Dillards 48: Proselytising Prick Preaching to People

[Beermeet]

11 hours ago, Icea said:

I don't think it was that strange, Derick was always the center of attention in CA, the only place where he could out-stage Jill. While there she and Israel were completely dependent on him, seeing as they didn't speak the langage, were pretty isolated and it was so incredibly "dangerous". When they came back to the US that was no longer the case, Jill had her family around and didn't have to rely on Derick for every little thing that happened, and she was clearly the bread-winner of the family. When she became pregnant with Sam even more attention was given to her and I'm guessing his ego couldn't handle that. So, the best way to shift focus back to him was to go back to CA, the place where he clearly was in charge of his family. If Jill hadn't had such complications with Israel's delivery, I'm sure they would've stayed in CA and had Sam there.

By George,  I think you've got it!  Wants to be more like John Shrader, big fish in a little pond, isolated where he could be a shit to Jill and others more, get his dominance on.  Cause, he was while in CA.  Now, he's too close to her family to pull that.  So, like our dear orange asshat, he takes to Twitter to get that feeling.  Interesting theory, plausible. 

ETA: And, he made sure Jill was out of that show, sabotage perhaps?

[marmalade]

w/r/t who owns the Dullard abode, I did some digging, and neither JB nor Cathy own it. Cross Church owns some properties, but the addresses aren't made public. 

[cascarones]

@Georgiana Your expat theory is interesting, especially if you take a longer lens look at how it would affect Israel and Sam. Third culture kids, kids who spend a significant amount of time during their developmental years outside their home culture, tend to show certain psychological traits: increased adaptability, heightened interpersonal sensitivity to other lifestyles as well confused loyalty to the home culture. The last one is fairly striking since the Dillards follow such a narrow viewpoint on how to live a Godly life, I can’t see Derick and Jill being thrilled with a lot of more global viewpoints that come out of being in diverse cultures influencing their sons.  It’s two desires that might be at war in Derick, now I’m also leaving out the white savior complex that drives some missionaries. 

I’m TKC and would love to live abroad again, but understand realistically that my spouse much prefers us to be in the US and simply do immersive travel.  

What really gets me about Derick is the dehumanizing way he and Jill speak of their friends, reducing them to their religion, their clothing or nationality. I also doubt they ask any of these individuals they’re making such strides with for permission to write about them in their blog.

Either way Derick seems to be doing nothing to change his behavior or slow his online shenanigans, Cathy clearly eggs him on and I don’t get the impression Jill or any of the Duggars have any influence over him at this point, given it seems the purse strings have been tightened.

[SapphireSlytherin]

The property where they’re living is owned by an LLC that doesn’t appear to be connected to the Duggars. At least on the surface. 

27 minutes ago, cascarones said:

TKC

Explain?

[JenniferJuniper]

I have an expat daughter.  Her latest stint has been in the UK for about 5 months now.  Before that it was South Africa.  Her father thinks it's something she'll get out of her system; she's only 23, she'll be back for good soon enough.  But mother knows best.  She's not likely to stay in London ($$$ and too similar a culture) past the end of 2018.  But I know she's never coming back to live in the US for long.  There are too many adventures to have elsewhere.  She had the nicest, cutest, most promising boyfriend since 10th grade.  She dumped him freshman year in college.  "He wants a house with a picket fence!  A picket fence!  Can you believe it? Like I'm going to live my life trapped behind a picket fence!  With babies!"

My daughter differs from Derick in almost every way possible.  But I think in this one regard, it's the same way with him.  He's probably terrified of being trapped behind a picket fence in Sometown, USA.  Big mistake marrying Miss Tontitown, Pistol Pete.  Big mistake.

[PainfullyAware]

In my experience there are actually 2 types of expats. 

1. Who want to learn about other people and places; have adventures; see things they never could have imagined

2. People who are escaping home, running from something, reinventing themselves. Often drawn to the privilege of being a wealthy Westerner in a developing country- kind of a cross between being an exotic curiosity and an assumption about wealth/connections/education. (Ex on a semester abroad in east Africa, on a visit to a hospital many assumed we were med students or doctors, not just undergrads or while volunteering it was assumed we ran a nonprofit at home). The privilege gap and massive disparity can make it impossible to explain you are just a dumb broke undergrad student. (Just going to uni is a massive privilege in a country like Uganda). Some expats love living in a place that makes them feel uber privileged, wealthy and interesting.

