Joe & Kendra 16: Praise - ing Their Brooklyn All the Day Long!

[adidas]

Linguistics nerd checking in.

Aaron has the phoneme ‘a’ (as in cat or apple - IPA /æ/)

Erin has the phoneme ‘e’ (as in bed or dress - IPA /e/).

[Jana814]

My aunt’s sister-in-law’s name is Cherry (like the food) & it’s pronounced the same way. No one gets it right. People think her name is sherry just with a Ch instead of a Sh. 

[theotherelise]

I don't think I have the sounds in my repertoire to make Erin and Aaron sound different! At least not on the first sound. I think I say them Air-Un and Air-In. 

[CarrotCake]

5 hours ago, Marly said:

So, I'm not a native speaker.
To me "eh" as in meh and "ah" as in apple, sound exactly the same. 
In English, these names sound the same to me.
In Dutch they would be pronounced completely different. Double aa in Dutch gets a 'long' sound, I can't find an equivalent in English. And Erin, if pronounced Dutch, would be pronounced somewhat like: the first 'e' would be kind of similar in pronounciation to the 'in' part. Slightly different, the 'e' is pronounced longer than the 'i', but I don't think an English speaker would hear the difference, but again I can't find a good equivalent in English. (For the Dutchies: I think it would be pronounced Eerin). 

In Dutch I would pronounce Erin like Eh-rin, which makes no sense because logically it would indeed be Ee-rin with a long E.

And then Aaron I would pronounce the English way while Aron I would pronounce the Dutch way (with a long A), but that is probably because I had two colleagues with those two names, one being American and the other Hungarian and this is how we pronounced them.

To explain our short and long vowels to English speakers:

We have 'e' and 'ee' where 'e' is pronounced like 'eh' and 'ee' is pronounced like you would say the letter A.

We also have 'a' and 'aa' where 'a' is pronounced like in bath and 'aa' is pronounced like the last a in banana.

But then there is the rule that when a short vowel is followed by only one consonant (or when you just mention the letter), they automatically become long. Which is what happens in Erin and Aron. Aaron with 2 a's would therefore make no sense since Aron is already pronounced like it has two A's. Which is why I assume Aaron is pronounced the English way. To make Erin with a 'eh' sound, in Dutch you would have to write Errin.

 

Also, this is why Dutchies fuck up spelling in English all the time. Our 'i' is pronounced like your 'e' and our 'e' is pronounced like your 'a'.

Edited June 11, 2021 by CarrotCake

[HerNameIsBuffy]

2 hours ago, Jana814 said:

My aunt’s sister-in-law’s name is Cherry (like the food) & it’s pronounced the same way. No one gets it right. People think her name is sherry just with a Ch instead of a Sh. 

So funny, as a kid I knew a girl with the same name but it was pronounced like Sherry and she'd get so upset because everyone always got it wrong.

28 minutes ago, CarrotCake said:

In Dutch I would pronounce Erin like Eh-rin, which makes no sense because logically it would indeed be Ee-rin with a long E.

And then Aaron I would pronounce the English way while Aron I would pronounce the Dutch way (with a long A), but that is probably because I had two colleagues with those two names, one being American and the other Hungarian and this is how we pronounced them.

To explain our short and long vowels to English speakers:

We have 'e' and 'ee' where 'e' is pronounced like 'eh' and 'ee' is pronounced like you would say the letter A.

We also have 'a' and 'aa' where 'a' is pronounced like in bath and 'aa' is pronounced like the last a in banana.

But then there is the rule that when a short vowel is followed by only one consonant (or when you just mention the letter), they automatically become long. Which is what happens in Erin and Aron. Aaron with 2 a's would therefore make no sense since Aron is already pronounced like it has two A's. Which is why I assume Aaron is pronounced the English way. To make Erin with a 'eh' sound, in Dutch you would have to write Errin.

 

Also, this is why Dutchies fuck up spelling in English all the time. Our 'i' is pronounced like your 'e' and our 'e' is pronounced like your 'a'.

Thank you for this!  I've been on a genealogy binge lately and the surnames in my Dutch lines are my favorites and now I'll know better how to pronounce them in my head!  

[CarrotCake]

38 minutes ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Thank you for this!  I've been on a genealogy binge lately and the surnames in my Dutch lines are my favorites and now I'll know better how to pronounce them in my head!  

