[CW: Child Sex Abuse] Josh&Anna 28:Does anyone wonder how many times JB has phoned up Mike Huckabee?

[llucie]

10 minutes ago, HarleyQuinn said:

JD was involved in that Medicorps thing was he not? When he and the Bates flew to the Bahamas after the hurricane, guns and badges in tow and acted like total assholes? I wouldn't put it past him to do something shady tbh.

And regarding the Dillards I think a lot of them not being allowed to the TTH had to do with TLC filming. They probably couldn't be there when any of the film crews were, where as Anna and family could, making it easier for Josh to go lurk in a corner or something. 

 

JD is the Director of bussiness of Medic Corps indeed.

[Coy Koi]

4 minutes ago, The Baby Humanist said:

I've never watched these shows, so this is a real question, not snark:

Does Anna have any smarts? Do ANY of the Duggars or Duggar-adjacent have any smarts?

Clearly, they're culturally ignorant — the products both uneducation and miseducation. I'm not even sure how you measure "common sense" in people that didn't share a common reality with the rest of us. 

But is anyone bright? Articulate? Curious? Or has all that been beaten and brainwashed out of them? 

I've never seen any evidence of it, but then I mostly just read instead of watching videos. Still, I see it soo often where snarkers will claim the kids or even adult kids are doing all kinds of things that I sure can't see. (I will watch videos when enough people insist that it shows something like that.) I think there's generally just a lot of wishful thinking involved.

[Cam]

I think the older Duggar siblings have smarts, yes. Just because they were homeschooled and were taught a very limited curriculum in no way means they are dumb. They all have access to the internet and can learn whatever it is they want to from it. They make money by figuring out in what ways they can use their fame to bring in the dollars. I also think there’s competition among the couples, where any of them would love to be breakout stars (the “Michael Jackson” of the group”) and gain greater popularity than all the others.  I don’t see any of them being supportive of Josh. 

Jeremy seems like he’s bored with Jinger. She seems a bit fragile and he seems like he doesn’t want to deal with it. 

[Lgirlrocks]

7 minutes ago, Cam said:

Jeremy seems like he’s bored with Jinger. She seems a bit fragile and he seems like he doesn’t want to deal with it. 

If that’s true then he shouldn’t have married her. I’m sure he knew how deep in the cult she was. I think he wanted a yes women and he got one. Maybe he no longer wants it but we may never know.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

1 minute ago, Lgirlrocks said:

If that’s true then he shouldn’t have married her. I’m sure he knew how deep in the cult she was. I think he wanted a yes women and he got one. Maybe he no longer wants it but we may never know.

Many people are blindsided after they marry by the emotional baggage of their partner, definitely not just a fundy thing.  I can see fundies being less inclined to be self aware about their issues and open with their potential spouse before marriage, but to be honest that's not super common in mainstream society either.  

[Queen Of Hearts]

51 minutes ago, OrchidBlossom said:

Maybe he can disguise himself as a very large suitcase and hitch a ride with John Shrader

VERY large.  Smuggar is quite pudgy.

[ADoyle90815]

11 minutes ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Many people are blindsided after they marry by the emotional baggage of their partner, definitely not just a fundy thing.  I can see fundies being less inclined to be self aware about their issues and open with their potential spouse before marriage, but to be honest that's not super common in mainstream society either.  

That's true, but with how short fundie courtships are, by the time someone realizes their partner has a ton of emotional baggage, they're married and have a lot of children. Also, especially for people like the Duggars, divorce is clearly not an option when in that type of situation. In mainstream society, people have a much longer period of dating, so sometimes, they split up when they realize they're not compatible or that there's a lot of emotional baggage they aren't capable of dealing with.

Edited May 4, 2021 by ADoyle90815

[Idlewild]

The thought of Josh doing a Ronnie Biggs and fleeing to Brazil where he impregnates a local woman (under the watchful eye of Anna in a Handmaids Tale style??) is a non starter in my view. Josh is lazy and entitled and JB is cheap. It costs JB enough to keep him and his brood in a warehouse - the idea of bankrolling him and illegitimate offspring in Brazil is laughable.

