Who's Responsible for the Possible Gov't Shutdown?

[Verin Sedai]

I do find it comforting that her post count right now has earned her the title of Speshul Snowflake. Because clearly, she is one.

[Cartmann99]

You're one of those people huge on having the last word rather than continuing your "I'm disabled and can't work but can spend 30 hours a week online" and "amen!" rant with your little friends, aren't ya? I'm going to go ahead and pack my suitcase so we can get ready to shove off for our week in Jamaican paradise. (I have my brother staying at the house while we are gone, so don't get any crazy ideas :wink: ) - while I am busy doing that, why don't you fish up some more of my hysterical quotes and get that "last word" you so badly need. I'll check back before next week. :kiss:

From her earlier comment:

I certainly do not think that the government has any right to control the business I worked hard to build, and I absolutely don't agree that my employees should have a say in how I choose to run my business. Incidentally, the implementation of obamacare means we will be cutting the hours of nearly 1/4 our employees and reducing them to part-time) - not sure how the government expects this "healthcare reform" to help people when many business owners like me will be reducing their work hours, thus slicing their weekly pay. But hey - affordable healthcare!!! right?

I couldn't sleep at night if I cut my employees hours so I could take nice vacations.

[starfish]

Ding! Ding! Ding!

We've got ourselves a flouncer.

It's funny how they flounce around the time they can't remember what Sean Hannity said next.

[Mecca]

From her earlier comment:

I couldn't sleep at night if I cut my employees hours so I could take nice vacations.

Neither could I.

I hope this troll really is a troll, but considering there are representatives in Congress that hold these very same views, she could be legit. Sad, but true.

I was reading last night numerous complaints about the President unwilliness to compromise on ACA. Why the hell should he? It passed every freaking branch of government. Besides, has it not always been the policy of the White House to not negotiate with terrorists? At this point that is what I believe the 80 members of the "Suicide Caucus" to be at this point.

[J'ean Skirt]

From her earlier comment:

I couldn't sleep at night if I cut my employees hours so I could take nice vacations.

It's also bullshit. I am a small business owner (for reals!) and we don't have any pricing on health care on the Small Business exchanges. PLUS the employer mandates are off the table until 2015.

She's just repeating right-wing bullshit about how HORRIBLE the employer mandate is. And it's all bullshit. She doesn't even know what the law says.

Disney (yes, that Disney) has moved everyone who works 30 hours a week or more to "full time" status and is covering them under Disney's health plan.

I didn't think the vacation flounce was near as funny as the "I'm going to go do something liberals hate because you were mean to me."

[starfish]

The poster/troll was probably running late for his orthdontist/dermatologist appointment. I'm guessing the poster is, in reality,

a member of the Jefferson Jr. High Ayn Rand Study Club. Or possibly it's Kelly Crawford.

[Handmaiden of Dog]

I think someone has a little crush on me! Taking the time to locate, cut, copy, and paste all my old posts? Good thing I am careful about what I post, or I might worry you would show up at my door begging me for a date! xoxo

I don't know you, nor do I care to, but take it from someone who is just reading this post and not arguing: You are being childish. Your remarks come across as petty and inane temper tantrums. I read them, sigh, roll my eyes and pity you.

[docmom]

Ding! Ding! Ding!

We've got ourselves a flouncer.

It's funny how they flounce around the time they can't remember what Sean Hannity said next.

If there is a god, she will have flounced. If she never comes back, we may have a mass converison of previously atheist FJers.

But really, if you were undecided and you read this thread and compared thoughtful, accurate information with her "nanny, nanny, boo, boo and communism" diatribes I think you'd be coming down in favor of the ACA. So maybe she did us a favor.

[ThisOlGirl]

The good people of Jamaica have my sympathy and sincerest apologies.

For what it's worth, this has been a very helpful thread for me.

[OkToBeTakei]

The good people of Jamaica have my sympathy and sincerest apologies.

For what it's worth, this has been a very helpful thread for me.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: To the first.

To the second I always learn something and the exchange of views and comparisons of differing countries is fascinating. Which is why I probably went a bit troll tracker. When people post their own situations and how these political decisions impact them it ceases for me to become a platform for being an arsehole as the OP was being.

