The Queen/Prince Philip

[Kaylo]

Do you think Philip gifted E the new puppies because he knew he would be passing soon?

I think it’s likely. It seems like they knew for a while and this last trip to the hospital would have been even longer if he hadn’t decided he wanted to pass at home, so that’s what he did.

[viii]

1 hour ago, kachuu said:

Do you think Philip gifted E the new puppies because he knew he would be passing soon?

Unlikely, tbh. I think she got some new dogs because she wanted them. I think a lot of people believe Elizabeth and Philip were closer than they were. I don’t want to dismiss their 73 year marriage, because that is a huge accomplishment, but I do think the Queen is a lot more independent than some people realize. Wasn’t it confirmed that Philip didn’t even live with her at Windsor in 2020 but in a different cottage on the grounds? 

[tabitha2]

I never heard of her as particularly independent in all honesty and She is not a confrontational person either. She let Phillip make most of the decisions concerning the Windsor’s as family such as When they were making Decisions about Charles schooling Her mother tried to convince her that Gordonstown was a bad fit for him and she had big doubts herself but let Phillip have control without much fuss .
 

She  was intimidated  out of getting involved the child care at all by the older domineering nanny they employed until the sweet treat she chose for Charles dessert on day was crossed off the menu. Nanny was gone the next day. 

[Xanariel]

18 hours ago, Anna Bolinas said:

And how will the poor royals deal with people thinking that they're racist? When they go into job interviews, they'll--well, no, they don't have to do that. But when they're on Twitter, they'll--well, no, they don't really have those. Okay, I've got it. Think of the future episode of The Crown, that show that they don't watch. Yes, I'm sure that'll really devastate them. Poor lambs. 

... I mean, these are national figures in the UK who carry out public engagements and regularly interact with the press. It does and already did come up, especially as Harry and Meghan immediately leak any conversations to the press. 

Most people would not like it if their family member went if Facebook and accused an unnamed relative of being a racist, let alone your brother/son/grandson going on Oprah to an audience of millions and doing that, while also inaccurately implying that you willfully yanked needed security from his son purely for the colour of his skin (when he should know full well that's not how security is assigned). 

[tabitha2]

I have a question for Harry and Meghan apologists: would you want these two in your family?  Would you answer their calls or give them money? 

[viii]

Sure! I think Harry and Meghan would be a great addition to any family; especially her. I would happily talk to them, and I’m guessing they wouldn’t run to the media about anything I say because I’d actually treat them with kindness and respect. ?

Edited April 25, 2021 by viii

[Xanariel]

1 hour ago, viii said:

Sure! I think Harry and Meghan would be a great addition to any family; especially her. I would happily talk to them, and I’m guessing they wouldn’t run to the media about anything I say because I’d actually treat them with kindness and respect. ?

I think it might be worth pointing out that the very first thing Meghan leaked to the press was a blind item, back when she was Harry's girlfriend. She and Kate were going off to the same shopping district (not on a planned trip together, Meghan headed off after mentioning she was going there and then saw Kate arrive by car) and Meghan apparently felt snubbed she wasn't offered a ride. 

Later leaks about the incident mentioned that Kate didn't know Meghan well enough at that time to go shopping with her, but that even if she had, she wouldn't have risked being photographed with her before an announcement was made because it would be taken as an unofficial confirmation Meghan was going to be her sister-in-law. 

This then appeared as a blind item on Lainey Gossip's site (for those who aren't aware, Lainey is a blogger who works alongside the husband of Jessica Mulroney, Meghan's BFF. Lainey mentioned during Jessica's racism scandal that she was scared of the family and aware the Mulroneys could wreck her career, meaning that she's not sticking blind items about Jessica's best friend on her site unless Jessica is happy with it). The blind asked readers if they would think it was weird to not be offered a ride, implying Kate deliberately excluded Meghan. 

The Cambridges are famously averse to getting their private life leaked outside of the agreed and controlled updates they release to the press - this goes back to the phone hacking scandal where Kate and William had their phones hacked and private voicemail messages stolen by journalists, leading William to repeatedly suspect various friends and staffers of selling stories. This blind item evidently didn't go down well with them, and is thought to have been one of the points of contention against Harry at the infamous Sandringham summit. 

Maybe Meghan didn't mean anything malicious by it, but if your first reaction to not being offered a ride by your boyfriend's notoriously private sister-in-law who you barely know is to rush off to leak it to a gossip blogger...you're probably not setting up a great footing with your in-laws going forwards. 