Derick is #2.

[grandmadugger]

2 hours ago, marmalade said:

w/r/t who owns the Dullard abode, I did some digging, and neither JB nor Cathy own it. Cross Church owns some properties, but the addresses aren't made public. 

I find it most telling it isn’t a Dugger owned property. This is the first couple in Arkansas to move out of a Dugger owned property. I can’t imagine that JB was really charging them much if at all. I truly wonder if JB kicked them out or if Dwreck moved them to the new house so he didn’t have to play the game. I honestly can’t fathom JB kicking Jill out. 

[waltraute]

On 12/27/2017 at 8:32 PM, MarblesMom said:

And as my dearly departed would say, "Christ on a bicycle!"

Ahhhhh!!!!! I thought I was the only one that said this.  One of my favorites!

[marmalade]

13 minutes ago, grandmadugger said:

I find it most telling it isn’t a Dugger owned property. This is the first couple in Arkansas to move out of a Dugger owned property. I can’t imagine that JB was really charging them much if at all. I truly wonder if JB kicked them out or if Dwreck moved them to the new house so he didn’t have to play the game. I honestly can’t fathom JB kicking Jill out. 

I imagine once the TLC gravy train ended for the Dullards (whether Derelict quit or was fired), so did their usefulness to JB. Time to move in another couple more amenable to the Firm. I have a sneaking suspicion that JoKen are inhabiting the Pool House these days. 

[TheOneAndOnly]

1 hour ago, PainfullyAware said:

 

Derick is #2.

He sure is.

[grandmadugger]

3 minutes ago, marmalade said:

I imagine once the TLC gravy train ended for the Dullards (whether Derelict quit or was fired), so did their usefulness to JB. Time to move in another couple more amenable to the Firm. I have a sneaking suspicion that JoKen are inhabiting the Pool House these days. 

That’s the head scratcher of it all. If Dwreck could have shut his mouth on twitter they would have had it made. TLC would be paying them, JB would be providing housing, his mom wouldn’t have to fight his battles.  The other 25 Duggers can figure this out why can’t he? If they were truly breaking away from fundie life I would understand but they aren’t. Dwreck is very vocal about the dark side of the cult. The rest try hard to hide it. 

[JenniferJuniper]

6 minutes ago, grandmadugger said:

That’s the head scratcher of it all. If Dwreck could have shut his mouth on twitter they would have had it made. TLC would be paying them, JB would be providing housing, his mom wouldn’t have to fight his battles.  The other 25 Duggers can figure this out why can’t he? 

Well, no gravy train can hold that many passengers for that long.  Probably wouldn't take a junior rocket scientist to see that the show will end, the Duggars will be relegated to the ash heap of reality television, and that Jim Bob will have to decide where to best use his (not unsubstantial but still ultimately limited) resources going forward.   All of the sons-in-law will ultimately have to - mostly - pull their own weight.   And Derick wants to be seen and known as  *man*, not a dependent.   Course, being a smug, clueless Mama's boy he has no idea how to actually pull it off. 

She's not one of my favorites, but I do feel sorry for Jill.  She doesn't have half the smarts of Jessa and she's been sold a bill of goods since the day she was born.  

[cascarones]

3 hours ago, SapphireSlytherin said:

The property where they’re living is owned by an LLC that doesn’t appear to be connected to the Duggars. At least on the surface. 

Explain?

  TKC, third culture kid. Children that spend a significant amount of their developmental years outside their home culture. Children who live abroad, refugees, military brats, seasonal work families, children of missionaries, etc. Wikipedia has a fairly good starting section on the ot research, bu there’s several websites and blog communities as well. Children of mixed culture couples also often identify with the label and show many of the studied characteristics. There’s also some interesting inter generational carry overs as well.

Not knowing how immersed Derick was in Nepal I’ve no clue if their experience with SOS in CA was similar. 

[Drala]

I think there could be some truth to the rumor that D'wreck was "let go" by SOS ministries partly because of the way TLC portrayed the "mission" as so dangerous.  Such a situation would have prompted the realization that a missionary career was incompatible with a reality show gig.  If the Counting On exposure did have a negative impact on the Dillards continuing with the SCA mission, it likely contributed to D'wreck's resentment of TLC's programming.

