Maxwell 36: Wearing What Some Might Call an Outer Garment While Dealing with Cancer in the Family

[PennySycamore]

This attitude that nothing could possibly happen in church or afterward reminds me of something that happened at the NICU waiting room one Sunday 33 years ago.  We were supposed to thoroughly wash our hands and then gown up before we entered the NICU.  This one man said "Oh, we don''t need to do that! We just came from church".   I'm not necessarily the bravest or outspoken, but I said rather loudly "Oh, yes, you do!  We all washed, gowned and then went into the NICU to visit our babies.  

And @Palimpsest, the sentence about Sarah could actually be read two ways.   Of course, to read it other than what you meant it helps to be reading Legendary Children: the first ten years of Ru Paul's Drag Race and the last century of queer life by Tom Fitzgerald and Lorenzo Marquez  (TLo).

[Palimpsest]

3 hours ago, Alisamer said:

I think that's scheduled for Sunday afternoon. That's when they have the bean burrito lunch, right?

Maxwell jokes pretty much write themselves!  I expect the church on being informed of the new Maxwell plan to attend morning services said "Praise the Lord we are not going to be exposed to evening Maxwell gaseous emissions!"  And the Pastor said, "Not so much.  They'll be here twice a day. And the evening farts probably aren't as bad as Steve's morning verbal farts!"

 

3 hours ago, PennySycamore said:

And @Palimpsest, the sentence about Sarah could actually be read two ways.   Of course, to read it other than what you meant it helps to be reading Legendary Children: the first ten years of Ru Paul's Drag Race and the last century of queer life by Tom Fitzgerald and Lorenzo Marquez  (TLo).

Wait, what did I say?

 

[kpmom]

Did anyone else read Sheri's comment to the COVID-19 post to be a bit of a hand slap to Steve's, "We're not worried about no stinkin' coronavirus"?

She pointed out those who are caring for people with compromised immune systems do have to worry.

She also posted a friend's email from Italy on what life is like for them there, and how it's not just a hyped up flu.

Good for Sheri for standing up to Steve.

Edited March 13, 2020 by kpmom

[Palimpsest]

Sheri's post kicked ass.  So much so that I'm surprised Stevie let it stand.

Here it is, just in case the Maxwells delete it.

Spoiler

We do not fear the virus as we put our faith in the Lord. But we do see it as an opportunity to do exactly what God asks: Philippians 2:4 Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others.
We care for elderly parents who have compromised immune systems, so we are considering them rather than ourselves.

But bigger than that is something else. The best way to explain it is via a friends message here – she sent this as she is living in Italy right now during their outbreak. I think it sheds light on an issue that isn’t really shared. Here it is:

