Dillards 27 - Allergies, Fever, and the Dangers of Being a White Baby

[dbauched]

Idk. I don't feel too good giving Jill sh*t for Izzy's cold shower. As a long time nanny and babysitter, I can imagine that she was in a position where they had literally just gotten home, didn't have enough time to get to Walmart yet, izzy was really gross and needed to get clean and a 5 minute shower was available, even if the water was cold. And I'm also thinking that if she had to help him into the shower, she was probably in the shower with him, not forcing him in there. I think they were on a time crunch, since Jill doesn't strike me as someone who would force her kid into a cold bath-if for no other reason than he would be upset and crying and she doesn't need that added drama on top of everything else.

As for turning off the hot water, I can imagine the situation was more like she was lifting him up to wash his hands in the sink or play with bubbles while she was washing dishes etc...He thinks it's a toy or another faucet, he reaches for it, and boom. Instant burn.

Toddlers are honestly drawn to the sweet siren call of danger, I give Jill credit-if only because I've seen worse people become good parents with little training. I'm sure we could all tell stories of the strange situations we got into as little kids, because our parents looked away for literally 3 seconds [emoji23]

[Carm_88]

@dbauched I'm pretty sure Jill doesn't leave the house, let alone the compound. 

[SassyPants]

3 hours ago, nst said:

Jessa is the type as I have said who will plan ahead with regards to everything.  It's in her nature. But Jill and Josh are lost causes and that is JB's fault.  

Even the type of girl Joe is courting who I am sorry is a baby who will be married within the year is insane.  JB can control her simply. He controls his sons he now will control this chickie.  Joy on the other hand will be going towards another patriarchal type of man so that is on her. 

Beyond his pocketbook no - because they are all dependent on him. 

so now Joy is considered above her sister Jana  - we should rename FJ to Free Jana 

 

 

All the planning ahead in the world will do nothing if one doesn't know how to do anything to earn a sustainable, long term income, and are willing to work for many, many, many years.

Jessa has a false since of reality.

JB has given none of his kids the ability to think for themselves, leave or cleave.

9 hours ago, nastyhobbitses said:

Jamie the Very Worst Missionary is awesome. My one quibble is with her last point: HOW THE FUCK DO YOU TEACH JOB SKILLS TO PEOPLE WHEN YOU DON'T EVEN SPEAK THEIR LANGUAGE HAVE NEVER HELD DOWN A JOB?

Oh I love is game:

Don't speak the language

Have never held down a job

HAVE NEVER MADE AN INDEPENDENT DECISION

[dbauched]

@dbauched I'm pretty sure Jill doesn't leave the house, let alone the compound. 

I mean, I'm pretty sure that she does-for all our snarking-if only because she's a person that wants to do other things than stick around a house all day without her husband. And by coming home, I meant that they were coming back from the airport. Like, literally coming back to the house for the first time in months, and didn't have time to get regular supplies or water yet.

[unicorncastle]

Idk. I don't feel too good giving Jill sh*t for Izzy's cold shower. As a long time nanny and babysitter, I can imagine that she was in a position where they had literally just gotten home, didn't have enough time to get to Walmart yet, izzy was really gross and needed to get clean and a 5 minute shower was available, even if the water was cold. And I'm also thinking that if she had to help him into the shower, she was probably in the shower with him, not forcing him in there. I think they were on a time crunch, since Jill doesn't strike me as someone who would force her kid into a cold bath-if for no other reason than he would be upset and crying and she doesn't need that added drama on top of everything else.

As for turning off the hot water, I can imagine the situation was more like she was lifting him up to wash his hands in the sink or play with bubbles while she was washing dishes etc...He thinks it's a toy or another faucet, he reaches for it, and boom. Instant burn.

Toddlers are honestly drawn to the sweet siren call of danger, I give Jill credit-if only because I've seen worse people become good parents with little training. I'm sure we could all tell stories of the strange situations we got into as little kids, because our parents looked away for literally 3 seconds [emoji23]

I'm glad you said something. I'm sure if I listed out all of the ways I've ended up in the hospital with my children or all the ways they have been seriously hurt, I would be the worlds worst mother.

