Who's Responsible for the Possible Gov't Shutdown?

[GeoBQn]

Citation on the Frank Marshall Davis info please. Preferably, something not from World Net Daily.

[HomegirlRuby]

Citation on the Frank Marshall Davis info please. Preferably, something not from World Net Daily.

You can read it in his own words. Here is a PDF: scribd.com/mobile/doc/22472003

Hope that helps!!

[Ruby Slippers]

I live in the mid-west and I'm just not seeing an increase in racism or racial bumper-stickers. And there are several pages of Bush/monkey photos available: https://www.google.com/search?q=bush+mo ... =869&dpr=1 . So to say that this is a new thing since Obama became president is not correct. It has nothing to do with the race of either Obama or Bush and everything about people- both democrats and Rebuplicans- expressing their frustrations. It is appropriate? No. But it isn't about the hue of the President's skin.

First, comparing a black person to a monkey has a long and unfortunate history rooted in racism-- specifically, its purpose was to dehumanize blacks and to prove their inferior intelligence / incomplete evolution. A simple Google search will explain it to you.

Second, just because you're not seeing any signs doesn't mean they haven't been insidious and humiliating. Here you go. http://aattp.org/20-of-the-most-racist- ... cal-signs/

Also, here's a nice little collection of racist-ass reactions to Obama's re-election. http://jezebel.com/5958490/twitter-raci ... reelected/

Even consider the reaction to his citizenship. John McCain was actually born in another country, and when it was explained that a military base counts as being a natural citizen, people calmly accepted the explanation. Obama, unlike McCain, was actually born in the US, and the reaction was a hysterical frenzy of "OMG HE'S NOT WHO HE SAYS HE IS!"

The folks who call themselves the Tea Party didn't rally the troops when GWB was spending 4 trillion dollars in Iraq for years. They didn't have collective coronaries over GWB's TARP. You don't see any coincidental timing AT ALL that within a year of a black man taking office, they are protesting his spending en masse?

So please, tell me again how race has nothing to do with the mass outcry against Obama over the outcry of ANY other President. Why THIS President?

[OkToBeTakei]

You can read it in his own words. Here is a PDF: scribd.com/mobile/doc/22472003

Hope that helps!!

A very quick google brings this conclusion.

In order to raise cash, in 1968 Davis authored a pornographic novel, titled Sex Rebel: Black under the pseudonym Bob Greene,[11] which was published by William Hamling's Greenleaf Publishing Company.

A work of fiction. He was a writer and poet.

In his memoir Dreams from My Father, Barack Obama mentions a friend of his grandfather named Frank, who was later identified as Davis. Davis told Obama that he and Stanley (Obama's maternal grandfather) both had grown up only 50 miles apart, near Wichita, although they did not meet until Hawaii. He described the way race relations were back then, including Jim Crow, and his view that there had been little progress since then. As Obama remembered, "It made me smile, thinking back on Frank and his old Black Power, dashiki self. In some ways he was as incurable as my mother, as certain in his faith, living in the same sixties time warp that Hawaii had created."

If I had a mentor I would not discuss him in my autobiography in a manner which makes him sound an acquaintance. A quaint one at that.

You really need to try harder.

[Mama Mia]

You can read it in his own words. Here is a PDF: scribd.com/mobile/doc/22472003

Hope that helps!!

Umm....that PDF is for an autobuiography ( apparently an autobiography of porn) by a guy with a completely different name. Is that the link you meant to post? Or is this guy supposed to be the same guy ( and if so, proof ? ) , I'm confused :think:

Eta: never mind, saw ok's post. Boy a quick google bring up a lot of paranoid crazy :shock:

[realist51]

Hehehe. I saw this earlier and can understand why you would find it odd. Initially when I read it I was well that is the way it works what is the problem.

