Duggars by the Dozen 26 - Double Baked Duggars

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

1 hour ago, imokit said:

I have friends who date multiple people at the finding a boyfriend stage. As soon as they find one they like it becomes exclusive. They make a distinction between dating and bf/gf.

This right here.  I dated pre internet (thank god) but at one point I was seeing 2 guys for about a month, I know 1 other guy was seeing another gal he had just met. The other guy I was seeing wasn't seeing anyone else, but he worked so much we barely had time to see each other.  The guy that was seeing another gal, we wound up hitting it off and we broke it off with the others and dated for several months. I don't know if it is a regional thing or just a personal thing, I know several people who went out with more than one person at a time and none of it seriously, lots of "friends with benefits" kind of deals. 

[JMO]

Back to predatory birds, this was my fave hawk story:

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/fat-cat-eddie-snatched-hawk-dropped-neighbor-garden-due-weight-article-1.160998

[seraaa]

2 hours ago, front hugs > duggs said:

@purplepeony yes there is definitely a difference between the UK and US in terms of dating. My husband is from England and I'm from the US. I've always thought of dating as casually, maybe you talk to a couple different people and go on a few dates with each before kind of deciding if you see a relationship in the future or not. Some people agree that they are just kind of having fun and nothing serious. My husband says this was not really how it went in the southwest of England. He said it was more typical that you would go on one to two dates with someone, and either call it off or become exclusive. 

That's certainly how it used to work; I don't know to what extent apps like Tinder have changed the game. I can still remember a time when even the term "dating" was a recognizably American word that we didn't really use, and I'm not that old. That' not the case now, tho!

It's interesting to think about how much culture shapes our preferences for this kind of thing. A lot of us fall into patterns without really thinking about it because it is what everyone around us is doing.

[singsingsing]

2 minutes ago, seraaa said:

That's certainly how it used to work; I don't know to what extent apps like Tinder have changed the game. I can still remember a time when "dating" was a recognizably American term that we didn't really use, and I'm not that old

I think it still works that way for quite a few people. I used to be on an online dating site (not that long ago) and one of the questions was, "How soon should you be exclusive?" To my surprise, I found that the vast majority of men answered, "From the very first date."

[seraaa]

4 minutes ago, singsingsing said:

I think it still works that way for quite a few people. I used to be on an online dating site (not that long ago) and one of the questions was, "How soon should you be exclusive?" To my surprise, I found that the vast majority of men answered, "From the very first date."

Ha, that's interesting! I wonder if they'd distinguish between talking to (multiple) people on an app or online, and actually meeting up in person. Or I wonder if they're making a distinction between "just meeting up" and "a date". Who knows

[rexasaurus_nirb]

19 hours ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

 

2.5 I'm guessing you don't know any liberals, from anywhere, if you don't think they act differently. Are you perhaps a Muslim? That is about the only other religion I can think of that would consider the Duggar's to be "non modest

*Snipped for space*

Just wanted to note that making sweeping generalizations about islam is not ideal. I see a lot of nuance in our discussions here about the different types of Christian and I recall at least one other time when Islam was kind of used in a negative sense. Muslims, just like Christians, range from those who are quite conservative and yes, would cover up more than the Duggars, to those who wear shorts and tanks in the summer and bikinis on the beach. This message isn't directed at any particular person, just wanted to put it out there for future thought, especially due to the current intense level of Islamophobia right now in the USA and abroad. 

[buggers]

Agreed. Every religion has shades, people who live it in an "extreme" manner and those who use it mostly as a moral guideline or to establish their general ethics. While most of here are clearly unhappy with fundamentalist extremists, AKA the Duggars, I don't think of most here are overtly opposed to Christians. I think it's important to distinguish  religious extremists from people of faith - all faiths. 

[MargaretElliott]

I've never dated multiple people at once because that would require more than one person to be interested in me... womp womp.

Nah but seriously, dating multiple people is common casually, even seriously (several of my friends are polyamorous, where you have multiple serious relationships and everyone is informed/consenting about the situation). I don't know how they do it, I can hardly keep track of one SO, but different strokes for different folks. If you want to sleep around or wait until marriage or take a vow of celibacy, fine. If you want to be exclusive on the first date or have both a husband and a boyfriend, fine. My beef with fundies is that they completely rob their children of these options, of their independence, and their ability to choose an option and a partner that's right for them. 

I'd have to disagree with @eveandadam and say that the Duggar courtship model is very, very different from what most people do and doesn't enable the courting couple to truly get to know each other. I wouldn't want my parents to know every single word that passed between my SO and me, even before our very first kiss! At that point we weren't saying anything wildly inappropriate, but still- it's private. And if your parents (or a chaperone who will undoubtedly report to your parents) are listening in, you're not dating the person- you're dating their parents. You have to impress THEM, you have to conform to THEIR rules, not your partner's, because the parents have the power. And I don't know about you guys, but I don't really want to date my own future mother-in-law, let alone JimBob and Michelle 

[Carm_88]

3 minutes ago, MargaretElliott said:

I'd have to disagree with @eveandadam and say that the Duggar courtship model is very, very different from what most people do and doesn't enable the courting couple to truly get to know each other. 

