Jill Duggar Dillard Part 11

[Valerie3kids]

24 minutes ago, twinmama said:

I hope your daughter and her baby are well and continue to be well through the season! Hand washing is so so helpful and important. Agreed that I doubt the Duggars ever were vigilant about that. Josie is older than my boys so I wasn't a NICU mom yet when those episodes aired. I do remember a visit of all siblings there, though they were in a separate room. Our NICU allowed parents and 2 guests who had to be on an approved visitor list. And no one under 18 was allowed in the NICU, no exceptions for any reason, during cold/flu/RSV season. Our particular NICU had family rooms (tv, couch/bed, chairs) outside the actual NICU but inside the locked entrance if that makes sense, where if a baby was passing away all family members could gather.

We are heavy duty hand washers!! Sweet pea is well so far. Just a tiny sprite.

I believe that is true here also that no one under 18 is allowed in the NICU, unless the baby is not expected to live. I believe they are then transferred to one of the family type rooms so all can come in.

I just remember that tiny child with all those people hanging over her. Along with JB and Mechelle with their goofy smiles plastered on their faces. Plus, there had to be camera people in the room also. Film first. Family safety last. Go Duggars!

[choralcrusader8613]

They did make mention of the 18 and older rule on some episodes where 1 or 2 kids would go visit Josie. I know it was said when Jana and Jill went to visit her.

[RosyDaisy]

i'm hoping jfer's in general don't agree with blanket training!

It's child abuse, so no, I don't agree with it at all. I don't believe in corporal punishment. As for others here, I have never read a post here condoning blanket training.

My sister had blanket time with her kids. She would put a quilt on the floor with toys and play with her babies. Even the kitties got in on it. It was hilarious to watch.

[ClaraOswin]

We often put blankets down for our son. Even though we have carpet, I liked the extra layer. Especially with all of his spit up (there was a LOT of spit up.)

Of course, I was always trying to get him to crawl and not slapping him for doing so. 

The only blanket "training" he had was tummy time.

[nastyhobbitses]

On 1/23/2016 at 5:55 AM, Cactus said:

A question: if Jill were to fall pregnant in Central America, contract Zika virus from whatever source, and (heaven forbid) have a child with microcephaly or other serious birth defect, would she truly look after this child and accept it as her own? Would she genuinely give up her extended praycation in Central America to care for a disabled child? Would the Duggars consider such a child a sign that Jill has displeased God?

I really don't know what the Duggars would be likely to do. I honestly hope I don't find out.

The Duggars would consider such a child an excellent opportunity for We Are So Great For Not Aborting A Disabled Baby speaking tours, with very high speaking fees and optional "love offerings".

[unforgiving]

13 hours ago, Valerie3kids said:

Are most babies born with Rika virus born with microcephaly or anecephaly? Neither is a promising outcome. 

I don't think anyone knows yet. They only just proved that there is a definate link between Zika virus in pregnancy and microcephaly, as had been suspected.

[foreign fundie]

Just commenting on the suicidal man in the church topic.

I doubt they would have gone into the church with the express purpose to evangelise. Probably it was just hot and they were looking for some shade and ran into the guy. 

And even if they did go there to meet people, church is not a bad place to talk about God. It would however be offensive if they inconvenienced people or spoke badly of the Catholic church while being in the venue. 

Now they could very well have done both, but we don't really know that. The man may have been relieved to talk. They may have genuinly encouraged him to a degree. 

As for the assumptions they make about his spiritual condition and the framing of the incident to fit their expectations and ideals, it shows the limitness of their worldview, not so much malicious intent.

Taking a picture of that and putting it on the web is a way to justify the importance of their efforts to the people who p(r)ay for their mission. They probably have not even considered the privacy of the person, and just think only their prayer partners read their up dates. 

Seeing 'natives' as a prop in the background of your own story is sadly immature but not uncommon. If you travel to exotic places for holiday it is often the same. It takes years of living with people and sharing their lives to connect with them as true and equal friends. And some never get to that place because they have the wrong mindset constantly enforced by other immature people. 

This is often no different for people going to build schools or orphanages in their holiday. Superiority, be it religious, cultural or economical is hard to shake. It takes time and self-reflection. And it is a constant battle against one's natural tendencies. At least for me...

Summarizing, these SOS folk could mean well, but need some serious training and do some growing up. 

[Arete]

16 hours ago, twinmama said:

I also never want to find out, but my guess is they would treat the child like her parents treat Josie. We'll pray real hard and pretend to get her the help she needs. Not that I think Josie really has any delays or whatnot, but from what I saw of how they treated their 25 weeker after she came home from the NICU... it was NOTHING like I treated my 29 weekers. And 29 weeks is a completely different ball game (like they spent no time on a ventilator and only 9 weeks in NICU with no complications). We did isolation from October to April their first two years to keep them safe from RSV/flu season. The Duggars didn't seem to do anything to protect Josie. Side note, if you want to know the perfect way to make someone who is borderline postpartum depression tip right into PPD, it's isolation for months on end with two refluxy infants.

