Erika Shupe *grim rictus* Large Families on Purpose Part 4

[mango_fandango]

Ooh. Anna Marie's got a Karen-style fringe. Didn't recognise her the first time I saw it. I think the twins do, too, although there aren't many close-ups. In the one close up there was only one twin, but as Erika likes to lump Lacey and Lilly together I'm pretty damn sure both would have the same.

"The kids had a blast!" Yeah, Karen so looks happy in that first photo. It could just be a candid, but...

[19 cats and counting]

14 minutes ago, Criscat said:

Add me to those who think Karen will flee...maybe not right at 18, but I eventually.

Maybe she'll wait until Melanie is 18 and they flee together.

[Hane]

But, to kids brought up this way, the concept of full legal adulthood and autonomy at 18 rarely computes or signifies.  Leaving would Make Mommy Mad, and you can't have that--it's the Worst Possible Thing you could do. The concept of being ostracized from your family of origin would be terrifying. I was raised mainstream, fairly liberal Catholic, but had a very controlling mother. My sisters and I didn't leave home till we got married, at 20, 28, and 26. That's why those of us who had daughters strongly encouraged our girls to go away to college.

[notfundy]

Bob actually looks like he is over it, too, at least in some of the pictures.  

Poor Karen.  It doesn't seem like she has any time to spend with friends her own age.  

When I was 17 (I have three younger brothers; they are close in age but the next closest one to my age is five years younger) bowling with my family was the LAST thing I'd have wanted to do.  

 

[19 cats and counting]

2 minutes ago, notfundy said:

Poor Karen.  It doesn't seem like she has any time to spend with friends her own age.  

 

Does she even HAVE friends her own age?  They're definitely not in the schedule.

[lauraloralara]

I'm glad the camping trips are with the entire church and not just their family. It looked like there were lots of kids for the Shupe kids to hang out and play with. If you can ignore the fact that it's Erika and she's crazy, the trips look like a pretty fun time, especially compared to the normal Shupe existence. The skirts thing still drives me crazy though. So impractical in the woods. I'd like her to do a blog post on thrifting for stuff like this if she hasn't already - i wonder where all the sleeping bags, tents, etc. came from.

[nellautumngirl]

I feel claustrophobic just looking at her blog, how do her children endure her?

That's the first time I've seen Karen not smiling on cue, good for her.

[pnwgypsy]

7 hours ago, lauraloralara said:

I'm glad the camping trips are with the entire church and not just their family. It looked like there were lots of kids for the Shupe kids to hang out and play with. If you can ignore the fact that it's Erika and she's crazy, the trips look like a pretty fun time, especially compared to the normal Shupe existence. The skirts thing still drives me crazy though. So impractical in the woods. I'd like her to do a blog post on thrifting for stuff like this if she hasn't already - i wonder where all the sleeping bags, tents, etc. came from.

Thrift stores in the PNW are pretty good places to find used outdoorsy goods.  I personally like searching for the name brands like North Face, REI, Merrell, etc.  Their tent *might* be a Costco purchase.  I have a similar one that I got from Costco.

[IronicallyMaeve]

Run, Karen, run! And take Happy with you! 

[Pseudoname]

9 hours ago, notfundy said:

Bob actually looks like he is over it, too, at least in some of the pictures.  

Poor Karen.  It doesn't seem like she has any time to spend with friends her own age.  

When I was 17 (I have three younger brothers; they are close in age but the next closest one to my age is five years younger) bowling with my family was the LAST thing I'd have wanted to do.  

 

Looking at all the pics, Karen seems so over it.  Karen has what appears to be a deliberately over exaggerated her smile, in a defiant, "see I am too having fun" look (picture is the 14th one down)

So good to see some defiance showing through.

[16strong]

I wonder if Karen and Bob are so close because they're both over Erika's shit.

[defraudingjezebel]

2 minutes ago, 16strong said:

I wonder if Karen and Bob are so close because they're both over Erika's shit.

