Meghan and Harry 3: Working Towards Financial Independence

[nokidsmom]

13 minutes ago, viii said:

Exactly; just because the media isn't fully aware of who everyone was, doesn't mean they weren't there. I highly doubt that Doria was the SOLE member of Meghan's family that attended the wedding. Even if she was, though... I don't find it that odd. Some people come from very small families. 

I personally didn't find it odd that Doria was the only (or only known) family member attending though I think there were likely others.  Mr. No's family is very small and there were very few of his family at our wedding compared to mine.   Small families happen.  Meghan being criticized for "having only one family member at her wedding" was a real stretch IMHO even if it were true.

 

 

 

[bea]

Also that the person sounding off on Not Being Invited To The Wedding is a half sister who’s - I wouldn’t even say estranged, they never had a relationship. Someone who at the time was literally ACTIVELY WRITING A BOOK on Meghan being trash. Good GOD, who’d invite that to a solemn state occasion? Gah.

Meghan’s dad. Invited, despite his constant paid media statements bemoaning the fact that the daughter he hasn’t been close to for 20 years isn’t closer to him. Invited to walk her down the aisle as she marries a prince, no less. Despite the fact that she KNEW he was selling his picture and stories and past stories and half-remembered random facts to the press. Despite the fact that she had begged him to stop the public attacks and selling stories to the paparazzi - a letter that he literally SOLD TO THE PRESS. She was *still* going to have him walk her down the aisle.

He had a heart attack. And another heart attack. And then heart surgery. He was unable to travel. They can’t reschedule a state occasion four days in advance. It’s not a couple of people in a clerk’s office, it’s a ROYAL WEDDING. I don’t know what she was expected to DO.

But apparently something other than get married. She probably dodged a bullet on that one, since he was sure to do something awful in the interests of making money off her wedding.

He released a (paid, obv.) interview on Wednesday that’s just mind boggling. He’s claiming that everybody owes him - e v e r y b o d y. The Royal family. Harry. Meghan. He’s old! She once said at some point she’d take care of him in his old age! He released new photos of her as a baby, child, and young adult (was paid for those, too).

He’s utter trash. He claims Meghan hasn’t talked to him since May 2018. Good for her.

 

 

[front hugs > duggs]

We have no idea how many of Meghan's family was or wasn't at the wedding. Say her mom was the only one, that doesn't indicate anything. 

I'm a US citizen; my husband is from England and we live here in the US. When we got married in a non-holiday month, only his immediate family of origin, plus 2 aunts/2uncles/1cousin were able to take the time off and pay the money to fly across the ocean, plus plan a trip, for our wedding (because who would spend that much $$ on a flight to come for JUST a wedding and not also plan a trip as well?). Our wedding was almost entirely my family/our friends here in the US.

Just because Meghan married into royalty doesn't mean all her maternal family members could spend the time and/or money to just drop what they are doing to attend a wedding. I understand how amazing attending a royal wedding would be, but it may just not be feasible to work out logistically for some.

[nokidsmom]

30 minutes ago, bea said:

He had a heart attack. And another heart attack. And then heart surgery. He was unable to travel. They can’t reschedule a state occasion four days in advance. It’s not a couple of people in a clerk’s office, it’s a ROYAL WEDDING. I don’t know what she was expected to DO.

But apparently something other than get married. She probably dodged a bullet on that one, since he was sure to do something awful in the interests of making money off her wedding.

She was stuck that's for sure.  I felt bad for her but was pleased when Prince Charles stepped up.

Honestly, given Daddy being "eternally available" to the tabloid press, I  think it was best that he didn't make it.   

Also the fact that Daddy never met Harry, that seems to be always thrown out there but given she invited him to her wedding and she wanted him to walk her down the aisle, it seems to me he probably had opportunities to meet his future son in law before then.  Given how he backed out of the wedding, I think he likely backed out of those too.