That sounds cool! If you have any questions, you can always ask.

First tip: 'van' is not pronounced like the car-type but more like vahn 

Edited June 11, 2021 by CarrotCake

[SassyPants]

My GD is 1/2 North American and 1/2 Latin American. She lives in Latin America. My daughter gave her a classic name, popular in the US and Europe. 
When my GD says her name when speaking to an English speaker she says it one way, and when she says her name to a Spanish speaker, she pronounces it completely different. It doesn’t even sound like the same name. It’s not like she adds an A to the ending. Think Ann (English) Enn (Spanish). Also in Spanish the name Ava is pronounced Eva. My daughter considered that name, but decided against it for that reason.

[CarrotCake]

11 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

My GD is 1/2 North American and 1/2 Latin American. She lives in Latin America. My daughter gave her a classic name, popular in the US and Europe. 
When my GD says her name when speaking to an English speaker she says it one way, and when she says her name to a Spanish speaker, she pronounces it completely different. It doesn’t even sound like the same name. It’s not like she adds an A to the ending. Think Ann (English) Enn (Spanish). Also in Spanish the name Ava is pronounced Eva. My daughter considered that name, but decided against it for that reason.

I do the same with some of my colleagues. If they have a name that exist in both English and Dutch but are both pronounced different (like Amanda, Steven, Sara) I pronounce the names also different in an English sentence than in a Dutch one. They do that themselves as well I think, when introducing to a Dutch vs non-Dutch person. 

[HerNameIsBuffy]

8 minutes ago, CarrotCake said:

I do the same with some of my colleagues. If they have a name that exist in both English and Dutch but are both pronounced different (like Amanda, Steven, Sara) I pronounce the names also different in an English sentence than in a Dutch one. They do that themselves as well I think, when introducing to a Dutch vs non-Dutch person. 

It's the same here.  I worked with someone whose name was Martin and Spanish is his native language.  When he introduced himself to other Spanish speaking people he's pronounce it Mar-teen and with English speaking people Mar-tin.  

[JustEnough]

7 hours ago, adidas said:

Linguistics nerd checking in.

Aaron has the phoneme ‘a’ (as in cat or apple - IPA /æ/)

Erin has the phoneme ‘e’ (as in bed or dress - IPA /e/).

I have known a bunch of Aarons and none of them would use that phoneme to describe their name. If I heard someone introduce themselves with the first syllable sounding like Apple I would assume it was another spelling/name altogether (which wouldn’t be odd, as I live in an area where there are a lot of cultures mixing, so I hear names all the time I am not familiar with at first), or else a noticeably different accent.

5 hours ago, Jana814 said:

My aunt’s sister-in-law’s name is Cherry (like the food) & it’s pronounced the same way. No one gets it right. People think her name is sherry just with a Ch instead of a Sh. 

I’m curious, how does she pronounce her name? Cherry and Sherry rhyme for me (though admittedly I’m going by how I was taught to say the food/drink, I don’t think I know more than one person named Sherry and I don’t know anyone named Cherry).

[JustEnough]

All three of my kids have names that different people pronounce differently.All three of them have an I in their names somewhere and we pronounce them all with a long I sound (like eye) for each. Most people pronounce them the same as us (at least where we live, one of my kids has a name that is pronounced very differently in Ireland, where it is a more common name than here). If they get pronounced differently by someone meeting them for the first time the sound change is consistent. With my oldest and youngest, what we say as eye gets changed to ee like key or flee. With my middle, what we say as eye gets changed to a short i like inn or kin.

We never meant to have a repeated sound in all three names but it’s interesting to me that it’s the (only) sound that gets changed by other pronunciations of their names. ?

[wastingcandles]

34 minutes ago, JustEnough said:

I have known a bunch of Aarons and none of them would use that phoneme to describe their name. If I heard someone introduce themselves with the first syllable sounding like Apple I would assume it was another spelling/name altogether (which wouldn’t be odd, as I live in an area where there are a lot of cultures mixing, so I hear names all the time I am not familiar with at first), or else a noticeably different accent.

I’m curious, how does she pronounce her name? Cherry and Sherry rhyme for me (though admittedly I’m going by how I was taught to say the food/drink, I don’t think I know more than one person named Sherry and I don’t know anyone named Cherry).

