S'morton Bret Alan Smith Jailed (2)

[Black Aliss]

If one of the charges against BAS is "rape" wouldn't that mean there was physical evidence? Otherwise, wouldn't the charge be molestation?

[Palimpsest]

2 minutes ago, Black Aliss said:

If one of the charges against BAS is "rape" wouldn't that mean there was physical evidence? Otherwise, wouldn't the charge be molestation?

In my opinion - yes.

[AmazonGrace]

Quote

 

 

(a) A person commits the offense of rape when he has carnal knowledge of:

(1) A female forcibly and against her will; or

(2) A female who is less than ten years of age.

Carnal knowledge in rape occurs when there is any penetration of the female sex organ by the male sex organ.

 

Quote

 

(a) A person commits the offense of child molestation when such person:

(1) Does any immoral or indecent act to or in the presence of or with any child under the age of 16 years with the intent to arouse or satisfy the sexual desires of either the child or the person; or

(2) By means of an electronic device, transmits images of a person engaging in, inducing, or otherwise participating in any immoral or indecent act to a child under the age of 16 years with the intent to arouse or satisfy the sexual desires of either the child or the person.

 

Quote

 

(a) A person commits the offense of incest when such person engages in sexual intercourse or sodomy, as such term is defined in Code Section 16-6-2, with a person whom he or she knows he or she is related to either by blood or by marriage as follows:

(1) Father and child or stepchild;

(2) Mother and child or stepchild;

(3) Siblings of the whole blood or of the half blood;

(4) Grandparent and grandchild of the whole blood or of the half blood;

(5) Aunt and niece or nephew of the whole blood or of the half blood; or

(6) Uncle and niece or nephew of the whole blood or of the half blood.

 

http://law.justia.com/codes/georgia/2015/title-16/chapter-6/section-16-6-1/

[MamaB]

@true believer would you be willing to revel who you are and who you think OldSalty is via private message to a former fundy and someone who was in the S'morton circle? 

I'm genuinely curious to know and won't revel to any else.lol. 

[Coconut Flan]

I would strongly discourage that kind of question and would recommend it not be answered.  You never know who is asking or why.

[Palimpsest]

5 minutes ago, Coconut Flan said:

I would strongly discourage that kind of question and would recommend it not be answered.  You never know who is asking or why.

You took the words right off my keyboard.  SMH.

[MamaB]

I understand what yall are saying.

I'm someone who was in the S'morton church for 3+ years. Just asking because I probably know the person. I would gladly tell who I was also. I've already told a few people.lol

The only reason I haven't said who I was yet in public because I'll more then likely be blocked by all them after I do.hahah

[SpoonfulOSugar]

1 hour ago, MamaB said:

I would gladly tell who I was also. I've already told a few people.lol

The only reason I haven't said who I was yet in public because I'll more then likely be blocked by all them after I do.hahah

For a lot of reasons, I discourage anyone from being open with your private information on this or any other site.  The concept of "PERSEC" (personal security) is a really good idea for anyone and everyone - for your family, your sanity, your comfort.

There's absolutely no guarantee that who/what you think you are talking to is actually that person.  Lots of people on the Interwebz have nefarious intentions - no sense in giving them an embroidered welcome mat and a key to your house . . .

If you read in the archives, there was an *enormous* brouhaha when someone got mad here and started spewing information.  It gets shut down, believe me, but it's really difficult to erase when someone is intent on putting information about you out to the world. 

[oldsalty]

5 hours ago, true believer said:

I am not sure how many details of the situation @oldsalty actually has...I think she called herself defending a family she respects and admires, to some extent.  I am quite sure, if she is who I think she is, she would be appalled and horrified by what has been alleged to have happened in this situation.  I can clearly state that I do NOT support child abuse, molestation, or rape under any circumstances. 

Our definitions of abuse might vary a bit (I don't think spanking in and of itself, done properly is abuse).  However, this isn't about spanking, or sheltering, or anything like that.  This is something else entirely and it is WRONG, no matter who did it or for what reason.  There is NO defense for this kind of thing.