Sometimes I struggle to see why there is so much hate for the kids of JB. They have been indoctrinated and brainwashed their entire lives. I genuinely believe they think they are making the best choices based off of how they think the world works.

ETA: not including Josh. His shit choices are all on him, but I do fault his parents for never getting him and his sisters proper counseling.

[apandaaries]

1 hour ago, dbauched said:

Idk. I don't feel too good giving Jill sh*t for Izzy's cold shower. As a long time nanny and babysitter, I can imagine that she was in a position where they had literally just gotten home, didn't have enough time to get to Walmart yet, izzy was really gross and needed to get clean and a 5 minute shower was available, even if the water was cold. And I'm also thinking that if she had to help him into the shower, she was probably in the shower with him, not forcing him in there. I think they were on a time crunch, since Jill doesn't strike me as someone who would force her kid into a cold bath-if for no other reason than he would be upset and crying and she doesn't need that added drama on top of everything else.

As for turning off the hot water, I can imagine the situation was more like she was lifting him up to wash his hands in the sink or play with bubbles while she was washing dishes etc...He thinks it's a toy or another faucet, he reaches for it, and boom. Instant burn.

Toddlers are honestly drawn to the sweet siren call of danger, I give Jill credit-if only because I've seen worse people become good parents with little training. I'm sure we could all tell stories of the strange situations we got into as little kids, because our parents looked away for literally 3 seconds

With all due respect, that is an awful lot of imagination and assumptions made on Jill's behalf, and some assumptions seem rather generous.  If you read the blog itself, she clearly states that they'd been back for several days before the shower incident.  He had to bathe somehow because he'd played soccer after church and was a mess.  She states that they had to help him in and move quickly, rather than "he took a quick shower with Daddy."  (Link to blog: https://www.dillardfamily.com/dillard family blog )

Who wants an upset and crying kid?  Not many of us, but this is Jill, who posted Izzy hot, bothered, swaddled and screaming.  Her first instinct was NOT to calm the screeching child, but to take a picture and share it online.  

I'm not 100% sure what Jill means by an "instant hot water dispenser," which to me sounds like what one would find on a Culligan water dispenser with hot and cold options (although perhaps it is a sink?  Jill isn't exactly clear in her reports, and since none of us were there, her shoddy writing is all we have to go by).  Such an item would require electricity (and kind of a waste of electricity, in my mind), but they also have an AC, so their power supply must be pretty steady. Isn't a hot water dispenser within toddler's reach the kind of thing one would child-proof?  If it was the sink, why was he able to reach it?  I know that the Duggars believe in house-proofing their kids, rather than the other way around, but still.  This strikes me as an easily avoidable accident. 

 While I wish I could imagine that Jill was doing dishes, this is the same person who wasn't bothered by her son licking a metal fan, saying that it felt good on his teething gums.  

This is also the same person who repeatedly misused a baby carrier (though watching MEchelle with MyBrestFriend certainly wasn't educational).

This is also the same person who feeds her son from cans on a regular enough basis that Dreck doesn't bat an eye and she feels comfortable posting THAT, too.  

Anyone who's been around toddlers knows of their love for danger...but that means parents and caretakers have to be more hands-on and attentive during those times.  

I'm reminded of one of the old episodes when Josie was in the hospital, and Jill was supervising the Howlers at their (not rented, right?  the house was lent to them?) borrowed home closer to the hospital.  IIRC, one of the Howlers was (appropriately) in a tree, messing around.  Jill gave out a half-hearted warning, but didn't seem particularly perturbed by his behaviors.  Sort of made me wonder if JB and MEchelle's requirements were as basic as, "avoid blood and death.  If you can't avoid bloodshed, then just don't let the little one die."

