for you. 8-)

[usmcmom]

There. Fixed that for you. 8-)

Thanks. Boy, do I feel silly. :embarrassed:

[formergothardite]

She must be incredible dumb because Ken says she writes these posts in advance. So she is sitting there writing blog posts one day and not realizing that she is contradicting herself.

[Tiger Lily]

She must be incredible dumb because Ken says she writes these posts in advance. So she is sitting there writing blog posts one day and not realizing that she is contradicting herself.

LOL, that doesn't say much for her intellect, does it?

BTW, has anyone noticed that Lorken hasn't mentioned one word about the exodus of CM and our part in it (according to them, anyway)? Are they trying to ignore us/hoping we'll go away given our knowledge of their um, real estate? Oh, if it were only so! Then again, what would Lori have to write about if she couldn't slam us? I suppose she could disparage our good virtue anonymously as in today's post because you KNOW that's what it's all about. :nenner: to you, Lorken.

[Curious]

Lori's daily bitch and moan:

Well bless your vile little heart....it must be a real burden to not be able to talk about hitting kids without the internet being mean to you. :roll:

I think it's possible for people to write about spanking without being blasted and called a child abuser. I think it's not possible for LORI because she doesn't advocate for mere spanking, but for child abuse.

Hitting your child with implements and saying things like "spank harder" is not just the the average little swat on a diapered butt that a reasonable person considers a spanking.

I'm not a fan of spanking, myself, but I don't necessarily think that ALL spanking is abuse. What the Pearl's teach and what Lori advocates, however, is not reasonable and is dangerous. That is why you can't write about it without blow back, Lori (or Ken since Lori isn't allowed to read here :roll: )

[usmcmom]

LOL, that doesn't say much for her intellect, does it?

BTW, has anyone noticed that Lorken hasn't mentioned one word about the exodus of CM and our part in it (according to them, anyway)? Are they trying to ignore us/hoping we'll go away given our knowledge of their um, real estate? Oh, if it were only so! Then again, what would Lori have to write about if she couldn't slam us? I suppose she could disparage our good virtue anonymously as in today's post because you KNOW that's what it's all about. :nenner: to you, Lorken.

I have two ideas about this (the bolded). Either Lori has written several scheduled posts about submission and hasn't worked her rant about us into the schedule yet, or they've decided to not address it at all. I think not addressing it would be the rational thing to do; so I fully expect to see a scathing rant any day now. :lol:

[usmcmom]

Given Ken's "friendship" with Cabinet Man, I find myself hoping that he will follow through on his suspicion (remember, even he asked CM what he was so afraid of from being found) and do what he can to check on CM's wife. I know, I know. It's silly of me to think Ken might have that kind of compassion, but I think even he knows something is not right in that home. I really wish we could count on him to use what contact information he has to see what's going on with them. Then again, I can easily imagine a situation where Mrs. CM reaches out to Ken and Lori only to have them turn her away and shame her.

[jerkit]

Every time I see a Poe-y comment on Lori's blog, I wonder if it's Firiel :lol:

[Firiel]

Every time I see a Poe-y comment on Lori's blog, I wonder if it's Firiel :lol:

Nah, my computer IP is perma-blocked on Lori's blog. And I really hate typing on my phone. So it's probably not me.

Maybe I'll figure out a way someday, though!

[jerkit]

Nah, my computer IP is perma-blocked on Lori's blog. And I really hate typing on my phone. So it's probably not me.

Maybe I'll figure out a way someday, though!

My phone definitely is, I wonder if my home computer is? Hmmm, I shall try sometime.

[Firiel]

My phone definitely is, I wonder if my home computer is? Hmmm, I shall try sometime.

I would love to have a Poe conversation with myself on Lori's blog by using two different devices.

OH. So, when I was playing LuckyWife, I saw you mention something about the Book of Common Prayer on CM's blog and almost called you out for being an Episcopal (I hadn't formulated exactly why I thought that was evil, but it probably would have had something to do with the similarity to the Catholic church).

I decided against it 'cause I didn't want to just piss of FJers, regardless of how Fundie-like it would be.

[jerkit]

I would love to have a Poe conversation with myself on Lori's blog by using two different devices.

OH. So, when I was playing LuckyWife, I saw you mention something about the Book of Common Prayer on CM's blog and almost called you out for being an Episcopal (I hadn't formulated exactly why I thought that was evil, but it probably would have had something to do with the similarity to the Catholic church).

I decided against it 'cause I didn't want to just piss of FJers, regardless of how Fundie-like it would be.

This would've been brilliant. I bet that would've drawn out some serious crazy in CM. I was sort of trying to bait him with that, knowing he would rail against my female rector and my raging liberalism to the point that I'm not even a Christian, but sadly, it did not work. Shortly after that I realized he was also in a liturgical church and I decided it probably wasn't going to happen.