Are there any examples of fundies who have had a child with a severe disability? I don't mean the serial adopters who "rescue" child after child with severe issues and basically neglect and collect them, but someone who had a child with an issue. I wonder what the standard reaction is.

The Munck's have a son with Down's Syndrome. While they are obviously committing educational neglect by not enrolling him in public school and having his sister pretend to educate him, he is clearly loved and well integrated into the family.

[ksgranola1]

Quote

 "I find is nauseating that she describes Josie's seizures as a "glitch". I also feel there are probably more issues with Josie than we will ever be told."

I'm surprised Michelle admitted that much. She's been saying all along that Josie's seizures were "febrile." I never bought that. I'm certain those seizures are a result of her horrible birth and that Michelle would never admit to that b/c she knew people would scream it was her fault for having a baby at 44. 

[choralcrusader8613]

5 minutes ago, ksgranola1 said:

I'm surprised Michelle admitted that much. She's been saying all along that Josie's seizures were "febrile." I never bought that. I'm certain those seizures are a result of her horrible birth and that Michelle would never admit to that b/c she knew people would scream it was her fault for having a baby at 44. 

Supposedly they are febrile, and they'll go away once she's 10. But like you, I never know how much of that to believe.

[quiverofdoubt]

6 minutes ago, ksgranola1 said:

I'm surprised Michelle admitted that much. She's been saying all along that Josie's seizures were "febrile." I never bought that. I'm certain those seizures are a result of her horrible birth and that Michelle would never admit to that b/c she knew people would scream it was her fault for having a baby at 44. 

I personally believe Josie has more issues than the family is letting on.  My background is in psychology/education/early childhood.  Premie's are at risk for a lot of developmental delays, many of which can be subtle or not arise till school age, like dyslexia.  She may not be severely handicapped, but I do believe she would have benefited from therapy early on.  Between the early birth, which i believe most families see specialists for to determine any delays that may have caused, the seizures, her severe food allergies and a her overall rough start, they should have had her evaluated several times by now.  Just as a precaution, if nothing else.

I do not believe the duggars are capable of recognizing developmental issues or behavioral issues in their children, nor would they get proper mainstream treatment for them if they did. I bet several of their children would have been diagnosed as ADHD in ps by now.  That condition is over diagnosed IMO, but for kids who actually suffer from it, it can be miserable to live with.

[ksgranola1]

Quote

 

One of my grandsons is ADHD. It's like living w/a hurricane in your house. To Michelle's credit, she has taken Josie to a specialist at the Ark. Children's hospital.  I remember that much. She never mentioned having to take her to the eye doctor, but I'm sure they did. Vision problems for preemies is a big issue. I remember Kate Gosslin having to take her sextuplets in for eye exams every year. The screaming; I'm glad at least Michelle  TLC spared us that.

[quiverofdoubt]

1 minute ago, ksgranola1 said:

One of my grandsons is ADHD. It's like living w/a hurricane in your house. To Michelle's credit, she has taken Josie to a specialist at the Ark. Children's hospital.  I remember that much. She never mentioned having to take her to the eye doctor, but I'm sure they did. Vision problems for preemies is a big issue. I remember Kate Gosslin having to take her sextuplets in for eye exams every year. The screaming; I'm glad at least Michelle  TLC spared us that.

Doctors she is willing to see. but most medical doctors aren't specialized in childhood development, and in fact are often grossly misinformed. A really good doctor may catch a developmental issue, but then can only suggest the parents take them to a specialized therapist. Most likely they won't notice, if the child is developing physically fine, and doesn't have huge cognitive delays, they won't do anything.  And for all we know, the doctors advised being seen by a behavioral therapist, or an occupational therapist, or to see a child psychiatrist for a full eval, and she ignored them.

small example: in a recent episode, where Jill had a lot of little siblings do a sleep over, she was shown spoon feeding 5 year old josie.  Maybe Jill was just babying her- she is the youngest and the miracle. It could have been totally unnecessary.  Or maybe there's more delays going on than the duggars will show us- or admit to, or notice themselves. Mechelllle hardly notices the younger ones anymore.  Some issues may not appear major until the discrepancy between the child's peers and herself begin to grow. At infancy she seems totally fine, but by 5/6 years old the gap between her and her peers is much more obvious.

[ksgranola1]

Maybe the kid is a picky eater. She does seem pretty small & fragile.

[quiverofdoubt]

I have a picky eater. Choosey, opinionated, as my husband would say.  If she doesn't like something spooning it into her mouth will not make her eat it. Plus, i'm pretty sure it was breakfast cereal? There were questions on this forum as to why Jill needed to be spoon feeding a 5 year old breakfast. For me it was just a red flag. Could be nothing at all, of course.  Just a small red flag. Among many.

[ClaraOswin]

The only thing I could figure is maybe Josie is a messy eater and Jill didn't want Josie to drip milk all over her clothes (probably the only clean outfit she had for that day there.)