For all the emotional closeness Jill seemed to provide for her buddy team, she isn't the natural mother many of us envisioned her as.  I'm sure lots of it is due to her horrible upbringing and her parents failing to teach their children anything, but it's still rather shocking. Her family's whole schtick was preparing the girls to be wives and mothers, yet here we have the Golden Child floundering over the most basic of child care moments.  

[TuringMachine]

Wasn't there also a time when one of the howlers fell behind a stage or something and all the Duggars were taking pictures of him being put into an ambulance? TBH I don't have high hopes for any of the girls to be great caregivers. Jill seems to be particularly oblivious though.

[apandaaries]

4 minutes ago, TuringMachine said:

Wasn't there also a time when one of the howlers fell behind a stage or something and all the Duggars were taking pictures of him being put into an ambulance? TBH I don't have high hopes for any of the girls to be great caregivers. Jill seems to be particularly oblivious though.

I believe it was MEchelle who was taking the pictures of her fallen child.  It was not unlike the time a Howler was lost at the airport, then ran to Jana for comfort.  JB & M failed to parent their own children, and failed to teach their children how to parent, though the children were left in charge.  Horrible all around...and now we see Generation 2 floundering and making even more mistakes.  Damn. 

[choralcrusader8613]

12 minutes ago, amandaaries said:

I believe it was MEchelle who was taking the pictures of her fallen child.

Josh took video too, but...it's Josh, so not shocked.

[Bad Wolf]

They had Izzy in his own car seat on the plane. I was surprised that they would pay for a seat for him. Well, someone paid.

[SassyPants]

1 hour ago, amandaaries said:

With all due respect, that is an awful lot of imagination and assumptions made on Jill's behalf, and some assumptions seem rather generous.  If you read the blog itself, she clearly states that they'd been back for several days before the shower incident.  He had to bathe somehow because he'd played soccer after church and was a mess.  She states that they had to help him in and move quickly, rather than "he took a quick shower with Daddy."  (Link to blog: https://www.dillardfamily.com/dillard family blog )

Who wants an upset and crying kid?  Not many of us, but this is Jill, who posted Izzy hot, bothered, swaddled and screaming.  Her first instinct was NOT to calm the screeching child, but to take a picture and share it online.  

I'm not 100% sure what Jill means by an "instant hot water dispenser," which to me sounds like what one would find on a Culligan water dispenser with hot and cold options (although perhaps it is a sink?  Jill isn't exactly clear in her reports, and since none of us were there, her shoddy writing is all we have to go by).  Such an item would require electricity (and kind of a waste of electricity, in my mind), but they also have an AC, so their power supply must be pretty steady. Isn't a hot water dispenser within toddler's reach the kind of thing one would child-proof?  If it was the sink, why was he able to reach it?  I know that the Duggars believe in house-proofing their kids, rather than the other way around, but still.  This strikes me as an easily avoidable accident. 

 While I wish I could imagine that Jill was doing dishes, this is the same person who wasn't bothered by her son licking a metal fan, saying that it felt good on his teething gums.  

This is also the same person who repeatedly misused a baby carrier (though watching MEchelle with MyBrestFriend certainly wasn't educational).

This is also the same person who feeds her son from cans on a regular enough basis that Dreck doesn't bat an eye and she feels comfortable posting THAT, too.  

Anyone who's been around toddlers knows of their love for danger...but that means parents and caretakers have to be more hands-on and attentive during those times.  

I'm reminded of one of the old episodes when Josie was in the hospital, and Jill was supervising the Howlers at their (not rented, right?  the house was lent to them?) borrowed home closer to the hospital.  IIRC, one of the Howlers was (appropriately) in a tree, messing around.  Jill gave out a half-hearted warning, but didn't seem particularly perturbed by his behaviors.  Sort of made me wonder if JB and MEchelle's requirements were as basic as, "avoid blood and death.  If you can't avoid bloodshed, then just don't let the little one die."

For all the emotional closeness Jill seemed to provide for her buddy team, she isn't the natural mother many of us envisioned her as.  I'm sure lots of it is due to her horrible upbringing and her parents failing to teach their children anything, but it's still rather shocking. Her family's whole schtick was preparing the girls to be wives and mothers, yet here we have the Golden Child floundering over the most basic of child care moments.  

