Nathan Lawrenson's Twitter

[HeckBound]

It Nate is faking being a judgmental douchecanoe, he's doing a bang up job of it. It would almost make me feel better for his wife and children if I thought he WAS shining it on, but sadly I think he's legit.

[chaotic life]

Expose the trolls was created specifically because of a CF troll. The online CF community is pretty aggressive at hunting down and exposing trolls. Because we cannot meet in person withou vioalting doctor's orders we are dependent upon the internet for interactions.

The day Micah died, someone trolled and claimed that another child died from CF that day as well. Our CF friends were like rabid dogs ferretting it out and exposing. Yesterday, there was another troll exposed in the community. Gina, the troll that website was started over, was so good because she was the fictitious creation of a male CFer in the first place. It's HARD to fake the medical aspects of CF without either exagerating and exposing yourself or not having a personal grasp and showing inconsistencies. Also, CFers will call a hospital when a CF is inpatient, in part to encourage them but also because IF there are questions, it's a fast way to verify a story.

I've never seen any evidence that Tricia doesn't have CF. SHE was an active part of the CF community, including had her own blog, before she met Nate. Also, they have been in LOTS of newspapers confirming her story. Do I think Nate exaggerates things to make himself look like he's a bigger hero than he is, you betcha. I think Nate was attracted to Tricia originally because he thought he would rescue her from her fate. I think he has a savior complex and likes to make the story look like he's the hero holding Tricia and Gwen up and saving them. However, I also believe Tricia has CF, had a lung transplant and struggled first with lymphoma and now rejection.

[2xx1xy1JD]

I hope so too. The pics he posts online of him and Gwen show a very happy father/daughter relationship. I've said this before, but I get a dark and shady vibe from Nate. Sometime back he posted something on twitter or facebook about spanking and it seemed he believes in it. Add in the fact that Nate's dad is a pastor, I can see religion being heavily pushed on Gwyneth. Nate's hateful attitude also scares me and I can picture him teaching Gwen to hate gay people, Catholics, transgendered people, etc.

Gwen had such a rough start in life, and is still very small for her age, so I could see Nate being very protective of her. I don't anticipate a "beat into submission" scenario. I think it's a given that she's being raised with some very strong religious beliefs, but that is all that she would have ever known so it's no so much "pushing" as it would be simply absorbing everything.

Undoubtedly, Gwen will be constantly hearing the story of her life from Nate and the rest of the family. She will hear about how her mother was determined to have her, how the doctors advised an abortion, how everyone prayed for them, and how Jesus heard those prayers to allow her to survive and her mother to get a new pair of lungs. Questioning any sort of sacred family lore is extremely difficult. If you have heard constantly that you are alive only because your mother refused an abortion and Jesus saved your life, you are going to have a gut reaction to any talk of abortion. If she ever does question, it would probably trigger a real inner struggle for her. Objectively speaking, continuing the pregnancy pushed Trish to the verge of death. How does a person deal with the fact that their very existence caused that? How could she acknowledge that her beloved father and everyone around her supported a course of action that forced her mother to death's door? I don't necessarily picture her being consumed with hate for gays, Catholics, etc. because I think that her energy would be directed toward CF, organ donation, preemies and pro-life causes. Of course, Gwen may also focus on her own special needs - I know that she has the glasses and that she got a cochlear implant for her hearing, but I thought that there may have been some additional issues.

[lilwriter85]

It Nate is faking being a judgmental douchecanoe, he's doing a bang up job of it. It would almost make me feel better for his wife and children if I thought he WAS shining it on, but sadly I think he's legit.

I don't think Nate is faking being a douche either. Looking at Nate's dad's twitter it easy to see why Nate is the way he is. Nate's dad Rick is Christian dominionist type pastor who ignores or can't accept things like separation of church and state. The Lawrensons have the attitude/belief that Christianity should reign over everything in this country. During, the Supreme Court hearings about DOMA and Prop 8, Nate was tweeting shit like "I hope God is with the justices". He ignores the fact the marriage predates Christianity. His constant whine tweets about abortion again show his domionist beliefs. I respect that he and Tricia chose not to abort. It was their choice, but they are assholes to not wanting options/choices for other people.