[OyToTheVey]

1 hour ago, quiverofdoubt said:

I personally believe Josie has more issues than the family is letting on.  My background is in psychology/education/early childhood.  Premie's are at risk for a lot of developmental delays, many of which can be subtle or not arise till school age, like dyslexia.  She may not be severely handicapped, but I do believe she would have benefited from therapy early on.  Between the early birth, which i believe most families see specialists for to determine any delays that may have caused, the seizures, her severe food allergies and a her overall rough start, they should have had her evaluated several times by now.  Just as a precaution, if nothing else.

I do not believe the duggars are capable of recognizing developmental issues or behavioral issues in their children, nor would they get proper mainstream treatment for them if they did. I bet several of their children would have been diagnosed as ADHD in ps by now.  That condition is over diagnosed IMO, but for kids who actually suffer from it, it can be miserable to live with.

Mine is in special education, birth to second grade. I completely agree with you. I have a feeling that Josie has more issues than they would like to admit. The problem with the Duggars is that you never know if her issues are from her birth or the fact that she's had absolutely no schooling at all. 

However, didn't Jill tutor James in the multiplication tables when he was 13?!? Never know if it's the lack of schooling or he actually has a learning disability. 

Theres so much advice I want to give them regarding Josie tho. Especially since she has a ton of people in that house that can help. All those older siblings, in typical cases, are beneficial for modeling and prompting. I normally tell parents to include siblings in helping with therapy because they can set examples. The Duggars seem to just ignore it. Like when they had the episode of pizza making and Josie would lick her pepperoni and plaster it. At 5-6, she shouldn't be doing that. They just laughed it off. That's a lesson right there that could have been very valuable for future purposes. Kind of ironic because they emphasize self control.

[HarleyQuinn]

Cathy Dillard says she's glad life was the only choice for her birth mother. So she didn't think back alley abortions existed? Oh you sweet summer child...

[2manyKidzzz]

@quiverofdoubt

I do not recall reading about Josie's severe food allergies. Can you remind me of what I missed? My youngest had food triggered migraines as an infant and toddler and it took a major stroke of luck to figure out what that was about. And then going against the grain to change his diet, as it was before the current awareness of these things. He is now 21. I eliminated milk immediately when I found out it was related to food. People carried on. Alas, he is only 6'5". Milk is a huge allergen so I just got rid of it. 

[Bad Wolf]

I remember they said she was allergic to dairy products, and Michelle had her chanting something like, "Others may but I may not."   Since she was making pizza later, I would think she's no longer allergic, or else they got vegan cheese for her.

They do know that cheese comes from milk, don't they?

[Drala]

1 hour ago, quiverofdoubt said:

I personally believe Josie has more issues than the family is letting on.  My background is in psychology/education/early childhood.  Premie's are at risk for a lot of developmental delays, many of which can be subtle or not arise till school age, like dyslexia.  She may not be severely handicapped, but I do believe she would have benefited from therapy early on.  Between the early birth, which i believe most families see specialists for to determine any delays that may have caused, the seizures, her severe food allergies and a her overall rough start, they should have had her evaluated several times by now.  Just as a precaution, if nothing else.

I do not believe the duggars are capable of recognizing developmental issues or behavioral issues in their children, nor would they get proper mainstream treatment for them if they did. I bet several of their children would have been diagnosed as ADHD in ps by now.  That condition is over diagnosed IMO, but for kids who actually suffer from it, it can be miserable to live with.

I agree completely.  In pediatrics there is an informal term used for the clinical impression I have of Josie, which is she's a FLIK.  It means Funny Looking Kid.  There's something odd or off about her, but I have nothing go on except her overall appearance.

[quiverofdoubt]

11 minutes ago, 2manyKidzzz said:

@quiverofdoubt

I do not recall reading about Josie's severe food allergies. Can you remind me of what I missed? My youngest had food triggered migraines as an infant and toddler and it took a major stroke of luck to figure out what that was about. And then going against the grain to change his diet, as it was before the current awareness of these things. He is now 21. I eliminated milk immediately when I found out it was related to food. People carried on. Alas, he is only 6'5". Milk is a huge allergen so I just got rid of it. 

When she was born, it took them a few weeks, but they figured out she is severely lactose intolerant. possibly allergy to casien? they couldn't breastfeed, and switched to a soy formula. she can't tolerate any dairy whatsoever. she was failing to thrive on breastmilk

[OyToTheVey]

Josie, Jordyn, Mackyenzie are all practically the same age. Just seeing how the 3 girls talk you can tell something is off with Josie. She's very immature for her age. She acts like a 3-4 year old, not a 6 year old. 

[Bad Wolf]

Josie's been babied, and since she can't go to school, it will be hard for her to mature. In a class of first graders, she would quickly learn appropriate behavior.

[2manyKidzzz]

17 minutes ago, quiverofdoubt said:

When she was born, it took them a few weeks, but they figured out she is severely lactose intolerant. possibly allergy to casien? they couldn't breastfeed, and switched to a soy formula. she can't tolerate any dairy whatsoever. she was failing to thrive on breastmilk

Thanks. I guess I do remember that now. Same thing happened when I was an infant.....although the milk allergy subsided. I wonder how they handle it now. I do not see that they are that particular about food, obviously.