Edited January 24, 2020 by nokidsmom

[meep]

@SweetJuly Before I say anything further, I should just say that I feel defensive towards Meghan because I feel like we're in a lot of the same situations due to being mixed, our dysfunctional families, etc. I don't know Meghan or her situation specifically, but since we are just giving our opinions, I'll give mine based on my own experience since that's all I have to go off of. 

"However, if you are getting married and there is only ONE relative (your mother) in attendance, then something is seriously off."
- Why? I'm engaged and we decided against a big wedding. It would be all his family and only 3 members of my family. I have tons of family by blood. None of them have ever cared or supported me, not when I was a kid and not now. I'm not mixed black/white like Meghan is, but I'm mixed Mexican/White and that was enough for both sides of my family to be thoroughly scandalized. My white family never has liked my dad, mostly I think because he is an immigrant to America. My Mexican family hates, hates, hates my mother. They hate that my dad married a white woman and they hate that I'm half white. They've made it abundantly clear I'm not one of them and I'm not welcome. They're the family that only contacts me for money. That pretty much leaves me with only my immediate family, except for my sister because I've cut her out of my life (and so have my parents, and own grandmother, and her adult son, so it's not just me). I am NOT saying this is what Meghan has experience but I would say we could toss this into the pile of 'hypothetical maybes' since she was born in 1980. If Meghan & Harry had been a normal couple and went off to elope, instead of having a royal wedding with hundreds of people, no one would blink an eye. 

"Additionally, Meghan has cut off many old friends, from her childhood, youth or earlier acting years.....it's in addition to her being estranged from virtually all her family that it starts to look a little odd."
- But it is normal to leave old friends behind as we grow up, as you say. And as other PP pointed out, she had lots of friends who have been in her circle for many years attend the wedding. She seems to have made a nice little life for herself in Canada with a circle of friends who acted more like her family. We actively encourage this whole entire exact scenario on this site for fundies (estrange yourself from 20+ of your family members, go out into the world and make your own supportive family, etc). But now we are using this as a basis for finding things to be "strange?"

"So there undeniably is a pattern in her life. At some point, when it's always everyone else who appears to be the problem, chances are that it's you."
- I find this to be unfair. Especially for people in the public eye, they are always going to be cutting more and more people out of their lives because more and more people will want to associate with them for their money. Do we want to know how many people the royals, Harry himself, have cut out of their lives? Our favorite celebrities? I just read how Hilary Duff said she had to do a great culling of her friends when she was 19, who called her a "selfish bitch," because she realized some of them weren't really her friends and were around her for the wrong reasons. So yeah, things in that regard once you are world-famous are only going to get worse, not better. No matter what your family life is like. 

I genuinely hope I am not coming off as rude or attacking you or anything, that's not what I'm trying to do! I just think there is a bit of either a double stand going here or maybe some people just don't realize how many families out in the world are just crappy and don't deserve a person's time - which honestly is great, that means you have a really nice family and can't imagine it any other way. But gross, dysfunctional families and people are everywhere.

[FluffySnowball]

That’s not an endorsement of everything that went on the last couple of weeks. Especially in regards to communication, quite a few things didn’t go well. However, I’m more empathetic to H and M’s decision than many others and this meme has a point IMO. 

 

[just_ordinary]

On 1/23/2020 at 7:22 PM, Pleiades_06 said:

Who are these “royal experts” anyways? How does one become a royal expert? Is there a degree or course or do you just have to be a gossipy biddy or buddy?

It depends. Some journalists really are experts. We have one guy here: he has made several documentaries, has personally met them, had interviews with them and if you want a balanced comment- that’s where you go to. A royal wedding without his commentary is no royal wedding. He knows every royal attending, the family connection, interesting/boring facts about their latest endeavours, the history of the venues, the protocol....

And then we we have journalists who are just bought as moderators. It seems tv stations think only women can do it. Full of half truths, lots of wrong information. Why we have no woman on a similar professional as the one I talked above- I have no idea. Maybe women get belittled if they show interest in the topic?

Even worse a z-celebrities or our own „royals“. Lost all their titles after World War I and some are pretty desperate to feel important. They are just useless. 

