Adoptive "Mothers" part deux

[DaisyD]

I think Kimmie is Mormon. There may not be a shorter service. That being said, she's such a bitch that I'd rebel too. I'm honestly surprised that Sissy hasn't just bailed yet. It's sad to think she may not feel capable enough to get out. I don't know that, of course, it just seems like the only reason for her to still be there.

[smittykins]

I'm also surprised that Kimmie hasn't put Sissy in a group home yet(which, frankly, might be the best thing for her).

[anachronistic]

Alexandracabot- I never saw the lentil post, can you link to it please?

from the description of the church services they are definitely Mormon. 

Everything is horrible for poor Kimmie. All the kids except Apple have problems that are entirely the kids fault. Woe is her. So much sympathy. [sarcasm]

[Stormy]

8 hours ago, DaisyD said:

I think Kimmie is Mormon. There may not be a shorter service. That being said, she's such a bitch that I'd rebel too. I'm honestly surprised that Sissy hasn't just bailed yet. It's sad to think she may not feel capable enough to get out. I don't know that, of course, it just seems like the only reason for her to still be there.

Where would Sissy have to go? It seems like Kimi has a complicated relationship with her own family, so I don't think Sissy'd be able to go to a relative. It seems her only option would be a group home or a shelter. I don't know what she'd be able to do for herself beyond that, granted she probably hasn't had any real education and, though I doubt it, she might really have an intellectual disability.

Also consider that Sissy may very well love her mother, or at least not want to leave her sisters behind. For some reason I think Sissy leaving on her own accord won't bode well with Kimi, and doing so might compromise her relationship with her mother or contact with her siblings.

[littlehouse]

Add to the what church would work for the girls, why do they NEED new church shoes?  Is this still really something that they need?  Shoes for three hours a week?  It has been some thirty years since I was in a church, but do you need to be all dressed up?  Isn't the word of god more important than what is on your feet, asks the atheist.

[Maggie Mae]

Quote

This week, if I expect her to be able to behave well, I'll have to put out extra effort to keep her busy so she feels like she's accomplishing something.

 

Shouldn't Kimmy do that anyway? I mean, if that's how Sissy responds best - being busy and feeling accomplished - shouldn't the parent make that effort so Sissy can feel her best? I'm not a parent of special needs children though, so YMMV. 

[Maggie Mae]

1 hour ago, jiggleromp said:

Add to the what church would work for the girls, why do they NEED new church shoes?  Is this still really something that they need?  Shoes for three hours a week?  It has been some thirty years since I was in a church, but do you need to be all dressed up?  Isn't the word of god more important than what is on your feet, asks the atheist.

 

Mormons are kind of weird about clothing, food, and socialization.  Also super secretive, so I have no idea what happens in the three hour church session on top of the super sekrit temple ceremonies. I don't think having nice shoes is important for God, as all earthly possessions are lost when you enter the Kingdom of Heaven anyway. 

I was raised Catholic and I don't get it. Over an hour is too long for church. I went to a "poor" church though that had services in Spanish and Vietnamese. Do mormons not have services in other languages? If I thought Church was important and I had a bunch of kids who spoke Chinese, I'd look for a church - probably any denomination - that had services in whichever Chinese the kids grew up in. Not only will they have an hour or so of time where it might be "easier" for them to understand, there are bound to be people there who can help support them and help them keep some of their culture. 

BTW I'm not religious. 

[Stormy]

THIS JUST IN: They made it to church, but without Sissy. She got left with a babysitter.

Hold up; wasn't there some thing where Sissy and/or Blossom got left to run Kimi's daycare by themselves once? Or am I mistaken? And now Sissy can't be left alone? What's Kimi afraid she'll do if left to her own devices, anyway?

[keepercjr]

I just can't take how she just blames Sissy as if she chooses to act the way she does.  She comes righ out and says that she doesn't understand but still blames the crap out of her for everything she puts poor suffering Kimi through.  Of course Sissy is going to be upset being left behind while the rest of the family went out.  I can't blame her for having an attitude for the rest of the day.

and YES you need to keep her busy!  If she is as limited as you say she is then you need to put more effort in!