I feel for those who are adversely affected by the shutdown, I feel strongly about free healthcare for all, it's difficult for me to not want that for you guys over the pond when I read your stories. So closed minds get my goat. Not even willing to see beyond their own needs, never mind looking at ideas that do not fit their 'idea' of their politics. It is mind numbing.

[Ruby Slippers]

The Republican Study Committee’s American Health Care Reform Act, in short, would be my answer.

Why don't you explain, without using talking points, what you like about this proposal? Because every post you have made in here thus far has been regurgitating some right-wing talking point: "OMG OBAMA WAS FRIENDS WITH A CHILD MOLESTER! HANDOUTS! ENTITLEMENTS!" I have made thoughtful replies to your posts and asked thoughtful questions, both of which you have entirely ignored-- which suggests you cannot sustain any real discussion beyond the talking points you have committed to memory.

The RSC is run by Republican House members. You know, those same ones tanking the economy and government right now? The same ones from the do-nothing Congress that passed only 22 fucking bills from January to August, marking them as the least productive Congress, like, ever? Do you really want to consider them a reliable source? Are they insurance experts? Economic experts? Health care experts? Statisticians? Researchers?

Let's start with Scalise's assertion that his plan "allows people to buy health insurance across state lines." No federal law exists banning anyone from doing so. None. Does this mean that you want the federal government shaping and regulating how states manage insurance? Really? This is the plan you're looking to?

Do you even know what it says? Tax cuts, the free market, and no abortion. That's what it says. So basically, it is not a plan at all; it is the status quo that has failed us.

lol at this whole discussion, including at myself for trying to talk intellectually and factually with a Republican.

[Verin Sedai]

Why don't you explain, without using talking points, what you like about this proposal? Because every post you have made in here thus far has been regurgitating some right-wing talking point: "OMG OBAMA WAS FRIENDS WITH A CHILD MOLESTER! HANDOUTS! ENTITLEMENTS!" I have made thoughtful replies to your posts and asked thoughtful questions, both of which you have entirely ignored-- which suggests you cannot sustain any real discussion beyond the talking points you have committed to memory.

The RSC is run by Republican House members. You know, those same ones tanking the economy and government right now? The same ones from the do-nothing Congress that passed only 22 fucking bills from January to August, marking them as the least productive Congress, like, ever? Do you really want to consider them a reliable source? Are they insurance experts? Economic experts? Health care experts? Statisticians? Researchers?

Let's start with Scalise's assertion that his plan "allows people to buy health insurance across state lines." No federal law exists banning anyone from doing so. None. Does this mean that you want the federal government shaping and regulating how states manage insurance? Really? This is the plan you're looking to?

Do you even know what it says? Tax cuts, the free market, and no abortion. That's what it says. So basically, it is not a plan at all; it is the status quo that has failed us.

lol at this whole discussion, including at myself for trying to talk intellectually and factually with a Republicanjackass.

FTFY. ;) HGR's antics have far more to do with some sort of personal issue than her party affiliation, I believe. I'm still a registered Republican and I'd like to think I'm reasonable and fair in conversations. Admittedly, I'm changing my registration soon. I've just always found it frustrating when either side paints the other with a broad brush or takes a crazy example to be the average party member. Though given the actions of our current elected Republicans I can hardly blame the association.

[FreeJosie]

You're one of those people huge on having the last word rather than continuing your "I'm disabled and can't work but can spend 30 hours a week online" and "amen!" rant with your little friends, aren't ya? I'm going to go ahead and pack my suitcase so we can get ready to shove off for our week in Jamaican paradise. (I have my brother staying at the house while we are gone, so don't get any crazy ideas :wink: ) - while I am busy doing that, why don't you fish up some more of my hysterical quotes and get that "last word" you so badly need. I'll check back before next week. :kiss:

Seriously, my 12 year old's maturity level far surpasses yours.

Jefferson Jr. High Ayn Rand Study Club

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[realist51]

Wow, and to think I tried to engage with her on a rational level. I'll admit it; I'm a dupe. She's an ass. Or a fanny. Or both.

[nokidsmom]

I really need to go for a pedicure...any suggestions on a good polish?

