Joy and Austin: The Wedding Is Over, On to the Honeymoon

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

29 minutes ago, eleanora3 said:

Ugh this is so sad to me because...I really did like him in the beginning

He was such a nice guy at first, and we have no idea what caused him to jump of the deep end into asshole land.  Is it Jill's constant whining while in Danger America that sent him over the edge ,or is it his grifting isn't going as well as he hopped, is he NOT enjoying fatherhood like he had hopped? Or did something go wrong somewhere else?  He went from a seemingly normal clean cut conservative white guy accountant to dirty conservative Jesus hippy with what appears to be a temper.   

I actually feel badly for Jill she is stuck with a guy who did a 180 on her after they had Izzy. I don't think either of them are particularly happy and they are trying to figure out how to make things work. Unfortunately, he won't bend to some woman, she will bend to him and she is miserable doing what he wants and can't figure out how to say fuck you, this sucks you want to mission go mission, I'm staying here.  Which is what an independent self sufficient woman would do in her shoes, but since she is neither, she just continues to be miserable and make him miserable so he makes her miserable and they keep running in circles digging themselves a path deeper and deeper into a hole.   She has no clue that she can tell him to shove off, because her family won't support her if she does, and being jobless, stupid and pregnant with #2, she's as trapped as Anna is with her 5 kids. This is another side effect of the SOTDRT, the inability to work yourself out of a problem, I'm guessing most of these kids(adults) don't have the skills necessary to work through emotionally challenging situations. 

[TeamDefraudinSquad]

2 hours ago, VineHeart137 said:

Man I feel extra sinful. I lost mine at 16. But we were together for 4 years. And like @ScorpiousMalfoy, I'm glad we had the option of breaking it off. We (or at least I) changed a lot in that 4 years. By the end it was clear that we weren't meant to "do life" together forever. The split was amicable and he was nice enough to give me my heart pieces back. All was well.

This was pretty much what happened with me too, except minus the amicable ending. I lost my v-card at 16 to my high school sweetheart. It was a happy relationship for a couple of years, but he became an alcoholic during college. After he got his first DUI, I knew we were through and I didn't want to spend my life with him.

And oh boy....am I glad that our parents weren't fundies, and that we had the option to break up after 5 years!  That relationship is a big part of the reason I feel like the courtship model is misguided, because people change, especially around the age when most courtships start (i.e. 15--25ish?)  At 14 years old, my high school sweetheart  was a straight A student who threw the grading curve in his chemistry class so far that the teacher had to factor in his grades seperately to avoid flunking all the other poor bastards in his class. By 20, he was a college drop-out with multiple DUIs. He didn't lie about who he was when he was 14, he just changed, and neither of us could have anticipated that he was going to change in the way that he did. If the married Duggar kids are lucky, they will grow up beside their spouse, and hopefully grow in the same direction as they do as time goes on. With 19 kids though, its inevitable the courtship model is going to fail one of them, and that one of them will grow in a different direction from their spouse (if it hasn't happened already...I'm looking at you, Josh and Anna... )

[trisprefect]

So I don't want to armchair analyze Austin but that's exactly what I'm going to do so bear with me.

I do think that he and Joy genuinely like each other and unlike many of her siblings, she has actually gotten the opportunity to get to know her future spouse and decide if they are compatible. So hopefully they'll be happy together. I also think that in candid moments, they're really sweet and Austin doesn't look creepy.

What Austin does seem like to me, however, is someone who has been abused from a young age. His father is terrifying, and it seems like all of Austin's prepared statements have an anxious vibe of trying to say the right thing. To my mind, he doesn't look or sound natural because he has been living on eggshells for a long time. I'm not saying that his dad was violent with him, I certainly don't have the insider info to back that up, but he just seems like the kind of rigid, strict, merciless father who would probably hurl verbal and emotional abuse around constantly. I feel contempt for Jim Bob and Michelle, but I actually find Mr. Forsyth scary.