—–
Because we’re living in Italy during the COVID-19 epidemic, people have asked me questions about it. They’ve asked about whether the media is hyping it up too much or whether there’s real cause for concern. They’ve asked what it’s like living in lockdown mode. I’ve also seen a lot of people compare it to the flu and say there’s no need to panic. I’m not telling people to panic, but I am telling people to prepare for disruptions to their daily lives and try to get away from the flu vs. COVID-19 comparison. At this point (Wednesday, March 11, a little before midday in Italy), the U.S. has just over 1,000 confirmed cases of COVID-19. Two weeks ago, Italy had about 630 confirmed cases. As of Monday night’s data, there were over 10,000 confirmed cases and 653 deaths. So there have now been more deaths than there were total cases two weeks ago. This virus moves rapidly once it takes hold.
While the death rate and demographic effects of the virus may be reassuring to some people, the hospitalization rate is what should cause major concern. It’s a supply and demand problem. People want to compare this to the flu, but healthcare infrastructure around the world knows how to plan for the flu – there are fairly predictable patterns every year. The problem here in Italy (and previously in China) is a rapid spike in cases that overwhelms hospital infrastructure and healthcare workers. They’re essentially having to convert all the routine wings of hospitals into intake and treatment for COVID-19 patients. There aren’t enough ventilators to go around, so doctors and nurses are having to decide who not to treat. People over 65 and those younger than 65 with co-morbities often cannot receive adequate treatment. Italy is calling in retired doctors to help. Despite protocols for protection, some healthcare professionals are contracting the virus and having to go into quarantine, which exacerbates the supply/demand problem. Northern Italy is the wealthiest part of Italy, and the Lombardy region, where the majority of cases are, is the richest part of that wealthy region, so the hospitals there are the best in Italy. What really worries Italians is what will happen when the virus takes hold in the poorer regions of the south where hospital infrastructure isn’t as good as in the north.
The U.S. has those same discrepancies between hospital infrastructure and healthcare worker availability across different regions and urban/rural divides. Think about what the impact of this virus on the healthcare system could mean to you. If you or someone you love has a heart attack, a stroke, gets into a major car accident, or your kid has a serious injury, will a hospital overwhelmed with COVID-19 be able to handle its “normal” level of trauma while coping with the virus? Also, routine and preventative care is mostly suspended during this time. This is not just a straight comparison of flu vs. COVID-19. They are different viruses with different impacts on communities.
As for how life is during lockdown, it’s really not all that bad. We’ve been dealing with the flu in our house, so for a portion of the time at least, we wanted to be snuggled up at home anyway. We’re doing virtual school, and thankfully, our internet has held up well so far. (Italy has pretty bad internet connectivity, so some of my friends haven’t been so lucky.) We have enough food to get through a couple weeks if we need to, but we have permission to leave the house to go to the grocery store (1 person per family at a time), work, or medical appointments. We can also go on walks outside as long as we stay in our own comune (town/village). It’s really not as bad as we expected it to be. We go a little stir crazy sometimes, but we’ve caught up on shows, movies, played board games and found toys we had forgotten about. At least it’s almost springtime, and there is some sunshine and flowers blooming. As the crisis here worsens, we’re actually glad to do whatever we can to lessen our family’s risk of contracting or spreading it to others. So do your best to prepare your household to be hunkered down if it comes to that. I’ve shared some lessons learned before, but here are a few more tips. Make sure you have a working thermometer. We found out ours was broken when we had the flu, and they’re sold out everywhere. Make sure you have a printer with plenty of paper and ink in case you end up having to virtual school/homeschool. There’s a lot more printing involved that I expected. Pick up some Play-Doh, sidewalk chalk, board games, card games, Legos, and other random fun things you can hide and then bring out one at a time when things get desperate at your house. My kids haven’t done Play-Doh in a long time and have spent several hours over the last few days playing with it. Make sure you have enough OTC meds at your house to last you a couple weeks. (Think about alternating Tylenol and Motrin for kids for a few days when they’re sick). You will likely be instructed not to bring a feverish child to the doctor (and you probably won’t want to) unless they are experiencing other serious problems. So be prepared to treat regular illnesses at home. And PLEASE don’t hoard things. Just get enough for your household to last two weeks. You will have access to stores, and they will continue to stock them.
Finally, keep Italy in your prayers. Pray for the U.S., too, that there will be adequate preparation and response. Pray for all the world, because viruses don’t respect borders. Pray for the families losing loved ones. Pray for the families losing income and financial security due to the containment measures. Prepare, pray, and be grateful to wake up every day.

Um, Steve and Teri, what are you doing about the interests of others?  You did not mention praying for them.

[freejugar]

won't anyone think of GIGI?!

Some christians these guys are, no prayers for the sick and the medical personnel? just concern for how it affects your own schedule? pull your head out of your ass for a change

[FloraKitty35]

Steve & Teri:  "We’re so grateful that because of placing our faith in Jesus and accepting Him, as Christians, we have nothing to fear from the coronavirus. In fact, it is an incredible opportunity to share with others the hope we have in Jesus!"

No it is not!  ?

 

 

[Granwych]

1 hour ago, Palimpsest said:

Sheri's post kicked ass.  So much so that I'm surprised Stevie let it stand.

Here it is, just in case the Maxwells delete it.

  Hide contents

We do not fear the virus as we put our faith in the Lord. But we do see it as an opportunity to do exactly what God asks: Philippians 2:4 Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others.
We care for elderly parents who have compromised immune systems, so we are considering them rather than ourselves.