Yes, definitely I would be appalled!  and i was/am shocked (I also do NOT SUPPORT child abuse, molestation or rape and I agree there is no defense . . .  .I have maintained if he is guilty he needs to confess that and spare the victims.  If he is innocent he needs to defend it.  I don't know what is truth, I don't know what happened.  What I do know is that I am a mother and I would be DEVASTATED as a mother if my child did this to my children, grandchildren or any child.  This  has to be DEVASTATING for the Smiths on many levels (and the Mortons as well) - and I think some of these comments make light.  I see comments like he should "burn" - or someone in prison should get him . . . I want to see justice for these victims  

[formergothardite]

Oldsalty, I would think Jackie's statement would be making light. Why isn't it?

[ladyamylynn]

Is negative 44 points with only 8 posts some kind of new record?

[alexandracabot]

4 hours ago, Black Aliss said:

If one of the charges against BAS is "rape" wouldn't that mean there was physical evidence? Otherwise, wouldn't the charge be molestation?

Is physical evidence at all a prerequisite of a rape charge? I'm really only going off of news stories and Law & Order SVU episodes here, but it seems to me that most rape cases necessarily do not have physical evidence, as they are often reported days, months, etc. after the fact. 

The distinction between rape and molestation is about what the encounter actually entailed, I think, not the evidence.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

7 hours ago, MamaB said:

@true believer would you be willing to revel who you are and who you think OldSalty is via private message to a former fundy and someone who was in the S'morton circle? 

I'm genuinely curious to know and won't revel to any else.lol. 

It concerns me that you felt comfortable enough to post publicly asking someone to dox an FJ member in PM.  I find your casual approach to asking someone to violate another's privacy pretty appalling.

A reminder about doxing being against ToU and that rules and ToU apply to PMs as well.  

 

Knowingly posting private, identifying information about another FreeJinger.org member and linking it to their FJ identity, (including but not limited to last name, address, phone number, email, or the full names of family members) without the express permission of the FJ member whose information has been disclosed.

Is forbidden (editing to clarify becuse mod box only gives me 1 paragraph to C&P)

Just because you're under the honor system in PM doesn't make this kind of thing okay.  I hope if people get PMs asking them for personal information they report it.  People shouldn't have to worry about this kind of stuff here.

[Pammy]

Maybe on of our new friends can explain how/why the man is called "Captain"?

[dawbs]

2 hours ago, SpoonfulOSugar said:

*snip*you read in the archives, there was an *enormous* brouhaha when someone got mad here and started spewing information.  It gets shut down, believe me, but it's really difficult to erase when someone is intent on putting information about you out to the world. 

And for those people who are considering being more open w/ their identities because they like the people on FJ, please remember that we have plenty of readers who you don't know--who don't post or may not even have an account.

We've had influxes from other sites in the past--anything you're putting out here can be read by anyone who is smart enough to figure out the internet (and some remarkably obnoxious and otherwise idiotic people can be smart enough to put things like that together).

Channel ElastiGirl from the Incredibles.
 

Spoiler

 

[Palimpsest]

1 hour ago, oldsalty said:

Yes, definitely I would be appalled!  and i was/am shocked (I also do NOT SUPPORT child abuse, molestation or rape and I agree there is no defense . . .  .I have maintained if he is guilty he needs to confess that and spare the victims.  If he is innocent he needs to defend it.  I don't know what is truth, I don't know what happened.  What I do know is that I am a mother and I would be DEVASTATED as a mother if my child did this to my children, grandchildren or any child.  This  has to be DEVASTATING for the Smiths on many levels (and the Mortons as well) - and I think some of these comments make light.  I see comments like he should "burn" - or someone in prison should get him . . . I want to see justice for these victims  

Are you really still here?  I give you points for shamelessness and multiple flounces.

It has to be so much more DEVASTATING for the victim(s) who went through it, and Katie, than the various extended Smith and Morton family members, don't you think?  

Note, I did not put the Mortons in parentheses as you did.  It is rather telling that you focus seems to be on defending the Smiths - and you delegate the Morton family to parentheses.

No comment here on FJ has made light of the criminal charges of sexual abuse, incest and rape - except your own, @oldsalty.  You tried to imply the victims have lied. The rest of us did not.  

The vast majority of us seem to want to see justice for the victim(s) AKA the child(ren) who were targeted  and Katie who may not have been able to defend them.  