Hopefully, if this is the case, being married will allow him to be out on his own and out from his father's thumb, to the point where he can actually relax a little bit.

[Georgiana]

I have the opposite situation as Derick and Jill.

My high school sweetheart was a double bass player.  Still is, actually.  He's primary double bass in a moderately sized metropolitan symphony orchestra.  Back in high school, I thought I would LOVE to be the wife of an orchestra musician.  I love music.  I love being surrounded by music in my home.  I want to raise my kids with music in the home (some of my earliest memories are sitting under the piano bench as my mother played).  I was CONVINCED that sort of life would make me happy.

Now I KNOW that sort of life would make me miserable.

I like to put down roots.  Orchestra families follow the work, which can mean a lot of moving.  My favorite couples moments are the night time cuddle sessions in front of the TV before bed.  Orchestra musicians are often working at night.  I could go on.  But despite what I thought, it really isn't the sort of life that would make me happy.

Luckily for me and unlike Jill, I didn't rush into marriage so I was able to figure this out.  

In the immortal words of Gretchen:

 

[RosyDaisy]

I was 22 when I lost my virginity. He was my college boyfriend and we were together for 3 years. I have no regrets. We parted on good terms. Now I'm married to Mr. Daisy and very happy.

[Funwithfundies]

24 minutes ago, trisprefect said:

What Austin does seem like to me, however, is someone who has been abused from a young age. His father is terrifying, and it seems like all of Austin's prepared statements have an anxious vibe of trying to say the right thing.

Yes, I read Austin the same way as well.  His father seems scary-intense from the (admittedly) little we've seen of him.  I can't stand JB, but I wouldn't be frightened of him, you know?  I think Austin has lived in scared rabbit mode for a long time - hopefully he can separate a bit and become his own person now, but I'm not holding my breath.

[Carm_88]

1 hour ago, RosyDaisy said:

Ashley looks gorgeous in those pics. Is that Josiah between Ashley and Anastasia?

I believe it is Josiah. I don't think Jason's hair line has gone back that far yet. So I am going with Josiah. 

[VeryNikeSeamstress]

I lost my virginity at 15 to a total ass.  I could've done better, but curiosity and hormones got the better of me. I didn't have enjoyable sex until about a year later, when I dated an 18 year old virgin who was actually interested in learning how to please a woman.

At 19 (Joy's age), I had my first same sex encounter. It had never seemed like an option before, but what a game changer.

I guess I'm a sinful hussy who's going to hell. I just hope that these virgin Duggar brides are enjoying sex, and that their husbands actually care about making it pleasureable.

[Casserole]

1 hour ago, VelociRapture said:

Don't feel bad. A lot of us did. We had high hopes because he presented himself as a halfway decent guy.

Thats why I'm being so cautious about these new husbands (and Kendra.) You just can't tell what's in someone's heart until they show it to you.

I believe so, but I had trouble trying to tell.

Definitely Siah. Ashley's sister posted this: (side note, who are this twin boys in this photo and most of ashley's photos? a little old to be dressing in matching outfits)

 

[JMO]

1 hour ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

This is another side effect of the SOTDRT, the inability to work yourself out of a problem, I'm guessing most of these kids(adults) don't have the skills necessary to work through emotionally challenging situations. 

I never thought about it this way. I always knew that they didn't have the job skills to be independent and that they are bred to be completely dependent on their families but this is a good point. Their lack of critical thinking skills and even deductive reasoning means that they probably feel depressed and overwhelmed without a thought that they are or that there is something that they can do about it.  

[ihaveanexamintwodays]

man, the ¿twins? in Ashley's insta photos look like such douchey dude-bros....worse than Carlin's Evan I think haha. damn.

now, seeing those posts did put the random thought in my head that Si and Ashley could totally be a sensible arrangement....