For those not familiar with Ronnie Biggs see under the spoiler

Spoiler

Ronnie Biggs was part of a gang responsible for the Great Train Robbery in England in the 1960s- it was the highest value robbery in history. He was caught and sentenced to a lengthy term in prison. Due to his gang connections he was able to escape from prison and fled to Brazil where he fathered a child which meant Brazil refused to extradite him. Once his son reached 18 Biggs was very ill and broke - he tried to negotiate a return so he could get medical treatment under the NHS. He did eventually return but was returned to prison straight away. His son came over too and campaigned for his release on compassionate grounds. He was eventually released a few weeks before he died.

He has always been a hero to some people- no idea why as he was a professional criminal and the rail employee who was attacked in the robbery never fully recovered. 

 

[HerNameIsBuffy]

Just now, ADoyle90815 said:

That's true, but with how short fundie courtships are, by the time someone realizes their partner has a ton of emotional baggage, they're married and have a lot of children. Also, especially for people like the Duggars, divorce is clearly not an option when in that type of situation.

Absolutely.  There is also the fact that those who have those supervised courtships never even have the time or opportunity to talk about deeper stuff, even if they wanted to.  

I was just saying marriage can bring a lot of surprises about your partner even when you've known each other fairly well.  With these people there are a hell of a lot more unknowns.  

That said I've never understood how some people think they can tell what someone is thinking based on highly staged and edited social media,  but that's just me.

[Antimony]

46 minutes ago, The Baby Humanist said:

I've never watched these shows, so this is a real question, not snark:

Does Anna have any smarts? Do ANY of the Duggars or Duggar-adjacent have any smarts?

Clearly, they're culturally ignorant — the products both uneducation and miseducation. I'm not even sure how you measure "common sense" in people that didn't share a common reality with the rest of us. 

But is anyone bright? Articulate? Curious? Or has all that been beaten and brainwashed out of them? 

Eh, classic nature vs nuture. Depends how you measure any of these things.

The thing is that it's pretty clear to me, at least, that the kids aren't stupid. But, they aren't nearly as smart as Michelle and Jim Bob wanted to advertise with their promotion of homeschooling. When somebody is clearly lying out their ass by calling you super intelligent, the obvious rebuttal is to be like "wow these kids are so stupid" when the reality is just...something in the middle. 

Being a pilot isn't nothing. Playing the number of instruments they do isn't nothing. All of those things require being a certain level of smart and talented in that field -- but more importantly, an ability to learn and practice. (We saw TimBits fail at being a pilot, a stark contrast to JD, so we can see that there are differences even when both families homeschooling can be described as "subpar, at best.") We've seen them build things, learn new skills, have hobbies. They're likely average people who got failed in a big way, and we could have seen a lot more from them in an alternate universe where Michelle wasn't trying to explain bankruptcy to all five year olds. 

They also might have some of what might be termed folk-knowledge. The kind of thing that you learn just by being in a relatively rural area. (My parents live in the middle of literally nowhere, in the woods, and they develop skills just by living there and observing things while doing their daily life.) Maybe Joy, with all her adventures with whatshisface, is now really good a identifying trees or trail plants. Maybe they like field guides to plants, etc. Maybe the ones who got into hunting are good at animal tracks and birdwatching. Who knows. That kind of thing is rarely advertised and we all have bigger inner worlds than most of the people around us imagine. I can see that being the case for some of the kids. 

[Mama Mia]

2 hours ago, SassyPants said:

OTOH, he would have to buck daddy, thus changing his lifestyle if he refused. Do you think JD would be willing to walk Jill’s path? I suppose he and Abbie could find daycare and  jobs to support their family. Maybe move to OK?

 

As far as I know JD owns his own property, or has in the past? And a towing company, or demolition or something similar. Those are businesses that pay well. I hear he might have a pilot gig as well. There’s no reason JD and Abbie wouldn’t /couldn’t continue a very similar lifestyle without Counting On / JB. Less perks/fluff $, but comfortable.