[Black Aliss]

4 hours ago, jiggleromp said:

Add to the what church would work for the girls, why do they NEED new church shoes?  Is this still really something that they need?  Shoes for three hours a week?  It has been some thirty years since I was in a church, but do you need to be all dressed up?  Isn't the word of god more important than what is on your feet, asks the atheist.

If the girls weren't dressed nicely, I suppose Kimi thinks it would reflect badly on her as a mother. Or the contrapositive---as long as the girls are dressed nicely, people will know she is a good mother.

[Mirla]

Link to the "Lentils" story:  http://fencingmama.blogspot.com/2012/11/its-so-worth-it.html  So much Shudder.  There are a few nuggets here that I wish she'd reconnect with, such as "Facing the facts, and accepting the child for who his is now.  This means accepting the child as he is in the moment, not for who we hope he will become." "I have stopped showing anger to the best of my ability."  And "I also try hard to start each day fresh and not bring the previous day's mistakes into the new day."  But most of it is best forgotten.

She is LDS (Mormon), and LDS are more picky about wearing the "right" clothes to church than most churches would be.  Per the Mormon FAQ:

Quote

Both men and women have dress standards they generally adhere to when attending church. Men wear sports jackets, white shirts, ties, dress pants, and dress shoes. Women wear dresses or skirts, blouses or nice sweaters, and dress shoes. Clothing is modest and not revealing. Children dress as their parents do, although most little boys don’t wear suits, substituting less expensive shirts.

That said, if someone shows up differently, it is unlikely anyone will say anything to you. One local leader said that anyone who attends our church is sent by God and so we welcome him or her. Visitors are always asked just to wear their Sunday best—and if jeans are the best you have, they are acceptable for the visit.

For Mormons, dressing nicely doesn’t mean we think God won’t love us or listen to us if we’re not dressed nicely. It is a demonstration of our own faith and love for God—a gift we choose to give Him. When we go on a job interview, meet someone important, or attend a special occasion, we wear the nicest thing we have that is appropriate for the situation. To dress less nicely or less appropriately to visit God in His home would be to suggest we don’t consider God important enough to dress up for. To most Mormons, it is a very small request from someone who has given us so much.

One would expect that some contingent of the congregation would be happy to see her family there after a long absence, and not be too concerned about a child with special shoe-fitting issues wearing "inappropriate" footwear.  However, from what I've heard, it's also very likely that some contingent of her congregation would criticize her.  I've heard plenty of tales of criticism for men wearing a pale blue shirt, and females wearing dressy pants, so I doubt it would be unheard of.

 

If the girls don't enjoy being to church, and it sounds like at least a couple of them don't, having Sissy stay home for bad behavior is only going to show them that bad behavior is their ticket out of it.

Sissy's "grin" isn't hurting anyone.  I'm not sure why K has decided to call it out.  I'm also not sure what kind of "fits" Sissy has, but I would think K should handle it the same way at church she did at the Mall.  If K is letting Sissy's behavior occupy her thoughts and eat at her, that's on K, not on Sissy.  

As someone who has taught in plenty of Sunday School classrooms, there is almost always a person who monopolizes the discussion time with non-relevant, long answers.  If it is too much for Blossom's teacher to handle on her own, K should help provide tips and tricks to how to reign some of it in, while still giving Blossom the social outlet it's apparent she so desparately craves.  

If Jie Jie struggles with hearing all the voices, they definitely shouldn't go directly from not attending church (or any other large group) at all to three hours at a time.  I think K's plan to ease into it and let Jie Jie have an out is actually a fairly sane one.

As to Apple's illnesses:  It's my belief that you can shelter your kids from getting sick now, but you can't shelter them from getting sick ever (unless they're living in a bubble, and that's no way to live).  If there's a good medical reason for Apple to avoid illness now, K's plan is a good one.  Otherwise, she's just delaying the inevitable.   It really bugs me when parents say, "I can't take my kids to super-fun-play-place because they pick up germs and get a cold every time they go there."  Yes, church isn't "super-fun-play-place," but it's possible the Nursery or Primary part that Apple is missing due to germs is about as close as she gets to that all week.