Nate doesn't realize or even care that couples in difficult health situations may not have the resources he and Tricia have. Nate's parents and Tricia's parents help them out a lot in several ways. Other couples might not have family members who are always available for babysitting or financial help. Finances play a part in why some people terminate high risk or special needs pregnancies. Some people can 't constantly rely on relatives for financial help. I give credit to Nate's and Tricia's parents for constantly helping Nate and Tricia out. But not all 50 or 60 something couples can constantly help out their adult children. I have to wonder if Nate's parents will eventually hit a breaking point in which they get fed up with constantly covering for Nate at his job. Daddy Lawrenson has to feel some pressure or questioning about Nate's job at the church. I wouldn't be surprised if people have left that church because of what is going on with Nate and Tricia. Nate doesn't realize how lucky he is. Nate, Tricia, and Gwyneth will never go hungry or have to worry about living on the streets. I know many people would do their best to not let relatives end up without food or shelter. But with Nate, it seems he and Tricia are able to have extra things despite their situation. They both have iPhones, a Mac computer, they eat out often, and they go out to movies and other outings. Couples in difficult health situations might not have any of those extras. Based on twitter and IG, Nate is always saying stuff like "Gwyneth is coming". It does cost money for Nate's parents or in-laws to drive the little girl to Durham. I wouldn't be surprised if Nate isn't giving out gas money. Overall, Nate and Tricia have resources that some people in need don't have. I can honestly sympathize with a couple who knows they wouldn't have been able to afford or give a good financially secure life to a child while dealing with difficult health situations.

Nate's twitter activities have bitten him in the ass, but he seems not to realize it. He pulls the whole "People are shocked about me" whenever people wise up that he is an asshole. He doesn't realize that he has driven away some of the audience that would buy his book. Outside of his anti-gay marriage and anti-choice tweets, he comes off as immature whiner about other things. His book will probably paint him as kind Christian man who married a woman with a difficult illness. His twitter doesn't show that. He acts entitled when it comes to Tricia's health care. Sometimes it seems that he is never satisfied with what goes on at Duke. I know the health care industry in this country isn't perfect, but it is better than other countries. Nate said on FB back in November that a big publisher was interested in his book. I have to wonder if employees at the publisher have been seen Nate's twitter. In a way I like that he keeps running his mouth on twitter because there is a chance a publisher would drop him. I have to also wonder if the publishing company is secular or maybe a Christian publisher. I can't see Nate doing well writing his story from a secular viewpoint.

[lilwriter85]

Expose the trolls was created specifically because of a CF troll. The online CF community is pretty aggressive at hunting down and exposing trolls. Because we cannot meet in person withou vioalting doctor's orders we are dependent upon the internet for interactions.

The day Micah died, someone trolled and claimed that another child died from CF that day as well. Our CF friends were like rabid dogs ferretting it out and exposing. Yesterday, there was another troll exposed in the community. Gina, the troll that website was started over, was so good because she was the fictitious creation of a male CFer in the first place. It's HARD to fake the medical aspects of CF without either exagerating and exposing yourself or not having a personal grasp and showing inconsistencies. Also, CFers will call a hospital when a CF is inpatient, in part to encourage them but also because IF there are questions, it's a fast way to verify a story.

I've never seen any evidence that Tricia doesn't have CF. SHE was an active part of the CF community, including had her own blog, before she met Nate. Also, they have been in LOTS of newspapers confirming her story. Do I think Nate exaggerates things to make himself look like he's a bigger hero than he is, you betcha. I think Nate was attracted to Tricia originally because he thought he would rescue her from her fate. I think he has a savior complex and likes to make the story look like he's the hero holding Tricia and Gwen up and saving them. However, I also believe Tricia has CF, had a lung transplant and struggled first with lymphoma and now rejection.

Thank you CL for the addiotional info on the exposethetrolls site. I agree with the bolded, I do think Nate exaggerates to make himself look like a bigger hero and I also see the savior complex.

[GeoBQn]

My husband and I are going to his friend's wedding next year in Nag's Head. I will be keeping my ears open on the choice of minister for the ceremony . . .

[lilwriter85]

Gwen had such a rough start in life, and is still very small for her age, so I could see Nate being very protective of her. I don't anticipate a "beat into submission" scenario. I think it's a given that she's being raised with some very strong religious beliefs, but that is all that she would have ever known so it's no so much "pushing" as it would be simply absorbing everything.