That would be amazing! I mean, in the hope that Bob would (on the down low) help equip Karen w/ the knowledge/info she needs to support herself outside of the Shupe compound. 

[anjulibai]

If Bob wanted to change anything, he could. He probably likes being the good dad to his suffering children. 

[princessmahina]

26 minutes ago, anjulibai said:

If Bob wanted to change anything, he could. He probably likes being the good dad to his suffering children. 

Theoretically, he could change things, but imagine for a moment what it would be like to go against Erika. The passive aggressive *smile,* the loud praying for her husband to change his ways...she would probably make his life hell. I figure he probably takes the path of least resistance.

[16strong]

50 minutes ago, anjulibai said:

If Bob wanted to change anything, he could. He probably likes being the good dad to his suffering children. 

Maybe, maybe not. He certainly can't afford to divorce her. They have 9 kids under 18, and she'd take him for everything, plus the kids. They already can't afford a bigger house, much less separate ones. And iirc, Bob runs the business with Erika's brother. There's a chance he might not be so friendly if Bob left. Erika is the definition of a ball buster. Sure, Bob could make new rules, but life with Erika would likely be even more miserable. Bob looks depressed in every recent photo I've seen of him, and I do believe that's down to him having no say in the marrriage. I don't think there's any love left there.

[mango_fandango]

In that photo with Erika, Bob looks like his usual over-it self. In the next photo with Tyler, he looks perkier. 

Melanie's barely in the album- just about visible in the group photo, and then in the background of another where she's scratching her nose.

[feministxtian]

If she is such a "submissive" wife, why doesn't Bob lay down the law with the crazy bitch?

[elliha]

4 hours ago, 16strong said:

Maybe, maybe not. He certainly can't afford to divorce her. They have 9 kids under 18, and she'd take him for everything, plus the kids. They already can't afford a bigger house, much less separate ones. And iirc, Bob runs the business with Erika's brother. There's a chance he might not be so friendly if Bob left. Erika is the definition of a ball buster. Sure, Bob could make new rules, but life with Erika would likely be even more miserable. Bob looks depressed in every recent photo I've seen of him, and I do believe that's down to him having no say in the marrriage. I don't think there's any love left there.

Yes, it is theoretically about men having all the power but Erika clearly makes a lot of the family decisions and I think Bob has given up trying to change things. Remember, he doesn't even get to see his mom and dad regularly because they are a "bad influence" on the children and perhaps on Bob as well. 

And yes, she would take every penny possible and make him into the most evil man alive. I don't think Erika would grieve a divorce very much though. While I think she does on some level enjoy Bob's company I don't think that she loves him more than the idea of being the perfect wife and mother. He is an accessory that allows her the image she wants but he could be replaced with another man if the church allowed her to remarry. I honestly think that in another type of church Erika may well have ditched Bob herself and upgraded herself as soon as she had an opportunity. 

[ofDany]

Erika asked the local musical theater group (on facebook) if they were having a "pay what you can night" so she could afford to bring the whole family to see Mary Poppins. I wonder if she also asked the local movie theater that before she took all the kids to Star Wars during it's opening week or two...

[usmcmom]

In the Facebook post about the bowling trip, she thanks SNOMOMS. Any idea what that group is?  Anyway, for some reason, I thought they'd been given a gift card for the bowling trip. I have no idea why I thought that but realized that family outing gift cards WOULD be great gifts for the Shupe family.  At least then the kids are guaranteed to get out of the house on occasion. 

But, in thinking further about it, I started wondering if Karen and Melanie have their drivers' licenses. I wonder if they'd be allowed to use a gift card to a local coffee shop or the mall and go shopping on their own one afternoon.  I can't help but remember how much my daughter, at their ages, LOVED  gift cards that allowed her to take a friend and spend a couple hours shopping just for herself at the nearby mall.  I loved it too because she and I were always excited for her to come home and show me what she'd chosen...you know...without her mother hovering around like a warden.  For that matter, my son also loved gift cards just for him - usually to the local video game shop.