But bigger than that is something else. The best way to explain it is via a friends message here – she sent this as she is living in Italy right now during their outbreak. I think it sheds light on an issue that isn’t really shared. Here it is:

—–
Because we’re living in Italy during the COVID-19 epidemic, people have asked me questions about it. They’ve asked about whether the media is hyping it up too much or whether there’s real cause for concern. They’ve asked what it’s like living in lockdown mode. I’ve also seen a lot of people compare it to the flu and say there’s no need to panic. I’m not telling people to panic, but I am telling people to prepare for disruptions to their daily lives and try to get away from the flu vs. COVID-19 comparison. At this point (Wednesday, March 11, a little before midday in Italy), the U.S. has just over 1,000 confirmed cases of COVID-19. Two weeks ago, Italy had about 630 confirmed cases. As of Monday night’s data, there were over 10,000 confirmed cases and 653 deaths. So there have now been more deaths than there were total cases two weeks ago. This virus moves rapidly once it takes hold.
While the death rate and demographic effects of the virus may be reassuring to some people, the hospitalization rate is what should cause major concern. It’s a supply and demand problem. People want to compare this to the flu, but healthcare infrastructure around the world knows how to plan for the flu – there are fairly predictable patterns every year. The problem here in Italy (and previously in China) is a rapid spike in cases that overwhelms hospital infrastructure and healthcare workers. They’re essentially having to convert all the routine wings of hospitals into intake and treatment for COVID-19 patients. There aren’t enough ventilators to go around, so doctors and nurses are having to decide who not to treat. People over 65 and those younger than 65 with co-morbities often cannot receive adequate treatment. Italy is calling in retired doctors to help. Despite protocols for protection, some healthcare professionals are contracting the virus and having to go into quarantine, which exacerbates the supply/demand problem. Northern Italy is the wealthiest part of Italy, and the Lombardy region, where the majority of cases are, is the richest part of that wealthy region, so the hospitals there are the best in Italy. What really worries Italians is what will happen when the virus takes hold in the poorer regions of the south where hospital infrastructure isn’t as good as in the north.
The U.S. has those same discrepancies between hospital infrastructure and healthcare worker availability across different regions and urban/rural divides. Think about what the impact of this virus on the healthcare system could mean to you. If you or someone you love has a heart attack, a stroke, gets into a major car accident, or your kid has a serious injury, will a hospital overwhelmed with COVID-19 be able to handle its “normal” level of trauma while coping with the virus? Also, routine and preventative care is mostly suspended during this time. This is not just a straight comparison of flu vs. COVID-19. They are different viruses with different impacts on communities.
As for how life is during lockdown, it’s really not all that bad. We’ve been dealing with the flu in our house, so for a portion of the time at least, we wanted to be snuggled up at home anyway. We’re doing virtual school, and thankfully, our internet has held up well so far. (Italy has pretty bad internet connectivity, so some of my friends haven’t been so lucky.) We have enough food to get through a couple weeks if we need to, but we have permission to leave the house to go to the grocery store (1 person per family at a time), work, or medical appointments. We can also go on walks outside as long as we stay in our own comune (town/village). It’s really not as bad as we expected it to be. We go a little stir crazy sometimes, but we’ve caught up on shows, movies, played board games and found toys we had forgotten about. At least it’s almost springtime, and there is some sunshine and flowers blooming. As the crisis here worsens, we’re actually glad to do whatever we can to lessen our family’s risk of contracting or spreading it to others. So do your best to prepare your household to be hunkered down if it comes to that. I’ve shared some lessons learned before, but here are a few more tips. Make sure you have a working thermometer. We found out ours was broken when we had the flu, and they’re sold out everywhere. Make sure you have a printer with plenty of paper and ink in case you end up having to virtual school/homeschool. There’s a lot more printing involved that I expected. Pick up some Play-Doh, sidewalk chalk, board games, card games, Legos, and other random fun things you can hide and then bring out one at a time when things get desperate at your house. My kids haven’t done Play-Doh in a long time and have spent several hours over the last few days playing with it. Make sure you have enough OTC meds at your house to last you a couple weeks. (Think about alternating Tylenol and Motrin for kids for a few days when they’re sick). You will likely be instructed not to bring a feverish child to the doctor (and you probably won’t want to) unless they are experiencing other serious problems. So be prepared to treat regular illnesses at home. And PLEASE don’t hoard things. Just get enough for your household to last two weeks. You will have access to stores, and they will continue to stock them.
Finally, keep Italy in your prayers. Pray for the U.S., too, that there will be adequate preparation and response. Pray for all the world, because viruses don’t respect borders. Pray for the families losing loved ones. Pray for the families losing income and financial security due to the containment measures. Prepare, pray, and be grateful to wake up every day.