Undoubtedly, Gwen will be constantly hearing the story of her life from Nate and the rest of the family. She will hear about how her mother was determined to have her, how the doctors advised an abortion, how everyone prayed for them, and how Jesus heard those prayers to allow her to survive and her mother to get a new pair of lungs. Questioning any sort of sacred family lore is extremely difficult. If you have heard constantly that you are alive only because your mother refused an abortion and Jesus saved your life, you are going to have a gut reaction to any talk of abortion. If she ever does question, it would probably trigger a real inner struggle for her. Objectively speaking, continuing the pregnancy pushed Trish to the verge of death. How does a person deal with the fact that their very existence caused that? How could she acknowledge that her beloved father and everyone around her supported a course of action that forced her mother to death's door? I don't necessarily picture her being consumed with hate for gays, Catholics, etc. because I think that her energy would be directed toward CF, organ donation, preemies and pro-life causes. Of course, Gwen may also focus on her own special needs - I know that she has the glasses and that she got a cochlear implant for her hearing, but I thought that there may have been some additional issues.

There was a newspaper article that came out when Gwen was 2 or 3 and it said that she wasn't showing any signs of having learning difficulties. She might have additional issues that haven't been caught yet. She is enrolled a preschool and teachers there could be getting indications if she has learning difficulties.

[lilwriter85]

My husband and I are going to his friend's wedding next year in Nag's Head. I will be keeping my ears open on the choice of minister for the ceremony . . .

If the minister turns out to be Rick Lawrenson, you are tasked with your first fundie blogger encounter trip and report.

[chaotic life]

Well, to state that Gwen has no learning delays is a misnomer. She does in fact have language delays, which are typically with deaf children. If she is typical for most preemies, she would show other delays but would still be considered within normal for micro-preemies. AFAIK, micro-preemies have their developmental progress charted based upon their adjusted age until at least four. It's also common to have medical syndrome whereby children with lots of complex medical issues are delayed in their development and learning because you cannot learn while managing medical conditions, and you can often regress under the stress and pain. A micro-preemie child with the medical complications that Gwen has presented can be said to show no disabilities but it means she's normal for her circumstances not necessarily that you can compare her to a normal, full-term, healthy child and they will stack up the same. Ultimately, the expectation is that the child will catch up and as an adult show no differences than their peers. However, as a toddler, they are going to be different but progressing on the curve expected *for them*.

[flyawaystray]

Nate has been quiet. I hope Trish is ok.

[lilwriter85]

Nate has been quiet. I hope Trish is ok.

I hope so too. I think if she in bad condition, I think Nate would tweet or blog about it. I also wouldn't be surprised if Nate has decided to keep things on the down low because of the publisher.

[tamster59]

he has been known to take a break and maybe this is one.His latest blog post from 2 weeks ago was this and more: We believe that the end is coming soon. Either she will be relisted because she become a "now or never" case, or the transplant team decides she cannot be re-transplanted and sends us home.

Could be they are going private to spend time together as a family.

[flyawaystray]

If that's the case, then I have nothing snarky to say. That is the right thing to do. I wish he had gotten of Twitter a while ago to spend more time with Trish, but it's possible he was still delusional about getting a transplant. Who knows.

[LibbyLiv]

This has been a fascinating read, particularly because I know the Lawrenson family personally. I attended college with Nathan's parents and have kept in touch over the years, and am actually good friends with a few people at his father’s church. Although I still keep my faith, I abandoned the fundy mentality a long time ago.

I could probably shed some truth/light on some of the things discussed here if anyone is interested.

BTW, a friend told me about this forum, and I have to say it’s been quite enjoyable so far.

[LibbyLiv]

My husband and I are going to his friend's wedding next year in Nag's Head. I will be keeping my ears open on the choice of minister for the ceremony . . .

I am attending a wedding in Nag's Head as well next year! I'm looking forward to some time on the beach! Wouldn't it be funny if it were the same wedding?!?

[lilwriter85]

This has been a fascinating read, particularly because I know the Lawrenson family personally. I attended college with Nathan's parents and have kept in touch over the years, and am actually good friends with a few people at his father’s church. Although I still keep my faith, I abandoned the fundy mentality a long time ago.

I could probably shed some truth/light on some of the things discussed here if anyone is interested.

BTW, a friend told me about this forum, and I have to say it’s been quite enjoyable so far.