And this:  "I need to be able to sit in peace and feel God's presence around me."  Those are pretty high expectations for a single woman who is sitting in a church service with four special needs kids who are "like having a lot of little ones," and "can't comprehend the majority of the speaking around them."  I really hope she's bringing quiet activities for her kids, at least for the first worship service part.  They can be religious materials for children if it makes her feel better.  I doubt it, but I hope she is.

[nelliebelle1197]

12 hours ago, smittykins said:

I'm also surprised that Kimmie hasn't put Sissy in a group home yet(which, frankly, might be the best thing for her).

Oh, no. They might figure out KimmieKittie is a terrible "mother" and Sissy is not as disabled as Kimmiekittie needs her to be. Besides, how can she be a martyr without her hairshirt? She'd just be left with the cross to bear (Blossom) and the crown of thorns (JieJie). Soon, I am sure, when Apple outgrows Gymboree, she will be the nails...

[freejugar]

Apple will be homeschooled, right?

[dianapavelovna]

When Kimi says her girls don't understand the services, does she mean because they can't understand the English? Or is she also referring to their various SPDs and other impairments? They've all been here years. The basics of a church service & Sunday school shouldn't be beyond them.  They should be in school. I'm not at all convinced that Kimi is meeting their educational needs - and what homeschooling mom alone could, of 4 special needs ELL kids?

These kids are so isolated. Kimi posted recently about them going to an inclusive sports center, which is awesome. They go to church at least occasionally. But otherwise it's them, Kimi, her boyfriend, and appointments with OT, PT, doctors, etc. I agree with the previous poster upthread - Sissy will probably never leave on her own because it doesn't appear she has anyone to reach out to.

[Lurky]

8 hours ago, dianapavelovna said:

When Kimi says her girls don't understand the services, does she mean because they can't understand the English?

I was wondering this too.  It must me much harder for children with intellectual disabilities to learn English - BUT this is where getting specialist support comes in.  But, I have a generalised anger against the Fundy adopters who expect their children to learn English, when they won't learn the child's own language, and won't provide them with actual teachers.

[nelliebelle1197]

17 minutes ago, Lurky said:

I was wondering this too.  It must me much harder for children with intellectual disabilities to learn English - BUT this is where getting specialist support comes in.  But, I have a generalised anger against the Fundy adopters who expect their children to learn English, when they won't learn the child's own language, and won't provide them with actual teachers.

I will never be convinced that the disabilities are as severe as KimmieKittie claims. The tide may be turning against Apple of the six post birthday - she mentioned she is getting lanyards because all the girls are speech impaired. Usually those comments are followed with a caveat about Apple's genius. She also did not especially praise Apple for good behavior at church. I may be reading too much into this, but it is always the little chips with Kimmie that lead to the break.

[Lurky]

1 minute ago, nelliebelle1197 said:

I will never be convinced that the disabilities are as severe as KimmieKittie claims.

Yes, there's this, too. 

[DaisyD]

19 hours ago, Maggie Mae said:

If I thought Church was important and I had a bunch of kids who spoke Chinese, I'd look for a church - probably any denomination - that had services in whichever Chinese the kids grew up in. 

But then how would Kimmie show all the other Mormons how much of a martyr to motherhood she is?

19 hours ago, Stormy said:

THIS JUST IN: They made it to church, but without Sissy. She got left with a babysitter.

Hold up; wasn't there some thing where Sissy and/or Blossom got left to run Kimi's daycare by themselves once? Or am I mistaken? And now Sissy can't be left alone? What's Kimi afraid she'll do if left to her own devices, anyway?

Kimmie had 16 yo Sissy watching the daycare kids while she was teaching the other girls (I think that's what she was doing). I have no idea what changed, but if she's leaving an 18 yo with a babysitter, I really hope she's not still leaving that same 18 yo in charge of toddlers.

I don't know where Sissy would/could go. When she first arrived stateside she was capable enough to sneak onto a Chinese social media site to talk to one of her friends who'd been adopted around the same time. Kimmie cut that off because Sissy wouldn't learn English that way, or something. I really doubt Sissy is anywhere near as disabled as Kimmie says. Kimmie is probably one of those people who talks to all foreigners like they're slow.

