Sister Wives 3 - Collective in Crisis?

[Imagine20]

I would love for Kolleen to revisit the Maddie, Mariah, and Logan. I think those are the three that had a sit down discussion with Kolleen and 2 others who had escaped. I wonder if the Brown kids continue to think polygamy is great and can work now that their family is falling apart.  We know Mariah's views have changed. I'd love to hear the adult Brown children talk about any opinion changes they've had. 

Escaping Polygamy is a great show. The Kingstons are scary. 

[SweetFellowshipper]

12 hours ago, Cleopatra7 said:

My question about blacks upthread stems from the fact that it seems like a number of LDS became AUB after the priesthood was opened up to black men in the 1970s. I don't have any numbers on this, but it reminds me of how Catholic traditionalists separated themselves from the mainstream Catholic Church after Vatican II. Traditionalists may not be large in number (maybe a million tops), but they exert a huge influence on Catholic discourse. According to this quote from the AUB Wikipedia entry:

For me, the big issue is that if the Browns really aren't AUB or any flavor of Mormon fundamentalist as we understand the term, then why are they subjecting themselves to this dysfunctional situation? It's quite obvious that the original three wives aren't happy and haven't been so in quite a while. Meri was ready to leave the family to run off with some random stranger on the Internet, and only didn't because there was no actual guy behind the computer screen. The so-called "sisterhood" that the women claim to have is obviously false, as they seem more like frenemies who share the same baby daddy and have to place nice for the good of the children. The only reason why any of these women put up with Kody is because of religion, because they fear they won't get to the Celestial Kingdom and be with their children for eternity without being polygamous. As with the Duggars, TLC isn't explaining the religious reasons for why the Browns act the way they do, even when religion is the elephant in the room.

I assume the same reason the My Five Wives people stay together even though they don't identify with the religion and left it entirely...or why any formerly religious people, including mostly monogamists, stay in bad marriages. They're family. It's habit. Finances are tied. It's easier. There's some love there. They grew up together. There are children, houses, friends, pets. Whatever the reason, lots of people marry as one religion and don't leave the second they're not so religious anymore. Actually I would think that's rarer than just staying together and figuring it out, even if it never truly improves. I don't think the celestial kingdom has a single thing to do with why any one of them stays. 

And actually, Kody seems to be the most religious of all of them. I don't think the women feel any sort of religious pressure at all. I believe all of them, except recently Meri, are very much in love with Kody and fell for him deeply. Kody actually doesn't seem to me to be very much in love with them. He's the one who seems to be most in love with the religion and the idea of plural marriage, to me. Not even the sex or the power, but the specificity of being AUB and having that large family structure seems very special to him. I will never get it but that seems to be his focus. 

[theinvisiblegirl]

3 hours ago, Imagine20 said:

I would love for Kolleen to revisit the Maddie, Mariah, and Logan. I think those are the three that had a sit down discussion with Kolleen and 2 others who had escaped. I wonder if the Brown kids continue to think polygamy is great and can work now that their family is falling apart.  We know Mariah's views have changed. I'd love to hear the adult Brown children talk about any opinion changes they've had. 

Escaping Polygamy is a great show. The Kingstons are scary. 

I'd love to see her return to the show for another sit down.

I had no idea there were so many different kinds of fundamentalist Mormons. From what I'm reading here, these Kingston people sound pretty damn scary. No wonder Kolleen was so hard on the Browns - her experiences are even more difficult than the ones they experienced in their group. I'm glad she got out.

I also can't wait to go through the tag! I "love" me some fundamentalist Mormons. (Love obviously isn't used in the regular sense here  )

[DaisyD]

Yeah, the world Kolleen grew up in is a really scary place. Groups like hers are why I tend to defend the Browns. They're dysfunctional, but no more so than some monogamous families, and nowhere near as awful, sick, and twisted as groups like the Kingstons.

[SweetFellowshipper]

I'm obsessed with polygamy and would love an FLDS subforum. 

"Agenda" is kind of a loaded word, generally with a negative connotation. If their only agenda was to decriminalize their relationship, I don't see much of an issue, even if one doesn't agree with decriminalizing it. It actually makes sense to go on TV for that purpose...wider audience, start a discussion, etc. That's what ACT UP did with the AIDS crisis. (And no, I am not comparing the Browns and their silly religion and silly relationship to the badass activist group that was ACT UP, just their attempt to use the media to talk about an often unaddressed topic). People have done it with shows about disability, gay couples who want to marry, etc., to change laws or change the conversation. I think it's pretty normal. And it wasn't hidden. They were always quite clear that that was their agenda from the beginning. They said they wanted to legalize and normalize polygamy.