[Curious]

Trying this post again using the QUOTE feature instead of EDIT. I'm really sorry about that Koala. I'm usually so careful, but Lori had me all spooled up!

---

Lori's daily bitch and moan:

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyat ... -daughter/

One of the beating implements favored by the Williamses was a quarter-inch flexible plumbing line of the kind advocated by evangelist Michael Pearl and his wife Debi, who run No Greater Joy Ministry in Tennessee. The Pearls, in their best-selling self-published book “To Train Up a Child,” recommend that Christian parents physically discipline children as young as six months with “the same principles the Amish use to train their stubborn mules.”

To Richard Long, the Williamses’ pastor, their behavior might have been “loving” and “appropriate.” But Hana’s frozen corpse didn’t lie, and Judge Susan Cook wasn’t buying the good reverend’s apologia. Last week, she sentenced Larry Williams to almost 28 years in prison. His wife and co-defendant, who had arguably been the more enthusiastic abuser, received a 37-year term.

The sentences are the highest allowable under law.

Those seem like pretty strong punishments. Let's see what else we can find.

---

This is off topic for what I was trying to point out, but it's such a good post, I want to highlight it: http://sortacrunchy.typepad.com/sortacr ... treme.html

Here is a quote from it:

With attachment, even abusive parents feel a conviction to stop short of death usually. In older child adoption, attachment is sooo hard to form. This child is a stranger in your home, yet you are expected to call yourself parent. In the best of situations, its a scary yet thrilling dance to attach with this fully formed person. If you start HITTING them, they WILL retreat and will not attach. And, now you are responsible for a child who sees you not merely as a stranger but a monster. And, you rise to that monster with no small voice inside of you that tells you BACK AWAY FROM THE PLUMBING TUBING. In short, you create RAD; you teach them to fear, to cringe, and that response causes you to hit harder because that is precisely the 'heart issue' Pearl tells you to discipline out of them. And, eventually they are simply dead, you have beaten them to death nothing can be done to stop it.

So instead of continuing to look up criminal punishments and making my original point, I'm going to let this quote stand.

Maybe Ken and Lori will read it and LEARN something.

[2xx1xy1JD]

Perfect explanation of why the Pearl's methods are particularly toxic in older adoption cases.

I'm not a fan of any type of corporal punishment, but will acknowledge that some people who use it still manage to raise kids who turn out well enough. The spanking is just a small part of a larger parenting picture, and the parents love their child and bond with them and naturally want to see their kids as good. A baby is welcomed home and loved and cuddled and fed when hungry and changed when wet/dirty, and on a very deep level grows to know that the parents represent love and care and security. The thousand small things that are done every day are the real heart of the parenting. Spanking is a minor part, the parent who loves a child and feels that the child is good is unlikely to take things to extremes and the child who feels loved is less likely to act out or to take a hand-swat for going near a hot stove as a rejection.

[Koala]

From the comments:

Reader 1:

Lori, I get this, but what if the father is verbally abusive, always grumpy and irritated so that EVERYTHING is tough, hard, unloving love? Ken said he believe in leading through loving, but this is not the case in every home. Harsh angry words breed harsh angry children.

Lori Alexander:

No, not always. Children would rather have a father like that than no father at all. You give them a ton of tender love, pray earnestly for your husband then go about winning him without a word by your godly behavior. This is God's prescription for changing your husband and His way is the best way.

Reader 2:

Children would rather have a father, but not always in their own home. I've heard from kids whose fathers were abusive and how the children just wished their father would leave. Horrible, but true. Women are to be kind and loving to their husbands, but never can they let their children be mentally and physically abused and stand by.

Reader 3:

Exactly! My comment, which was erased for some reason, expressed similar thoughts.i spent my first 5 years in a home with a father who was mean and harsh. I was so glad when my mother left and I didn't have to live in constant fear. This kind of father is unbiblical. I'm not sure why Lori thinks kids want that kind of a father over none at all.

Nice. Lori is deleting comments made by abuse survivors because she knows they expose the fact that what she's saying isn't necessarily true. Instead of addressing and LEARNING from them, she deletes them- because anything she deletes totally doesn't exist. :roll:

I also like that someone called her on the fact that her "biblical parenting" isn't all that biblical when you think about it.