My guess: 95% have no more idea about it than most normal royal watchers. But they get paid for the job and some crave the attention.

[zee_four]

On 1/21/2020 at 4:22 PM, Pleiades_06 said:

As a Commonwealth country, does Canada have some kind of reciprocal immigration agreement with the UK? I remember friends from New Zealand and Australia being able to stay on extended visas in the UK because of reciprocity-but that was in the early 2000’s.

Also, as a grandson of the monarch, is Harry entitled to some kind of special status in Canada?

Those are generally working holiday visas, which now go up to age 35 for Canadians to Commonwealth countries except the UK. As far as adults, you can go visit for periods of time easier if you're a member of the Commonwealth but outside some really wonky stuff about being a Commonwealth citizen living in the UK prior to the 70s or 80s or being a Commonwealth woman married to someone in the UK prior to a certain time, you don't have any right to  residency in the UK or vice versa.

I'm a duel US Canadian citizen and I almost married an Aussie and used to live and work in Australia and the UK. It's super wonky, but as far as becoming a citizen/permanent resident there's not a huge benefit being within the Commonwealth, it's mostly for travel and trade.

[LurkerOverThePond]

I have nothing constructive to say since I don't follow the royals but have to post this.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

2 minutes ago, LurkerOverThePond said:

I have nothing constructive to say since I don't follow the royals but have to post this.

This needs a caption under both...

"The public blaming women for men's choices since 1966"

[acheronbeach]

On 1/24/2020 at 9:53 AM, nokidsmom said:

I personally didn't find it odd that Doria was the only (or only known) family member attending though I think there were likely others.  Mr. No's family is very small and there were very few of his family at our wedding compared to mine.   Small families happen.  Meghan being criticized for "having only one family member at her wedding" was a real stretch IMHO even if it were true.

I think a lot of people questioned it just because how she used to feature various family members on her social media and made it seem like they were super close and super loving.  Knowing what we know now, it looks like that was just a "creative version of the truth," to portray a certain family-friendly image, because every single relative (Markles at least) that's come out of the woodwork seems utterly dysfunctional.  

@Pleiades_06 There are lots of trustworthy royal experts - people who have covered the BRF for years and have connections to sources close to the family (or, rumoured, the family themselves).  For the core of the family, I'm thinking reporters Roya Nikkhah, Richard Palmer, Rebecca English and Emily Andrews.  Lady Antonia Fraser (particularly in the past) and her daughter Flora used to appear for commentary a lot, and rightly so.  I think we can trust Lady Pamela and India Hicks as well.  I'd say that Tom Bradby is an expert as well, given his years of friendship with Harry.  But then there are a lot of know-nothings as well.  Other than being friends with the Mulroneys, I'm not sure what Lainey's qualifications are to opine as a Royal expert on Canadian television... 

[nausicaa]

On 1/24/2020 at 7:49 AM, formergothardite said:

IETA: When it comes to all these so called "friends" crawling out of the woodwork to talk about how Meghan cut them off, I give that the side eye. In these cases people will say and do anything for their moment of fame and getting to act like an insider. 

I definitely think there is some of this. And I 100% support her cutting off her shitty dad and other crappy relatives who were clearly just using her. 

But there's a lot of people who've talked about how Markle just used them and they've got receipts. I think it's useful to go back and read her posts on The Tig to get an idea of how she spins things. (And how differently she spins them now.) And again, she was living with a boyfriend when she agreed to go on a date with Harry. (And she claimed she knew nothing about the BRF despite having her photo taken in front of Buckingham Palace as a teen. Oh, and her only question was "Is he kind?" ?). There's pretty solid evidence the woman can be insincere and can use people to her advantage. 

Edited January 27, 2020 by nausicaa

[formergothardite]

32 minutes ago, nausicaa said:

nd again, she was living with a boyfriend when she agreed to go on a date with Harry.