[SweetFellowshipper]

I tried to read the whole thread but got too upset; with a physically disabled husband and a brother in law with Down syndrome I'm just disgusted at how "parents" like this treat disabled kids. If they're not treated like shit they can do a ton-- my BIL with Down's lives alone, has a girlfriend and supports himself with two jobs. He needed extra support and coaching to do it but he does it. It's disgusting to lack maturity and education yourself and adopt disabled kids to look like a "hero" only to complain rather than empower them. Instead of defending them, they act embarrassed by them and make assumptions about their abilities. The ableism is real. 

[freejugar]

I would really like to see Sissy getting a job outside the home, there are many opportunities for people with disabilities. I mean, she even managed a daycare for 2 ish years. I hope Kimmi paid her.

[nelliebelle1197]

14 hours ago, freejugar said:

Apple will be homeschooled, right?

No. But Kimmie will pretend she is. I doubt she will get much schooling.

[nelliebelle1197]

You know, I just went back over the birthday posts because I am supposed to be doing something I don't want to tackle at work. One of Apple's birthday posts was mostly about the gifts the Firefighter's friends bought for the older three and one was really about Kimmiekittie's creepy doll obsession and another was about KK's emotions. So really only THREE totally Apple posts. And it looks like sweet little JieJie had TWO birthday parties, one with family and one with friends, AND she got a new handmade doll wardrobe from Kimmie. So really, only the oldest girls got screwed. Just like every other day in their lives.

[Antimony]

4 hours ago, DaisyD said:

But then how would Kimmie show all the other Mormons how much of a martyr to motherhood she is?

Kimmie had 16 yo Sissy watching the daycare kids while she was teaching the other girls (I think that's what she was doing). I have no idea what changed, but if she's leaving an 18 yo with a babysitter, I really hope she's not still leaving that same 18 yo in charge of toddlers.

I don't know where Sissy would/could go. When she first arrived stateside she was capable enough to sneak onto a Chinese social media site to talk to one of her friends who'd been adopted around the same time. Kimmie cut that off because Sissy wouldn't learn English that way, or something. I really doubt Sissy is anywhere near as disabled as Kimmie says. Kimmie is probably one of those people who talks to all foreigners like they're slow.

I believe Kimmie caught Sissy frantically looking for her birth certificate or some kind of ID papers at some point and punished her for it or something similar. I think she knows way more about what is going on than Kimmie thinks she does. 

[Stormy]

So another thing that makes this situation screwed up is that you can easily find Kimi's daycare location (and, therefore, their home) by simply Googling "daycare" + "California" + "Kimi". Which is great, what with all the personal details about the girls that the world has access to. /sarcasm Here's a page from her daycare's official website. >> http://appletreemanor.com/about.htm
To save you a click, I'll just include the most important part:

Quote

This year, Apple Tree Manor officially becomes a family run business since two of my daughters will now be my assistants, according to licensing requirements. My oldest daughter, is my "right hand" as I was for my mom and is eager to be my assistant and interact with the children in our care. As a bonus, she is fluent in Mandarin and Cantonese!

Copyright 2015, Apple Tree Manor

This gives us three possibilities:

1. Kimi falsely advertised to make her daycare more appealing. (least probable)

2. We live in a multiverse where both "good" and "bad" versions of Sissy are able to exist simultaneously, and a glitch in the matrix has allowed webpages from both (or...more???) universes to be visible to the naked eye.

3. Kimi's assertion that Sissy (and possibly Blossom) is too intellectually disabled to be left alone is bullshit. (most probable)

13 minutes ago, Antimony said:

I believe Kimmie caught Sissy frantically looking for her birth certificate or some kind of ID papers at some point and punished her for it or something similar. I think she knows way more about what is going on than Kimmie thinks she does. 

That's actually really, really disturbing. Could you link me to the post?

[DaisyD]

1 hour ago, Antimony said:

I believe Kimmie caught Sissy frantically looking for her birth certificate or some kind of ID papers at some point and punished her for it or something similar. I think she knows way more about what is going on than Kimmie thinks she does. 

I remember that. Yet another reason I think Sissy has a lot more going on upstairs than Kimmie gives her credit for. I imagine it's a lot easier to play dumb with Kimmie than to try to live up to her crazy expectations.