[HereticHick]

When 6 unmarried young people go out for meal, as in Anastasia's picture, who is the chaperone?  Is everyone everyone else's chaperone? What is to prevent them from lustfully lunging over the table at each other? : )

[MsSaylor]

How old is Anastasia? Could she be a possible match for Josiah? I think shes really cute. 

[OyToTheVey]

Ashley and Anastasia seem to have spent quite a lot of time with Josiah. I wonder if we need to know anything. And if it'll be awkward with Nathan.

[ihaveanexamintwodays]

I think Ashley and Anastasia are 22 and 20?

[ViolaSebastian]

30 minutes ago, VeryNikeSeamstress said:

I lost my virginity at 15 to a total ass.

Mine was a total ass, too. I was 19, and unfortunately bled A LOT. I was at a loss as to what to do to make it stop, so I was standing outside his bathroom after a shower with a towel around me, and blood ran down my legs onto the floor. (Looking back, I think I may have been in some state of low-level shock, as it was pretty painful). He then yelled at me for getting blood on the floor and rudely told me to "use a tampon the some girl thing."

We dated for three years after that, and I thank my lucky stars he dumped me after I got meningitis. Dodged a bullet with that douche canoe. 

[Lurky]

I hope if Josiah does end up with one of the Salyer sisters, he can move to NYC to live with them, and the poor Salyer isn't expected to relocate to Arkansas, where their life seems to be even more country than the Bateseses.

ETA Of course I REALLY hope Josiah isn't courting, and gets the chance to move far, far away from the TTH and enjoy himself as a person, rather than just a cog in the machine, and gets to live out his dreams and ambitions.

ETA Hate myself for assuming any unmarried opposite-gendered people pictured must have romantic interest in each other, but I remind myself that's how it is in their world.  But I wonder how come the Salyers ended up at Joy's wedding? Is it because Ashley is back with Nate Bates?  Or is it that they know each other via the Bates & Big Sandy conferences?

[SuhrEnity]

38 minutes ago, ihaveanexamintwodays said:

man, the ¿twins? in Ashley's insta photos look like such douchey dude-bros.

This was my exact thought when I saw them. Lmao. I feel like if we knew who they were there would be soooo much snarkable material for us. They look so snarkworthy!!!

[Daisy0322]

Honestly it seems to me that Jill and Derek got too wrapped up in the competition to be the first engaged, married, knocked up, etc. and they didn't really get to know each other. Plus Jill spent her life tattling on her siblings so when her chaperones went on her dates I'm sure they weren't as lienent as they could've been. In comparison to Jessa and Ben where I think they actually went at their own pace and I think Jinger the main chaperone wasn't exactly a hard nose. ( I'm not saying that I think they "broke rules" or anything, no use speculating.  just that I think they could talk more openly and probably privately). So I think they knew better what they were getting into. 

Id say jessa and Ben look much happier in comparison. I mean they look like they argue and have bad days but that's young marriages they also look like they have fun together a lot of times. Jill and Derek looking F-ing miserable every time we see them. And I noticed in one of the episodes I got around to watching last season they were having dinner on their anniversary when Jill speaks Derek just looks like he wants to cut his ears off and use them to choke her. I've never seen that kind of contempt in Ben lol. 

Joy and Austin seemed to have really rushed things relationship wise but they knew each other a long time previously so it'll be interesting to see what they look like in a year.

[Incognito22]

1 hour ago, ihaveanexamintwodays said:

man, the ¿twins? in Ashley's insta photos look like such douchey dude-bros....worse than Carlin's Evan I think haha. damn.

now, seeing those posts did put the random thought in my head that Si and Ashley could totally be a sensible arrangement....

Wow!  Get outta my head. Verbatim my thoughts, including the emoji.

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

12 minutes ago, Daisy0322 said:

Joy and Austin seemed to have really rushed things relationship wise but they knew each other a long time previously so it'll be interesting to see what they look like in a year.

