The Invisible Jinger (and Her Preacher Man Jeremy)

[Nicole Jinger Duggar]

On 12/29/2016 at 0:25 PM, GotCaughtDancing said:

I am not sure hw many guys the four of them talked with before deciding on that special one

I had to (I hope that link works)

[Scribber]

Oh my lord, this is so true. I'm still with my first boyfriend (Can't be giving away pieces of my heart now, can I? ) but we have changed SO MUCH over the course of our many-year relationship. Luckily, we were still compatible when we changed from the teens we were into the adults we are (even more so, in fact), but whaddya know, we got to KNOW each other over a period of many years, and are only now talking about marriage... god, we were so awkward at first. I cringe when I remember us during the first year 

Me too! In June? The husband and I will have been together 21 years, married 14.

I was 14 when we started "going out" (he is 4 years older than me... and may have been lead to believe I was much closer to his age...) but? We grew up together. We never intended to get married - but life happened. And it's been one hell of a journey!

But I cannot imagine if that had been our sole purpose in even talking to one another.

[snickers34]

7 hours ago, GotCaughtDancing said:

I do often wonder how these relationships will last in the years to come.

Agreed. There's NO way all of these are going to end well, and I, sadly, suspect they'll walk through some challenging Josh-style seasons of life, especially when the show ends and money dries up.

[trustworthy]

On ‎12‎/‎23‎/‎2016 at 11:49 PM, grandmadugger said:

On ‎12‎/‎25‎/‎2016 at 6:42 PM, Kira said:

3 hours ago, eleanora3 said:

I think Jinger has started wearing sleeveless shirts

 

 

Oh I love this photo.  The little glimpse of the dress looks gorgeous.  And she's got this mischievous look on her face.  What fun!

[frugalitymom]

She looks to be enjoying herself and I hope it was The Nutcracker, I enjoyed seeing it when I was younger.

[trustworthy]

Looking at this picture of them at the concert or opera or whatever it is, I can't help but think that Jill & Jessa never had this kind of opportunity.  Other than the honeymoons (which, in the case of Jill involved a week on a beach and in the case of Jessa, involved TLC cameras everywhere) they never had a time or space where they were exposed to new things and people different from what they were used to. They immediately moved to the compound and had Arkansas in-laws who lived a quick drive away.  Already Jinger has the expansion advantage.  You may not agree with Vuolo theology, but they seem relatively normal and kind compared to creepy, cringe-inducing JB.  I love that she's totally out of the TTH bubble.  Even Jill going to CA was somewhat routine -- she'd grown up going on those SOS missions to CA so it's not like it was a huge new thing for her.  Seems like Jinger is getting a taste of more mainstream North American life.  I went to my first opera when I was seven, and by the time I was her age I'd graduated from an Ivy League school, studied things she's probably not even heard of, and traveled by myself in nine European countries -- but for her, what she's experiencing is radical in many ways, and I'm happy for her.

[marmalade]

It looks like The Nutcracker coincides with the Academy of Music's event schedule, as it runs through the weekend (so one can assume it ran before Christmas). We don't know when the picture was taken, but the red seat sections do not jive with Sydney's layout. I'm pretty positive that this is part of their Philly junket. 

But I agree, between this and whatever they saw at the Sydney Opera House, she's been exposed to levels of performance that no one else in her family has. And she scored some nice opera glasses! LOL

[SweetFellowshipper]

2 hours ago, MargaretElliott said:

Oh my lord, this is so true. I'm still with my first boyfriend (Can't be giving away pieces of my heart now, can I? ) but we have changed SO MUCH over the course of our many-year relationship. Luckily, we were still compatible when we changed from the teens we were into the adults we are (even more so, in fact), but whaddya know, we got to KNOW each other over a period of many years, and are only now talking about marriage... god, we were so awkward at first. I cringe when I remember us during the first year 

Now imagine after 6 months of meeting in that first year you were expected to learn to flirt, date for the first time, marry, have sex for the first time and procreate. !!!!!

[srosieb827]

I have said this before and I'll say it again... I REALLY think Jinger had found something great with Jeremy.  Sure there are some appalling views and I won't forgive that, but I'm thrilled that she seems to be experiencing life and doing normal things and really falling into a normal right wing christian life. In spite of their views too, they seem to still be spending time with his siblings who are much more liberal.  

I think Jeremy will listen to her, and support her in her dreams whatever they are and however small they may seem to us.  I mean, if she did see the nutcracker, that's not something a guy would just naturally want to do, but I'm sure it was either something she wanted, or he thought she should experience.  I actually see it being the latter because I don't know that she would even have an understanding of what it was culturally. He clearly supports her wearing what she's comfortable in. 