Completely agreed. Even if you are casually dating someone, you will go out and talk one on one. You will ask questions, tell stories, and say things that you wouldn't normally say in front of your family. I don't date with a friend beside me, it would be strange. (Friend on speed dial for emergencies is different  ) Also, kissing, hugging, hand holding, and so on, even if you don't necessarily kiss someone on the first date, you'll likely hug. It's weird to think about dating without that being a possibility. 

[NakedKnees]

Echoing a lot of others here that there is whole infinite world of dating/relationship styles, and even given that, the Duggars' is still extreme. All of my conservative friends either couldn't date until they were an arbitrary age like 18, or dated with boundaries (no calls after certain hours, group dates only, requiring identical religious beliefs, etc.)

On the other end of the spectrum, I would imagine more "extreme" liberal dating/relationship styles are often kept quiet due to prejudice. It's perceived very differently to say "My daughter can only date Christian boys in certain environments after she's 18" and a whole other thing to say "My daughter dates a handful of men and women at once on Tindr," at least across the cultures I've lived in. 

Maybe I have a persecution complex too, haha... but my partner and I associate strongly with the "monogamish" label (thanks to the fantastic Dan Savage), but only a very select few friends know IRL because of the fear of judgement. This is completely normal in non-monogamous communities, if hotly debated.

[Chickenbutt]

Back in the day I dated a different guy every night. Dated, not slept with. #1 on Friday for dinner and a movie, #2 on Saturday for dancing and dinner, #3 on Sunday for a day at the beach, etc. That was common then. You dated multiple people and when you knew them well enough and wanted to make a commitment, you became exclusive. I did cuddle, kiss, hold hands etc with most of them, but did not sleep with them. That was in reserve for a committed relationship.

My son, a high school teacher, says no one used the word "dating" anymore. They "talk to, text, hang out and go out" nowadays. Am I showing my age??

[patsymae]

28 minutes ago, Chickenbutt said:

Back in the day I dated a different guy every night. Dated, not slept with. #1 on Friday for dinner and a movie, #2 on Saturday for dancing and dinner, #3 on Sunday for a day at the beach, etc. That was common then. You dated multiple people and when you knew them well enough and wanted to make a commitment, you became exclusive. I did cuddle, kiss, hold hands etc with most of them, but did not sleep with them. That was in reserve for a committed relationship.

My son, a high school teacher, says no one used the word "dating" anymore. They "talk to, text, hang out and go out" nowadays. Am I showing my age??

Not as much as me. In my day, back when Jesus was holding  baby dinosaurs, "dating" was going someplace with a person, like a movie or a dance or just something to eat or even a walk, and you did it with multiple people-- in fact, parents encouraged it as you should get to know a lot of people before you "got serious." Then if you and someone liked each other enough, you "went steady" and he/she became your "boyfriend" or "girlfriend." It had nothing to do with how many other people around or what kind of physical contact you did or did not engage in. 

[Stormy]

35 minutes ago, Chickenbutt said:

Back in the day I dated a different guy every night. Dated, not slept with. #1 on Friday for dinner and a movie, #2 on Saturday for dancing and dinner, #3 on Sunday for a day at the beach, etc. That was common then. You dated multiple people and when you knew them well enough and wanted to make a commitment, you became exclusive. I did cuddle, kiss, hold hands etc with most of them, but did not sleep with them. That was in reserve for a committed relationship.

My son, a high school teacher, says no one used the word "dating" anymore. They "talk to, text, hang out and go out" nowadays. Am I showing my age??

I'm 22, and since I was a teenager I don't think it's been much of a thing to date multiple people at once anymore. There were people who seemed to go through a lot of partners (in the sense that they'd date for a few weeks, break up, and then quickly find someone else), but going *on* a date is a fairly big deal since the outcome of deciding whether or not to go exclusive with them is expected. I think the exception would be those who are polyamorous, but that's moreso for people who want to be committed to more than one person, not to get to know them all and pick one.

I remember reading an article in Seventeen when I was in middle school about a girl who found out her boyfriend was dating other girls too -- which he didn't see as a big deal, since he considered himself committed to her -- and she retaliated by deciding to do the same thing. It ended with the two other guys she'd started dating getting really upset upon learning she had a boyfriend, and the boyfriend getting kinda hurt as well before figuring he'd done the same thing to her and deciding not to date other girls anymore. It was painted as this huge deal, and "dating around" was likened to cheating.

I can't mention a male friend or acquaintance around my mom without her suggesting I date him "just for fun". Even if I were interested in doing something like that, it could put my friendships with these guys at serious risk if it didn't work out since it's not as relaxed as a concept as it used to be.

[singsingsing]

1 minute ago, Stormy said:

I remember reading an article in Seventeen when I was in middle school about a girl who found out her boyfriend was dating other girls too -- which he didn't see as a big deal, since he considered himself committed to her -- and she retaliated by deciding to do the same thing. It ended with the two other guys she'd started dating getting really upset upon learning she had a boyfriend, and the boyfriend getting kinda hurt as well before figuring he'd done the same thing to her and deciding not to date other girls anymore. It was painted as this huge deal, and "dating around" was likened to cheating.