Um, Steve and Teri, what are you doing about the interests of others?  You did not mention praying for them.

Steve and Teri don't give a proverbial shit about anyone outside their borg..

[PennySycamore]

@Palimpsest, the sentence about Sarah Maxwell could be read, to me at least, as Sarah finding a GYM as Sarah Mally did OR Sarah finding a GYWoman like Sarah Mally.  Does that make any sense?  

[mango_fandango]

What sentence about Sarah Maxwell? Is it on here or on the blog?

Edited March 14, 2020 by mango_fandango

[Lady Grass Lake]

Back when the SARS virus was a big thing, we were at my in-law's very small rural Missouri Synod Lutheran Church when they had communion.  They were using a common cup for the wine, so I refused to take communion.  After one person takes a sip, the pastor would wipe the rim with a cloth, rotate the cup about an inch to give the next person a sip, wipe and repeat.   I said I was afraid of germs and was all for individual cups which she thought was an outrage as that isn't REAL communion.  She told me there were NO GERMS because germs can't  stick to silver and besides it was church so it was germ free.  Unbelievable.

 

[mango_fandango]

Church is germ-free? Lolwut?? 
People are batshit crazy at times. It really comes out at times like this.

[MamaJunebug]

37 minutes ago, Lady Grass Lake said:

Back when the SARS virus was a big thing, we were at my in-law's very small rural Missouri Synod Lutheran Church when they had communion.  They were using a common cup for the wine, so I refused to take communion.  After one person takes a sip, the pastor would wipe the rim with a cloth, rotate the cup about an inch to give the next person a sip, wipe and repeat.   I said I was afraid of germs and was all for individual cups which she thought was an outrage as that isn't REAL communion.  She told me there were NO GERMS because germs can't  stick to silver and besides it was church so it was germ free.  Unbelievable.

 

LCMS-raised here. I remember back in the 1950’s being told about germs & precious metals. Even as a really slow and agreeable kid, I thought: Ah, no. That must’ve been a very small and hidebound congregation, not to have had the individual cup option by the time of SARS.

And the “she” who fussed at you — was she your mother-in-Law? That’s really too bad, whoever she was.

The ex- and I attended church where somebody decided it was the ushers’ duty to see to it that EVERY adult member take the Sacrament. I remember one day the usher practically pulled an adult male, pretty obviously a guy with some intellectual delays, out of the pew and sent him up the aisle to where the man’s parents were at the Communion rail.

The parents told the young man to go sit back down and he kind of slunk in embarrassment back to his seat. For whatever reason, he was not supposed to commune! Simple as that! He had tried to tell the usher that, but the usher wouldn’t have it.  

One time I was there alone and chose not to go up when it came my pew’s turn,  and I thought the usher (a different guy) was going to swoon from frustration!  I did go up when I was ready — IIRC, we were in the middle of a hymn that I wanted to finish, thankyouverymuch, and as a grown woman, I knew I’d approach the altar when I was darn good & ready! LOL now.  Then, not so much  

I don’t know where or when this attitude started, nor how wide it’s spread, but it is NOT the religion I grew up with and which gave me comfort for many years. 

I guess I should ask around!  

And back to your experience, @Lady Grass Lake I’m sorry you had to put up with her interfering in your own expression of faith.  We know better, right? ?

Edited March 14, 2020 by MamaJunebug

[PennySycamore]

1 hour ago, mango_fandango said:

What sentence about Sarah Maxwell? Is it on here or on the blog?

It's on page 9 and it's something @Palimpsest wrote after the Maxxes had posted saying they had some big news to share, the big news being that the nursing home church is shut down for a while so the Maxwells will be going to an actual church for the time being. 

ETA: What I wrote before was silly and is best ignored.

Edited March 14, 2020 by PennySycamore

[Ozlsn]

1 hour ago, mango_fandango said:

Church is germ-free? Lolwut?? 
People are batshit crazy at times. It really comes out at times like this.

The Greek Orthodox church just came out to say that communion is germ free. Public Health experts world wide just sighed...

[terranova]

You know it's a big deal when the Maxwells are aware of outside news.

[Syriana]

3 hours ago, Ozlsn said:

The Greek Orthodox church just came out to say that communion is germ free. Public Health experts world wide just sighed...

