No good ending here: Idaho mom dead, other kids missing

[Chickenbutt]

I think the breaking point will be when the kids see the autopsy of their mother and the conclusion is homicide (by strangulation?) No way to spin that fact (if it is truly a fact).

[TuringMachine]

25 minutes ago, Chickenbutt said:

I think the breaking point will be when the kids see the autopsy of their mother and the conclusion is homicide (by strangulation?) No way to spin that fact (if it is truly a fact).

Yeah I have to imagine the autopsy is pretty damning for Chad to have been charged with murder in addition to conspiracy.

[Ozlsn]

Maybe. There was a pretty horrific murder in my home town where a husband murdered his wife and was convicted. There was no doubt whatsoever - but his children have spilt, and at least one still believes decades later that he was framed (of the other family members some have cut contact and some retain contact but acknowledge that he is guilty.) I cannot even begin to imagine how much that would shatter your world.

[FiveAcres]

Many years ago, I lost a family member when he ended his life with his handgun. His mother was smart, accomplished, held down what was then considered a "man's job", and had a juris doctor degree. Despite all this, and a police investigation that ruled self-termination, she still had doubts that he ended his own life and thought that someone had been in his apartment and used his gun to kill him. (There were no signs of a break-in or theft.)

Families don't always have the ability to respond rationally to these sorts of extreme situations. 

[smittykins]

There was a case featured on TV’s “Forensic Files” about a man convicted of drowning his two wives(the first in a bathtub, the second in a hot tub), and his three children from his first marriage were convinced of his innocence .  But apparently, one of his sons has since changed his mind .

Edited September 3, 2021 by smittykins

[meep]

On 9/2/2021 at 9:12 PM, Ozlsn said:

Maybe. There was a pretty horrific murder in my home town where a husband murdered his wife and was convicted. There was no doubt whatsoever - but his children have spilt, and at least one still believes decades later that he was framed (of the other family members some have cut contact and some retain contact but acknowledge that he is guilty.) I cannot even begin to imagine how much that would shatter your world.

The Christopher Porco case is seared into my brain. He took an ax to his mom and dad...his mom miraculously survived, and to this day maintains he is innocent - even though immediately after the attack, she is the one who said he had done it. I think she just doesn't want to believe her child would do that. Family will do really impressive mental gymnastics to retain any bit of normalcy that they can. 

[Bobology]

Have Chad's children not heard the recording of the call between Chad and Lori while Lori was jailed? The one when he is sitting in his car by his house during the search and when they are digging in "the spot" he tells her about it? The two of them absolutely knew what was there, you could hear it in their voices and by what they said. That one recorded call leaves no doubt as to their culpability, even if Alex actually killed the children.

[EmmieJ]

Does anyone else watch Hidden True Crime on YouTube?  It's a podcast that's been following this case from early on.  The woman running it was a reporter, her husband is a psychologist, and another woman who appears frequently is an attorney.  The husband and wife recently discussed the Daybell children's interview and talked about enmeshed families.  It did provide insight into why and how family members can completely ignore factual evidence and continue to believe their family member is, in this case, being framed.

[Chickenbutt]

Lori Vallow still not competent, Chad's trial rescheduled | Lori Vallow Case | azfamily.com

 

Lori's still crazy and Chad is distancing himself from her. He is asking for more time for documents and his trial be separated from Lori's

[TuringMachine]

Seems like Lori is refusing to take medication 

https://www.eastidahonews.com/2021/09/should-lori-vallow-daybell-be-forced-to-take-medication-prosecutors-want-to-know/

[Chickenbutt]

Holy cow! The comments in that article. How/why do alleged adults get into all these arguments with other so called adults? What a sh$tshow.  

But to the question, Yes I believe Lori should be forced to take her meds. If she refuses, then take her to trial. This whole case is trying my patience.  

[Howl]

A forced medication case is ongoing in Colorado related to a man who started a fire in Colorado in 2018 that ultimately burned 149 homes. 

Forced medication approved for wildfire suspect, lawyers say

You can see the problem:  

Quote

His lawyers have said he has refused to take medication to treat his condition because his delusions make him believe he is well and does not need them.

A psychiatrist recently recommended forced medication for 6 months. 

With Lori, who knows...

 

[Chickenbutt]

'I Knew Right Then ... the Kids Were Dead': Lori Vallow's Brother Recounts Harrowing Conversation (msn.com)

"My mom and dad have written Lori in prison, and the letters that they've got back from Lori are that Lori has not changed at all her stand or her, uh, persona," Adam says in the podcast. "Apparently she's not talking to anybody. So at this point, she can't defend herself because she doesn't answer any of the questions that they ask her."