It is rather clear that this is not your focus.  You apparently want to give Alan Smith the benefit of the doubt (against the evidence). But even more you just want to defend the "Smith Family Image," such as it is, against the reality of these incredibly serious criminal charges.

Good luck with that.  The Smiths (not just Bret Alan Smith, Jn) are looking really dreadful at the moment.  The Mortons are looking pretty good in comparison.

[snowgirl]

7 hours ago, true believer said:

First time posting...longtime lurker.  Up front, I'm a fundie (per your definition).  I only registered a week or two ago, cause I've seen what you folks do to fundiers/sympathizers when they post and I couldn't quite make my mind up to post and expose myself to that.

I know the Mortons quite well, the Smiths somewhat less well, the Sanders and Lanes even less than the Smiths.    Based on what old salty posted here, I'm quite certain she is not Captain Bret or even a family member, though I think I know who she is IRL.  I won't out her (if I'm correct in my guess) cause that isn't the right thing to do and I would hope if someone figured out who I am IRL they wouldn't out me either.  lol

I've followed the threads on this event since they first began here.  And when I first started lurking here a couple of years ago, I went back and read lots of old threads, particularly the ones on the S'Mortons.

I'm not quite sure why I am posting now...I'm not looking for attention and I'm not very interested in a debate about my beliefs.  Maybe I just wanted to verify that there are some of us who do read here on occasion and wish we could have a conversation with some of you without feeling like we are being chewed up and spit out.  A real conversation, with give and take on both sides, with respect given by both parties toward the *other side*.

Right, dialogue goes back and forth.

. . .I don't think anyone can deny that there was time and effort put into the Love Boat Dancing Video.

But also?  I can't remember who said it, but someone said, Rarely do you see someone out-Brady the Brady's!

That is the whole point. . . remember when the Brady's jumped around to Sunshine Day?  . . .yeah, well, this video even topped that.

The Love Boat Video. . .where the Brady's were out-brady-ied.  

 

Now, back to topic of your post.  Sorry for bird-walking. . .it is nice to meet you, and dialogue is a great thing.  Everyone can learn from dialogue.

 

Have a good night!

7 hours ago, ladyamylynn said:

I can debate about some things, sure, like say whether or not homeschooling is a viable educational option. "Is child rape bad"  and "should we listen to the victims or not?" isn't up for debate though. 

*This!*

One million likes!!!!!

37 minutes ago, Pammy said:

Maybe on of our new friends can explain how/why the man is called "Captain"?

I *think* it is because during a time when they were raising their 4 kids, they had a boat and they spent a year on the boat in the Bahamas and maybe Puerto Rico.  It is on the homeschool videos.  *le sigh*  Yes, yes, I know.  I can't believe I plowed through those videos.  I just. . .could not look away.  *face plant*

[Coconut Flan]

24 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

Are you really still here?  I give you points for shamelessness and multiple flounces.

She is deactivated at her request.

[Palimpsest]

1 minute ago, Coconut Flan said:

She is deactivated at her request.

Thank the FSM!

[Grimalkin]

12 hours ago, Feministe9000 said:

i'm sure i will get a sarcastic or scathing or patronizing response from someone, which is pretty much expected whenever anybody says that other readers/posters on FJ are being over-the-top or annoying. I get sometimes you guys get very defensive because you've invested so much into the story and if you have some kind of personal connection to something as horrific as this SMorton tragedy (i hope Alan is locked up for life too, believe me!)

 

But seriously, just reading the back and forth this last page between people it's like......please, can you just calm the fuck down and move on?

Sometimes I don't know what you would do if you weren't able to launch into a tirade or diatribe when you feel someone on this site has wronged you/criticized you in some way.

 

let it gooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

You guys are annoying.

 

Cue the "GET OFF FJ IF YOU DON'T LIKE READING THIS" rant, foaming at the mouth practically......but i'm not here to make friends, so go for it!!!

Aaaannndddd here's the downvotes LOL

 

you guys take yourselves so seriously, and you complain about Pickles?

LOL

sit down.

    For some reason whenever you post I read it with an 80's valley girl voice in my head. 

Cue the snapping gum noises. "Like oh my god guys. Like, why are you like snarking on a snark site? Like, why engage in like gross debate. You like, think too much. Thinking is like gross, gag me with a spoon" more gum smacking. 