I think both Joy & Austin wanted away from their parents. I'm not saying they aren't drowning in the cult kool aid I'm just saying they've had enough of other peoples rules and wanted to get away from it and be in charge of themselves. They both grew up in a spiritually abusive homes, and they both probably had much more physical and emotional abuse than any child should have to endure. I'm not here for a parenting debate or to hear that I was an abusive mother because  I wasn't, but I spanked my kids and by spanking I mean they would get ONE swat on their bottom with my hand, that is my definition of spanking. I don't consider that to be abusive, I'm talking kids who where spanked repeatedly and forcefully enough to leave marks for every little infraction. Parents who use belts, wooden spoons, switches, fly swatters, things like that to inflict lasting pain on a child. Add that physical abuse to the emotional and spiritual abuse, where kids are told everything you do, everything you think, everything you see is a sin and if you don't stop doing, looking ,seeing that stuff you will burn in the fires of hell for all eternity. They are taught that God hates every natural instinct that they have so by nature God hate them unless they do EXACTLY as they are told by their father.  

The Joshly Madison scandal was the best thing that ever happened to Boob, it just "proved" to his kids that going out in the wold will destroy you.  The only child to leave that umbrella of protection and he failed so miserably it almost destroyed them all. 

[veron1que]

1 hour ago, Georgiana said:

I have the opposite situation as Derick and Jill.

My high school sweetheart was a double bass player.  Still is, actually.  He's primary double bass in a moderately sized metropolitan symphony orchestra.  Back in high school, I thought I would LOVE to be the wife of an orchestra musician.  I love music.  I love being surrounded by music in my home.  I want to raise my kids with music in the home (some of my earliest memories are sitting under the piano bench as my mother played).  I was CONVINCED that sort of life would make me happy.

Now I KNOW that sort of life would make me miserable.

What's funny to me is that I've always wanted the same guy and life, but my Hs sweetheart turned out not be him.

We dated 17-23, he was top of the class with me in high school and we ended up going to the same highly ranked college. He was set on the path of becoming an electrical engineer. It's what I wanted in a hubby, introverted intellegent engineer who wanted the childfree life with me. Well 1 year in he drops out and become a derelict. Things still haven't changed for him. In he final years, I really couldn't see how far who he was and who I thought he was had diverged. I still regarded him far more highly than he deserved.

The current bf is the successful engineer I've always wanted +more. I think he might be the one, but only time will tell.

I worry about these fundie girls and getting married too soon, most people don't become who their 18 year old self thinks they will.

[Cheetah]

So caveat that I haven't watched most of the show episodes for the past 2 years, and I rarely click through to the TLC mini videos, so I'm taking y'all's word for it that Derrick and Jill don't seem very happy.  So that said, I'm sure that Jill getting pregnant immediately didn't help the situation at all.  Can you imagine never ever being alone with your partner, then within a few days of finally getting to totally focus on each other, she has this new consuming passion of becoming a mother?  If I were Derrick I'd feel cheated, frankly.  (And yeah, it's on him for not insisting on waiting a few months to TTC, but still...).  I'm glad that Jinger had a few months at least (and really good for her for separating from the borg for that timeframe, too) and I hope that Joy and Austin either deliberately take a few months or at least don't have quite the luck that Jill did.

[Jana814]

I have written before about a classmate of mine who passed away a few months back. Another classmate of mine was his high school sweetheart. They were each others firsts. They even went to neighboring colleges in upstate New York.  They broke up soon after and she transferred to another school. When I realize he died after thinking about his wife and kids then next person I thought of was her. A few days after he died she wrote the most loving tribute to him.  If he had been her one and only I don't know if she truly would have been happy.  Since she was not raised fundy  she was after to find someone who makes her happy.  

[neurogirl]

I hope that Jostin at least avoid sex during her most fertile days. Just for a bit. The thought that she could already be pregnant is just...making me a bit ill actually.