Truly, if there was a supreme being that controlled all, s/he would limit the number of children that a couple could have, to a safe number. The Duggars would have hit that threshold well before 19, and Jill/Derick might have been sitting at 1 for quite a bit longer. It's as if neither one of them has any parenting sense or logic at all. I'll give Ben/Jessa and Anna some credit here. They seem to understand parenting. The Dillards are dullards in this particular area. They need the village and not the jungle!!!!

[Million Children For Jesus]

17 hours ago, SorenaJ said:

Are we doing the name and birthday guesses yet? A boy (obv), called Solomon James, born on 7 July, weighing 8 lbs 10 oz. 

Good guess.

9 lbs. 4 oz, July 6

My guess is they will continue to use Old Testament names, like Israel David, with a less common first name and more common or trendy middle name.

First Names: Ezekiel, Gabriel, Solomon, Asher

Middle Names: Aaron, Adam, Jacob, Zachary, Michael, Daniel 

Final Answer: Ezekiel Aaron, because Izzy and Zeke actually sound cute together 

ETA: Okay, that wasn't my final answer. Derick's dad's name was Richard, so I'm guessing for an Old Testament first name and Richard as a middle name. Ezekiel isn't really flowing with Richard.

Asa Richard, Asher Richard, Samuel Richard, Nathaniel Richard, Levi Richard

 

[Bethella]

3 hours ago, Bad Wolf said:

They had Izzy in his own car seat on the plane. I was surprised that they would pay for a seat for him. Well, someone paid.

Jill's pregnant, so less room on her lap and you can't actually expect Derick to parent his own child for the entire length of the flight!

[Cheetah]

I didn't watch Counting On last year, so I'm taking what y'all are saying about Jill's attitude to her life in El Salvador for gospel (not going out exploring, unhappy, no ability to problem-solve on her own).

That said, I've just in the last few days gotten drawn into one of the adoptive mom blogs discussed on QFOS, the "Mother and Daughters" blog where Kimi the single Mormon mom adopted 4 kids in about 2 years... one at age 8 or so, one at 13, one at 11, and then one as a (almost still) baby of about 18 months.  Anyway, her older 2 didn't come advertised as intellectually delayed, but it became clear over the years they've been home that they both have significant delays.  How much is inherited vs how much is due to their years in orphanages is unclear.  But I'm struck by some of the similarities.  I mean, clearly Jill is much higher-functioning than these girls, but there's a certain similarity in the lack of curiosity,  the backgrounds that actively discouraged critical thinking or initiative. 

[anotherone]

11 hours ago, SassyPants said:

But this thinking is so short sided- either JB is stupid or very, very perverse.

Think about it. He controlled his kids to the point of dulling their intellect and rendering them unable to function in every day society. That's what we are seeing with Jill-Josh and probably Jessa too, if she didn't have the village at her every whim and disposal.

So, how did JB think the cult would grow beyond is own life and pocketbook?

It will die out because none of the kids, or at this point their spouses, have the ability to become JB...well, maybe JD or Jana, but they have no adult credibility, because as single people, they are still considered "kids".

I wonder if he ever thought about that.  It was his time of NOT being in the cult that allowed him to join and follow the cult.

[SassyPants]

8 minutes ago, anotherone said:

I wonder if he ever thought about that.  It was his time of NOT being in the cult that allowed him to join and follow the cult.

And set up his foundation-

[ViolaSebastian]

6 hours ago, Bad Wolf said:

They had Izzy in his own car seat on the plane. I was surprised that they would pay for a seat for him. Well, someone paid.

It's not like they're paying, that's what people with jobs are for. 

[LawsonBatesEgo]

13 hours ago, amandaaries said:

 

For all the emotional closeness Jill seemed to provide for her buddy team, she isn't the natural mother many of us envisioned her as.  I'm sure lots of it is due to her horrible upbringing and her parents failing to teach their children anything, but it's still rather shocking. Her family's whole schtick was preparing the girls to be wives and mothers, yet here we have the Golden Child floundering over the most basic of child care moments.  