[Sumeri]

I am going to try and introduce "fanny" to our side of the pond. Amazingly appropriate in this case.

[Aviano]

I wish there was a way to have an objective analysis of how it will really work-time will tell.... I have several FB friends posting that their costs are going up like this one:

Ok, just a little frustrated right now........my healthcare premium went up over 60%, yes it more than doubled, (I don't qualify for the subsidy)! So I decided to become more knowledgeable about my plan. I'm now paying for maternity and newborn care, (at age 50??), pediatric care, (it's just me on my plan), and other services that I'm now REQUIRED to carry.

My friend has BCBS. Does anyone have a first hand story about costs going down?

I normally just read the Duggar threads, but I saw this and decided to post. I'm in Kentucky, and am still reeling from the rates we're seeing.

First off, I'm not sure why they call it an exchange ... Anthem Blue Cross Blue Shield was the only insurer available starting in 2014. We have 10 different plans available - several bronze and silver, and one gold - but only one insurer.

My husband is 50, I'm 49, no children at home. Healthy non-smokers, not overweight, no pre-existing conditions. We don't take any medications. Income last year $67,000. For a family of two making more than $64,000 there is no federal subsidy.

Cheapest Bronze plan - $577.08 a month with a $12,600 deductible.

Cheapest Silver plan - $717.78 a month with a $6,000 deductible. All office visits were still 10% after deductible met.

Gold plan (only one offered) - Only a $1,500 deductible, but $969.63 a month. And you still had to pay $30 per office visit!

All plans had a $200 ER co-pay (waived if you were admitted) and a $50 urgent care co-pay. Dental and vision were not included in any of the plans.

There is absolutely nothing in these rates that we find affordable. :(

[Mama Mia]

I normally just read the Duggar threads, but I saw this and decided to post. I'm in Kentucky, and am still reeling from the rates we're seeing.

First off, I'm not sure why they call it an exchange ... Anthem Blue Cross Blue Shield was the only insurer available starting in 2014. We have 10 different plans available - several bronze and silver, and one gold - but only one insurer.

My husband is 50, I'm 49, no children at home. Healthy non-smokers, not overweight, no pre-existing conditions. We don't take any medications. Income last year $67,000. For a family of two making more than $64,000 there is no federal subsidy.

Cheapest Bronze plan - $577.08 a month with a $12,600 deductible.

Cheapest Silver plan - $717.78 a month with a $6,000 deductible. All office visits were still 10% after deductible met.

Gold plan (only one offered) - Only a $1,500 deductible, but $969.63 a month. And you still had to pay $30 per office visit!

All plans had a $200 ER co-pay (waived if you were admitted) and a $50 urgent care co-pay. Dental and vision were not included in any of the plans.

There is absolutely nothing in these rates that we find affordable. :(

I thought they didn't ask any health questions on the application ? And how are there more than one plan at the same level when there's only one provider ?

Is that price for both of you, or each? At my job we were paying $980 a month for an individual in the 45-49 bracket, but it was an excellent HMO plan. No deductibles, I think $20 per office visit, $100 ER visit. If the price you got was that high per person you might want to look at insurance that isn't through the exchange, if that's the price per couple you probably won't find anything cheaper ( especially with your husband having hit 50 ...the rates jump way up then)

Wow, my Facebook page has hit a whole new level of crazy. Did you know that because of Obamacare CPS / the UN now is going to come to everyone's house to inspect how you take care of your children? And that effective Oct. 1 st they can take your kids if you have beer in the home, or if you ground your kid? Among about a thousand other scary reasons ? I didn't know either ! You've been warned :lol:

[Savoring Samsara]

I normally just read the Duggar threads, but I saw this and decided to post. I'm in Kentucky, and am still reeling from the rates we're seeing.

First off, I'm not sure why they call it an exchange ... Anthem Blue Cross Blue Shield was the only insurer available starting in 2014. We have 10 different plans available - several bronze and silver, and one gold - but only one insurer.

My husband is 50, I'm 49, no children at home. Healthy non-smokers, not overweight, no pre-existing conditions. We don't take any medications. Income last year $67,000. For a family of two making more than $64,000 there is no federal subsidy.