I also think D'wreck's break with TLC was multi-dimensioned.  Something happened with Sam's birth.  I think that TLC either refused to film it or filmed and refused to air the episode, for any number of reasons.  Perhaps they refused to film because D'wreck tried to change the terms of the contract.  More money or more editorial control over the content?  Whatever the reason, there was a break with TLC for D'wreck at the time of Sam's birth.

I always thought it was ironic that TLC began to feature I Am Jazz immediately after they shut down 19KAC.  Not at all surprising that someone from the "godly" Duggar camp lashed out at the star of TLC'S alternate programming, given the role Michelle's anti-trans robocalls had on exposing Josh's crimes and putting an end to 19KAC.  I imagine I Am Jazz gets better ratings than Counting On?  She's certainly a more compelling character than any of the Duggarlings.

[Icea]

9 hours ago, Beermeet said:

By George,  I think you've got it!  Wants to be more like John Shrader, big fish in a little pond, isolated where he could be a shit to Jill and others more, get his dominance on.  Cause, he was while in CA.  Now, he's too close to her family to pull that.  So, like our dear orange asshat, he takes to Twitter to get that feeling.  Interesting theory, plausible. 

ETA: And, he made sure Jill was out of that show, sabotage perhaps?

I don't think he's aware of this himself though, I'm thinking it's more along the lines of "I was much happier when we were in CA, we should go back". Which is even more dangerous, because that means he's completely oblivious to the fact that he's isolating Jill. 

[Fun Undies]

9 hours ago, Beermeet said:

By George,  I think you've got it!  Wants to be more like John Shrader, big fish in a little pond, isolated where he could be a shit to Jill and others more, get his dominance on.  Cause, he was while in CA.  Now, he's too close to her family to pull that.  So, like our dear orange asshat, he takes to Twitter to get that feeling.  Interesting theory, plausible. 

ETA: And, he made sure Jill was out of that show, sabotage perhaps?

I think my persistent Pollyanna-optimism syndrome realllllyyyy wants to believe that he would *never* purposefully isolate Jill and his family, so he can live in a delusional state of "top-dogness" . . . but honestly, y'all make some compelling arguments.  It's not like I don't agree, per se, but I was really hoping it was just more along the lines of unintentional (still bad of course, but at least there'd be hope it could change if shone the error of his ways).  Mmm, I really really hope them not living in a Duggar compound property, was a leave and cleave sort of thing on their part, and not Derick trying to keep Jill away from the family.  

9 hours ago, cascarones said:

-snip- What really gets me about Derick is the dehumanizing way he and Jill speak of their friends, reducing them to their religion, their clothing or nationality. I also doubt they ask any of these individuals they’re making such strides with for permission to write about them in their blog. - snip - 

@cascarones I'm a military brat, and I can honestly say that even though my Dad was the soldier, my Mom is definitely an expat!  Even having done the beginning stages of research on the effects of military brat life, I have actually never heard of TCK, so now I got a whole new sub group to check out

When I read their blog entry about the two Muslim women they approached, invited into their home and attempted to "minister" to - and then asked for their reader's prayers that they come back, it made me cringe.  I can only imagine two women of not only a different religion, but probably different nationality (because to Jill and Derick, I'm imagining they would find someone non-Caucasian "easier" to convert ), being approached by Jill, all smiles, and invited to their home - and the women were maybe even grateful, and interested to see what her life was like.  They get there, and all it is is Bible-thumpers encouraging them to strip any and all semblance of their own religion and culture to conform to what the "white people" believe.  They politely smile, and then leave as quickly as they can - and Jill is asking for prayers because she has NO CLUE as to what she possibly could have done wrong 

7 hours ago, PainfullyAware said:

In my experience there are actually 2 types of expats. 

1. Who want to learn about other people and places; have adventures; see things they never could have imagined

2. People who are escaping home, running from something, reinventing themselves. Often drawn to the privilege of being a wealthy Westerner in a developing country- kind of a cross between being an exotic curiosity and an assumption about wealth/connections/education. (Ex on a semester abroad in east Africa, on a visit to a hospital many assumed we were med students or doctors, not just undergrads or while volunteering it was assumed we ran a nonprofit at home). The privilege gap and massive disparity can make it impossible to explain you are just a dumb broke undergrad student. (Just going to uni is a massive privilege in a country like Uganda). Some expats love living in a place that makes them feel uber privileged, wealthy and interesting.

