Jessa, Ben & Spurgeon Part 3

[MayMay1123]

Dear God, I have been very very very good. Well mostly. Forgive me for that stuff last weekend, k? I really really need a house at the jersey shore of my very own. Pretty please. Thanks in advance! 

Think if I keep asking praying, I can get what I want? 

 

[2manyKidzzz]

8 minutes ago, MayMay1123 said:

Dear God, I have been very very very good. Well mostly. Forgive me for that stuff last weekend, k? I really really need a house at the jersey shore of my very own. Pretty please. Thanks in advance! 

Think if I keep asking praying, I can get what I want? 

 

Well, if this works, can we all submit requests to you!!!!!!!! ho ho I live in South Jerzee....hope you get the house!

[MayMay1123]

1 minute ago, 2manyKidzzz said:

Well, if this works, can we all submit requests to you!!!!!!!! ho ho I live in South Jerzee....hope you get the house!

I have been trying to figure out what to do about my awning that is half hanging off from the wind last night and it is so cold and nasty here that all I really want is a beach...if I had my own house I'd be there... ::sigh:: my grandmother had a house in Somers Point and I really want it back. I'll pray some more for God to just gimme what I want.

[DuggarWatch]

34 minutes ago, quiverofdoubt said:

What a cute story :).  Totally appropriate, and wonderful, for children to hang on to their sense of magic.  It's when you're 15/20/30/40 years old and still believe you don't need a diploma or a job or feel the need to get off your butt because prayer can get you anything you want.  No one ever told jill that it was probably just a coincidence, instead this magical idea kept getting, and still being, fed to her. Ask and you shall receive. No need to do.

I wonder how Michelle explained to the kids why she had miscarriages or why Grandpa Duggar died of a brain tumor or why Josh wasn't cured of sexual addiction as a teenager.  Again, God isn't Santa Claus.   

[choralcrusader8613]

9 minutes ago, DuggarWatch said:

I wonder how Michelle explained to the kids why she had miscarriages or why Grandpa Duggar died of a brain tumor or why Josh wasn't cured of sexual addiction as a teenager.  Again, God isn't Santa Claus.   

Re: the bold text: they probably trotted out something akin to, "The Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away. Blessed be the name of the Lord," a.k.a. we don't know the mind of God or something like that.

[Bad Wolf]

Yeah. God moves in mysteterious ways. Pink blanket good. Jubilee, not right now. I think God was trying to tell her something with Josie. I guess they have selective hearing.

[quiverofdoubt]

Correct me if i'm wrong. But don't they teach that god punishes for misdeeds? michelle's first m/s was considered a punishment from god for taking birth control.  So if something bad happens they look what sin is being punished. Even if they have to fabricate one.

[JesSky03]

1 hour ago, DuggarWatch said:

I wonder how Michelle explained to the kids why she had miscarriages or why Grandpa Duggar died of a brain tumor or why Josh wasn't cured of sexual addiction as a teenager.  Again, God isn't Santa Claus.   

1 hour ago, choralcrusader8613 said:

Re: the bold text: they probably trotted out something akin to, "The Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away. Blessed be the name of the Lord," a.k.a. we don't know the mind of God or something like that.

Eek, be careful in this territory. There are women on this site of who have had miscarriages AND are christians and would like to believe that their losses are part of a bigger plan and that God knows what he is doing. That DOESN'T mean rejecting science and the medical reasons behind a loss. Obviously the Duggars are a whole different breed than this but still, be careful. 

 

[quiverofdoubt]

5 minutes ago, JesSky03 said:

Eek, be careful in this territory. There are women on this site of who have had miscarriages AND are christians and would like to believe that their losses are part of a bigger plan and that God knows what he is doing. That DOESN'T mean rejecting science and the medical reasons behind a loss. Obviously the Duggars are a whole different breed than this but still, be careful. 