Communion is germ free?  That must be why the chalice has been stopped in the the church I attend, along with holy water stoops being empty and the sign of peace being stopped.  I'm a little surprised that Mass itself isn't being re-considered given the number of people who attend the same service I go to.

 

[uber frau]

I remember when I was a kid in the late 90s.   The fundie church my family attended insisted on using a common cup for communion because it was considered a "good tradition"(in other words,we have no real reason scriptural or otherwise but it's always been like that and we're not going to change it for anything, dammit ). 

Except the one guy with HIV. He had to use his own special cup. By that time, they knew that HIV wasn't transmitted by sharing a cup but the "good tradition" didn't apply to him. I remember thinking it was all a crock,  even then.

[anachronistic]

All Catholic Mass in Massachusetts is suspended, all church services, anything over 250 people is officially banned and nobody is going to anything smaller anyway. The schools, museums, sports, parades and libraries are closed or will be closed by Monday, which really freaks me out because wtf am I supposed to do without books?  You’re also not supposed to share food or items beyond your immediate family, so all the baking I was going to do for first responders and health care providers won’t happen. You’re also supposed to do social distancing, which is staying 6 feet away from everyone but immediate family at all times. Kids aren’t supposed to go on playgrounds either, the playground equipment can spread the virus.

The Maxwells might pretend that this won’t affect them a lot but it will soon. They go to parades, playgrounds, etc, they aren’t country backwoods isolationists. It will affect everyone. If the country is still around in 100 years this will be looked back on like the 1918 flu epidemic. People are already dying, it will accelerate soon. I’m absolutely terrified and am packing to go to my moms so if either of us gets sick we can care for each other.

[kpmom]

1 hour ago, anachronistic said:

.

The Maxwells might pretend that this won’t affect them a lot but it will soon. They go to parades, playgrounds, etc, they aren’t country backwoods isolationists.

ITA.  When are they due to go to Austria?  Will it affect that trip?

[mango_fandango]

The website says they’re going to Austria at the end of August. 

[Black Aliss]

17 hours ago, freejugar said:

won't anyone think of GIGI?!

 

Oh, but they are! They are just waiting for Gigi to go meet her maker so they can move some part of the extended family closer to the fathership.

2 hours ago, anachronistic said:

All Catholic Mass in Massachusetts is suspended, all church services, anything over 250 people is officially banned and nobody is going to anything smaller anyway. The schools, museums, sports, parades and libraries are closed or will be closed by Monday, which really freaks me out because wtf am I supposed to do without books?

All of our libraries are closed as well but we can still check out ebooks and stream movies. Fortunately they cannot close the mountains, so I'm going for a long hike to check on the status of this spring's wildflowers. 

Edited March 14, 2020 by Black Aliss

[Lady Grass Lake]

9 hours ago, Syriana said:

Communion is germ free?  That must be why the chalice has been stopped in the the church I attend, along with holy water stoops being empty and the sign of peace being stopped.  I'm a little surprised that Mass itself isn't being re-considered given the number of people who attend the same service I go to.

 

 

9 hours ago, Syriana said:

Communion is germ free?  That must be why the chalice has been stopped in the the church I attend, along with holy water stoops being empty and the sign of peace being stopped.  I'm a little surprised that Mass itself isn't being re-considered given the number of people who attend the same service I go to.

 

This was years ago, my in-laws are in their late 80's, lived in the same small town all their lives, don't read books or magazines, refuse to touch a computer and only have a flip phone cell phone, and are not open to learning for themselves, but will often ask to have someone look up things which is a small step in the right direction.   Her solution to my oldest son's ADHD was I just didn't spank him enought, and still believes the lies spouted in attack adds during the election campaigns, and live in fear that Social Security and Medicare are going to disappear completely.  I've developed a thick skin over the 45 years I've been related to them, and can generally ignore the slams and just plain crazy talk.  There are some people who will never change and you will drive yourself crazy if you try.  

[fundiefan]

We have closed every school in the state until April 5th. Some districts closed of their own accord with an end date of April 13 - a full month.

No public gatherings of more than 50 people, I think? I could be wrong; to be honest, I don't remember reading anything exact on that but 50 is jiggling in my head for something. 