Cheapest Bronze plan - $577.08 a month with a $12,600 deductible.

Cheapest Silver plan - $717.78 a month with a $6,000 deductible. All office visits were still 10% after deductible met.

Gold plan (only one offered) - Only a $1,500 deductible, but $969.63 a month. And you still had to pay $30 per office visit!

All plans had a $200 ER co-pay (waived if you were admitted) and a $50 urgent care co-pay. Dental and vision were not included in any of the plans.

There is absolutely nothing in these rates that we find affordable. :(

Part of this has to do with Kentucky rejecting the Medicaid expansion, and making the federal government set up the exchange for them. Not a friendly climate for any businesses who might want to set up shop there. In my state, we're expanding Medicaid and doing our exchange in-house, and from what I have heard the rates here are much more reasonable.

But yeah, those are out of control and don't sound affordable at all. Don't those rates exempt you from needing to purchase coverage under the provision in the law that says if you have to pay more than 9% of your income for insurance you don't have to pay a penalty if you opt out?

[Curious]

You're one of those people huge on having the last word rather than continuing your "I'm disabled and can't work but can spend 30 hours a week online" and "amen!" rant with your little friends, aren't ya? I'm going to go ahead and pack my suitcase so we can get ready to shove off for our week in Jamaican paradise. (I have my brother staying at the house while we are gone, so don't get any crazy ideas :wink: ) - while I am busy doing that, why don't you fish up some more of my hysterical quotes and get that "last word" you so badly need. I'll check back before next week. :kiss:

Yes, I spend a lot of time online. What would you like me to do with my time? Sit staring at the walls? Just because I can't work, due to my disability does not mean I am now completely unable to do ANYTHING. I never say this, but you are one person I would gladly trade places with for a while so you can see what it's like. You are one of those people that thinks disability is like being on a perpetual vacation, no doubt :roll:

Lest you think I'm a "freeloader," I am not and never have been on disability (taking "handouts" from the government).

Here's another little secret. I LOVED my job. I was extremely depressed when I could not go back to work. I looked into telecommuting jobs, but they are apparently a myth (or were in 1997 when I was disabled). If you think it's anyone's dream to be disabled, you are truly a moron. Even if I was getting disability payments, the trade off would absolutely NOT be worth it.

I haven't been able to take a fucking bubble bath since 1997. That alone makes it not worth it. You are not even worth the time it took me to write this post, honestly.

[pattygbucks]

But yeah, those are out of control and don't sound affordable at all. Don't those rates exempt you from needing to purchase coverage under the provision in the law that says if you have to pay more than 9% of your income for insurance you don't have to pay a penalty if you opt out?

I think that is one of my biggest issues with the ACA....there seems to be a variety of provisions that target specific demographics. Why have income limits for subsidies and then exempt someone from the mandate b/c their insurance costs will be too expensive? It just doesn't make sense...from a mathematical perspective.

nice flow chart...i assume it's accurate...

http://kff.org/infographic/the-requirem ... -care-act/

[Curious]

Congress voted (unanimously) today to pay back pay to the federal workers that have been furloughed once they are back to work. So that is something at least. It's a relief for us and I'm sure the other furloughed workers as well. However, it also makes me wonder if they did that because they have no intention of ending this shutdown anytime soon.

We haven't decided yet, what we are going to do since we were ok to pay our mortgage this month (my biggest worry), but if it looks like the shutdown is going to continue my husband is going to have to either apply for unemployment or pick up some kind of temp work since we and our pets like to eat and have electricity and running water etc.

[HomegirlRuby]

So "disabled" or handicapped people are unable to hold jobs? That's a new one for me. If one is able to manage nearly a full workweek's with of time online, surely they are able to find employment. Even Christopher Reeve worked after his accident - and what about Helen Keller or Steven Hawkings? Hell, even Einstein was "disabled."

This society has turned into a sad place where no one accepts their own laziness or accountability. THIS is what's wrong with the Democratic Party and THIS is exactly what I was referring to when I said everyone has a sense of entitlement. That, coupled with most living outside their means is what has tanked this economy. And I'm supposed to be worried about healthcare reform? Sorry - there are things far more broken that just that system.