I realised I think like that because it is absolutely the normal for me. I live in the UK so have no knowledge of the German system really but here every child receives 2 years pre-school. It is free and is the right of every 3 yr old. If a place is not available you can be offered another maybe not of your choice or await a later intake. To start 'your own daycare' is wholly feasible and there are many. They are private and parents pay for these places. Here also legislation for working with vulnerable children is a lengthy process with many safety nets in place. Disclosure forms. Vetting etc etc. This for me is a good thing. No system is infallible but one with no oversight ie A group of disgruntled parents tired of the 'system' should be vetted exactly the same as the State pre-schools. This means Disclosure checks, health and safety, they should have clear fire regulations, policies procedures, qualified staff, audit, be answerable to OFSTED. Etc, etc, etc. The private preschool/nurseries are exactly all this. Money is no protector of children, legislation is. It is as you pointed out in the second part of your post the ideal on which socialised care is built.

The system can be difficult to fathom as in all aspects of socialised care if it is not a demographic norm for you, but no, I would not wish my child to be in a system which did not have these measures be it private or state.

This was many years ago, so I can't remember the specifics. I just remember the take-away, which was, "We can't do it." Starting a home daycare here in the US does require some oversight. I know people who started home daycare businesses, and they did have to comply with safety standards, and they were visited by government (state? county? I don't know which) employees. I have to say, though, that my experience SHOPPING for daycare exposed me to many daycare homes that I wouldn't leave my dog in, so, I'm not so sure what happens after the government employee leaves. As for the capitalism/socialism issue, I do think that there are aspects of the American mindset that I would not want to lose. That kind of, "if you see a problem, solve it" perspective is valuable. I would, on the other hand, like to see us being more concerned about our fellow citizens. I guess I have taken to saying lately that the Republicans are right about personal responsibility and the Democrats are right about social responsibility. I think that we have become polarized, with both sides claiming that they shouldn't have to be responsible for THOSE PEOPLE. It's unfortunate that trying to solve a serious problem with our healthcare delivery system has become such a lightening rod for people's basest fears. This is one area where the US could learn a lot from the MANY countries that have successful systems that provide better care for less money.

[J'ean Skirt]

A very quick google brings this conclusion.

A work of fiction. He was a writer and poet.

If I had a mentor I would not discuss him in my autobiography in a manner which makes him sound an acquaintance. A quaint one at that.

You really need to try harder.

She does. But I don't think she can.

But, yeah, that's not a mentor. That's just someone who your parents know and that you interact with. It's not like real mentors.

Wait, didn't some Republican Congressman write a porn novel, too? Does that mean he's an adulterer?

[HomegirlRuby]

Well, according to obama's book he was much more than a family aquintence...

I am unsure of the representative you are referring to, but certainly I didn't insinuate only democrats could be child rapists. If his novel is auto-biographical and contains admittance of sex with a 14-year-old, then yes. I'd say he is a rapist as well.

Edited to add: a "quick google search" may not be the best or most accurate way to find a synopsis of a novel...

[HomegirlRuby]

You know what? Calling me names like schoolyard children and insisting my information is incorrect has made me see the light!! I think socialism IS the answer!! I no longer see class systems as necessary. I totally support Obamacare and all other socialist reform ideas. Thanks so much for helping me to better understand these basic government principals and guiding me onto the correct path. Viva la Free Jinger!! I have been healed!!

[OkToBeTakei]

Well, according to obama's book he was much more than a family aquintence...

I am unsure of the representative you are referring to, but certainly I didn't insinuate only democrats could be child rapists. If his novel is auto-biographical and contains admittance of sex with a 14-year-old, then yes. I'd say he is a rapist as well.

Edited to add: a "quick google search" may not be the best or most accurate way to find a synopsis of a novel...

So let's say he was more than an acquaintance and that he had a dodgy past, let's say he did sleep with a 13 yr old girl even. Let's say he was a family friend of the Obamas and that he did on occasion give Barrack advice as evidenced.

What is your point? That Barrack Obama is unfit to be president because his parents were friendly with someone? That Barrack Obama having being exposed to a sexual deviant is in some way tainted? That Barrack Obama who wishes to bring socialised healthcare or at least the start of it is so abhorrent to you and this ideal also that you wish to make this point to prove it? That you can't discuss the actual issue itself and why it is right or wrong without resorting to emotive and sensational posting?

OMG Barrack is a .....insert.