Hi welcome to FJ. How big is Nate's dad's church and do people at the church question Nate "working" there?

[LibbyLiv]

Hi welcome to FJ. How big is Nate's dad's church and do people at the church question Nate "working" there?

Well, first off, I love the snark, but I also value my friendships with people, even when we disagree about things like politics and religion. So, it is a little frustrating to see some of the misconceptions that have been discussed here. As I said before, I’ve known Nathan’s parents since college, and I’ve met Nathan and his siblings, and although I can’t really speak directly about Nathan’s motives, the family in general are “good†nice people. I’m not close to any of them now, but from everything I gather through my friends in their church and from my limited contact with them over the years, that fact hasn’t changed. Again, I don’t agree with a lot of their beliefs, and I know too many fundies who could certainly be described the way Nathan has been described here, so I’m not going to defend that. I have a lot of friends who wouldn't have any problems with what has been posted here from Nathan's twitter about gays and abortion, etc. and I think people are entitled to their beliefs, even if they are dead wrong. But, I can address a few things that have been mentioned here based on some things that I am aware of.

I’m certainly not close with Nathan’s family these days, but I am good friends with a few people in his church and have spent some time talking with them about Nathan's situation as I have a dear friend who has a daughter with cystic fibrosis. I've never been to the church, but if I remember it's around 250-300 members. But, it is in a resort community and I've been told they average a lot more than that, especially during the summer. Not sure if that's big for that area or not, but 200-300 would make it bigger than most churches where I live.

I also have been told that Nathan is still working while they are at the hospital, although obviously not as much as when he is at the church. From what I can gather, there is not any question about his work ethic, and my friends don't seem to be concerned when Nathan and Tricia have had to be away. In fact, they have nothing but great things to say about how the church is run about Nathan. I know they talked about missing his presence when they were in the hospital several years ago. I do know for a fact that my friends have never been approached to contribute to Tricia’s medical needs/trust fund. From what I’ve gathered, Tricia’s trust fund is funded by close family and friends outside of their church (No, I've never been approached either). In fact, my friends have told me that it seems like most people in the church aren’t even aware of Tricia’s trust fund because the Lawrenson's don't seem to want to solicit from church members.

[lilwriter85]

Well, first off, I love the snark, but I also value my friendships with people, even when we disagree about things like politics and religion. So, it is a little frustrating to see some of the misconceptions that have been discussed here. As I said before, I’ve known Nathan’s parents since college, and I’ve met Nathan and his siblings, and although I can’t really speak directly about Nathan’s motives, the family in general are “good” nice people. I’m not close to any of them now, but from everything I gather through my friends in their church and from my limited contact with them over the years, that fact hasn’t changed. Again, I don’t agree with a lot of their beliefs, and I know too many fundies who could certainly be described the way Nathan has been described here, so I’m not going to defend that. I have a lot of friends who wouldn't have any problems with what has been posted here from Nathan's twitter about gays and abortion, etc. and I think people are entitled to their beliefs, even if they are dead wrong. But, I can address a few things that have been mentioned here based on some things that I am aware of.

I’m certainly not close with Nathan’s family these days, but I am good friends with a few people in his church and have spent some time talking with them about Nathan's situation as I have a dear friend who has a daughter with cystic fibrosis. I've never been to the church, but if I remember it's around 250-300 members. But, it is in a resort community and I've been told they average a lot more than that, especially during the summer. Not sure if that's big for that area or not, but 200-300 would make it bigger than most churches where I live.

I also have been told that Nathan is still working while they are at the hospital, although obviously not as much as when he is at the church. From what I can gather, there is not any question about his work ethic, and my friends don't seem to be concerned when Nathan and Tricia have had to be away. In fact, they have nothing but great things to say about how the church is run about Nathan. I know they talked about missing his presence when they were in the hospital several years ago. I do know for a fact that my friends have never been approached to contribute to Tricia’s medical needs/trust fund. From what I’ve gathered, Tricia’s trust fund is funded by close family and friends outside of their church (No, I've never been approached either). In fact, my friends have told me that it seems like most people in the church aren’t even aware of Tricia’s trust fund because the Lawrenson's don't seem to want to solicit from church members.

Thank you for the info and clearing up some stuff.

[tinylegs1]

This thread is filled with an incredible amount of erroneous speculation, and while I respect your personal experience, chaotic life, you seem to currently lead the pack.