I guess "flounce" means "leave for several hours to catch a flight" and I should have caught a later one so I could sit here and argue with a bunch of liberals? The poolside bar is calling me at the moment, so I'm going to flounce on over to it.

I may check back in the morning, but I have a feeling I'm going to be a bit busy with the breakfast buffet and sunning myself. On top of that, I don't really even see the point in arguing with anyone who is so dead-set against working for their own coverage. Don't worry. Our family will still continue to pay for everyone's lack of contribution, Obamacare is going to fail miserably, and things will right themselves again in 16. Hope you girls have as nice a night as I am having!!

[mockingbird]

Part of this has to do with Kentucky rejecting the Medicaid expansion, and making the federal government set up the exchange for them. Not a friendly climate for any businesses who might want to set up shop there. In my state, we're expanding Medicaid and doing our exchange in-house, and from what I have heard the rates here are much more reasonable.

But yeah, those are out of control and don't sound affordable at all. Don't those rates exempt you from needing to purchase coverage under the provision in the law that says if you have to pay more than 9% of your income for insurance you don't have to pay a penalty if you opt out?

I have insurance so I haven't looked at my state's options yet but I have heard it is a similar situation to Aviano after talking to someone who works for a free clinic. There is a large gap between people who make little enough to qualify for a subsidy and people who make enough to actually afford the plans. Also have heard most of the plans are health savings accounts where the insurance company doesn't pay anything at all until you go over the amount in the savings account. I think my state rejected the Medicaid expansion too so that could be why.

ETA: Also wanted to say I agree with Curious that HomegirlRuby would probably benefit from a day in the life in her (or any other disabled or chronically ill person's) shoes. Really have no patience for people who think we are "freeloading" when in reality I and the VAST majority of disabled people I know do as much as they can to be able to live as normal a life as possible.

[Curious]

So "disabled" or handicapped people are unable to hold jobs? That's a new one for me. If one is able to manage nearly a full workweek's with of time online, surely they are able to find employment. Even Christopher Reeve worked after his accident - and what about Helen Keller or Steven Hawkings? Hell, even Einstein was "disabled."

This society has turned into a sad place where no one accepts their own laziness or accountability. THIS is what's wrong with the Democratic Party and THIS is exactly what I was referring to when I said everyone has a sense of entitlement. That, coupled with most living outside their means is what has tanked this economy. And I'm supposed to be worried about healthcare reform? Sorry - there are things far more broken that just that system.

I guess "flounce" means "leave for several hours to catch a flight" and I should have caught a later one so I could sit here and argue with a bunch of liberals? The poolside bar is calling me at the moment, so I'm going to flounce on over to it.

I may check back in the morning, but I have a feeling I'm going to be a bit busy with the breakfast buffet and sunning myself. On top of that, I don't really even see the point in arguing with anyone who is so dead-set against working for their own coverage. Don't worry. Our family will still continue to pay for everyone's lack of contribution, Obamacare is going to fail miserably, and things will right themselves again in 16. Hope you girls have as nice a night as I am having!!

Are all disabled or handicapped people unable to work or hold jobs? Of course not. Am I unable to work? Yes. This may come as a shock to you, but not all disabilities or handicaps are the same. Being in my HOME and being online is absolutely the same as being at a job. I've seen the light and will go out on Monday and get a job. How silly of me...all these wasted years I've spent sitting at home eating bons bons and doing nothing :roll: I'm not sure why you put disabled in scare quotes either. It's pretty brazen to suggest that I'm malingering since you know nothing about me or the nature of my disability other than what I've told you on this forum and I've also stated that I'm not taking government handouts (which you, no doubt, consider disability payments to be). I also stated that I enjoyed my job and would much rather be doing it than be disabled.

It's awfully presumptuous to assume that I am or was lazy, as well. I worked 2 jobs when I was in college (while I was pregnant), graduated with a 3.93gpa and had a job created specially for me when I graduated. As I said, I loved my job, which I worked hard to get. The fact that I can no longer do it, doesn't mean that I am now "lazy" or that I have a sense of entitlement. How exactly does wanting my husband to be able to actually go to his job translate into a sense of entitlement?