It's interesting the way that the other experience's people have with children often don't mean anything in regards to how people will be with their own kids. If you asked me which of the J-Slaves would hate being a mother the most, I'd have said "Blessa hands down"  but she seems to actually really enjoy her children (so far. Who knows what it will be like when she has 6 of them and Bin is regretting every single life choice he made to end up the 30 year old father of 6 kids). She didn't seem as into her Buddy team as Jilly Muffin, but seems very good with her own kids. And Jilly Muffin seems to not really understand child development despite being one of the J-Slaves that semed the most invested and close to her buddy team. Not to mention how dumb she is for going along with Derick's White Savior dreams to El Salvador despite all the dangers and Zika risk. 

[apandaaries]

4 hours ago, LawsonBatesEgo said:

If you asked me which of the J-Slaves would hate being a mother the most, I'd have said "Blessa hands down"  but she seems to actually really enjoy her children (so far. Who knows what it will be like when she has 6 of them and Bin is regretting every single life choice he made to end up the 30 year old father of 6 kids). She didn't seem as into her Buddy team as Jilly Muffin, but seems very good with her own kids. 

Totally agree.  Jessa has taken to motherhood like a swan to water (since we all know Jessa is no duck).

[breakfree]

4 hours ago, LawsonBatesEgo said:

It's interesting the way that the other experience's people have with children often don't mean anything in regards to how people will be with their own kids. If you asked me which of the J-Slaves would hate being a mother the most, I'd have said "Blessa hands down"  but she seems to actually really enjoy her children (so far. Who knows what it will be like when she has 6 of them and Bin is regretting every single life choice he made to end up the 30 year old father of 6 kids). She didn't seem as into her Buddy team as Jilly Muffin, but seems very good with her own kids. And Jilly Muffin seems to not really understand child development despite being one of the J-Slaves that semed the most invested and close to her buddy team. Not to mention how dumb she is for going along with Derick's White Savior dreams to El Salvador despite all the dangers and Zika risk. 

While I also thought Jill would hands down be a better mother than Jessa, who I also thought would be a train wreck, it's unfair not to account for the fact that Jessa has been parked 10 minutes from her parents and the remaining J-slaves this entire time , and is over there A LOT, getting help and support as she raises her children. While Jill seems uniquely unqualified even accounting for this difference in their circumstances, I'm willing to bet if she'd stayed parked 10 minutes away too, her vast incompetence would not be nearly as evident as it currently is, and that she'd probably also objectively be doing a 'better job'. It's also easier to enjoy your kids when you have a lot of help with them. If you don't have any help (and trust me, D-wreck isn't helping) a lot of the time they are just gong to be/seem like work, especially at such a young age. 

[Pukingpearl]

5 hours ago, LawsonBatesEgo said:

It's interesting the way that the other experience's people have with children often don't mean anything in regards to how people will be with their own kids. If you asked me which of the J-Slaves would hate being a mother the most, I'd have said "Blessa hands down"  but she seems to actually really enjoy her children (so far. Who knows what it will be like when she has 6 of them and Bin is regretting every single life choice he made to end up the 30 year old father of 6 kids). She didn't seem as into her Buddy team as Jilly Muffin, but seems very good with her own kids. And Jilly Muffin seems to not really understand child development despite being one of the J-Slaves that semed the most invested and close to her buddy team. Not to mention how dumb she is for going along with Derick's White Savior dreams to El Salvador despite all the dangers and Zika risk. 

I think Jill was the crown jewel for her parents. She was a totally self righteous kid who got smothered with praise and approval from JB and Michelle for every little thing she did, and in a house with that much competition for love, she lapped up their praise and I think it drove her forward in everything she did with her buddies and parroting their beliefs and tattling. Now that she's off on her own, I don't think she's getting much attention and just has to raise a kid for the sake of raising the kid, and it's not nearly as satisfying being the mom whose job it is versus the perfect daughter-wife. Her external motivation is gone. 