     That's how you sound to me.

[Black Aliss]

3 hours ago, alexandracabot said:

Is physical evidence at all a prerequisite of a rape charge? I'm really only going off of news stories and Law & Order SVU episodes here, but it seems to me that most rape cases necessarily do not have physical evidence, as they are often reported days, months, etc. after the fact.

In the case of a child there would most likely be injuries that would still be evident months, even years later.

7 hours ago, AmazonGrace said:

http://law.justia.com/codes/georgia/2015/title-16/chapter-6/section-16-6-1/

Seriously? In Georgia it's only rape if it's a male assaulting a female? SMH

[oldsalty]

5 hours ago, SpoonfulOSugar said:

For a lot of reasons, I discourage anyone from being open with your private information on this or any other site.  The concept of "PERSEC" (personal security) is a really good idea for anyone and everyone - for your family, your sanity, your comfort.

There's absolutely no guarantee that who/what you think you are talking to is actually that person.  Lots of people on the Interwebz have nefarious intentions - no sense in giving them an embroidered welcome mat and a key to your house . . .

If you read in the archives, there was an *enormous* brouhaha when someone got mad here and started spewing information.  It gets shut down, believe me, but it's really difficult to erase when someone is intent on putting information about you out to the world. 

 

3 hours ago, formergothardite said:

Oldsalty, I would think Jackie's statement would be making light. Why isn't it?

It's a weird statement.

[DaisyD]

Well that was short lived...

[oldsalty]

3 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

Are you really still here?  I give you points for shamelessness and multiple flounces.

It has to be so much more DEVASTATING for the victim(s) who went through it, and Katie, than the various extended Smith and Morton family members, don't you think?  

Note, I did not put the Mortons in parentheses as you did.  It is rather telling that you focus seems to be on defending the Smiths - and you delegate the Morton family to parentheses.

No comment here on FJ has made light of the criminal charges of sexual abuse, incest and rape - except your own, @oldsalty.  You tried to imply the victims have lied. The rest of us did not.  

The vast majority of us seem to want to see justice for the victim(s) AKA the child(ren) who were targeted  and Katie who may not have been able to defend them.  

It is rather clear that this is not your focus.  You apparently want to give Alan Smith the benefit of the doubt (against the evidence). But even more you just want to defend the "Smith Family Image," such as it is, against the reality of these incredibly serious criminal charges.

Good luck with that.  The Smiths (not just Bret Alan Smith, Jn) are looking really dreadful at the moment.  The Mortons are looking pretty good in comparison.

Sorry I put the Mortons in parenthesis - I like them very much too.   I do not know the evidence against Alan - I have not heard it - I have no clue.  So I give the benefit of the doubt.  Also I am not trying to defend an image, but the Smiths did not make their son do that.  Plus, I don't see what the videos have to do with Alan . .  .that seemed off topic to me.  

As far as flouncing I did not even know what it was - BUT since I have been put on the "straight and narrow" I will try to be careful, courteous and respectful - okay?  Even when you insult me . . . I will take it.  BTW if you don't see me for awhile it is because I will be be busy elsewhere . . . since the information is private I will not disclose per FJ's rules about PERSEC.

[IntrinsicallyDisordered]

1 hour ago, Black Aliss said:

In the case of a child there would most likely be injuries that would still be evident months, even years later.

I've had lifelong pain and will never bear children because of what was done to me but I've just got to learn to let it goooooo lol

It only being rape if it's male on female in GA is screwed up, I know multiple states have updated their definitions in recent years, hopefully they'll catch up soon.  

@oldsalty, giving the benefit of the doubt to the accused and not the victim empowers and encourages predators.  I am giving you the benefit of the doubt that you don't realize that but I'm telling you, it does.  It is an incredibly common tactic for the abuser to tell their victim(s) that no one will believe the victim(s) and it's a tactic that works because it's true.   We need, as a society, to destroy that.

And that is part of why we can't just let it goooooo.  Evil thrives in silence and being afraid of "scandal" and the myth that the only evil is an ugly stranger lurking outside, and not the people you know and love and admire and should be able to trust.  We should never stop talking about it.