Edited April 25, 2021 by Xanariel

[tabitha2]

Sounds like she demanded/ expected  the respect and the perks of the closeness of intimates which is completely the wrong approach for guarded careful  people like William and Kate. They have a proven circle of very old dependable society/school  friends of him or her or both that do not talk to the press or use them for personal benefits AKA the Turnip Toff or Cambridge set. 
 

I honestly don’t Think Meghan can understand such a clique. 

[SoSoNosy]

Going back to the puppies, I read either on Hello or People that Andrew gifted them to his mother.

Meghan doesn't have the ability to understand anything that she isn't the center of.

[Manda]

23 hours ago, viii said:

reputable sources confirmed that Meghan had proof of the conversations

Unless the proof is a recording, text, email, or similar I'm guessing it's as good as the proof of their early wedding.

Also Harry's not getting to bike ride has been debunked with photos.  As the statement said that recollections may vary.  That may have been one of the palace's better understatements. 

[Kaylo]

Unlikely, tbh. I think she got some new dogs because she wanted them. I think a lot of people believe Elizabeth and Philip were closer than they were. I don’t want to dismiss their 73 year marriage, because that is a huge accomplishment, but I do think the Queen is a lot more independent than some people realize. Wasn’t it confirmed that Philip didn’t even live with her at Windsor in 2020 but in a different cottage on the grounds? 

I believe he lived on the Home Farm when she was working and with her when she wasn’t.

[Anna Bolinas]

9 hours ago, Xanariel said:

Most people would not like it if their family member went if Facebook and accused an unnamed relative of being a racist, let alone your brother/son/grandson going on Oprah to an audience of millions and doing that, while also inaccurately implying that you willfully yanked needed security from his son purely for the colour of his skin (when he should know full well that's not how security is assigned). 

I've gone through a lot of drama, both familial and peer-related, in my life. I remember getting vagued on Twitter one time by a girl I went to school with. I was upset, and then I realized, "I don't even like her either, so who cares what she thinks of me? If she wants to fight me, she knows where she can find me. If she doesn't, she can think what she wants about me." So I honestly would not care at this point in that situation, and if I was rich as fuck and had special fancy titles and was apparently so well-beloved and so much more popular than the other family member or friend in my home country, I would care even less.

And I also think that white people especially get upset when accusations of racism pop up because they are more concerned with being seen as one of the Good White People than they are with actually grappling with the issue of racism. And like if you accused my grandfather of being racist, I would have to agree with you because he was. Didn't make him an irredeemably evil person, it was just a major flaw of his. It's the same way men lose their minds over accusations of sexism. And it directs all the energy to the label of "racist" or "sexist" or "homophobe" than to the actual issue at hand, at least in my opinion.

[Xanariel]

2 hours ago, Anna Bolinas said:

I've gone through a lot of drama, both familial and peer-related, in my life. I remember getting vagued on Twitter one time by a girl I went to school with. I was upset, and then I realized, "I don't even like her either, so who cares what she thinks of me? If she wants to fight me, she knows where she can find me. If she doesn't, she can think what she wants about me." So I honestly would not care at this point in that situation, and if I was rich as fuck and had special fancy titles and was apparently so well-beloved and so much more popular than the other family member or friend in my home country, I would care even less.

I think that's a commendable attitude to have, but most people still would be very upset by it, especially if this family member basically admits the issue wasn't important enough to raise in public until they realised you weren't giving them the material stuff they wanted. 

Or to turn what should be a serious and emotional discussion within one's family into a public guessing game - "Right guys, there's about 10 people in the family with this distinction, and one of them said it - no, hold up, you're not guessing who I want. I'll knock out two people from the pool - no, I don't see a reason to clear the other seven people who didn't say it, why would I?"

Or basically prove that you don't want to have the kind of frank and clear conversations needed to explain why the comment upset you, because you're relaying every word to Gayle King so she can announce on public television how the talks are going. 

And speaking of being more concerned with being seen as a good person than actually tackling racism ... I mentioned this in a different comment, but Harry was the family member who straight-up used racial slurs against other soldiers in the army. He made a mealy public apology of it at the time that basically wrote it off as army banter, but was never reported as apologising to the individual soldiers involved, even though the uncle of one of them publicly said it was upsetting for the family. 

So as Harry has never since addressed those comments, it really comes across as "Speculating what skin colour my royal son will have? Unacceptable. Racial slurs against lower-class men? Just banter, innit?" 

Edited April 26, 2021 by Xanariel

[SweetJuly]

3 hours ago, Kaylo said:

I believe he lived on the Home Farm when she was working and with her when she wasn’t.

Didn't he live on Wood Farm at the Sandringham Estate since his retirement, and only moved in with the Queen late last year/earlier this year to facilitate quarantining (and, possibly, medical care)?