There really are tons of guys who make enough to support their families without college or working in an office. 

[SorenaJ]

I think Abbie has smarts. She seems fairly well-spoken. 

[HereticHick]

1 hour ago, QuiverFullofBooks said:

Leaving aside how JB would get Josh to Mexico, and whether he would be extradited, Mexico isn’t that far away and it’s a small world now. The tabloids would be after him there too, maybe even more so than when he’s in boring small-town Arkansas. 

Yes to this. It might be different if he had friends and family--a network--in Mexico, to help him out. But he doesn't as far as we know.

Media is global, and Mexico already knows about Josh, For example:

Arrestan a la exestrella de TV, Josh Duggar, por descargar videos inapropiados de niños

https://www.tribuna.com.mx/temas/josh-duggar-20702.html

And the Mexican media was even covering him back in 2015.

Sexo y represión, escándalo en "reality": Mientras Josh Duggar se somete a rehabilitación, surgen nuevos detalles de su vida íntima

https://www.eluniversal.com.mx/articulo/espectaculos/farandula/2015/08/27/sexo-y-represion-el-escandalo-de-una-estrella-de-reality

 

[OrchidBlossom]

22 minutes ago, Queen Of Hearts said:

VERY large.  Smuggar is quite pudgy.

I don't want to body shame anyone, not even Josh who deserves naught but ill for the rest of his life. However, I do own a suitcase large enough to fit an adult human male. I use it for my clothes when I move ? It's this massive pink thing and standing up its a bit taller than me. Perhaps he can pack himself away in something similar... it also comes in pink zebra stripe and electric purple with yellow stars on it and blue with rainbow hearts. And I think lime green.

 

Inconspicuous.

Edited May 4, 2021 by OrchidBlossom
I forgot about the blue with rainbow hearts.

[Alisamer]

19 minutes ago, Idlewild said:

The thought of Josh doing a Ronnie Biggs and fleeing to Brazil where he impregnates a local woman (under the watchful eye of Anna in a Handmaids Tale style??) is a non starter in my view. Josh is lazy and entitled and JB is cheap. It costs JB enough to keep him and his brood in a warehouse - the idea of bankrolling him and illegitimate offspring in Brazil is laughable.

For those not familiar with Ronnie Biggs see under the spoiler

  Reveal hidden contents

Ronnie Biggs was part of a gang responsible for the Great Train Robbery in England in the 1960s- it was the highest value robbery in history. He was caught and sentenced to a lengthy term in prison. Due to his gang connections he was able to escape from prison and fled to Brazil where he fathered a child which meant Brazil refused to extradite him. Once his son reached 18 Biggs was very ill and broke - he tried to negotiate a return so he could get medical treatment under the NHS. He did eventually return but was returned to prison straight away. His son came over too and campaigned for his release on compassionate grounds. He was eventually released a few weeks before he died.

He has always been a hero to some people- no idea why as he was a professional criminal and the rail employee who was attacked in the robbery never fully recovered. 

 

Oh I definitely know it's far-fetched and basically impossible.

But think of the headlines it'd generate!

[Knight of Ni]

I haven't had time to read every post but I did a quick scan and didn't see it mentioned but there's a news article about how German officials have shut down a huge CP website with over 400,000 subscribers. I don't want to post the link as I don't want to use certain keywords at work but it should be easy to find. I am very curious if this the site he used. It's also very disturbing to see how wide spread the problem is. It would also explain the amount of time between the raid and actual arrest. 

*if this has already been mentioned I'm sorry. My supervisor has decided it's ok to take out the stress he's been dealing with outside of work on his employees. It's been fun.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

1 minute ago, OrchidBlossom said:

I don't want to body shame anyone, not even Josh who deserves naught but ill for the rest of his life. However, I do own a suitcase large enough to fit an adult human male. I use it for my clothes when I move ? It's this massive pink thing and standing up its a bit taller than me. Perhaps he can pack himself away in something similar... it also comes in pink zebra stripe and electric purple with yellow stars on it.