I am still holding out to see when she gets pregnant, but I also still think there's a chance they aren't running into it.  During that q&a when asked about kids she gave a horrified look, and then diverted to him, and he just said they would "see where the lord took them" which seemed like a cagey way of saying, we trust gods plan but don't need to have a zillion babies when we don't have to. 

I'm still cautiously optimistic, but I think she's as free as could ever really be possible, and I'm happy for her. 

[snickers34]

27 minutes ago, srosieb827 said:

In spite of their views too, they seem to still be spending time with his siblings who are much more liberal.  

Evidence of this? So far I've only seen the video with his sister Val singing.

[trustworthy]

On ‎12‎/‎23‎/‎2016 at 11:49 PM, grandmadugger said:

On ‎12‎/‎25‎/‎2016 at 6:42 PM, Kira said:

25 minutes ago, srosieb827 said:

During that q&a when asked about kids she gave a horrified look, and then diverted to him, and he just said they would "see where the lord took them" which seemed like a cagey way of saying, we trust gods plan but don't need to have a zillion babies when we don't have to. 

 

 

I agree.  I think Jeremy is smart enough to know there are certain ways you have to phrase things to the TLC cameras and then there's what you actually think.  I can totally see them using BC, but he's smart enough to know he had to keep his mouth shut.  How they worked that one out without private time pre-marriage would be fascinating if it's true.   My only worry is that he's ruining it for Joy and future girls ... like now JB's going to build into the 10 page questionnaire -- or whatever that thing is -- questions like "Do you believe women should wear pants?" or "How do you feel about alcohol?"

[marmalade]

2 minutes ago, snickers34 said:

Evidence of this? So far I've only seen the video with his sister Val singing.

His brother's IMBD profile is not fundie-approved. You can find him under either Charles/Chuck Vuolo.

[SweetFellowshipper]

I don't believe for one second they will use birth control. I'm sure that not using it was a condition of their marriage and I can't imagine them actually purchasing condoms or the pill. We hope that with everyone but he's likely to be more conservative than the Duggars if anything...As someone else said, he's seen the world but chose a Duggar, which means he's choosing a fundie life very deliberately. He's not like a Chad or even Brandon who was raised in IBLP so could be expected to continue...He's been a pro soccer player with a million chances to be with women of every religious and political stripe. He chose Jinger. He might be a bit more mainstream culturally but that has very little to do with birth control, which to them is abortion. *A lot* of people in Duggar circles, including the Bateses, do a lot of mainstream things...Go on musical tours, to theme parks and beaches, shopping, dining out, etc. The ideological stuff is what will show some slight possibility of change...Like Bin's statements on racism or Erin and Chad's statement, if very vague, on Gothard. Alyssa can wear pants all she likes to look trendy and fashionable but she's still eyeball deep in the Kool Aid.

This isn't pants, dancing or a bit of wine. This is literally one of the foundations of their shared religion. To them the pill is tantamount to killing (murdering!) a baby. Not a fetus, a living human the same as you or me. I get that we want them to be different but I'd be positively shocked if Jinger, who hasn't shown the slightest sign of rebellion in years, suddenly denounced essentially the basic tenets of their religion. Doesn't seem logical to me.

[snickers34]

1 minute ago, marmalade said:

His brother's IMBD profile is not fundie-approved. You can find him under either Charles/Chuck Vuolo.

Fine. But how does that prove they're spending time with their siblings? I don't disagree that his brother seems liberal. I haven't seen much evidence that he's influencing J & J and/or close and/or spending time with them. Just because he stood up in his brother's wedding doesn't say much - that's like the one time in life that families tend to suck it up and show up for things.

All I'm saying is, I don't see any evidence of some liberal uprising from the Vuolos.

[marmalade]

I don't either. I'm just pointing out that not all Vuolos in the immediate family fit the typical fundie mold. He's likely mainstream Christian, which is fine, but neither he nor anyone else in his family is going to inform his own sexual reproduction choices. He made up his mind when he decided to pursue a Duggar. He couldn't have been so blind as to be ignorant of their no b/c stance. If he was, he was certainly dispelled of that notion inside of a week. 

Unlike Duggarbots whose minds have never wandered, I think Jeremy has had a sea change in his religious philosophy since college. And I think those types are even scarier. 

Points for having a family whose members MAKE A LIVING in the arts and may expose Jinger to that world (unlike Jana the "concert pianist"), but other than that? I don't know if I see any real differences between Pa Vuolo and Pa Duggar (aside from limiting family size).