 

For sure! to ever, EVER blame a woman for a miscarriage....it's heinous.  First things i was told when i had mine? 1)not your fault 2) you could have done nothing differently to change the outcome 3) they are very very common, usually a genetic defect if it's first trimester.

sadly, gothard women are told otherwise, and i'm afraid that they get blamed for their m/s.  I can't imagine going through all the pain of losing a pregnancy then being told it was my fault. What a way to mistreat and beat down women. But it is part of gothard logic sadly.  I do not believe it's part of normal christianity, other than to maybe say the old stand by's :it's all part of god's plan, baby is with god now, etc. 

[choralcrusader8613]

12 minutes ago, JesSky03 said:

Eek, be careful in this territory. There are women on this site of who have had miscarriages AND are christians and would like to believe that their losses are part of a bigger plan and that God knows what he is doing. That DOESN'T mean rejecting science and the medical reasons behind a loss. Obviously the Duggars are a whole different breed than this but still, be careful. 

I'm sorry that my tone came off as disrespectful. I'm also Christian, and I try to trust in God's plan, even when it's been very hard. I don't think that even religious people can totally know God's plan, because God's not a kid just messing around (if God is as powerful as people think he is). I was speaking out of annoyance that the Duggars believed that God called them to give up any kind of BC, NFP, or anything similar, but then when they're told that, at the very least, it was going to be much harder for Michelle to have more children, they kept trying and trying to have another kid.

If I offended anybody, please accept my apology.

[JesSky03]

2 minutes ago, choralcrusader8613 said:

I'm sorry that my tone came off as disrespectful. I'm also Christian, and I try to trust in God's plan, even when it's been very hard. I don't think that even religious people can totally know God's plan, because God's not a kid just messing around (if God is as powerful as people think he is). I was speaking out of annoyance that the Duggars believed that God called them to give up any kind of BC, NFP, or anything similar, but then when they're told that, at the very least it was going to be much harder for Michelle to have more children, they kept trying and trying to have another kid.

If I offended anybody, please accept my apology.

Not offended, just pointing out that some people do believe God has a plan, even when bad things happen. Also, while I'm in a healthy place right now, there may be women still trying to get there. I do know where you were going though, most normal people don't use those events to justify some completely ridiculous notion like swearing off birth control forever. And even if we had those crazy thoughts at one point most of  us come back down to reality once we have come to terms with the situation. 

[Whoosh]

15 minutes ago, JesSky03 said:

Not offended, just pointing out that some people do believe God has a plan, even when bad things happen. Also, while I'm in a healthy place right now, there may be women still trying to get there. I do know where you were going though, most normal people don't use those events to justify some completely ridiculous notion like swearing off birth control forever. And even if we had those crazy thoughts at one point most of  us come back down to reality once we have come to terms with the situation. 

I totally agree with what you are saying here with a however.  I try to be very careful what I say so that I don't totally offend others (particularly when they are having a hard time).  Yet there are limits.  For example, I will eventually treat others with only about 10 times the level of respect they afford me in a similar situation.  Many, many people of faith are wonderful, respectful, etc.  Many others are flat out nasty to people not just like them.  And many others simply have blind spots to the fact that others have legitimate differences in their beliefs or that their views could possibly be offensive.

So, I agree we should all try to be respectful of people, particularly when they are recovering from a traumatic event.  However, if individuals choose to force me to listen to their rantings about how my life partner died at the age of 36 because a supernatural being I don't believe in has a plan or because we were punished for holding the wrong beliefs or because he was an Irish Catholic or because people prayed wrong or didn't pray enough or WHATEVER - at some point I will stop being polite, courteous, and careful.  I really can't imagine why anyone would expect anything different.

My sincere condolences to everyone out there who has lived through a significant loss.  I hope everyone finds a way that works for them to come to peace with it all.  For a long time I didn't think that would be possible, but it proved possible for me.  

ETA - I know non-believers can be flat out nasty, etc also.  This truly is a two way street in my opinion.

[ksgranola1]

1 hour ago, choralcrusader8613 said:

Re: the bold text: they probably trotted out something akin to, "The Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away. Blessed be the name of the Lord," a.k.a. we don't know the mind of God or something like that.

Yeah, she did say just that.

[Bad Wolf]

I think JB said it. Although I thought she was crazy to have another baby after she and Josie almost lost their lives, I did feel for her. That same week my DIL miscarried our first grandchild.