My guess is that if one of the girls received a gift card to, say, Starbucks, Erika would tag along and make them use part of the card to buy her a drink. She'd label it a "mother/daughter date," when it was really just Erika controlling yet another aspect of their lives.

If the girls do not drive, Erika is being very shortsighted. If she'd give up some control (heh...I know, crazy idea) they could do many of her errands for her while she stayed home and counted the crackers for the daily snacks. 

What it boils down to, I'm sure, is that Erika does NOT let her older children out of the house without her. She calls it "protection" when really it's the same old lack of confidence in her teachings and being unable to trust her kids to do the right thing while away from her.  I don't think she's capable of actually worrying about their safety, so strong is her need to control them. 

[ViolaSebastian]

Karen and Melanie don't drive.  She said in one of her comments sections that driver's education classes were too expensive and that she'd teach them to drive when they turned 18.  And, alas, they'll still be tightly controlled: limited areas and they'll have to take a sibling with them.  

Quote

We will have them start driving at age 18 is the plan. We feel 16 is *way* too young (as do many other families we know). And there is no need yet. When they do drive it will be limited to local areas, and they'll always take a sibling with them.

They have not gotten jobs outside the home yet either at only ages 15 and 16. Again, no need, and not wise in our opinion to do so so young. I mean they've done some pet sitting with neighbors next door, and maybe some car washing/detailing this summer, but not actual employment. We do allow them to have money-earning jobs in our home so they can begin learning about using/saving money. They need to be developing all of their skills in keeping a home and homeschooling, etc. And they are learning a lot. There is no hurry to get a job and get out into the world so early. We have talked a great deal about what kind of work they would like to pursue and what skills they should then be developing and education to pursue that if they choose. 
 

 

[usmcmom]

21 minutes ago, ViolaSebastian said:

Karen and Melanie don't drive.  She said in one of her comments sections that driver's education classes were too expensive and that she'd teach them to drive when they turned 18.  And, alas, they'll still be tightly controlled: limited areas and they'll have to take a sibling with them.  

 

Thank you for that reference.  I wonder what will happen when they actually turn eighteen. Will they actually be allowed to drive or will Erika find an excuse to go back on her word?

 

[ViolaSebastian]

Just now, usmcmom said:

Thank you for that reference.  I wonder what will happen when they actually turn eighteen. Will they actually be allowed to drive or will Erika find an excuse to go back on her word?

 

If the past is any indication, she just won't have time to teach them properly and will just have to do it for them.

[Antimony]

A lot of moms in my area had the opposite attitude as Erika -- a teeanger driving (even short distances) means you get somebody to run errands for you! Very handy. Sure, no errands that require like banking or stuff but they can pick up groceries (Erika writes lists anyway, so it's easy) or more jellybeans or whatever. 

[usmcmom]

2 minutes ago, Antimony said:

A lot of moms in my area had the opposite attitude as Erika -- a teeanger driving (even short distances) means you get somebody to run errands for you! Very handy. Sure, no errands that require like banking or stuff but they can pick up groceries (Erika writes lists anyway, so it's easy) or more jellybeans or whatever. 

I loved having an extra driver (or two) once each of my kids received his/her driver's license.  They ran grocery errands for me, picked up dinner when the whole family was running in different directions and got  themselves to sleepovers, etc. When my older one started driving, part of that privilege was helping me out by dropping his sister off and picking her up from her various activities at times.   We actually got each of our kids a debit card - with a very small amount available to them - so they could grab some cash while out with their friends and learn some more complex budgeting and banking skills that a simple allowance didn't teach.  I DID give them my debit card a time or two so they could bring me some cash from the ATM.  Some called me silly for that but we never had an issue with them abusing it. Even if they were tempted, they knew we'd easily catch on just by logging into our bank account to see the transactions. 

I agree, shopping for Erika would be VERY EASY. I'm sure her lists are very detailed. Plus, her girls (not the boys) have always accompanied her to the store so they would know exactly what she normally buys.