I've posted on MWOP and lurk here. I will not defend or debate his politics or religion, fire away. He puts it out there, go to town.

If you don't know something for fact, don't bother speculating, because you come off just as asshatish as you suggest he is. You think reading his tweets are blood boiling? You should read what is perpetuated as "fact" and then dog-piled as truth, when it is wildly inaccurate.

Chaotic Life: You are wrong about several things that you seem to be speaking with such authority about. The hospital. She hasn't been IN a hospital beyond short term procedures in many months. So, no, she hasn't been stuck in a hospital for weeks or more as you've implied. That is easily discernible and common knowledge. And before you speculate about their foster situation, you might want to actually be accurate with at least who you believe the child is. Otherwise it looks like you stalked out her FB account or pictures off a blog from 2-3 years ago and then attempt to factually share what you've conjured. Which, in this thread, has been wrong on many accounts.

[LibbyLiv]

Duke has refused to relist Tricia. It's in the CF community today, but I guess not being publicized otherwise. They say they have done everything Duke has asked of her but they have flat out stated they will not relist her.

Selfish asshole. Take that tortured women home to her children and give her peace!!! I've said it before and I'll say it again, Nate's selfishness is driving this insanity. Tricia is well beyond the ability to make her own decisions in this and he openly admits he doesn't want to live without her. Tough shit. She had this when you married her and it is your JOB TO PROTECT HER.

I can tell you that the first quote above is completely untrue, which makes me beleive that the second quote above is also untrue. (You can't believe everything you read on the internet, eh?) I am part of a private group on Facebook for friends of Tricia's family to keep up to date with Tricia's health (It was originally an open group when I got in, but now it's private), most of the information comes from different family members Tricia. If relisting were taken off the table, they would certainly be home by now. The only reason Tricia has not gone home yet is because the doctors are still giving her hope. From what I gather, Nate is prepared to come home if that is what the doctors tell them to do, but it's Tricia who is holding out hope. I'm not sure why Nate hasn't been updating his Facebook the past week, but the information being shared by family is that Tricia is recently on the upswing and the doctors are very hopeful that she'll be relisted soon. Apparently, Duke is one of the few hospitals in the country who will give people a second set of transplanted lungs, but they only seem to do a few dozen of those a year. I recall Nathan posting something online back in the fall about praying that Tricia would be reconsidered about being a candidate for another transplant, which apparently she was/is. All that to say, it seems to me that Nate is the one who has a realistic take on all of this and he's only continuing the fight because Tricia is still a candidate.

[chaotic life]

Oh, I see. So, you have watched someone die from CF and know that stating a person who goes hypoxic cannot think clearly is a false statement? You have suctioned the mucous that gurgles out and watched them struggle and fight? You are aware that there reaches a point where you CANNOT intubate because of the level of sticky mucous that clogs up the lungs? You've watched someone cry out in their sleep because of the pain it causes their body to not have that oxygen? You've watched them cough so hard they break blood vessels in their eyeballs and fall on the floor because the coughs wrack their body so badly???

See, when it was MY TURN to face that, a close friend called us and said, "There are some things that are unique in CF deaths that you need to be prepared for." I was nervous but didn't quite get it. Now that I have suctioned the nastiness from my son's mouth just so that his siblings wouldn't vomit from how horrific it is to watch, yeah I GET IT.

You can be on a private FB group ALL YOU WANT, but if you haven't sat there in person and watched someone die from CF, you are not going to get it. Nate can post anything he wants on that FB group to spare all of you the REALITY of what Tricia is living but his glossy the horrifying parts over for YOU does NOT make what it's really like to sit there, to watch it, and to try to provide comfort less accurate.

Now, go re-read what I've written on this thread. The absolute VAST majority of my writing has been sharing what I KNOW are FACTS about the end of life wiht this disease because unlike you I HAVE LIVED IT.

I stand by what I've said at least a dozen times, which I speak from personal experience. He needs to take Tricia back to her children and make her comfortable. It makes me VERY angry to watch and see him not doing that because I DO know what it's like and I know there is a point when it's too damn late to hope for lungs.