So, sympathy aside, it still makes me crazy that they are so cavalier about pregnancy

[quiverofdoubt]

1 minute ago, Bad Wolf said:

I think JB said it. Although I thought she was crazy to have another baby after she and Josie almost lost their lives, I did feel for her. That same week my DIL miscarried our first grandchild.

So, sympathy aside, it still makes me crazy that they are so cavalier about pregnancy

Michelle has been incredibly lucky- only two losses and 19 live births. Even with josie included she's beat the odds there.  All those healthy generally straightforward pregnancy history probably makes her feel like it's no big deal. While others suffer loss after loss after loss.  I'm on pregnancy 4, have one successful birth and one expected in April.   I'm part of a women's health issue group where most of the women have had a miscarriage.  Some as many as 10 or more.   A homeschool friend of mine lost a baby at 20 weeks, no real reason found. Michelle has just been very very lucky. She probably 

[socalrules]

The problem with the Duggars is that it would never occur to them that most believers can pray, go to church and still go to school/work. 

Granted I am Catholic and going to hell in the Duggars' eyes, but I may pray to St. Jude for the impossible, St. Anthony to help me find something and I always light a candle before the Sacred Heart but I still get my ass up everyday and go to work like I believe Jesus wants. I never got the memo that I don't have to do anything as long as I pray. Hell, I prayed for a good job, got one and intend to work hard to keep it. Jesus wasn't lazy so why would he expect us to be? 

What happened to faith without works is dead? I don't recall a passage about sitting on your ass, grifting and waiting for others to do for you while you "flaunt" your religious superiority. I would worry about having to stand before God one day and explain why I neglected whatever talent he gave me so I could play perfect Christian on a reality show while I looked down on others. 

[choralcrusader8613]

4 minutes ago, socalrules said:

I don't recall a passage about sitting on your ass, grifting and waiting for others to do for you while you "flaunt" your religious superiority. I would worry about having to stand before God one day and explain why I neglected whatever talent he gave me so I could play perfect Christian on a reality show while I looked down on others. 

Paul even addresses believers being lazy in one of his epistles (2 Thessalonians 3:10-15):

Quote

10 For even when we were with you, we gave you this command: Anyone unwilling to work should not eat. 11 For we hear that some of you are living in idleness, mere busybodies, not doing any work. 12 Now such persons we command and exhort in the Lord Jesus Christ to do their work quietly and to earn their own living. 13 Brothers and sisters, do not be weary in doing what is right.

14 Take note of those who do not obey what we say in this letter; have nothing to do with them, so that they may be ashamed. 15 Do not regard them as enemies, but warn them as believers.[g]

So, who wants to do their Christian duty with regards to the Duggars LOL?

[Valerie3kids]

2 hours ago, quiverofdoubt said:

Michelle has been incredibly lucky- only two losses and 19 live births. Even with josie included she's beat the odds there.  All those healthy generally straightforward pregnancy history probably makes her feel like it's no big deal. While others suffer loss after loss after loss.  I'm on pregnancy 4, have one successful birth and one expected in April.   I'm part of a women's health issue group where most of the women have had a miscarriage.  Some as many as 10 or more.   A homeschool friend of mine lost a baby at 20 weeks, no real reason found. Michelle has just been very very lucky. She probably 

She has been very lucky and I was pretty stunned when she announced she was pregnant with the Jubillee (?) after all the problems both she and Josie had endured to survive. I sometimes wonder if they just do not grasp how close Michelle was to losing her life. Or if it has just been brushed under the rug? I really don't think JB gets it at all and I don't think he could emotionally continue without Michelle.

Miscarriages suck. I can find no other word to describe them. My daughter suffered her fourth last week and it just rips my heart out. She has a three year old miracle and wants another. She suffered three losses before our grandson was born. They have identified her problem and we were all hoping she would have an easier time this time around. No, such luck. It is so hard to watch someone you care so deeply suffer so and not be able to help. I, as her mother want to FIX IT. NOW. I need to make it all better for her and I can not. My heart goes out to all those who suffered losses. You carry them with you for the rest of your days.