Well, he has admitted their relationship was on the rocks. And she did break up with him before she went on the first date. Would I do that? Probably not, but I've not been a relationship that was falling apart and met someone I wanted to date, so I don't know if I would agree to a date and go home to end the currently relationship. 

38 minutes ago, nausicaa said:

(And she claimed she knew nothing about the BRF despite having her photo taken in front of Buckingham Palace as a teen. Oh, and her only question was "Is he kind?" ?).

One can go on a tourist trip as a teen and still not know a lot about the royal family. 

And so what if she asked if he is kind? That is a pretty important thing to know. 

41 minutes ago, nausicaa said:

There's pretty solid evidence the woman can be insincere and can use people to her advantage. 

Can you provide links? The stories I've read just seem like people who are fame hungry and trying to use their connections to Meghan for attention. 

43 minutes ago, nausicaa said:

hink it's useful to go back and read her posts on The Tig to get an idea of how she spins things.

I've read some of them. She seems shallow in Gwyneth Paltrow sort of way. I haven't read them all but are there certain ones that show her as using people and spinning things?

[HerNameIsBuffy]

1 minute ago, formergothardite said:

One can go on a tourist trip as a teen and still not know a lot about the royal family. 

I went there as a teen, too and the only thing I know about them besides cursory Diana stuff I learned here.

[acheronbeach]

4 minutes ago, nausicaa said:

Sure, I definitely think there is some of this. And I 100% support her cutting off her shitty dad and other crappy relatives who were clearly just using her. 

But there's a lot of people who've talked about how Markle just used them and they've got receipts. I think it's useful to go back and read her posts on The Tig to get an idea of how she spins things. (And how differently she spins them now.) And again, she was living with a boyfriend when she agreed to go on a date with Harry. (And she claimed she knew nothing about the BRF despite having her photo taken in front of Buckingham Palace as a teen. Oh, and her only question was "Is he kind?" ?). There's pretty solid evidence the woman can be insincere and can use people to her advantage. 

This is the issue, right here.  Her spin is so inconsistent and messy that many people don't find her believable.  Look at how confusing their story was initially about how they met, and then the retraction and stories about being set up by their aristo PR friend.  Or how Zara, on live TV, said that Meghan and Harry had announced the pregnancy at Eugenie's wedding, and the furious PR backpedaling after that.  When your first story contradicts later stories, when your first story better aligns with other facts, it makes for terrible PR.  

Let's face it, the portrayal of her as some villainous mastermind who controls her husband is over the top insane.  But it's also insane to paint her as this ignorant, innocent naif who just showered everyone with love until the cruel, endless racism of the BRF and the entire UK media destroyed her mental health.  

[HerNameIsBuffy]

17 minutes ago, acheronbeach said:

  But it's also insane to paint her as this ignorant, innocent naif who just showered everyone with love until the cruel, endless racism of the BRF and the entire UK media destroyed her mental health.  

I don't see anyone here saying that, I'm certainly not.  I see her as human.  She's not a child so has had many relationships in her life and I'm sure had her moments where she didn't handle things well.  And I'm sure had her moments where she was shitty to people, like the rest of us.

[Pleiades_06]

37 minutes ago, acheronbeach said:

This is the issue, right here.  Her spin is so inconsistent and messy that many people don't find her believable.  Look at how confusing their story was initially about how they met, and then the retraction and stories about being set up by their aristo PR friend.  Or how Zara, on live TV, said that Meghan and Harry had announced the pregnancy at Eugenie's wedding, and the furious PR backpedaling after that.  When your first story contradicts later stories, when your first story better aligns with other facts, it makes for terrible PR.  

Let's face it, the portrayal of her as some villainous mastermind who controls her husband is over the top insane.  But it's also insane to paint her as this ignorant, innocent naif who just showered everyone with love until the cruel, endless racism of the BRF and the entire UK media destroyed her mental health.  

Nothing-nothing at all-warrants racism. And it’s clear she’s experienced it in many levels. I’m sure it had an effect on her as it does on millions of people. Don’t downplay that. 

