Dillards 84: Craving Attention

[justmy2cents]

1 hour ago, clueliss said:

Was it that Jessa wanted a Jill, or in the case of the last birth, was it that literally the entire Duggar family was at Carlin’s wedding and she needed someone (and let’s not forget that in that case Jill caught the at home footage for them).

Jill’s been at Jessa’s every birth, by SKYPE for Spurgeon. As I pointed out they have friends in common and we have evidence of them hanging out together, which we don’t have for the other sisters. It seems that Hessa is the sister that Jill is closest to now.

[SassyPants]

3 hours ago, Snarkasarus Rex said:

I disagree. I think Boob cut them off because Derick defied him and they now are no longer financially dependent on show. It’s the loss of authority and control that pissed off Boob.  

Jeremy was never IBLP and JinJer do not live like an IBLP family. Yet they are still in Boob’s good graces. Why? Because Jeremy doesn’t openly challenge Boob’s authority and ‘plays ball’ for show money.

Jeremy knew how to get what he wanted while still placating Boob.  Derick did not, so he used the nuclear option to get his way. There’s no way Boob would stand for that because it threatens his house of cards. 

IMO it’s never been about religion. 

Jeremy also made it vastly easier by putting a big distance between his family and the TTH. The Vuolos like money and a showier lifestyle vs the Dillards. DD seems to have a more true religious conviction, no matter how vapid, vs Jeremy, IMO. Jeremy seems to be the type to morph into whatever the toad , AKA JB says,  in order to continue his income stream and lifestyle. Overall, and in the long run,  I think DD’s approach will be better for his entire family; pay me now or pay me later.

[wendy-sparkles]

I think that it's much less moving away from the Duggar lifestyle than the conflict between Derick and JB - Derick seems pretty confrontational on social media, I'm sure some pretty uncomfortable scenes went down irl. Now, I'm sure the lifestyle they are gravitating towards exacerbates this, but JB probably just doesn't want Derick trashing him to his younger kids, and unfortunately Jill is ~ under his headship umbrella~.

Oh no, this sounds like I'm defending JB, I promise I'm not! He's awful and Derick is right about a bunch of stuff, I just think it's likely they had some nasty in person confrontations and this is colouring the relationship more than anything else.

[neuroticcat]

Also much of what we think we know about family relationships is formed by tlc editing. They may have put Jinger and Jessa together for all the talking heads and played up their closeness, and as a result we think Jill wasn’t as close to them.

We really know so little. And film crews/article writers do manipulate interviews. Me. Neuroticat was recently interviewed for a short news piece. They took over an hour of footage and asked a lot of open ended questions. But they ran with a tiny clip of his answer to a very specific and direct question.

It wasn’t a big deal in this instance but it in no way accurately represented his thoughts or interview and instead showed what the producers wanted.

I imagine tlc is like that times a million

[justmy2cents]

@neuroticcat I’m sure that’s part of it, but also as people grow and change their relationships change. I believe that Jill and Jessa may not have been as close growing up as they are right now. 

[clueliss]

Jill posted a 5 gallon bucket gardening video on YouTube.  

[mpheels]

Jill and Jessa both had two boys in two years, at roughly the same time, and at a time when none of their other sisters had kids. It make sense that they would grow closer. They also have both likely drifted from their childhood besties - Jill from Jana due to the married/single distinctions and Jessa from Jinger due to geographic distance (assuming those close childhood bonds were real and not made for TV)

[LacyMay]

I just saw The Sun (I know I know unreliable garbage) and in an interview with Derick he said something about being full time missionaries and leaving the USA (again)

"“Our original plan from the time we married was to serve permanently on the international mission field.

"So, yes, we are definitely open to moving wherever God would lead us.”" 

I really really hope that this was Derick's trademark vaguespeak and not an actual plan. I thought law school maybe meant him putting in the work to provide a stable environment for his family and himself and the end of missionary gifting. Now my cynical self is worried that it was just a quick regroup before another half baked jaunt to Central America. 

[Snarkasarus Rex]

Derick Dillard: Missionary Lawyer!

He also said that they’d be open to reappearing on the show, as long as it was on their own terms. ?

Jill’s apparently gone through a lot of personal growth lately, but Derick not so much. 

[princessmahina]

If Jill continues mentally growing and Derick stays stagnant, I think that’ll spell trouble for their marriage. Skittles and the Kama Sutra can only do so much.

[Idlewild]

6 hours ago, Snarkasarus Rex said:

 

He also said that they’d be open to reappearing on the show, as long as it was on their own terms. ?