Reader:

Just a thought... I wonder if you'd be interested to looking into how mothers interacted with their children in ages past. In America certain aspects of child rearing have completely changed from what most other countries do and they're still doing it the way this great great great (x10) grandmother's did it. In America many people believe holding a baby too much or various other natural things will "spoil" a baby. Research shows that's not so, quite the opposite in fact. I know you put little stock in research if it contradicts the Bible but I don't believe it does in this case. Traditionally, even in Bible times, moms probably wrapped their baby and wore them on their back (or front where the baby could easily access a breastfeed nurse on demand)... in many cultures especially in years past it was normal, safer, and even expected that you would sleep with your baby and probably your children too. A family bed. Sleep training small children or babies, not holding them constantly (babies crave touch and warmth and closeness, very positive together developmentally), and trying to put them on a feeding schedule is a relatively new idea in the grand scheme of things. I just think that the "gentle parenting" movement that you seem to disagree with isn't too far from the way people in Biblical times probably did things when you think about it, especially in the 3 areas I listed above. Proverbs 31 woman would probably have worn her children! ;)

Lori Alexander:

As long as the husband is in agreement with gentle parenting, I have no problem with it. I am just seeing way too many children growing up to be undisciplined. As children grow up, they need a firm hand so they will grow up to obedient. They need a man's toughness since the world is a tough place.

I can't speak for anyone else here, but I don't want children who "grow up to be obedient". I want kids who can think (even if their thoughts are contrary to mine), and make wise decisions for themselves. I want confident kids. I want happy kids. Who wants kids that go through life waiting for someone to tell them what to do so they can be obedient????

Reader:

I'm really just referring to the last sentence in your first paragraph, nothing to do with fathers. You've made similar statements in the past about gentle parenting practices and it honestly boggles my mind. You of all people know how rotten this country is spiritually and how far people have fallen and believed in the world's ways... and historically and maybe even biblically... the way many raise their babies/small children is shocking. Not referring to discipline here, I don't disagree with that... I'm talking about all the little moments in between. Even at night. Parents don't get to clock out at bedtime.

Except Lori, because she needs her sleep. :x

[formergothardite]

Has Ken jumped in with a really long reply that includes a made up statistic about how sure, some children might suffer under the hands of a mean father, but that is only 1% of children. The other 99% would rather be abused in the home than have the father leave?

[kpmom]

From the comments:

Lori Alexander:

Firm hand, obedient, discipline, a man's toughness, these are all exciting words to Lori, and she uses them often.

That would be fine except she presents these ideas as biblical and tries to guilt her followers into accepting them.

I have no desire to look, but I'd be curious to know how many of her posts are about discipline in some form or another.

[Koala]

This comment has been deleted:

Exactly! My comment, which was erased for some reason, expressed similar thoughts.i spent my first 5 years in a home with a father who was mean and harsh. I was so glad when my mother left and I didn't have to live in constant fear. This kind of father is unbiblical. I'm not sure why Lori thinks kids want that kind of a father over none at all.

Lori, why don't you explain to your readers why you deleted this comment (twice).

Since you are speaking on behalf of abused children, perhaps you'd like to have another adult who actually experienced abuse as a child weigh in.

[jerkit]

That person has most assuredly been banned.

[Koala]

That person has most assuredly been banned.

What kind of person deletes a person who is speaking from a place of experience, only because they know it contradicts what they are saying in fucking stupidity ignorance. If Lori is "always learning" then why does she pull absolute bullshit blanket statements out of her ass and then delete people who know of what they speak???

And the crazy thing? She KNOWS she's a fraud. She can't unread those comments, so she knows what she's saying is bullshit, but she's so dead set on being right, that she will do it at any cost. She is truly the vilest person I have encountered on the internet. Just pure evil.

Ughhhh :pull-hair: :pull-hair: :pull-hair:

[jerkit]

What kind of person deletes a person who is speaking from a place of experience, only because they know it contradicts what they are saying fucking stupidity ignorance. If Lori is "always learning" then why does she pull absolute bullshit blanket statements out of her ass and then delete people who know of what they speak???

And the crazy thing? She KNOWS she's a fraud. She can't unread those comments, so she knows what she's saying is bullshit, but she's so dead set on being right, that she will do it at any cost. She is truly the vilest person I have encountered on the internet. Just pure evil.

Ughhhh :pull-hair: :pull-hair: :pull-hair:

Good god, right?! Lori gets under my skin like no other fundie ever has. INFURIATING.

[Firiel]

The best thing about CM's blog was that Lori couldn't delete comments when you disagreed with her.

[Curious]

This comment has been deleted:

Lori, why don't you explain to your readers why you deleted this comment (twice).

Since you are speaking on behalf of abused children, perhaps you'd like to have another adult who actually experienced abuse as a child weigh in.

Anyone disagreeing with Lori has to be a troll from here, so they are deleted. No one that reads her blog could POSSIBLY have a different opinion and still be a real reader...duh!

The irony of her blog title seems to be lost on no one, but Kenori (I know you guys generally use LorKen, but I give Ken the headship position ;) )