Also I don't think the duggars were trained in safety at all. And also she might legitimately be depressed beyond her will. 

I'm rambling. 

[2manyKidzzz]

@breakfree I so totally agree. Jess being so close to the TTH and all of the Jslaves makes such a difference. And Bin took off from "work", that is hysterical in itself, when Spurgie was born. No incredible fatigue. No lack of adult, well, sort of, conversation and she/they could run to the TTH for meals and company.

Being alone with a small child, as many here know, is stressful and not really natural. You should be surrounded with people to provide support. Hence the current deal with play groups, mommy and me classes and such to afford people who don't live near family social support. 

I think Derick is an a@#*s. Zika, delivering early........they are being so irresponsible. Burning Izzy and then freezing him. I am the oldest of 8 and I was always boringly responsible with my boys. They laughed at me ultimately. "Mom....do you think this is SAFE!?!?!?!?" They knew I loved them. 

[ViolaSebastian]

Isn't Josh's (piece of shit) remark the only "proof" of her being a tattle tale? Or did other brothers and sisters say that too? Because if what I'm remember is correct, it's unfair to call her a tattle-tale for reporting her brother's molestation of her and her sisters. 

[SassyPants]

1 hour ago, breakfree said:

While I also thought Jill would hands down be a better mother than Jessa, who I also thought would be a train wreck, it's unfair not to account for the fact that Jessa has been parked 10 minutes from her parents and the remaining J-slaves this entire time , and is over there A LOT, getting help and support as she raises her children. While Jill seems uniquely unqualified even accounting for this difference in their circumstances, I'm willing to bet if she'd stayed parked 10 minutes away too, her vast incompetence would not be nearly as evident as it currently is, and that she'd probably also objectively be doing a 'better job'. It's also easier to enjoy your kids when you have a lot of help with them. If you don't have any help (and trust me, D-wreck isn't helping) a lot of the time they are just gong to be/seem like work, especially at such a young age. 

Also, Ben as the eldest offspring from a larger family, is likely use to helping out and the general chaos that children bring. Derick, OTOH, is barely 2 years older than his only sibling, and has had much more mainstream life experiences- education outside the home, went away to college and traveled, alone, to a foreign country. Derick has never experienced the barnyard circus of LIVING in what could pass for an elementary school classroom.

Ben's experiences when coupled with Jessa's might ground them as parents, while Dereck's INEXPERIENCE likely amps up Jill's anxiety and feelings of being overwhelmed. Kids do pick up on those cues.

1 hour ago, Pukingpearl said:

I think Jill was the crown jewel for her parents. She was a totally self righteous kid who got smothered with praise and approval from JB and Michelle for every little thing she did, and in a house with that much competition for love, she lapped up their praise and I think it drove her forward in everything she did with her buddies and parroting their beliefs and tattling. Now that she's off on her own, I don't think she's getting much attention and just has to raise a kid for the sake of raising the kid, and it's not nearly as satisfying being the mom whose job it is versus the perfect daughter-wife. Her external motivation is gone. 

Also I don't think the duggars were trained in safety at all. And also she might legitimately be depressed beyond her will. 

I'm rambling. 

I do remember than when asked during talking heads about their sisters/daughters as they were getting married, BOTH the parents and the siblings heaped praise on Jill- so she probably was genuinely kind and considerate, but that doesn't  mean that she wasn't also an attention hog...conversely, the kids didn't have such nice things to say about Jessa's interactions.  "Don't mess with Jess" is one comment that I remember. I figure Jess wasn't as nice or kind-more of a drill sergeant. 

[Carm_88]

23 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

*Snipped*...conversely, the kids didn't have such nice things to say about Jessa's interactions.  "Don't mess with Jess" is one comment that I remember. I figure Jess wasn't as nice or kind-more of a drill sergeant. 

I think Jessa is just a person who loves HER children. She might not like children that much outside of her own but she loves hers. There's nothing wrong with that many women are like that.