The DNC convention is here in 4 months and there is much talk of what may or may not be when the time comes. I am a volunteer for the convention and all volunteer meetings & training have been canceled. Concerts, sports show, theater, beer/wine tastings/events, and so much more are canceled with no resume date. Just like most other parts of the country. 

Mega churches have shuttered their doors. Run away hiding. Smaller churches  are pulling together to help each other and their community. One church the the town my sister lives in had a tables & shelves outside  with supplies & food donated by their parishioners for those who couldn't find it elsewhere. Hand sanitizer, Clorox wipes, canned / non perishable foods, water bottles & purification tablets (no actual single use bottles of water) - and even toilet paper. But, no one could take more than their family needs. No hoarding. There are people at the church hanging out and chatting with people and interacting as a way of making sure no one drives up and stuffs the back of their car with everything intended for many. And, it's intended for use by the community, not just members of their church. 

THIS is what actual churches do, Maxwells. (To be fair to them, there are far more doing what they do - cower & pray - than helping). They don't just move onto another large gathering. They band together to contribute to the community. To help others. To give & share what they have. They don't worry about where they'll hear their bible preached, they worry about how their neighbors will eat & sanitize their homes & selves. 

The entire situation is insane, but it is multiplied exponentially by people who care only of themselves and hoard more than they'll ever need, try to spin a profit on needed items (there's been a big shake up with Amazon, Walmart & Ebay and hoarders who were selling hand sanitizer for $75 and other insane crap). 

And then there are the Maxwells, who turn it into a photo op and adding to their dog & pony show. They are helping no one by just going to a church they don't normally participate in, not even themselves. If they were truly "church leaders" they'd be stepping up and making sure to donate & add to the nursing home they invade weekly and staying home otherwise. 

They make me a little ill with their selfishness for jesus. 

[Can'tBelieveMyEyes]

On 3/13/2020 at 12:33 AM, JemimaPuddle-Duck said:

 

And I’m really just talking about some of the comments that don’t really align with our Maxwell knowledge and have reached their own level of woo. It started to seem a bit like “they better not be making her skip conventional medicine even though they use it, but she better decide to do what I think is best even though I’m not her or one of her doctors!” It was feeling..... yucky to me, for lack of a better word. 

Do you know the Maxwells personally?  Because plenty of people in this forum besides you have read their blog, their newsletters and their books.   Feel free to draw your own conclusions - but other people can draw different conclusions based on the same materials.  Just because you disagree doesn't mean the conclusions are invalid.

The Maxwells have a history of denialism and straight-up lying about health situations on their blog. 
- Steven's coverage of his heart issues spends a ton of time on his 'diet" choices  - while minimizing the fact that 1) his family has a history of heart disease at a early age, 2) he had untreated high blood pressure and 3) he had a poor triglyceride ratio.  All of this is in his writings - but apparently not a big deal to Steve compared to diet.
  
- Teri's got a classic history of postpartum depression according to her homeschooling books and Managers of their (pick a location).  She literally describes it as severe depression for the year after she gives birth.   It was so bad that Steve and Terri both admit that everyone - including pastors - felt that Terri should stop having babies.  Hence the vasectomy.  Steven always talks about how he came to the conclusion that he should have the vasectomy reversed.  He also shares a whole lot of stories in "Dad's Corner" where he discusses wearing Terri's objections to homeschooling, removing the boys from sports, by bringing it up all the time until she gives in.    How did that work out for Terri?  Oh, just another 12 years of PPD - but you have to track it carefully with dates because the Maxwells never admit it straight out while parading the reversals around.

- Let's talk about Nathan after Abigail was born.   Being in the NICU where your child died sucks.   I know plenty of parents who lost one - or two - babies in the NICU where they had a current baby.  Do parents want to bring their baby home?  Hell, yes!  Do most parents rail about how the neonatologists are being too conservative about A's and B's?   No, because most parents know that a baby who stops breathing and whose heart rate drops needs to have oxygen and a crash cart nearby in case they don't rally.   Does that mean that Nathan was a bad person or a bad parent?  No, he's human - but he also blocks out scary information when it frightens him.  Who does that sound like?