 

So it’s not about protecting his family from evil TLC, it’s about getting the money he thinks they deserve. This is why his ‘tell all’ will be nothing of the sort. 

[Snarkasarus Rex]

5 hours ago, Idlewild said:

So it’s not about protecting his family from evil TLC, it’s about getting the money he thinks they deserve. This is why his ‘tell all’ will be nothing of the sort. 

Right. Appearing on the show could undo the steps Jill’s made to extricate herself from her toxic family.  Also, does he really believe that Boob will welcome them back if he’s not in control? 

Dillwank hasn’t changed a bit. He’s only on board with Jill’s journey right now because it suits his own purposes.

[LacyMay]

You know what I think upsets me the most? 

I honestly don't think that the rift originated because of Jill's growth. I think her growth would have impacted the relationships and maybe strained them. I don't think that her parents would approve of all her choices BUT I don't think her changes alone caused the rift. 

I think it was primarily caused by Derick's contentious behavior. Which is fine IF that behavior was actually motivated by love for his family. 

But if he caused that rift and contributed to fracturing those relationships so that he would have the upper hand? That's just crappy. 

 

[SassyPants]

46 minutes ago, LacyMay said:

You know what I think upsets me the most? 

I honestly don't think that the rift originated because of Jill's growth. I think her growth would have impacted the relationships and maybe strained them. I don't think that her parents would approve of all her choices BUT I don't think her changes alone caused the rift. 

I think it was primarily caused by Derick's contentious behavior. Which is fine IF that behavior was actually motivated by love for his family. 

But if he caused that rift and contributed to fracturing those relationships so that he would have the upper hand? That's just crappy. 

 

The rift is because DD’s words could have potentially harmed JB’s pocketbook, and without his wallet full of greenbacks, JB has no means of control. I’ve said this all along, above all else (Gothard, Jesus, sex) JB worships at the altar of money and control. Those items are JB’s drug of choice- DD was a threat to JB’s drug.

DD became entrenched with the Duggars at a very vulnerable time in his life and he clearly was enamored and probably wholeheartedly fell for JB’s schtick...I think realizing that while he and Jill worked, JB collected the proceeds was a rude awakening. Really, at of all these folks, I think DD might be the most religious literalist in the group. I think JB’s underhanded ways nearly broke this man. Between the molestation, quitting WM because Gothard/ JB’s men do not work for others, no debt, his Wife’s lack of education, life experiences and overwhelming dependence on him, and JB getting and controlling all the money,  I’m sure he felt quite duped, who wouldn’t?

Edited June 16, 2020 by SassyPants

[DarkAnts]

I am going to guess that law school is not going well for Derik. 

[HerNameIsBuffy]

6 minutes ago, DarkAnts said:

I am going to guess that law school is not going well for Derik. 

I was wondering if becoming a lawyer would give him a scarce enough skill to use in missionary work.  If he wanted to work with a missions agency I'd think his background in accounting and soon law would come in handy.  

But I could be way off.  Skills in demand for missions aren't really my area of expertise.

[Giraffe]

6 minutes ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

But I could be way off.  Skills in demand for missions aren't really my area of expertise.

Imo a part of why missionaries can be so damaging is they don’t go with usable skills. They go in assuming all they need to do is show up, tell everyone they need Jesus, and expect everything else will fall into place. Eta: not that I’m in support of people who go with usable skills and take away from locals, but there’s a big difference between showing up with legitimate medical licenses vs pretending they’re helping and doing good. 

Edited June 16, 2020 by Giraffe
Clarifying

[SassyPants]

I’m sure the nuts and bolts of law school come pretty readily to DD. I think what is harder is integrating law school and the work load with a very dependent family, and then trying to find a way to financially support the entire enterprise at the same time. I think JB payed them off in exchange for future silence. My hope is that the D’s can fade away into obscurity and have happy, fulfilling lives. DD might be a vocal, conservative Christian, but I don’t think he is on his way to becoming JB II. I think the distancing from the TTH, and JB’s influence in particular, was the best thing that could have happened. Beyond all else, JB’s tactics-actions-beliefs are unhealthy and unrealistic; sets everyone but JB up for failure. I think much of Jill’s recent angst has come from the realization that how she was raised was unsuccessful and doomed her from the start!

[Idlewild]

Wasn’t his last course meant to prepare him for missions? Unless he actually is thinking of becoming part of the administration process he’d be better off learning Spanish properly and some speaking skills.

How long is a law degree in the US? In England it’s 3 years plus a further year to do bar/ solicitor exams. So he’s got at least 2 more years before qualifying. 
It could just be that while Derick likes studying and part time work, he’s just not that into a responsible full time job.