[Alisamer]

On 4/24/2021 at 9:24 PM, viii said:

They said naming them would cause damage. Everybody already knows Princess Michael is a racist shit, so I doubt it’s her. I really believe it’s either Charles, Camilla, William or Kate. I don’t think anyone else in the family has the popularity where it would matter as much. 

Yeah I guessed Princess Michael because she's done and said things in the past that are... problematic. And she would certainly consider herself an important royal, wouldn't she? Didn't she once talk about how she had more royal blood than anyone in the family except maybe Phillip?

(As an aside - I met her once! Briefly, but in person she was pleasant and kind despite being surrounded by Americans who had little to no knowledge of protocol and who she probably would consider bumpkins. Everyone had their moments, I suppose.)

22 hours ago, viii said:

Anything anyone says should be taken with a grain of salt. 

Agreed. Everyone sees through their own eyes and hears through their own ears, filtered through their own brain. Our brains are amazing but can skew things sometimes.

[viii]

7 hours ago, Xanariel said:

I think that's a commendable attitude to have, but most people still would be very upset by it, especially if this family member basically admits the issue wasn't important enough to raise in public until they realised you weren't giving them the material stuff they wanted. 

I don't think that's what happened, though. If Harry and Meghan were going to blast the family because they didn't receive what they wanted regarding a title and security for Archie, they would have spoken in May 2019 when Archie was born, they would have spoken in January 2020 and they would have spoken about it in February 2021. I genuinely believe that Harry and Meghan would have gone (more) quietly into the night if things had been handled more discreetly on both ends. I genuinely believe that the entire Oprah interview only happened because they were fed up with the royal palace blasting them left and right in the media under the guise of unnamed sources, and they wanted to defend themselves. 

If everything had been handled privately between the family, I genuinely believe we would have never known that someone questioned how dark Archie's skin might be. 

[Xanariel]

6 minutes ago, viii said:

I don't think that's what happened, though. If Harry and Meghan were going to blast the family because they didn't receive what they wanted regarding a title and security for Archie, they would have spoken in May 2019 when Archie was born, they would have spoken in January 2020 and they would have spoken about it in February 2021. I genuinely believe that Harry and Meghan would have gone (more) quietly into the night if things had been handled more discreetly on both ends. I genuinely believe that the entire Oprah interview only happened because they were fed up with the royal palace blasting them left and right in the media under the guise of unnamed sources, and they wanted to defend themselves. 

If everything had been handled privately between the family, I genuinely believe we would have never known that someone questioned how dark Archie's skin might be. 

When I say "material stuff", I don't just mean Archie's title and security. I mean their entire list of demands in January 2020 (including the statement that they were IPPs entitled to having their security funded by whichever country they were staying in, which it swiftly became apparent they hadn't checked with either the UK or Canada about), the money from Charles, their right to use HRH in a commercial context, the fuss about Harry's military honorary titles, etc. 

When the Sussexes initially left in 2020, it was announced that the situation would be reviewed in 2021 and a final decision taken then on the remaining royal privileges linked to them like the military appointments. In early 2021, it was reported that Harry was pressing very hard for a decision on the appointments, and the Palace didn't understand why there was such urgency when the final decision wasn't due until March - until ITV accidentally leaked news of the Oprah interview to them, and they realised he wanted a decision made before they learned of it. 

So I don't think the Sussexes were quite prepared to burn their bridges entirely until they had confirmation that the Palace was still not going to give them their way.

And I'm not sure which of the relatives they're accusing of briefing against them as unknown sources, when the Sussexes had major issues with their staff (which is an issue for BP too, as the staff who claim they were mistreated stated that the HR ignored their complaints for the sake of protecting Harry and Meghan), Meghan was leaking to bloggers before the engagement was even announced and they blatantly collaborated with Finding Freedom long before the Oprah deal had been struck. 

[Anna Bolinas]

21 hours ago, Xanariel said:

So as Harry has never since addressed those comments, it really comes across as "Speculating what skin colour my royal son will have? Unacceptable. Racial slurs against lower-class men? Just banter, innit?" 

Yep, Harry's a dumbass who should apologize for those comments and attempt to make some real restitution. But Harry's comments being shrugged off also comes across, at least to me, as "nobody in the British Royal Family is capable of having any kind of honest discussion about race or racism because to do so would mean they had to look at their own family's long history of colonization and imperialism, and it's a lot easier to just issue mealy-mouthed apologies or parade out their black friends or accuse someone else in the family of being the real racist."

Certainly Harry would've learned well from his own grandfather, to bring it back around to the topic of the thread, whose racist comments were always excused with, "Well, that's just his humor! And he's so old too! Just classic Philip!"

