Bontragers/Bowers/Helferichs 12

[HereticHick]

Liz Bontrager seems to have made her Insta account private. Interesting move for someone who is constantly shilling a MLM (Young Living essential oils).

[JermajestyDuggar]

2 minutes ago, HereticHick said:

Liz Bontrager seems to have made her Insta account private. Interesting move for someone who is constantly shilling a MLM (Young Living essential oils).

I swear we are the only ones talking about her. I don’t think they talk about her on Reddit or other fundie snark places. 

[Dominionatrix]

5 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I swear we are the only ones talking about her. I don’t think they talk about her on Reddit or other fundie snark places. 

I’m always surprised by how narrow the scope of the Reddit fundie snark page is.

[JermajestyDuggar]

10 minutes ago, Dominionatrix said:

I’m always surprised by how narrow the scope of the Reddit fundie snark page is.

I agree. Especially since Reddit talks a lot about girl defined while we only talk about them a little bit on FJ. They have their extreme faves and then sort of ignore a ton of fundies who have public images on social media. 

[SwimmerBoy29]

23 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I agree. Especially since Reddit talks a lot about girl defined while we only talk about them a little bit on FJ. They have their extreme faves and then sort of ignore a ton of fundies who have public images on social media. 

As someone who is active on both- 

the Reddit sub seems to be more geared towards the wannabe influencer types- Girl Defined, the Olliges, the Collins, and then the Duggars, who dare I say are the “OGs”.

Correct me if I’m wrong but I feel like FJ is geared a lot towards like the FUNDIE fundies- the IBLP crowd, the Family Camp-ers, and generally people that have been around for longer. Like I’ve been on the Reddit sub since quarantine when I discovered it and I don’t think I’ve ever seen the Arndts brought up. But I may me wrong.

 

[Ozlsn]

On 10/17/2023 at 6:16 AM, HereticHick said:

She turns 20 in December.

 

She really is so young. I wish she was being given the opportunity to expand horizons and some space to work out who she is instead of being told that her only future is marriage. In mainstream culture she might still be desperate for a boyfriend - but it wouldn't be the sole life path laid out for her, and there would be room for her to make some mistakes along the way.

[Dominionatrix]

I wonder if Liz found FJ and/or someone in her circle tipped her off and encouraged her to go private? 

[no fun funddie]

She perhaps needed some time to adjust now that her friend Maddison (dear single women on instagram) is no longer a single woman having recently got married. Or perhaps she is hoping to take over and be the unmarried fundie guru about being content in your singleness and other stuff that disguises how they are feeling. Just hope that she is genuinely happy at least some of the time, and not constantly feeling she needs to put on an act.  

[JermajestyDuggar]

She sounds like such a smug jerk. Sorry if you don’t have a perfect covenant marriage like me! She’s not going to win any friends acting like this. And no thanks to becoming one. My husband and I are two separate people. Two partners working towards a common goal. And we’ve been married a lot longer than her.

Edited December 4, 2023 by JermajestyDuggar

[deborahlynn1979]

She is LOVING this tiny bit of notoriety from her last video. And I do mean tiny.

[Giraffe]

"Many women don't know what it's like to be loved + known in a lifelong, covenant marriage."

Statements like this are always so rich coming from the recently married. Allison, even you don't know what it's like to be in a lifelong marriage! As far as the "covenant" part of your marriage? All that means is both parties are trapped, even if they both wanted to change it! It's not some magic spell that suddenly makes both parties like their marriage partner at all times and always want to remain married for life. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

49 minutes ago, Giraffe said:

"Many women don't know what it's like to be loved + known in a lifelong, covenant marriage."

Statements like this are always so rich coming from the recently married. Allison, even you don't know what it's like to be in a lifelong marriage! As far as the "covenant" part of your marriage? All that means is both parties are trapped, even if they both wanted to change it! It's not some magic spell that suddenly makes both parties like their marriage partner at all times and always want to remain married for life. 

What if her husband died tomorrow? Would she be only half a person? Would she get married again so she could be whole? Or would she have to stay single forever because she as an oh so special covenant marriage? 