- Choosing home birth is picking a subpar form of OB/GYN care.   I'm sure most home birth midwives are lovely people - but great bedside manner does not improve breast exam skills like doing 30+ a week like a OB/GYN does or even 10-15+ like a general practitioner does.  Has her midwife felt enough lumps to identify firm vs soft, mobile vs. fixed, and a clear edge vs a indeterminate edge?   It doesn't give access to a pap smear and STD check that most women get during pregnancy.  It also doesn't give experience in doing physical exams to note lymphomas or other cancers that can get started during a pregnancy.     Similarly "natural chemo" is a seriously subpar version of oncology.    There are plenty of alternative healing processes that are net neutral at worst and can be beneficial - like yoga, tai chi, mindfulness, reiki, acupuncture, the list is long... - but using non-standard pharmacology at home to treat cancer runs the risk of serious side effects.

The Maxwells are really into technology, right?   And they are really into their not-a-home-church at a nursing home - which I honestly think is sweet for the residents even if it's a way of keeping their kids and grandkids away from peers.

So....televised services?   Using the interwebs to have the services at the nursing home?   Am I just crazy here?

[SPHASH]

18 minutes ago, Can'tBelieveMyEyes said:

Do you know the Maxwells personally?  Because plenty of people in this forum besides you have read their blog, their newsletters and their books.   Feel free to draw your own conclusions - but other people can draw different conclusions based on the same materials.  Just because you disagree doesn't mean the conclusions are invalid.

The Maxwells have a history of denialism and straight-up lying about health situations on their blog. 
- Steven's coverage of his heart issues spends a ton of time on his 'diet" choices  - while minimizing the fact that 1) his family has a history of heart disease at a early age, 2) he had untreated high blood pressure and 3) he had a poor triglyceride ratio.  All of this is in his writings - but apparently not a big deal to Steve compared to diet.
  
- Teri's got a classic history of postpartum depression according to her homeschooling books and Managers of their (pick a location).  She literally describes it as severe depression for the year after she gives birth.   It was so bad that Steve and Terri both admit that everyone - including pastors - felt that Terri should stop having babies.  Hence the vasectomy.  Steven always talks about how he came to the conclusion that he should have the vasectomy reversed.  He also shares a whole lot of stories in "Dad's Corner" where he discusses wearing Terri's objections to homeschooling, removing the boys from sports, by bringing it up all the time until she gives in.    How did that work out for Terri?  Oh, just another 12 years of PPD - but you have to track it carefully with dates because the Maxwells never admit it straight out while parading the reversals around.

- Let's talk about Nathan after Abigail was born.   Being in the NICU where your child died sucks.   I know plenty of parents who lost one - or two - babies in the NICU where they had a current baby.  Do parents want to bring their baby home?  Hell, yes!  Do most parents rail about how the neonatologists are being too conservative about A's and B's?   No, because most parents know that a baby who stops breathing and whose heart rate drops needs to have oxygen and a crash cart nearby in case they don't rally.   Does that mean that Nathan was a bad person or a bad parent?  No, he's human - but he also blocks out scary information when it frightens him.  Who does that sound like?

- Choosing home birth is picking a subpar form of OB/GYN care.   I'm sure most home birth midwives are lovely people - but great bedside manner does not improve breast exam skills like doing 30+ a week like a OB/GYN does or even 10-15+ like a general practitioner does.  Has her midwife felt enough lumps to identify firm vs soft, mobile vs. fixed, and a clear edge vs a indeterminate edge?   It doesn't give access to a pap smear and STD check that most women get during pregnancy.  It also doesn't give experience in doing physical exams to note lymphomas or other cancers that can get started during a pregnancy.     Similarly "natural chemo" is a seriously subpar version of oncology.    There are plenty of alternative healing processes that are net neutral at worst and can be beneficial - like yoga, tai chi, mindfulness, reiki, acupuncture, the list is long... - but using non-standard pharmacology at home to treat cancer runs the risk of serious side effects.

The Maxwells are really into technology, right?   And they are really into their not-a-home-church at a nursing home - which I honestly think is sweet for the residents even if it's a way of keeping their kids and grandkids away from peers.

So....televised services?   Using the interwebs to have the services at the nursing home?   Am I just crazy here?

They did Live stream Prissy Chris and Amish Anna's wedding.  Instead of going to another church why don't they ust have church at the Fathership sans the old folks.  Speaking of I have to correct myself its a retirement community not a nursing home but its still shitty to not black out that lady's name on her walker.