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

10 minutes ago, trustworthy said:

I agree.  I think Jeremy is smart enough to know there are certain ways you have to phrase things to the TLC cameras and then there's what you actually think.  I can totally see them using BC, but he's smart enough to know he had to keep his mouth shut.  How they worked that one out without private time pre-marriage would be fascinating if it's true.   My only worry is that he's ruining it for Joy and future girls ... like now JB's going to build into the 10 page questionnaire -- or whatever that thing is -- questions like "Do you believe women should wear pants?" or "How do you feel about alcohol?"

Joy is okay, Austin passed muster in that it is probably an arraigned marriage.  As for Jinger & Jeremy discussing BC pre marriage, I'm guessing it was pretty easy, they didn't follow the rules as much as boob & DQ wanted.  I'm sure there were whispers and probably emails maybe snapchats or facetimes/skypes with out supervision.  My daughters friend with the fundy parents, whos fucking everything with a penis and doing more drugs than Keith Richards finds ways to chat with various boys and her dealer with out her mom & dad seeing the messages.  They aren't as computer savy as most teens so there are many message services to be used that don't leave traces.  Close face to face conversations, some of the "chaperoning" was merely having someone in the room with them. 

Now yah, Joy is being watched like a hawk, I notice Jed and Jenny/Hannie were sitting right next to them but it would be very easy for the two of them to whisper to each other as the siblings didn't seem overly interested in what they were doing and looked almost annoyed at being there.  But the next guy to come along will have some serious hoops to jump through.  So poor Jana, hopefully by the time Hannie courts Boob will be too old to care. 

[Audrey2]

8 hours ago, MayMay1123 said:

 

awww look at jinge having fun in church! that's a pretty secular song for her, too...

Sorry, folks, didn't grab the quote I wanted. I'm talking about the Twelve Days of Christmas video on the last page. You can see the organist on it.

 

Finally got to look at this video at home, instead of on my phone. 

 

I looked at the other songs on the song sheet, which feathered Holly Jolly, Christmas, Frosty the Snowman, and Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer. It looks like the Vuolo clan is participating in a Christmas sing-a-long. I'm not sure they're in a building currently used as a church, unless they are singing in a room other than the sanctuary. I wonder if this is something like Tuba Christmas (without the tubas, euphoniums, baritones, sousaphones, etc. Tuba Christmas takes place in many places, allowing the deep brass instruments that usually only get to play the oom-pa-pa part to play the melody. They're a lot of fun to attend. The instruments play the song the first time, then the audience sings along the second.).

 

I'm wondering if this is an annual tradition for the Vuolo family, or if they're trying to show Jinger as many different ways of celebrating the holidays as possible. I know when my sister was dating her (now) husband, we travelled to another state to visit her. Her (now) mother in law took us to a Catholic Shrine to see it decked out with Christmas light displays. I'm even wondering if some of this could be a reaction to his parents spending some time with her parents, and wanting to show her more about the world. 

[Adrienne83]

Reading the finds that some of you guys have had at thrift stores makes me sad that I don't have any luck at them. :/

I actually married the one guy I really dated. Prior to him I had only went on a couple of dates with one other guy. I met my now husband when I was 24. Minus first date, he was/is my first everything. No real reason I didn't date. I was just more interested in school because of some stuff that happened in my past. You can have a successful marriage with your only, but, the way the Duggars do it scares me. We defiantly didn't get married within seconds of knowing each other.

Also, the defiantly can limit their children without birth control. I refuse to ever take hormonal birth control, and my husband hates condoms. If they really don't want kids now, I can imagine they can abstain. With Jeremy growing up non fundie, I can't imagine him being against it. He can always say he has a headache or something.

 

[Kira]

3 hours ago, trustworthy said:

Looking at this picture of them at the concert or opera or whatever it is, I can't help but think that Jill & Jessa never had this kind of opportunity.  Other than the honeymoons (which, in the case of Jill involved a week on a beach and in the case of Jessa, involved TLC cameras everywhere) they never had a time or space where they were exposed to new things and people different from what they were used to. They immediately moved to the compound and had Arkansas in-laws who lived a quick drive away.  Already Jinger has the expansion advantage.  You may not agree with Vuolo theology, but they seem relatively normal and kind compared to creepy, cringe-inducing JB.  I love that she's totally out of the TTH bubble.  Even Jill going to CA was somewhat routine -- she'd grown up going on those SOS missions to CA so it's not like it was a huge new thing for her.  Seems like Jinger is getting a taste of more mainstream North American life.  I went to my first opera when I was seven, and by the time I was her age I'd graduated from an Ivy League school, studied things she's probably not even heard of, and traveled by myself in nine European countries -- but for her, what she's experiencing is radical in many ways, and I'm happy for her.

That's not true????

I think we made similar comments(about bc etc.) about the Dillards and Seewalds shortly after they married 

[marmalade]

1 hour ago, Audrey2 said:

Sorry, folks, didn't grab the quote I wanted. I'm talking about the Twelve Days of Christmas video on the last page. You can see the organist on it.