The problem is that while the Browns are probably right about the fact that decriminalizing polygamy would lead to less child abuse, cult control, and underage marriage, because their marriage would be regulated just like anyone else's instead of a secret. And more women would have the chance to escape before marrying. However, they can't get that across very well because they 1) have a terrible relationship with each other as adults-- they seem like good parents, but their own relationship sucks, 2) Kody is incredibly egotistical and grating and it's distracting, and 3) they're not terribly bright. So the purpose might be good, but their execution sucks. They should have just done a documentary or something. Instead we get several seasons of picking out mansion tile floors, catfishing, and arguing on road trips. Not really making their argument for them. 

[Coconut Flan]

One season or a few specials would have done a lot more toward promoting legalizing polygamy than what they have done.  I'm not sure with Kody if that was his real goal or it was window dressing to get other people onboard.  I think perhaps Kody's goal all along was to get Kody on TV.

[SweetFellowshipper]

4 hours ago, Coconut Flan said:

One season or a few specials would have done a lot more toward promoting legalizing polygamy than what they have done.  I'm not sure with Kody if that was his real goal or it was window dressing to get other people onboard.  I think perhaps Kody's goal all along was to get Kody on TV.

And move to Vegas. 

I think it was certainly the wives' goal. I don't know that Kody does anything that isn't about religion (and only because it's HIS religion) and himself. 

[FundieFarmer]

Amen. This has started to become counterproductive as we're basically watching middleschoolers fight over the dreamiest boy in class. 

[MarblesMom]

And by dreamiest, we might mean douchiest.... but, these are middle-aged middle schoolers pining/adoring him.  YMMV.

Kody always seems so clueless  - and confused, when one of his wives has an opinion or thought that wasn't his.  I can watch the show with the sound off just to "admire his countenance" as he attempts to process other adult thoughts. 

On another topic, has anyone any info on income for these folks since the move?  I remember in Utah K-ick had a job in sales or marketing and I think a wife had a job outside the home...?!  But since the move to Vegas, I have no idea how those houses are being paid for (other than TLC).  Certainly the SWC venture wasn't funding much....

 

[Blueruin]

And what is up with SWC since sobbin is in reproduction mode? They should have gone with Janelles idea it had more sale ability, does anyone actually buy that jewelry ? From what I've seen online it's poorly managed web page and over pricedness has me thinking people want to see it but definatly not buy it.

[FundieFarmer]

And what is up with SWC since sobbin is in reproduction mode? They should have gone with Janelles idea it had more sale ability, does anyone actually buy that jewelry ? From what I've seen online it's poorly managed web page and over pricedness has me thinking people want to see it but definatly not buy it.

That's exactly the case, which neither they nor their investors appeared to understand as they pondered why views weren't translating into purchases.

[DaisyD]

I believe Kody does gun show sales. There are a few posts on Tumblr with pics of him selling at gun shows. Janelle got into real estate. I have no idea what the others do.

[Cleopatra7]

14 hours ago, MarblesMom said:

And by dreamiest, we might mean douchiest.... but, these are middle-aged middle schoolers pining/adoring him.  YMMV.

Kody always seems so clueless  - and confused, when one of his wives has an opinion or thought that wasn't his.  I can watch the show with the sound off just to "admire his countenance" as he attempts to process other adult thoughts. 

On another topic, has anyone any info on income for these folks since the move?  I remember in Utah K-ick had a job in sales or marketing and I think a wife had a job outside the home...?!  But since the move to Vegas, I have no idea how those houses are being paid for (other than TLC).  Certainly the SWC venture wasn't funding much....

 

Someone on the Cynical Jinx blog postulated that the reason why the wives put up with Kody's nonsense is because they think it's better to share a conventionally attractive guy than possibly not have a guy at all or be stuck with a less attractive guy. If you look at photos of Kody as a young man, he's practically a Mormon Tiger Beat spread: tall, blond hair, blue eyes, square jaw, a returned missionary, and devoted to his faith. Janelle and especially Christine have weight issues and could feel like Kody is the best they can aspire to in a man, and if it means having to share him, it's better than the alternative.

[SweetFellowshipper]

Omg, thinking of Kody as dreamy is so unnerving. But I agree, that's truly what they think and have always thought. I think they have always been quite enamoured with him. 