[acheronbeach]

11 minutes ago, Pleiades_06 said:

Nothing-nothing at all-warrants racism. And it’s clear she’s experienced it in many levels. I’m sure it had an effect on her as it does on millions of people. Don’t downplay that. 

That's a hell of an allegation.  I'd appreciate an explanation of how my comment about the extremes she's painted in the media by is me warranting racism and downplaying that.   

[Palimpsest]

As Royal soap operas go I'm finding this one rather boring.  And the press coverage far too overwrought.  I mean, Harry and Meghan just wanted to step away from Royal duties, possibly get more political (and liberal) than the constitutional monarchy rules will allow, do some charity work, and actually earn their own bread.  It's not like they are cuddling up with Nazis (Duke of Windsor) or consorting with sex traffickers and having sex with minors (Andrew).  As far as we know.

And I think both their families are pretty fucked up.  I don't think the Windsors are particularly functional.  Meghan's unpleasant Markle relatives should shut up.  As for the Ragland side, I believe Daria has a couple of half-siblings and perhaps a half-nephew who all seem to want to keep a low profile.  And who can blame them.

But Harry and Meghan certainly screwed up the announcement.  A PR disaster.  And they need to do some serious damage control.  I'm not interested in tearing either Meghan or Harry down.  For Archie's sake.

They will never see this advice let alone follow it, but here's my plan for them.

Palimpsest's Guide to Repairing and Renovating Royal Reputations.  (For what it's worth.  And for FJ's amusement.)

Harry and Meghan, lay low for a bit.  A few months should do it.  And get your business and charity ducks in a row as you enjoy spending time with Archie.   Explore various options but tell people you are working with that the deal will be off the table if anything leaks before you are ready to go public. 

No more photo ops with Meghan if she visits a charity.  And no more complaints about being photographed walking the dogs.  Just polite requests in real time for privacy at most.  Stop threatening to sue  the press.  Make the press look bad for invading your mundane private lives.

And absolutely no more whining about your original plan to be half-royal being shot down.  Shut up about that.

In other words, be completely boring until all this dies down.   Harry, you can also use this down-time to improve your grammar.  You obviously weren't paying attention at Eton.

We've sorted the security issue already.  Charlie's going to tide you over until you can pick up your own bills.  Thank him nicely.  But for the love of Rufus don't buy a multi-million estate yet.  Rent!  You need to earn some money not spend it like water.

If you plan to stay in Canada get your visas in gear.  Apply for a Business or Entrepreneur visa so you can earn some cash there and you can pop across the the pond or down to the US every few months so as not to outstay your 6 month limit.

Better yet, move to the USA and apply for Harry's business visa there.  Meghan is still an American, and presumably Archie is too if you registered him as one. Harry doesn't need to apply for Permanent Residency.  He can pop back and forth across the pond. 

In both Canada and the USA stop using your titles as well as the HRH.  It's "Call me Harry" from now on.  Same for Meghan.  No more Duchessing in the former colony or a Commonwealth country.  You both need to cultivate the common touch.

Let's see now.  Work.  Work is very important because of money.  You need it with your expensive tastes and security costs.

Do give up on that Sussex Royal thing except for charity stuff.  "Meghan and Harry" or "Harry and Meghan" are much catchier brand names anyway.  Don't go on talk shows for pay.  You can do that for charity only.  And never ever say anything less than positive about the Royal family.  Granny will get angry.  

OK, Harry.  You can do stuff like narrating some documentary on conservation or global warming.  Or the dangers of genetically modified crops.  Daddy will love that.  I'm sure whether you can go back to flying helicopters for a living yet.  You might need new permits.  Actually, I'm not sure you are terribly employable outside the Army, but you may have other transferable skills.  Good luck.  

Meghan, try for voice-over work or carefully chosen acting roles.  Mr P wants you to do South Park voiceover work but I think that might be going too far.  No porn or nudity allowed,  Granny won't like it. 