[hoipolloi]

The BRF Slimming Plan appears to be moving into higher gear:

Quote

Philip’s death has given new urgency to a transition already underway in the House of Windsor. With the queen’s reign in its twilight, Charles has moved to streamline the royal family and reallocate its duties — a downsizing forced by the loss of stalwart figures like Philip, as well as by the rancorous departure of Prince Harry and his wife, Meghan, and the messy internal exile of Prince Andrew....The biggest challenge for Charles is reconciling the family’s workload with its reduced ranks. He has long favored a slimmed-down monarchy, built around him and his wife, Camilla; Prince William and his wife, Kate; and Harry and his wife, Meghan. Princess Anne, his younger sister, also remains a full-time royal....But the decision of Harry and Meghan to withdraw from their duties and move to California blew a hole in those plans....There is also little prospect that Andrew will ever return to the fold. If anything, the palace is girding itself for further embarrassing disclosures this July when his friend Ghislaine Maxwell goes on trial in New York on charges that she trafficked underage girls on behalf of her employer, Mr. Epstein. 

There may be still be a chance to get ahead of the Andrew-Epstein debacle coming up this summer if Charles forced his younger brother ASAP to cooperate with the SDNY. The BRF could at least try to look as though it's on the right side of justice and history. It's probably not going to happen, though. 

[tabitha2]

 Maxwell is where is the justice comes in and what they can realistically pursue. Legally and Physically American Authorities can’t touch Andrew and The British washed their hands of it long ago. Princess Mette Marit of Norway also dined and socialized with Epstein even after the abuses became public BTW. Ain’t nobody care.  

What they should do is They should also attempt to charge or at least investigate those American big names in Epstein’s but of course there is to much money and influence and the Law enforcements own dirty little secrets that could be revealed  for that to ever happen. 

 

[Xanariel]

I think unfortunately that there is zero chance of that happening. 

Andrew has not been officially accused of anything or been charged - he's just wanted for questioning. While he would be stupid to holiday in the USA going forward, there's no warrant going for him and thus no real pressure for the UK to make him go. 

Even if there was, there has been very bad publicity in the UK about the issue of Anne Sacoolas and the US's refusal to send her to the UK for justice. While I don't think many people in the UK like Andrew, it would be a pretty bad look if the UK handed over a prince when the US thinks its spies are above our laws. 

I think the most likely thing is that Charles will double-down on forcing Andrew into a (permenant) retirement from royal appearances and work to make sure that he doesn't get to wriggle back in after Philip's loss.

Charles has waited nearly 70 years for the throne; he's not going to risk Andrew jeopardising that for him. 

[hoipolloi]

5 hours ago, Xanariel said:

I think unfortunately that there is zero chance of that happening. 

 

So do I.

5 hours ago, Xanariel said:

Even if there was, there has been very bad publicity in the UK about the issue of Anne Sacoolas and the US's refusal to send her to the UK for justice.

That case is absolutely disgusting. Depending on the legal issues, I wonder if a new administration can revisit this situation and kick her ass back into the UK, at least for investigations where she will be required to cooperate with UK authorities. 

She was protected by her/her husband's diplomatic status although a US Court has ruled that she can be sued in a civil suit in the US.

[Xanariel]

14 minutes ago, hoipolloi said:

So do I.

That case is absolutely disgusting. Depending on the legal issues, I wonder if a new administration can revisit this situation and kick her ass back into the UK, at least for investigations where she will be required to cooperate with UK authorities. 

She was protected by her/her husband's diplomatic status although a US Court has ruled that she can be sued in a civil suit in the US.

Sadly, that doesn't look likely. The Biden administration has already made it clear that they're not extraditing her. Harry's family may be able to get a civil judgment, but I think that's the only hope they've got at this point. 

Democrat or Republican, the US has a pretty long history of not wanting to hand over its citizens (while having no compunction about pressuring foreign countries to give up theirs). And it seems Sacoolas actually has a history in the CIA that makes her more valuable than her husband, so she's definitely not getting given to the UK (even though the punishment for dangerous driving here is ridiculously low). 

[viii]

https://people.com/royals/queen-elizabeth-cousin-accused-selling-access-vladimir-putin-prince-michael-kent/

We always knew Princess Michael ain't shit, but now her husband has confirmed that he is just as terrible as she is. He has been accused of selling access to Putin. 

"Prince Michael, 78, allegedly offered his royal endorsement in exchange for a $200,000 fee, reportedly saying he'd use his home in Kensington Palace (where Prince William and Kate Middleton also live with their three children) as a backdrop for the recorded speech."

The Queen needs to get her family in order, damn. 

[tabitha2]

She is old and tired and can’t control all these people doing what they want.