Body shaming doesn't hurt Josh.  I doubt very much he's reading here hoping to hear nice things about himself.

It's just that mocking his weight or his looks minimizes how awful he is for what he has done.  He's a serial sexual predator of children and was arrested for CP but ha ha he's fat, too.   Yeah, so?  You don't like his body don't sleep with him, but it has nothing to do with why he's human garbage.  

Some people just can't resist the low lying fruit, but anything that takes the focus off what he has done helps minimize the valid criticism.  

1 minute ago, Knight of Ni said:

I haven't had time to read every post but I did a quick scan and didn't see it mentioned but there's a news article about how German officials have shut down a huge CP website with over 400,000 subscribers. I don't want to post the link as I don't want to use certain keywords at work but it should be easy to find. I am very curious if this the site he used. It's also very disturbing to see how wide spread the problem is. It would also explain the amount of time between the raid and actual arrest. 

*if this has already been mentioned I'm sorry. My supervisor has decided it's ok to take out the stress he's been dealing with outside of work on his employees. It's been fun.

It was mentioned, but thanks for the heads up in case it hadn't been.  Sorry things are crappy at work for you but don't feel bad about not keeping up, it's damn near impossible these days.

[OrchidBlossom]

1 minute ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Body shaming doesn't hurt Josh.  I doubt very much he's reading here hoping to hear nice things about himself.

It's just that mocking his weight or his looks minimizes how awful he is for what he has done.  He's a serial sexual predator of children and was arrested for CP but ha ha he's fat, too.   Yeah, so?  You don't like his body don't sleep with him, but it has nothing to do with why he's human garbage.  

Some people just can't resist the low lying fruit, but anything that takes the focus off what he has done helps minimize the valid criticism.  

I think that's how I meant it, in a sense. I don't think Josh reads here (partially because he's in jail-- ZING) but I don't want to shame his body because I do not want anyone ELSE to see comments about his body and infer negativity about larger people. I don't body shame harmful people not for their benefit, but for the benefit of others. And yes, his size is irrelevant. If there were a hypothetical discussion in which his weight was somehow relevant, I wouldn't have the same objection.

[SassyPants]

17 minutes ago, Mama Mia said:

As far as I know JD owns his own property, or has in the past? And a towing company, or demolition or something similar. Those are businesses that pay well. I hear he might have a pilot gig as well. There’s no reason JD and Abbie wouldn’t /couldn’t continue a very similar lifestyle without Counting On / JB. Less perks/fluff $, but comfortable.

There really are tons of guys who make enough to support their families without college or working in an office. 

Beyond the show, we’ve seen very little evidence that most of the Duggars do anything that could be construed as sustained work. Yes, Austin works and Abbie did work for a year before she married, but the rest of them really don’t give any indication that they are cut out for sustained work or following a structured time schedule. Duggar time does not generally lead to successful employment. Even JB was noted to be absent from his government job much of the time.

The now adult kids had really poor role models in terms of working and supporting a family, day after day, year after year for decades on end. 

[Imrlgoddess]

I just ran through the posts real quick & saw someone else posted a Tiktok about the case but I didn't see this one anywhere. 

She is saying Josh is/was telling Anna that the material found was for an old employee.  

Whether it's plausible or not, who knows.  But I absolutely expect that to be the denial. 

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMeVD9KGM/

[TN-peach]

Long time lurker - first time poster.

One of the podcasts I listen to "LA Not So Confidential" is with two forensic psychologists.  One of their first jobs post-degree was counseling sex offenders so they have talked a bit about child porn/ child sex abuse images. 

They mentioned they different type of people that have CSA images.  There are the pedophiles.  There are some that are collectors like it is like a competition - they want all 11 images of the "Susie collection" or something like that.  Then there are those that are looking at adult porn but probably very graphic porn and when they download 1000 images there may be 5 images of CSA in the group they downloaded.  By the time they have downloaded all 1000 images, it is too late they now have possession of CSA images.  This usually happens when you are looking for not "mainstream" porn images on the dark web. 