I believe Jana814 is saying it's pronounced with the "ch" sound, rather than a "sh" sound. Like actress Cherry Jones!

[Jana814]

2 hours ago, wastingcandles said:

I believe Jana814 is saying it's pronounced with the "ch" sound, rather than a "sh" sound. Like actress Cherry Jones!

Exactly like the actress Cherry Jones!  Thank you!  

[Bad Wolf]

Mary fairy. Merry cherry. Marry carry. Totally different sounds to me. The US way of saying double ts always sounds like d to me. I can't hear the difference between paddy and patty. Words ending in a in England tend to be pronounced uh. Donnuh rather than Donna. I remember my Spanish teacher trying to change that, because a lot of Spanish worlds end in a. Love the thread drift.

[Not that josh's mom]

I pronounce Donna as Donnuh. I'm in Iowa.

I simply do not hear or say hairy/Harry differently. Or Mary, merry, marry.  Or Erin/Aaron.  But there's a distinct difference between Cheryl and Sherry. I say pin and pen differently.

Its interesting to me how we hear and say words.  

[backyard sylph]

My son's name is Aaron. We say AIRun, pretty much. For Erin it would sound in my head like EHRin, but I'm not sure anyone could distinguish the first part out loud. 

[JDuggs]

23 hours ago, AussieKrissy said:

 

also I see on Facebook people mentioning That the caldwells senior have removed all baby posts. Bit worrying considering the Titus  xfile. 

That’s so strange. I can’t think of any reason to remove the baby posts. Does anyone have any good ideas?

[AussieKrissy]

2 hours ago, JDuggs said:

That’s so strange. I can’t think of any reason to remove the baby posts. Does anyone have any good ideas?

I was just coming here to check if people were wondering the same thing. I am surprised this topic did not pick up since I raised it earlier. 

[Kailash]

Oh English. Where “Give her her pen.” is correct but “Give him him pen.” is not. ? 

[Satan'sFortress]

17 hours ago, Bad Wolf said:

Words ending in a in England tend to be pronounced uh. Donnuh rather than Donna. 

What is the difference between those two pronunciations? I've never heard Donna pronounced as anything but Don-nuh, except in Spanish as Don-ya.

[Expectopatronus]

I say « T » in words like battery and cake batter which drives my friend’s husband crazy. He says « baddery » and « cake badder ». It’s funny how defensive some people can become about annunciation. I correct students for Zee rather than Zed but that’s more to hold on to our differences and push Canadian English versus adopting US English. We’re neighbours but not the same. 

[monkeyrocks71]

On 6/10/2021 at 6:36 AM, JanasTattooParlor said:

I live in South Carolina and these all rhyme for me as well. Also, to the poster who said that Don and Dawn aren’t pronounced the same, I’m really curious how both of those are pronounced for you. Because for me they are the exact same and I can’t seem to work out how they could be pronounced differently ?

Don rhymes with on

Dawn rhymes with lawn

 

[JustEnough]

3 hours ago, monkeyrocks71 said:

Don rhymes with on

Dawn rhymes with lawn

 

So interesting! Thanks for sharing that clip. For what it’s worth though I can hear the difference in the video, Don/on/Dawn/lawn all rhyme for me (and the other native English speakers around me that I can think of).

[shesinsane]

There are online quizzes that can determine where you're from based on pronunciation and terms used (including whether or not Mary, merry, and marry are pronounced the same). I spotted it in another thread but it's pretty relevant here too.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/upshot/dialect-quiz-map.html   Based on my responses, it picked the city closest to my hometown. 

This quiz is a bit broader and not behind a paywall:

https://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewziegler/dialect-quiz  It correctly guessed my home state. 

[Not that josh's mom]

1 hour ago, shesinsane said:

There are online quizzes that can determine where you're from based on pronunciation and terms used (including whether or not Mary, merry, and marry are pronounced the same). I spotted it in another thread but it's pretty relevant here too.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/upshot/dialect-quiz-map.html   Based on my responses, it picked the city closest to my hometown. 

This quiz is a bit broader and not behind a paywall:

https://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewziegler/dialect-quiz  It correctly guessed my home state. 

Their guess was Connecticut.  I've lived in Iowa nearly all my life. Still trying to figure that out.