Derick is #2.

Even though my Mom is definitely an expat, I think in her case it's a bit of both - and with Derick, I'd imagine it might be a bit of both, too.  In my Mom's case, she was the first person in her family, in like hundreds of years, to move outside of a 50 mile radius of Bavaria.  She was 18, flew to Canada and became an au pair (which boggles my mind, because hellz yeah, my Mom was super independent and rocked that shit for two years!).  However her home life was downright tragic, and she only moved back after her Dad died, then stuck around to help support her family, and then met my Dad when was working on the base <3

For Derick, I wonder if (and really, how could it not) his Dad's death led him to wanting to "run" a bit, and religion gave him the out to fund the purpose.  And now it's a bit of both.  He's obviously not happy at home, but he also has NO business as a missionary either.  He acts like a man who is stuck, and I really hope he doesn't lash out at Jill or the kids for it.

7 hours ago, grandmadugger said:

I find it most telling it isn’t a Dugger owned property. This is the first couple in Arkansas to move out of a Dugger owned property. I can’t imagine that JB was really charging them much if at all. I truly wonder if JB kicked them out or if Dwreck moved them to the new house so he didn’t have to play the game. I honestly can’t fathom JB kicking Jill out. 

FWIW, and really it's not like I have any insight or anything - but I really don't think JB would just kick them out.  I would find it much more likely that TLC asked JB to help smooth things over with Derick's twitter rants, and Derick probably replied with some sort of "sold out your faith" comment, and said he didn't need JB or TLC either - then went to Cross Church to ask about renting one of their properties.

 

[SapphireSlytherin]

7 hours ago, grandmadugger said:

I find it most telling it isn’t a Dugger owned property. This is the first couple in Arkansas to move out of a Dugger owned property. I can’t imagine that JB was really charging them much if at all. I truly wonder if JB kicked them out or if Dwreck moved them to the new house so he didn’t have to play the game. I honestly can’t fathom JB kicking Jill out. 

I would put my retirement fund on a bet that they're living in the LLC-owned property that Cross Church has leased from the LLC. Remember - he's in a "residential ministry" program.

[nastyhobbitses]

31 minutes ago, Fun Undies said:

When I read their blog entry about the two Muslim women they approached, invited into their home and attempted to "minister" to - and then asked for their reader's prayers that they come back, it made me cringe.  I can only imagine two women of not only a different religion, but probably different nationality (because to Jill and Derick, I'm imagining they would find someone non-Caucasian "easier" to convert ), being approached by Jill, all smiles, and invited to their home - and the women were maybe even grateful, and interested to see what her life was like.  They get there, and all it is is Bible-thumpers encouraging them to strip any and all semblance of their own religion and culture to conform to what the "white people" believe.  They politely smile, and then leave as quickly as they can - and Jill is asking for prayers because she has NO CLUE as to what she possibly could have done wrong 

I think the clincher for this whole incident pissing me the fuck off is that they act all folksy and friendly-like to these people, while slavishly supporting a president who wants to deport them or ban them from traveling or immigrating to this country, and calls the lot of them terrorists. How do the Dillards reconcile that? How can they call themselves friends to these people while supporting such things? My best guess is that they believe that if they make these poor benighted Syrian/Palestinian/Iraqi Muslims more like white Westerners, that will "remove" the factors that make them "bad" or "dangerous". 

It's like an undercooked cake: no matter how you slice it, it's fucked. 

[eveandadam]

22 minutes ago, nastyhobbitses said:

I think the clincher for this whole incident pissing me the fuck off is that they act all folksy and friendly-like to these people, while slavishly supporting a president who wants to deport them or ban them from traveling or immigrating to this country, and calls the lot of them terrorists. How do the Dillards reconcile that? How can they call themselves friends to these people while supporting such things? My best guess is that they believe that if they make these poor benighted Syrian/Palestinian/Iraqi Muslims more like white Westerners, that will "remove" the factors that make them "bad" or "dangerous". 