I was a whole person before I met my husband. He didn’t complete me. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

At least two have commented against Allison’s post. And they aren’t snarkers. One is possibly mennonite and the other is possibly fundie. 

[noseybutt]

2 hours ago, Giraffe said:

"Many women don't know what it's like to be loved + known in a lifelong, covenant marriage."

Statements like this are always so rich coming from the recently married. Allison, even you don't know what it's like to be in a lifelong marriage! As far as the "covenant" part of your marriage? All that means is both parties are trapped, even if they both wanted to change it! It's not some magic spell that suddenly makes both parties like their marriage partner at all times and always want to remain married for life. 

I’ve been married a gazillion years now and the reality is that I feel like I have been married multiple times…all to the same person. Life stages differ dramatically: from young couple with no kids to the busyness and sleeplessness of babies to the unpredictability of teenagers to launching young adults to career upheavals and health challenges and financial rollercoasters.

My marriage is a precious and beautiful gift but, dang it, I don’t take credit for it. Yes we both said the vows but so did everyone else and sometimes it pans out and sometimes it doesn’t.

 I wish these young people could understand that and approach relationships with humility and awe instead of certainty and rules.

[JermajestyDuggar]

26 minutes ago, noseybutt said:

I’ve been married a gazillion years now and the reality is that I feel like I have been married multiple times…all to the same person. Life stages differ dramatically: from young couple with no kids to the busyness and sleeplessness of babies to the unpredictability of teenagers to launching young adults to career upheavals and health challenges and financial rollercoasters.

My marriage is a precious and beautiful gift but, dang it, I don’t take credit for it. Yes we both said the vows but so did everyone else and sometimes it pans out and sometimes it doesn’t.

 I wish these young people could understand that and approach relationships with humility and awe instead of certainty and rules.

I’ve only been married 14 years and I totally agree. Many life stages means marriage looks so different depending on the stage. My sister is starting to deal with that old empty nest. Which is a totally different stage of marriage that can cause a lot of problems. Some people love it and enjoy it together. And some don’t. I come from divorced parents so I will say I’m very committed to trying to stay married. But there are absolute deal breakers for me and I’m glad I have the option for divorce if one of those deal breakers ever happened. 

[postscript]

I’ve never been married. So according to Allison I’m not a complete person (sorry, Allison - I r always been happier alone than when I was in a relationship). However. I’ve seen plenty of relationships, both good and bad. At your stage - 4-5 years married, couple of tiny kids - lots of couples are happy. But as the relationship progresses, things change in ways you can’t predict. Those changes may bring the couple closer together or may drive them farther apart. I’ve seen couples who were happy at year 5 grow apart by year 10 and barely able to communicate by year 15. Don’t proclaim the superiority of your flavor of marriage until you’ve been through some of those unpredictable changes. 

It’s hard to get a real take on their marriage because he doesn’t speak for himself. All we hear from her is that she’s prostrating herself in front of him and she loves it. I would like to hear his perspective, 

[noseybutt]

20 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I’ve only been married 14 years and I totally agree. Many life stages means marriage looks so different depending on the stage. My sister is starting to deal with that old empty nest. Which is a totally different stage of marriage that can cause a lot of problems. Some people love it and enjoy it together. And some don’t. I come from divorced parents so I will say I’m very committed to trying to stay married. But there are absolute deal breakers for me and I’m glad I have the option for divorce if one of those deal breakers ever happened. 

That's the conundrum. Pretty much every healthy long term marriage that I have had the privilege of seeing up close is a combination of stubbornness with honoring vows and firm boundaries around deal breakers. Because that's how most healthy people operate and healthy marriages are a by-product of that.

 

 

 

4 minutes ago, postscript said:

I’ve never been married. So according to Allison I’m not a complete person (sorry, Allison - I r always been happier alone than when I was in a relationship). However. I’ve seen plenty of relationships, both good and bad. At your stage - 4-5 years married, couple of tiny kids - lots of couples are happy. But as the relationship progresses, things change in ways you can’t predict. Those changes may bring the couple closer together or may drive them farther apart. I’ve seen couples who were happy at year 5 grow apart by year 10 and barely able to communicate by year 15. Don’t proclaim the superiority of your flavor of marriage until you’ve been through some of those unpredictable changes. 