 

[ChickenettiLuvr]

Wowza.  I just caught the second half of last week's episode.  What a fustercluck!!

Meri sure is playing the victim card for all its worth.  Especially telling is the "emotionally wobbly voice" -- with never a genuine tear. Hmmmm.....

Very impressed with the grace and class shown by Christine and Janelle.

Is @Buzzard gracing us with a recap tonight????

[MarblesMom]

Is anyone else watching?  Or just me? 

Did anyone else find it strange that Kody just asked Sobyn in their TH "How's the pregnancy going?"  What an odd question for a spouse to ask - he sounded more like a neighbor (well, technically, he kinda IS a neighbor....).

[Chicken bones]

Of course....Robyn had to insert her own all about me-Ness into Garrison's enlistment.

Eta... gee, I wonder if Robyn being "fiesty" and not holding back her opinions has more to do with her being the legal wife than her pregnancy?!

[ChickenettiLuvr]

I agree 100%, @Chicken bones.  Robyn found her voice & feisty-ness exactly when she assumed Most Favored Nation-Wife Status.  She is now Large Marge in Charge.  And even more insufferable.

[MarblesMom]

Can I point out (although this topic probably belongs with weddings and PB) how "tacky" I find it to hold a baby shower when she just had a kid like 3 years ago?!  And the extent of detail that went into the event, for the SAME PEOPLE YOU SEE EVERYDAY just irritated me.

I knew someone who had to throw HERSELF a baby shower for the 3rd kid, as no one moved forward, and she was determined to have yet another shower.

Perhaps the Utah and Arkansas party planners can just merge into one group?  Get a party planning compound somewhere in the middle??

[MarblesMom]

Let's hope the lack of chat here tonight means the beginning of their doom....

[Cleopatra7]

10 hours ago, ChickenettiLuvr said:

I agree 100%, @Chicken bones.  Robyn found her voice & feisty-ness exactly when she assumed Most Favored Nation-Wife Status.  She is now Large Marge in Charge.  And even more insufferable.

"Just assumed Most Favored Wife status" needs to be a post count.

[SweetFellowshipper]

Looks like it's now polygamy going to the Supreme Court! Should bring all the crazies out of the woodwork. What do you guys think??

[samurai_sarah]

For a brief overview of what's going on: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3589712/Sister-Wives-appeal-polygamy-ruling-US-Supreme-Court.html

 

I personally think the case will be thrown out. My opinion isn't based on any moral, social or religious considerations, but based on bureaucracy. Making polygamy legal would mean a major upheaval in terms of paperwork, taxes, establishing inheritance and so on. New laws would be needed for divorce and custody cases, and that's just the tip of the iceberg. I also suspect that a lot of medical insurance providers would very quickly change their policies to exclude spouses wholesale.

Legalising monogamy for LGBTQ people was relatively simple compared to that. Mainly, because in the West, monogamy is the rule, so it was easy to just go from "husband and wife" to "spouses".

Whether I personally think it's fair or not to keep polygamy illegal, is a different issue. 

[eandre31]

12 hours ago, MarblesMom said:

Can I point out (although this topic probably belongs with weddings and PB) how "tacky" I find it to hold a baby shower when she just had a kid like 3 years ago?!  And the extent of detail that went into the event, for the SAME PEOPLE YOU SEE EVERYDAY just irritated me.

I agree. I can't believe that second and third baby showers are becoming so commonplace now. I'm sorry, but asking for baby gifts when you had a child less than 5 years prior is tacky. Some people claim if the baby is a different sex, that makes it okay. No. That's why you don't register for EVERYTHING pink or blue with your first. Register for gender neutral staples and you're set. A baby doesn't need a pink high chair, pink car seat, pink baby bath, etc.

The only time multiple baby showers are acceptable in my opinion is if it has been like 7 years since your last. 

[DaisyD]

I had another baby shower for my second less than 4 years after the first. I didn't ask for it. I didn't even know about registering for gifts with my first. All I got were clothes for a boy, a crib, and one of those giant swings the first time. I registered the second time for gender neutral things ranging from pacifiers to a swing that would fit in our tiny apartment. I got clothes for a girl. That's just the way my in laws do things I guess (many of them were also fighting with my mil at the time, so most didn't even show up since she was hosting, thus turning the whole thing into something I'm still a little bitter about). Even though I had two baby showers we still ended up buying all the big stuff (minus the crib) ourselves. Judge me all you want. I don't think I did anything wrong (or tacky for that matter, ffs).