Socialised healthcare all but equals Communist Russia.

I'm a stay at home Mum or a business owner dependent upon which debate I wish to win.

Or you just can't engage in meaningful debate as to why it is morally right for all to expect healthcare in a first world country.

[Verin Sedai]

You know what? Calling me names like schoolyard children and insisting my information is incorrect has made me see the light!! I think socialism IS the answer!! I no longer see class systems as necessary. I totally support Obamacare and all other socialist reform ideas. Thanks so much for helping me to better understand these basic government principals and guiding me onto the correct path. Viva la Free Jinger!! I have been healed!!

You're the one who decided that your brilliant introduction to the thread should be an immature, silly attempt at a derail, and your "debate" hasn't gone up in quality since that point. You clearly don't hold your opponents in enough respect to have a civil, educated discussion with them, so how about you put your mind to rest and stop associating with those who are so clearly your intellectual inferiors? No one's telling you to believe anything and nobody's holding a gun to your head to stay in the thread. Jeez louise.

[FreeJosie]

Well first off, I didn't throw ethnicity into the mix. I was not the one that said I was born "lucky" because of my white race, and I felt it was assumed that I, too, am white. Yes, there are black republicans. And female ones, too.

Secondly, communism IS a form of socialism, so... back to the books for you. The idea of diminishing class systems means that those who work hard will do so in order to support those that don't. Sorry - that certainly doesn't align with my beliefs. I don't go for "handouts" except in very rare and very extreme circumstances. I certainly do not think that the government has any right to control the business I worked hard to build, and I absolutely don't agree that my employees should have a say in how I choose to run my business. Incidentally, the implementation of obamacare means we will be cutting the hours of nearly 1/4 our employees and reducing them to part-time) - not sure how the government expects this "healthcare reform" to help people when many business owners like me will be reducing their work hours, thus slicing their weekly pay. But hey - affordable healthcare!!! right?

It amazes me how willing people are to give up their own power and allow the government to take it. So many liberals say they are about "freedom of choice" - but when Big Government takes over there is no choice.

It also surprises me that so many FJers support a President that was mentors by a self-admitted child rapist, Mr. Frank Marshall Davis - but I guess when you're busy collecting homebuyer credits and tanking the economy you ignore things like that?

And so many conservatives have no problem with Big Government stepping in when the issue is abortion or gay marriage...funny that.

Haven't all of the "Obama is best buddies with the Devil himself" conspiracy theories been debunked yet?

[HomegirlRuby]

Yep! You're right!! I'm a total uneducated jackass piece of crap. But thanks to the friendly liberal folk at Free Jinger, I have come to understand how insane and obviously stupid I am!! I totally changed my mind and love the President. I think he is leading our country down the right path and doing an INCREDIBLE job! I love the idea of socialized healthcare!! What we need in order to right this country is more Big Government and kickbacks to help those poor unfortunate souls that cannot so right for themselves. After all, whats the point of being wealthy and becoming successful if you can't fork over that cash to those that are living with less, right. Thanks so much oktobetakei or whatever your user name is. Without your schooling and name calling I would have just stuck to my core beliefs and values. I am a changed woman, and I owe it all to you!!

Incidentally, I never had a problem with the freedom of choice or gay marriage before -- but now I think I am going to join rally teams for both causes. I'm going to do a quick google search to find some in my area. Gosh - how can I EVER thank you?

[Coconut Flan]

I'll be back after finding an adult beverage.

[Ruby Slippers]

It amazes me how willing people are to give up their own power and allow the government to take it. So many liberals say they are about "freedom of choice" - but when Big Government takes over there is no choice.

It also surprises me that so many FJers support a President that was mentors by a self-admitted child rapist, Mr. Frank Marshall Davis - but I guess when you're busy collecting homebuyer credits and tanking the economy you ignore things like that?

You know who else wrote a semi-autobiographical novel about raunchy pubescent sex? Nabokov. Yet he is considered a classical author. I'm sure your statement has nothing to do with a long legacy of images of animalistically, voraciously sexual black men coloring your view of Davis.