[Kjaerringa]

Oh, you sillies.....of COURSE Ben is a writer!! Remember his magnificent command of the language in the 'majestic pearls' letter? 

[season of life]

9 minutes ago, Kjaerringa said:

Oh, you sillies.....of COURSE Ben is a writer!! Remember his magnificent command of the language in the 'majestic pearls' letter? 

Oh my God, don't remind me of that letter. That little love letter always shows me how immature he really is. He had no business courting Jessa or anyone else at that age.

[Mercer]

I really don't think the Duggars have given the kids a good financial foundation at all. Regardless of whether they have some sort of lump sum or gradual payout, don't have any debt, or are spectacularly frugal at managing their money... if not enough is coming in (or if what's coming in is based on the whims of the fickle TV show audience or other people's willingness to donate,) it's not sustainable. Even if they somehow have enough money to last for this generation, what about the next one? What about the children of the children who have no idea how to hold down a job? What if each Duggar kidult spawns even a fraction of the number of non-earning adults that their parents did? It may be fine for now, but it increases exponentially and it can't last forever.

I won't buy that the Duggar children learned solid financial skills until I see gainful employment becoming a priority. 

[2manyKidzzz]

Well, we know that they learned to shop used and save the difference. Have we heard any other wise financial advice? We know the communal info that they have rental properties and other things but not all of it. I thought i remembered they have property they rent for cell phone towers.....and then a property they bought outright I think when Josie and Meecheelle were in Little Rock which they rent. 

They can't go out and work for someone else. That's what I understand. 

[LittleSpouseOnThePrairie]

On February 24, 2016 at 7:25 PM, nst said:

this - they won't have a platform of being secretive anymore - we know they have sex - we saw it in the TH's last time - the passion was flowed and gone - the courtship is over  - they cut toenails in front of each other

the real funny thing will be Jessa calling Spurgeon his full name on tv and not cringing 

Lol I was referring to the sex of the baby, not the act of sex ;-)

[Gemini]

17 hours ago, boston2495 said:

Oh gosh, I wouldn't even trust them with that! Not with their family's track records with pets! #freemeow 

This!

rocks... they can have pet rocks! 

[FlamingFundie]

9 hours ago, 2manyKidzzz said:

Well, we know that they learned to shop used and save the difference. Have we heard any other wise financial advice? We know the communal info that they have rental properties and other things but not all of it. I thought i remembered they have property they rent for cell phone towers.....and then a property they bought outright I think when Josie and Meecheelle were in Little Rock which they rent. 

They can't go out and work for someone else. That's what I understand. 

I seem to recall Michelle teaching about bankruptcy laws in SOTDRT. We also know that JB and Michelle attended some sort of financial seminars to begin their debt-free journey. I *think* I remember in some of the "pre-marital counseling" to either jill-derick or jessa-bin where they gave them scenarios about different money scenarios to see how they would work through them (perhaps involving some sort of car trouble?), so it can be assumed that there is more than just those splotches of money advice going around the Duggar house. And we have seen the effects of the children believing everything their parents say as gospel, so I think we can safely assume as well that the kids have picked up on any financial skills the parents have demonstrated (as in the buy used save the difference mantra).

Going out and working for someone else is another matter entirely, in my opinion. Im not arguing you there! But I do think that we don't know what is in their bank accounts/wallets, and we don't know how they do their budgets (if they have one, which I strongly assume they do). Im not AT ALL arguing that they can comfortably live forever off whatever their money gives them right now. But I DO think they aren't given enough credit just yet as far as managing the money they do/might have. For all we know, they might have a nice amount socked away and have such a strict budget with low bills that they've calculated they can live off that income for months (ie, til the next season!). This is obviously just my own humble opinion.

Something else to consider too is whether they invest. If JB has invested money in a good Roth or something along those lines, with a good bit of his TLC money he could easily live off the money those investments make. Perhaps Derick already had been doing so before he met Jill since he was a Real Live Accountant (tm) and now has encouraged all the kidults to invest in such a way. We just don't know.