It's like an undercooked cake: no matter how you slice it, it's fucked. 

haha, I think you fell for the "friends" trap. The word "friend", it seems, is applied to anyone the Duggars have ever talked to. A very wide notion. JB loves to use phrases like "some friends came over and finished the painting job of the girls room", "some friends we met 10 years ago for thefirst and last time", "some friends helped us finish this building project". Whenever building or craftmenship is involved the Duggars seem to have lots of "friends" to help out. I always suspected that this means those people are aquaintances who get paid to do the job, as, you know, all other people would do normally, but they can't admit that, of course.

It's similar to the description of dating they give, which is totally wrong but they do it to feel special. They say dating is just for fun, to distract yourself, with multiple people at the same time and not serious, just for the physical aspect. But for me (and all the people I know personally) dating always had the purpose of finding a spouse and as soon as you realize it won't lead to marriage you end the relationship to save time and energy and heartache for yourself and the other person.

The Duggars just change the definition of fundamental words like "friend" and "dating" and make it their own, which almost all cults do to feel special and to brainwash others. Actually, the differences between an average person and the Duggars are more profane and physical: the insane focus on sex, virginity, gender roles and on converting other people is grotesque and perverse.

[louisa05]

To be fair, “friend “ seems to become a catch all term on reality television to add realness or something. All of the paid experts that come in to appraise things on Pawn Stars are identified on-air as the cast’s “friend” or “buddy”.

 

I also notice that a lot of extroverts I know tend to classify everyone they’ve ever met as a friend.

 

[Four is Enough]

TBH, I believe the Pawn Stars guys have at least cultivated a relationship with the people who come into the shop and give appraisals. They wouldn' t just run into the store                 whenever if they weren't getting money, friendship, beer, something.

[louisa05]

40 minutes ago, Four is Enough said:

TBH, I believe the Pawn Stars guys have at least cultivated a relationship with the people who come into the shop and give appraisals. They wouldn' t just run into the store                 whenever if they weren't getting money, friendship, beer, something.

I read a couple articles about that show (and many other reality shows) when I did a paper in grad school about reality television. They are paid people that the producers bring in to appraise items. Some were people that the staff had previously used, most were not. So the notion that they are all Rick's personal "buddies" of longstanding is a bit silly. They are also waiting in the wings at filming because everything is pre-arranged. So there is no calling in the "let me call a buddy of mine", there is a pause while said "buddy" comes into the scene for filming as producers already called him. And they are getting paid by The History Channel for each appearance.  

[Fun Undies]

1 hour ago, louisa05 said:

-snip- I also notice that a lot of extroverts I know tend to classify everyone they’ve ever met as a friend.

 

Guilty as charged!  I will say though I w-a-y eased up on this, once it was pointed out to me - and that not everyone is comfortable with it.  I don't like insert myself in people's lives instantaneously or anything, but I definitely just have a comfortable ease with just about everyone, and though I try to read people's non verbal cues better, it's still something I work on.

I know it's not a "bad" thing or anything, but I *hate* making people feel uncomfortable, so I try to tone it down a bit when I first meet people. 
Though I'm also an ESFP, and have ADD - so toned down version of me is still . . . well, something 

[Beermeet]

3 hours ago, Icea said:

I don't think he's aware of this himself though, I'm thinking it's more along the lines of "I was much happier when we were in CA, we should go back". Which is even more dangerous, because that means he's completely oblivious to the fact that he's isolating Jill. 

I used to be skeptical about the whole marry an asshole and get isolated thing until it happened to my besy friend, who I never see now and has obvious limits on our contact and same with her family.  It sure can happen on purpose!

[louisa05]

49 minutes ago, Fun Undies said:

Guilty as charged!  I will say though I w-a-y eased up on this, once it was pointed out to me - and that not everyone is comfortable with it.  I don't like insert myself in people's lives instantaneously or anything, but I definitely just have a comfortable ease with just about everyone, and though I try to read people's non verbal cues better, it's still something I work on.

I know it's not a "bad" thing or anything, but I *hate* making people feel uncomfortable, so I try to tone it down a bit when I first meet people. 
Though I'm also an ESFP, and have ADD - so toned down version of me is still . . . well, something 

It feels very foreign to us introverts. To me, friends are people I've known a long time and am very close to. 

And I do suspect that Jim Bob is a natural extrovert. I don't think that is a bad thing for him or anyone else, it just is not the perception most introverts have of what "friend" means so it seems strange to us.