[SassyPants]

5 minutes ago, Giraffe said:

Imo a part of why missionaries can be so damaging is they don’t go with usable skills. They go in assuming all they need to do is show up, tell everyone they need Jesus, and everything else will fall into place. Eta: not that I’m in support of people who go with usable skills and take away from locals, but there’s a big difference between showing up with legitimate medical licenses vs pretending they’re helping and doing good. 

I’m old, retired, lots of experiences and solid work history under my belt, so likely have a skewed perspective, but I don't understand how a person with even average intelligence could think that there’s any job at all, even the most basic of entry level job or volunteer position, that wouldn’t require some level of knowledge and more importantly, require the participant to provide some output. Is missionary serve not considered work? If there are not goals to be accomplished (even if it’s only converting people), what’s the purpose and why would they need missionaries/people/volunteers/workers?

This is one of the most perplexing issues to me with regards to these fundie groups. It seems like they are very much structured like a Ponzi scheme; the people at the top getting all the funds and control, while the base plebs keep looking for new rats so they can move up the pyramid. 

6 minutes ago, Idlewild said:

@Idlewild US law programs are generally 3 years. Each state determines when you can take the bar. In CA, you can take the bar without ever having attended law school. I have heard that the CA is very rigorous and near impossible to pass without going to law school. I’m not sure about the rules and regs for Arkansas.

[Idlewild]

@SassyPants thanks for the information- you can take the bar exam in England without a law degree ( as I did) but you need to have a degree  and do a 1 year conversion course.

if he isn’t serious about pursuing a legal career it seems a frivolous waste of time and money for a father of 2 young children. 
I’m sure Derick has a cunning plan. He thinks he’s smarter than everyone. 

Edited June 16, 2020 by Idlewild

[LacyMay]

52 minutes ago, Giraffe said:

Imo a part of why missionaries can be so damaging is they don’t go with usable skills. They go in assuming all they need to do is show up, tell everyone they need Jesus, and expect everything else will fall into place.

I've seen "missionaries" who have done good but the one I'm referring to in particular lived in the area she served in for *decades* worked alongside local professionals and invested in the community through helping build training opportunities etc (she was a Dr) she also built a strong partnership with her home church to garner support for projects that's where local short term mission trips came in they helped to provide manual labor when needed (not specialized manual labor but stuff even I could learn to do in an hour or so) they worked alongside the community on these projects. 

Unfortunately this isn't the norm. Instead "mission tourism" seems to be more common and that's not helpful it's exploitative. 

 

I'm just not sure what skills his law degree would offer him as a missionary especially when his language skills seem to be severely lacking. He won't be able to practice law unless he jumps through hoops to be accredited and his knowledge of local culture/customs etc will be a huge barrier. 

If he wanted to *work* at the American headquarters for an organization that would be a little more understandable but that doesn't fit with his "called to be a foreign missionary" shtick. 

International relations, international development, engineering, medicine, nursing any of these would have made sense for an end goal of working long term overseas. But Law? That just seems to scream "I want power and prestige" which is not a good look for a missionary. 

 

ETA there are lawyers who clearly aren't in it for power and prestige and who genuinely use their skills and education to help people. But I don't see Derick working at a legal aid clinic or fighting for the oppressed. Unless you count oppressed white evangelical Christians.

 

Edited June 16, 2020 by LacyMay

[Born Skeptic]

3 hours ago, Idlewild said:

How long is a law degree in the US? In England it’s 3 years plus a further year to do bar/ solicitor exams. So he’s got at least 2 more years before qualifying. 
It could just be that while Derick likes studying and part time work, he’s just not that into a responsible full time job.

In the US law school is a three year graduate program that (generally) requires completion of a 4 year Bachelor's degree as a pre-requisite.  Many people also take additional prep courses after graduation to prepare for the bar exam.  While it is possible in California, Washington, Vermont, and Virginia to take the bar exam without attending law school, the reality is that it is very difficult to pass the bar this way.

Edited June 16, 2020 by Born Skeptic

[Idlewild]

Is Derick now in partnership with a barbecue brand? Some sort of giveaway on his instastory. 

[SassyPants]

3 hours ago, Idlewild said:

@SassyPants thanks for the information- you can take the bar exam in England without a law degree ( as I did) but you need to have a degree  and do a 1 year conversion course.

if he isn’t serious about pursuing a legal career it seems a frivolous waste of time and money for a father of 2 young children. 
I’m sure Derick has a cunning plan. He thinks he’s smarter than everyone. 

I will say this, intelligence wise, he likely is one of the smartest, if not the smartest person associated with the TTH, but there are others who are far more cunning/shady/underhanded-