In a situation like that, dating around is cheating. This was his girlfriend, not someone he was casually seeing. She obviously thought they were exclusive. They obviously weren't in a mutually agreed upon polyamorous relationship.

[Chickenbutt]

@patsymaeExactly! I can't imagine being exclusive after dating a guy ONCE!

7 minutes ago, Stormy said:

date him "just for fun".

That is exactly what we did. Went out with different people just for fun. No serious commitment unless we found that we really liked someone and they really liked us.

[singsingsing]

I could be exclusive after dating a guy once, but that's because I basically never date, so I'd just be exclusive by default... lol.

[Chickenbutt]

Actually, I went on a date with Mr. Butt and became exclusive from that first date on. But I knew I would marry him after that first date. I even called my mom the next morning and told her I just went out with the guy I was going to marry....lol. She laughed.

[Stormy]

Just now, Chickenbutt said:

@patsymaeExactly! I can't imagine being exclusive after dating a guy ONCE!

That is exactly what we did. Went out with different people just for fun. No serious commitment unless we found that we really liked someone and they really liked us.

Nowadays I think it's more common to start off as friends and if you decide you like them, jump straight into asking them to be you boy/girlfriend. And then boom! You're "dating"! It's not unheard of to ask someone to go on a date first, but there tends to be some awkwardness hurt feelings if the person you ask decides not to pursue a relationship with you.

Nowadays, I think dating -- as in going places on dates with people to get to know them better with little prior "hanging out" -- is typically reserved for people who are settling into their adult lives and are looking for a mate to eventually marry. With the advent of online dating, you don't even have to worry about seeing the rejects again! Teenagers and young adults often select from their existing peer group and have to be careful not to mess it up too much.

[CorruptionInc.]

26 minutes ago, patsymae said:

Not as much as me. In my day, back when Jesus was holding  baby dinosaurs, "dating" was going someplace with a person, like a movie or a dance or just something to eat or even a walk, and you did it with multiple people-- in fact, parents encouraged it as you should get to know a lot of people before you "got serious." Then if you and someone liked each other enough, you "went steady" and he/she became your "boyfriend" or "girlfriend." It had nothing to do with how many other people around or what kind of physical contact you did or did not engage in. 

My mum did the same thing, as did my dad. My parents have been married for 47 years. 

 

[singsingsing]

When I was a teenager (about 10 years ago), it was very uncommon for anyone to 'date'. Most people got to know each other as friends first, then maybe started hanging out more one on one, and then they would decide to be in a relationship. It's obviously much easier to do that when you're in school full time with 1000 other people your age and you're seeing all of your friends every single day.

[Fun Undies]

I went to high school in south Carolina, and I really felt the dating world was split in two: those who "dated" i.e. multiple sex partners  (no judgement whatsoever, so long everyone is consenting), or super duper "I'm waiting till I'm married because God and my parents." (Fyi, I'm demisexual, so it was way easy to fall into the 2nd crowd because I didn't have the same "struggles with sexual desires" << as they called it.  I never proclaimed my intent to wait till marriage though).  There were a few who dated all through high school, and either were sleeping together, or were abstaining (but dating) till marriage.

Even then, a few said their parents told them to date around, and not be too serious about anyone, and then told me about multiple sex partners and I'm thinking in my head, "pretty sure that's not what they meant." Lol.

When I met my husband, I was 19, and he was 20, and we were both only interested in immediate exclusivity from the first date onward (not talking, or going out on dates, with other people), while we got to know one another further.  But that was 90% because we both had been cheated on, and we were 100% okay with that.  Its not for everyone, nor should it be, but it worked for us.

[Minionmayhem]

You know, I always kind of assumed that the 1-2 dates out and then you're exclusive was more or less the way of it, but I'm also realizing that I had almost no experience dating.

I wasn't raised fundie, but I was Southern Baptist, and I can only remember going on 1 or 2 accompanied dates before we were married. I was 19 though and barely knew up from down. 

Dating sounds confusing, and now I'll probably overthink something that doesn't even apply to me. 

[Chickenbutt]

56 minutes ago, Fun Undies said:

(not talking, or going out on dates, with other people),

What does not talking mean in this context? Relationship finding (guess I can't call it dating anymore) is so confusing to me these days.

Certainly you don't mean that you literally can't talk to a male co worker/student/friend. Could you go out for coffee with a male friend?

[Gillyweed]

I'm a teenager in college, and my first relationship is in the budding stage  I don't know what's going to happen, as we just met a week ago and will be long distance in a month and a half for summer (if we stay together). We aren't labelled bf and gf yet, but I'm think we're exclusive. If it turns out we're not, well whatever, because I'm honestly just in it for a fun time with a cute boy  

Does anyone else think that relationships in college move faster? My friend thinks we're moving too fast, but it's weird because we live in the same dorm building, so we've just been hanging out a lot since it's so convenient. 

[singsingsing]

Never just assume. Don't be afraid to have that conversation! Just straight up ask, "Are we exclusive?" And if you want (or don't want) that, just say so. You have the right to clarity and honesty from your relationship/dating partner.