 

Finally got to look at this video at home, instead of on my phone. 

 

I looked at the other songs on the song sheet, which feathered Holly Jolly, Christmas, Frosty the Snowman, and Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer. It looks like the Vuolo clan is participating in a Christmas sing-a-long. I'm not sure they're in a building currently used as a church, unless they are singing in a room other than the sanctuary. I wonder if this is something like Tuba Christmas (without the tubas, euphoniums, baritones, sousaphones, etc. Tuba Christmas takes place in many places, allowing the deep brass instruments that usually only get to play the oom-pa-pa part to play the melody. They're a lot of fun to attend. The instruments play the song the first time, then the audience sings along the second.).

 

I'm wondering if this is an annual tradition for the Vuolo family, or if they're trying to show Jinger as many different ways of celebrating the holidays as possible. I know when my sister was dating her (now) husband, we travelled to another state to visit her. Her (now) mother in law took us to a Catholic Shrine to see it decked out with Christmas light displays. I'm even wondering if some of this could be a reaction to his parents spending some time with her parents, and wanting to show her more about the world. 

At best, it's a family tradition. I didn't watch the panning of the video closely, but was the brother there? I did see Valerie. Does anyone in Philly know when this happens? Maybe Chuck couldn't get down from Boston until the last moment or something? I saw Chuck Sr. and Diana...maybe Chuck Jr. was there, but I missed him (hard to do with his mop of hair). 

I'm just glad that she had some new experiences and enjoyed them. Maybe more concerts might re-ignight music in her (hasn't worked with Jessa at all). Voila! Church pianist! (Sorry, but probably true)

11 minutes ago, Kira said:

That's not true????

I think we made similar comments(about bc etc.) about the Dillards and Seewalds shortly after they married 

Oh, I NEVER made those remarks. Cape Hatteras and a TLC-produced "honeymoon" in Europe won't teach you much about each other. Well, maybe the former can, since they were alone. They managed to figure out how get a hole in one after ten whole days of marriage. So, I guess the Dullards "won" that round in fundieworld. 

[elliha]

I don't think that they are trying to avoid a pregnancy now regardless of what they will do in the future, I think that they will want to have a kid to kind of prove the worth of their marriage but that it is more open what will happen in the future. They could say they are open to the number of kids god will give them and still use NPF and not even lie. Jeremy's parents only have three kids and are deeply religious so I am pretty sure they would not have a demand on them to maximize their number of children from a religious point of view even though that might be what Michelle and JB want. I think they will feel free to choose their family size and feel that god is still on their side. My guess is that they will have 5-6 kids and the first one will be born late 2017 or early 2018. It would be great if they chose to wait a year or two but I don't think that will happen. I do hope they will allow for some spacing to truly have time to enjoy their kids. 

[Mela99]

I've been sporadic since full-time bar study came back, but did Jeremy seriously comment about drinking alcohol? He does? Anyone wanna fill me in on that?

[srosieb827]

8 hours ago, snickers34 said:

Fine. But how does that prove they're spending time with their siblings? I don't disagree that his brother seems liberal. I haven't seen much evidence that he's influencing J & J and/or close and/or spending time with them. Just because he stood up in his brother's wedding doesn't say much - that's like the one time in life that families tend to suck it up and show up for things.

All I'm saying is, I don't see any evidence of some liberal uprising from the Vuolos.

Chuck isn't influencing his siblings at all.  He very much hates the lime light, but he has spent time with his brother and his wife during the holidays.  I know this, because on my best friends works with him, and I've met him several times. The fact that they're still fairly close in spite of their difference I think suggests an open-mindedness at the minimum to accept his different world view. That is encouraging. 

[Gillyweed]

I wonder if having kids will change Jeremy's take on religion (as in being fundie). If they have a daughter, he might want to give her the same opportunities his mom and sister have. If his mind is at all normal, he'd want to give his kids as many opportunities as possible (unlike JB).... Well, one can hope

Also, they won't be able to fit 1000 kids in an apartment. From what we've seen of Jeremy's apartment, my guess is they could fit 2 or 3 kids at most. 

[srosieb827]

I could see them using NFP the opposite way that the rest of Duggars do, or just simply not endeavoring to get pregnant at every opportunity. Either abstaining when she's ovulating, or just not paying that much attention and letting it happen when it happens, rather than trying like crazy every time she's ovulating to get pregnant. I highly doubt they'll use any traditional hormonal bc, but maybe they would use condoms? I just don't see Jinger forcing the issue of getting pregnant as soon as possible at every opportunity possible the same way her sister have. And I don't see Jeremy hoping on board with that either.