Moreover, I hope your concern about governmental "handouts" and "entitlements" extends to student loans, dependent/marriage/homeowner tax credits, corn and oil subsidies, as well as low corporate tax and capital gains rates.

[OkToBeTakei]

Yep! You're right!! I'm a total uneducated jackass piece of crap. But thanks to the friendly liberal folk at Free Jinger, I have come to understand how insane and obviously stupid I am!! I totally changed my mind and love the President. I think he is leading our country down the right path and doing an INCREDIBLE job! I love the idea of socialized healthcare!! What we need in order to right this country is more Big Government and kickbacks to help those poor unfortunate souls that cannot so right for themselves. After all, whats the point of being wealthy and becoming successful if you can't fork over that cash to those that are living with less, right. Thanks so much oktobetakei or whatever your user name is. Without your schooling and name calling I would have just stuck to my core beliefs and values. I am a changed woman, and I owe it all to you!!

Incidentally, I never had a problem with the freedom of choice or gay marriage before -- but now I think I am going to join rally teams for both causes. I'm going to do a quick google search to find some in my area. Gosh - how can I EVER thank you?

What is really sadly ironic about your attempt at sarcasm is that what you have described is a decent human being.

[HomegirlRuby]

Amen sista!! There are no decent human beings that align themselves with the Republican Party. I cannot believe I ever thought otherwise. So glad I'm not one of "them" anymore!! :clap:

[Ruby Slippers]

I also just thought I'd add that the episode in question "took place" when Davis was married to his first wife. Since he married his second wife in the mid 40's, you can safely assume that this fictitious episode took place in the 30's. Child abuse wasn't codified until the 50's. We think of sleeping with tweens as child abuse because that is the world we grew up in. Not so much for someone born at the turn of the century.

Nonetheless, it likely didn't happen, so, yeah.

[Mama Mia]

I also just thought I'd add that the episode in question "took place" when Davis was married to his first wife. Since he married his second wife in the mid 40's, you can safely assume that this fictitious episode took place in the 30's. Child abuse wasn't codified until the 50's. We think of sleeping with tweens as child abuse because that is the world we grew up in. Not so much for someone born at the turn of the century.

Nonetheless, it likely didn't happen, so, yeah.

Completely off topic and trivial complaint, but its a pet peeve of mine: a "tween" is someone UNDER the age of 13. Because a thirteen year old is, by definition, a teen.

[Ruby Slippers]

Completely off topic and trivial complaint, but its a pet peeve of mine: a "tween" is someone UNDER the age of 13. Because a thirteen year old is, by definition, a teen.

That is the real takeaway from this discussion.

Misspelling "its" is a pet peeve of mine, so we will have to tolerate each other as civilly as possible, I suppose.

[Full enough quiver]

Anyone know of a lipstick that can make you pretty on the inside?

[Coconut Flan]

No, but after a couple of brandies it doesn't seem to matter as much. :wink-kitty:

[Ruby Slippers]

I love the idea of socialized healthcare!!

Oddly enough, our centrist President has not formulated socialized healthcare, and the ACA has nothing to do with it, either.

Shit, man, we haven't even gotten to death panels for the olds yet, and I have to go to bed. :crying-blue: :crying-blue:

[Mama Mia]

That is the real takeaway from this discussion.

Misspelling "its" is a pet peeve of mine, so we will have to tolerate each other as civilly as possible, I suppose.

Ha, oddly misspelling "its" is another of my own pet peeves, but unfortunately the iPad disagrees :embarrassed:

eta: actually I do think that making a distinction between "Tweens " and "teens" is important in many cases. In particular if you are talking about sexual conduct. A young teen, particularly during that time period, may have been over the age of consent.

[PennySycamore]

Are you suggesting that black people can't be lucky? Are you suggesting that the same luck that worked for the OP has nothing to do with black people being successful? Because if you are, I think you're wrong. I know a lot of successful black people (hell I'm married to one) and they'd be the first to agree that accidents of birth and luck along with hard work were instrumental in their success.

She is also making the assumption that aelar is Caucasian. I don't know anything about aelar's ethnic background.