I am curious as to the number of actual images he has downloaded.  If it is a relatively small number, I wonder if he downloaded the CSA images when he was downloading a large batch of adult porn. His reason for possession won't matter as far as the charges goes.  CSA images are evil. 

[Nike]

Apologies if this has been mentioned in the abuse debate and further apologies to use the UK as reference as this is where I live. In the UK charities now prefer the term domestic abuse rather than domestic violence as controlling and coercive behaviour are now a crime. 

As the duggar cult advocate for female submission I would say it's a given that women are being abused. Having said that, Josh is a POS who probably abuses this "privilege". 

For example, I think that John David is a nice guy who treats Aby with respect despite the belief he was brought up in whereas I can imagine Josh getting a kick off treating Anna like dirt.

I remember when he left her struggling with a suitcase just married and on camera and when he went to sleep when she was giving birth. 

I imagine that her self esteem is torn to shreds but she's is going to have to dig deep to protect her children, self esteem or no self esteem. 

 

[Howl]

2 hours ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

And to the second....agree on how it could insanely difficult emotionally but we can't forget how many of them are financially dependent on JB.  Hard enough to fight your brainwashing to do the right thing, but if doing so will mean you could be cut off financially now this would take a lot more courage than a lot of people would have.

...with the set up of one wage earner w/ heavily dependent SAHW with young children. 

[Queen Of Hearts]

8 minutes ago, OrchidBlossom said:

I think that's how I meant it, in a sense. I don't think Josh reads here (partially because he's in jail-- ZING) but I don't want to shame his body because I do not want anyone ELSE to see comments about his body and infer negativity about larger people. I don't body shame harmful people not for their benefit, but for the benefit of others. And yes, his size is irrelevant. If there were a hypothetical discussion in which his weight was somehow relevant, I wouldn't have the same objection.

Yes, I agree with you entirely.  My intention was not to offend others, only Smuggar.  Apologies to anyone who was offended.  

[HerNameIsBuffy]

Just now, OrchidBlossom said:

I think that's how I meant it, in a sense. I don't think Josh reads here (partially because he's in jail-- ZING) but I don't want to shame his body because I do not want anyone ELSE to see comments about his body and infer negativity about larger people. I don't body shame harmful people not for their benefit, but for the benefit of others. And yes, his size is irrelevant. If there were a hypothetical discussion in which his weight was somehow relevant, I wouldn't have the same objection.

That's what I thought you meant, I was agreeing with you.  Sorry if I wasn't clear.

Yes, if he were to have been busted humiliating women over their weight or looks then sure, it's relevant.  But when it's unrelated it's just like, oh we can fat shame because he's evil and deserves it.  IMO he deserves a hell of a lot worse than mocking, but that shit doesn't hurt him.  It hurts people reading who haven't done anything to anyone. 

I have gotten a ton of shit in the past for pushing back when people would suspect pregnancies based on whether a fundie woman had gained a few pounds, or if her tummy was less than perfectly flat but and have been accused of defending fundies.  I never understood the argument, but it's not defending fundies it's just speaking up about how damaging our society's obsession and comfort with publicly critiquing each other's bodies.  And not that I have a secret PM army or anything (for the record I do not, people rarefy speak to me outside of public threads except for technical help) every time I've done this I've gotten PMs thanking me from people who were hurt and struggling with how bad the body scrutiny comments made them feel.  

I have had people speculate that I have a personal issue with this and that's why I'm so obnoxious about it.  Nope.  I give zero fucks what anyone here thinks of my body but as someone who lived with a pretty serious ED when I was younger I do totally understand when people tell me how reading that stuff is damaging.  

To me making that fat joke about Josh is like when Trump called Hilary ugly.   What the fuck does that have to do with anything?  I consider knee jerk fat jokes to be a very Trump like response....sadly not uncommon.

I'm actually surprised it took so long for one to be made this time as they were really prevalent the last couple of smuggar scandals.