Or develop a line in affordable sportswear.  You look your best in casual clothing and all those pricey dresses wore you.  MeghanWear!  There you go.  And I know handbags are a bit cliched, but you have great taste in bags.  How about a line in natty bags made out of recycled materials.  Or "Megan's Reusable Grocery Totes."  I might even buy one!

I think late summer would be a good time to go public on all of this.  It might take about 6 months to get all those ducks lined up.  I think you have demonstrated good taste in your charity work so far.  Keep up that good work.

If you do all this you will prove nasty rotten stinky vicious rabid skunks like Piers Morgan wrong.  Do it!

(My apologies to all skunks for the comparison.  You are actually very cute and probably only dangerous when rabid.) 

 

[Pleiades_06]

2 minutes ago, acheronbeach said:

That's a hell of an allegation.  I'd appreciate an explanation of how my comment about the extremes she's painted in the media by is me warranting racism and downplaying that.   

Re-read the tone of your last sentence.

[acheronbeach]

There's a reason I said, "the cruel, endless racism of the BRF and the entire UK media destroyed her mental health."  Not that she hasn't experienced racism.  That's pretty damned clear from the shit that has been written by the Daily Mail.  Not that she hasn't suffered mentally because of it, because I imagine anyone who has read such garbage about themselves would.  

There are some media sources that have truly argued that the entire British royal family and entire country's media are constantly racist, and that's the only reason that Meghan and Harry left.  My point is that this is a caricature.

Though, I can see if you truly do believe that the whole BRF and the entire UK media are constantly racist toward her, then I'll grant you that logically, the conclusion would have to be that I am downplaying the racism toward her.  

[nausicaa]

16 minutes ago, Pleiades_06 said:

Re-read the tone of your last sentence.

I -re-read her sentence and still think you're grasping at straws here. 

[Pleiades_06]

Just now, nausicaa said:

I -re-read her sentence and still think you're grasping at straws here. 

We”ll have to agree to disagree.

[nausicaa]

1 hour ago, formergothardite said:

Well, he has admitted their relationship was on the rocks. And she did break up with him before she went on the first date. Would I do that? Probably not, but I've not been a relationship that was falling apart and met someone I wanted to date, so I don't know if I would agree to a date and go home to end the currently relationship. 

One can go on a tourist trip as a teen and still not know a lot about the royal family. 

And so what if she asked if he is kind? That is a pretty important thing to know. 

I think all of those are possible scenarios. But there's also the possibility that she's a bit shady in dating. Just like it is inaccurate to judge everything against her, I don't think everything should be judged in her favor either. The story also kept changing quite a bit. 

I think claiming all you wanted to know about someone before a date was "is he kind?" is a level of insincere, virtue signalling on par with "I'm spiritual but not religious" and "I don't see color." It was the first thing that dinged my "insincere, possibly a drama llama" radar. 

I still highly doubt she "had no idea" who Prince Harry was. Maybe she didn't follow the BRF and know the details, but claiming you have no idea of a famous celebrity is, in my experience, typically what someone with crappy intentions does to overcompensate. 

1 hour ago, formergothardite said:

Can you provide links? The stories I've read just seem like people who are fame hungry and trying to use their connections to Meghan for attention. 

I've read some of them. She seems shallow in Gwyneth Paltrow sort of way. I haven't read them all but are there certain ones that show her as using people and spinning things?

I'll have to look again for links. I thought the overall tone was noticeably insincere and performative (which granted, is pretty common in Hollywood. Doesn't mean I need to like it though). Also, calling people you haven't known long "family" is something, ime, done by difficult people who will also cut you off quickly. 

I realize some of this is "YMMV," but I do think there is some decent evidence that she might not be all on the up and up. 

[front hugs > duggs]

I know there is a different thread for the Prince Andrew stuff, but I can't not eyeroll at everyone all up in arms over Megxit and how HORRIBLE she is for the BRF when this shit is still happening...

"Prince Andrew has not cooperated with attempts to interview him about Jeffrey Epstein, US Attorney says"

https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/27/us/jeffrey-epstein-prince-andrew/index.html