[chaotic life]

For the record, doctors will NEVER tell you to take your loved one home to die unless and until YOU are ready to let go and go home. So long as NATE insists on fighting, the doctors will continue to work with him. Tricia reached the threshold for being listed in OCTOBER. Her lungs haven't gotten BETTER since that point when she was delisted. They have only gotten WORSE. To assume that Nate stays only because the doctors imply there is still hope is a circular argument. As long as NATE insists there must still be a chance, the doctors will continue to look at the situation. It will only be when NATE is ready to admit it's time to take her home that the doctors will do the same.

CF doctors HATE giving into this disease. More than most other doctors, they give their LIVES to fighting this and holding it at bay, even when they know they will lose EVERY SINGLE ONE of the patients eventually. CF has a 100% mortality rate. There is NO cure. They will fight for as long as YOU want to fight. When you are ready to stop fighting, they will be relieved and stand with you in letting go, but they are NEVER the ones to do the letting go first. And yes, once again, I know this from experience--not just mine but EVERY other CF family I've ever had contact with.

[treemom]

I gotta say I am less than thrilled with the attack on CL. Not hand slapping, but she hasn't led the gang in speculation. And the post about not being relisted months ago, and it was true at that time. She had been refused to be relisted.

And yeah assholes are good people all the time. Is anyone denying you can be both? But at the end of the day, they might be good people but they express repugnant ideas on a daily basis publicly.

[LibbyLiv]

chaotic life,

You've simply gone and proven my point. You think you know so much about Tricia and Nate, but you really know very little. Tricia hasn't been seen by a CF doctor in nearly six years. That's what happens at Duke when you enter the transplant program, but of course you wouldn't know that. She is seen regularly by a pulmonologist (not a CF specialist) and by a cardiothoracic surgeon. Tricia's lungs no longer have CF, which means she does not/will not suffer from that thick sticky mucus, and I would think you would know at least that much since you profess to be such an expert on CF and transplant. Just a few days ago Tricia posted on Facebook about a friend named Bobby who was told by the transplant team at Duke that they could do nothing else for him. He went home, even though HE still wanted to fight. You obviously don't know squat if you think that anybody outside of the Duke transplant team is going to dictate when their patients are deemed "unfit for surgery".

All that to say, YOU HAVEN'T LIVED what Tricia and Nate are living right now. YOU have never lived the transplant life, and shame on you for claiming to know exactly what they're going through when in reality, you know very little. Shame on you for making wild assumptions about Nate and Tricia based on your own experiences and believing them as facts and getting upset with others when they don't believe your crap.

I'm terribly sorry for your loss. It is something that no parent should ever have to go through. But you seem to have allowed bitterness and anger about your son's death cloud your ability to see others in an empathetic way. What is truly sad is that you've also allowed your bitterness to help cloud how others see Nate and Tricia. Very, very sad.

[tinylegs1]

hmm... well my first reply is lost, so I apologize if this double posts somehow.

First, Chaotic Life, I have an immense respect for your personal experience.

Because I am her sister.

However, again, you are erroneous in many of your current assumptions about what is going on right now in our lives.

Livvyliv, While I respect what you are trying to do and trust me, stuff here makes me want to vomit, I do think the things we share on our private sites should probably remain largely private. There is purpose to it and this is likely a big part.

In respect to CL, you are incorrect in OUR case. Every single doctor and family member is well aware of what is going on, but since you are not part of our situation, you've never met Tricia and you aren't on her medical team, perhaps in this case it'd be better to stick to criticizing their politics or faith or what he eats for dinner or whatever. When it is time to go home, every member of the team has said they will be honest and not waste their time. However, on the topic, EVERY team member has said they need to stay and fight right now. Not because my sister is ignorant to her body and disease, but because they believe relisting is still a possibility. Their caregivers on her team know their particular situation and have worked to be incredibly sensitive to it. None of us, including my sister or Nate are wearing rose colored glasses. We have medical professionals in our immediate family. This has been something, like you, that we've lived our entire lives. But it is OUR lives right now. Earlier you surmised she was living in a hospital room. You were wrong. So, perhaps you've misunderstood what has been going on and that has affected your filter. But she hasn't been hospitalized routinely and there has been no secret that she spends hours every day completing her regular team prescribed PT at the transplant center.

Again, I'm not handslapping and I've been careful to be as respectful as I can with CL, but the assumptions throughout this thread (and hers stood as as it pertained to laying in a hospital and their foster child) have been wrong. Very wrong.