It’s hard to get a real take on their marriage because he doesn’t speak for himself. All we hear from her is that she’s prostrating herself in front of him and she loves it. I would like to hear his perspective, 

Bingo.

Not be overly sexist here, but I do wonder sometimes if men from these conservative religious groups have opinions based on their emotional experiences. They don't seem to spend too much time and energy into identifying and expressing their emotional life. Rather, they are all about behaviors: providing financially and let their wives care for the home. And they judge their marriage based on those types of behaviors. Meaning: he may not have much of an opinion if the behaviors line up a certain way. 

Also--I don't buy into the prostrating piece. That's her public persona. Behind the scenes....who knows. I have seen many fundamentalist marriages that are surprisingly wife-centric but it takes time to figure that out because the public facade is so very important. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

Ok if anyone is a biblical scholar, I have a question. Doesn’t Paul say the holiest way you can be is alone and celibate? I was under the impression he says that somewhere in the bible. That it’s best to be unmarried and celibate, but if you cannot, then get married. I feel like so many Christians completely overlook this idea of being so godly that you are in fact alone and celibate for your whole life. What would allison think of those people? They are only half a person! Yet Paul spoke of them as the holiest (if I’m remembering correctly).

Edited December 4, 2023 by JermajestyDuggar

[JermajestyDuggar]

She’s backpedaling a bit now. She now says her post was only talking about the people who were crass and called her crazy. But the way she came off was so rude and judgmental. She was defensive and her message is still crap. Even if it was only meant for the haters. 

Edited December 4, 2023 by JermajestyDuggar

[JermajestyDuggar]

I have to post this heat since both Liz and Allison are MLM huns for young living. Liz in particular is always pushing Ningxia Red. It’s crazy expensive. This is an anti-mlm video and the first story shows a clip of a woman who reminds me of Ruby Franke. She sells Young Living and is using her children to push her agenda. It’s borderline abusive behavior. She has a daughter named Jerusha so I bet she’s fundie 🤣 Just watch the beginning of the video. Your blood will boil.

 

[MomKB]

7 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Ok if anyone is a biblical scholar, I have a question. Doesn’t Paul say the holiest way you can be is alone and celibate? I was under the impression he says that somewhere in the bible. That it’s best to be unmarried and celibate, but if you cannot, then get married. I feel like so many Christians completely overlook this idea of being so godly that you are in fact alone and celibate for your whole life. What would allison think of those people? They are only half a person! Yet Paul spoke of them as the holiest (if I’m remembering correctly).

Yes, he did say that in I Corinthians 7. I agree that many Christians completely ignore that, and make "godly" marriage out to be the holiest way to live. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

13 minutes ago, MomKB said:

Yes, he did say that in I Corinthians 7. I agree that many Christians completely ignore that, and make "godly" marriage out to be the holiest way to live. 

I swear fundies will pick the same 50 verses out of the Bible and just quote them over and over and over again. All while ignoring the rest. 

[HereticHick]

Liz turns 20 in 2 weeks so expect to see the "joyfully single" desperation scale get cranked to 11.

Meanwhile, she did a AMA and picked a pretty hilarious pic for this question.

[JermajestyDuggar]

4 minutes ago, HereticHick said:

Liz turns 20 in 2 weeks so expect to see the "joyfully single" desperation scale get cranked to 11.

Meanwhile, she did a AMA and picked a pretty hilarious pic for this question.

We know she must date her brother until she can find a boyfriend of her own. So ick.

[JermajestyDuggar]

So here’s the problem with being a submissive fundie wife. Allison, what if you r husband wasn’t ok with you resting instead of doing housework? Because not all men are exactly like your husband. What if a friend of yours was in the same situation? But her husband was upset she didn’t do housework? What if he thought it wasn’t a good enough excuse? Your friend would have to do what her husband said. That’s what kills me about fundies like allison. Their perfect husbands are so caring and loving and blah blah blah. So submitting to their husband is no problem. But what about the women who aren’t married to husbands exactly like yours? Are they screwed? Are they to live their miserable lives in submission? Are you better than them because they got a divorce?