 

Not much new info, but this was new to me. 

[WiseGirl]

People magazine has an article about the interview as well.

 https://people.com/crime/lori-vallow-brother-recounts-harrowing-conversation/

[Howl]

Legal to-ing and fro-ing over whether jurors can be brought into Fremont  County  for the trial and whether to sequester the jury for the duration of the trial. 

Prosecution asks to sequester a jury for Daybell trial

Quote

Madison County Prosecutor Rob Wood said during a last-minute Thursday hearing that he wants to bring in jurors from another county into Fremont County for Daybell’s trial.

Histrionics from Chad's highly indignant lawyer Prior over needing more time while  accusing the prosecution of grandstanding and game playing. 

[Howl]

Medical examiner releases autopsy report for Charles Vallow, Lori Vallow Daybell’s former husband

Autopsy confirms that Alex lied about "self defense";  he murdered Charles.  New info is that on the day he was murdered, Charles had planned to confront Lori about her affair with Chad: 

Quote

Cox told police on the day of Vallow’s shooting death that he shot his brother-in-law in self-defense. Arizona Police documents say those claims are not supported by evidence and indicate that Vallow planned an intervention that day to confront her over an alleged affair with her current husband Chad Daybell.

Only Lori has been charged in Charles' murder.  For the murder  of Tylee and JJ, 

Quote

...a mental health professional deemed her [Lori] not fit for trial and unable to assist in her defense

so she remains in a mental health facility in Idaho.

 

Edited October 3, 2021 by Howl

[TuringMachine]

Hearing for change of venue (and maybe sequestering the jury) is happening today. Both seem reasonable in this case.

[Chickenbutt]

I watched the hearing. All I can say is I don't want Mr. Prior for my defense attorney anytime soon. 

[Howl]

1 hour ago, Chickenbutt said:

All I can say is I don't want Mr. Prior for my defense attorney anytime soon. 

What's your take on Prior? I thought he was an experienced criminal attorney.  Is he out of his depth relative to the prosecutor?

[Chickenbutt]

@HowlFirst off, I am not involved in the legal profession at all, but I do have common sense. I also believe the trial needs to be moved out of Fremont county, or jurors need to brought in from elsewhere. Having said that, when I heard that they had polled 4 counties, yet only 18 people from Fremont county, my common sense kicked in and said "that's not enough". I don't understand how he didn't see that. Fremont has 13,000ish residents as of 2010. 

I also think he takes snide shots, unnecessarily, at the Prosecutor. His demeanor, imo, is not conducive to be convincing to a juror. 

What are your thoughts?

[Chickenbutt]

just heard on the news that Chandler Police are going to release documents later today in the Charles Vallow murder. I will keep an eye out and post it (if possible) when they do.  

[Howl]

13 hours ago, Chickenbutt said:

What are your thoughts?

Haven't watched him in action, so no opinion.  My overall impression early on from news reports, was that Prior was certainly more competent and experienced in criminal law than Lori's lawyer, who I think was primarily a divorce attorney.  However, she's been assigned a death-qualified defense attorney, so there's that.  

I do wonder if she'll ever go on trial in AZ for Charles' death. It makes my blood run cold when I think about her laughing and so relaxed with the police after her brother murdered her husband.  Charles Vallow was apparently a wonderful, stand-up guy who really cared about and loved his wife and kids. 

[Chickenbutt]

I dunno. I do remember hearing and reading that just because you are incompetent in Idaho, doesn't make you incompetent in AZ. Maybe AZ should move her down here and try her, then let her sit in jail here until she's fit to be tried in Idaho. 

[Chickenbutt]

Chandler Police to release investigation into death of Charles Vallow on Oct. 6 (fox10phoenix.com)

New, to me, videos of interviews  with Lori, Tylee, Alex, and Alex's wife. Scroll down in article. 

 

ETA: Still haven't found the Documents

Edited October 6, 2021 by Chickenbutt

[Chickenbutt]

vallow-emails.pdf (documentcloud.org)

Emails released

Lori Vallow Daybell case: A breakdown of evidence in 2,500 emails released by Chandler Police | 12news.com

"The case in Idaho would need to wrap up before Lori would go to court in Arizona for the charge in Maricopa County."

Welp, that answers that question. 

Lori Vallow case: Video shows late Tylee Ryan after Chandler shooting (azcentral.com)

Another article