3rd Degree Burns on a Child: Priesthood blessing THEN 911

[DGayle]

I've got the location, and yes, I will be calling. DHS there is closed tonight, so I will be calling in the morning after a couple appointments I have (since I don't neglect my kids' needs), or between, if I can make the time. I'll be taking my computer with me, and I have the info in a file to have all in one place. If this isn't a hoax, then this is deadly-bad parenting by people who have no idea they could have killed their son.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

Theyre real people you just have to google Andy and Natalie Goddard and doterra

[doggie]

I burned my leg when I was around 11. 3rd degree I thought It was ok as it did not hurt. Finally shows my mom and off to the hospital to become a financial burden. They took the dead skin off around 11 pm never felt it. Got out of Bed in the morning and when i stepped down I screamed it hurt so bad. But I had two skin grafts as some spots did not take and even 40 years later no real feeling but it does itch a lot sometimes for years after really badly. Kept finding pieces of black thread popping out.

[Mama Mia]

Um...so the dad supposedly started this blog about only one of his children, who coincidentally just happened to have a horrific accident the next day? And said horrific accident is made a thousand percent better because of some product the family shills? After people are done buying their essential oils I have a nice bridge for sale. :roll:

Also, that photo of his arm looks incredibly fake. It looks like they painted in the burned parts. I know sometimes burns can look so bright that they don't seem real-- but that arm really looks to me like someone colored in the red parts.

Plus, what are the odds that about half of normal friends and family commenting would throw in a plug for the oils? A kid gets burned almost to death and the thing people notice is the oils???i don't think so. Although, if it is a scam ( which I strongly think is likely. ) they were really smart in that they promote their product in every single post. But they don't give the brand name -- they let all the commenters do that. Clever.

[Sola]

Additionally, I remember learning in school that third degree burns typically hurt less than second degree because the tissue damage is so deep that the nerve endings are affected and can't feel the pain. Perhaps a FJer in the medical field can confirm or deny.

When you get burned you have a mixture of 1. surface, 2. superficial partial thickness, 3. deep partial thickness, 4. full thickness and 5. fourth degree (if it's really bad). The painful burns are surface and superficial partial thickness. More severe burns don't hurt. I had a mixture of 1, 2, and 3 and one small area of 4. The parts which were 1 & 2 were agonising. There really is no pain like it.

Not medical just personal experience.

[ILoveJellybeans]

Theres a fourth degree? I didn't know that.

I just looked it up and its a miracle this kid is alive, as they have done everything you are not supposed to do to serious burns.

[Firiel]

This whole thing is so horrific! It doesn't appear to be a straight scam-- it really seems like this kid was severely burned. So it seems that the only two possibilities are that the family really did put oil in his wounds, soak him in non-sterile water, and find a doctor that let them continue with these oils or that he is burned but the oil treatment stuff isn't true. Which would mean they are lying and exploiting their kid's horrific injuries to sell a product.

DGayle, I'm glad you called/will call DHS on this issue. It's just so awful and dangerous it's unreal.

[polecat]

This whole thing is so horrific! It doesn't appear to be a straight scam-- it really seems like this kid was severely burned. So it seems that the only two possibilities are that the family really did put oil in his wounds, soak him in non-sterile water, and find a doctor that let them continue with these oils or that he is burned but the oil treatment stuff isn't true. Which would mean they are lying and exploiting their kid's horrific injuries to sell a product.

DGayle, I'm glad you called/will call DHS on this issue. It's just so awful and dangerous it's unreal.

Yeah, while I prefer this outcome, it's still grotesquely distasteful. It's not like the kid got a small burn while taking something out of the oven. This looks like a serious, life-threatening situation, and the first thing the parents can think of is, "Hey, maybe we can make some money off this!" :censor2: :angry-cussingblack: :angry-screaming:

ETA: It appears to have been a fireworks accident (surprised it wasn't in the news), and a medic has left a comment on the page:

"Goddard family,

Hello my name is Wade, one of the flight medics with AirMed that airlifted your son to the University of Utah Hospital on that tragic day. I wanted to reach out to you and assure you that myself and my nurse took excellent care of your son as I would have my very own son. I do understand how hard it would be turning son over to someone you have never met before and flying to a different location for treatment. Thank you for trusting us in treating Max, he did great in transport! I am hoping I can stop by for a visit to say hello to you all and Max the next time I am at the U. Thank you for allowing us to take care of Max and please feel free to get ahold of me for anything.

Wade spivey

Flight Medic

University of Utah AirMed"

[Knight of Ni]

The entire entry sounds like something is off. No child would stand at the sink and rub dead skin off his arms as if it was completely normal. No one would calmly ask for scissors to cut a piece of dead skin that was peeling off. It says that they tried to kill the flames as he walked down the hall. I don't know about him but if I was on fire I wouldn't be walking anywhere. Hopefully I would be doing the stop, drop, and roll procedure I learned about in school.

Definitely sounds like a scam to me. I really hope for the child's sake that it is a scam. People who sell products from companies like that tend to want everyone to believe that their products are miracle products. If it is not a scam that poor kid has a long, difficult road to recovery. A friend of mine suffered 3rd degree burns several years ago. After spending an extended period of time in the hospital treatment continued at home for several months. He had to keep his legs wrapped and rub them with medicated lotion every day. I remember he had to continue wearing bandage for at least a year afterwards.

[chaotic life]

Outside of my medical training, I have one personal experience with severe burns. Oldest daughter got oil splatter burns cooking in the kitchen. Oil splatter is unique in that the margins of lesser burns are very small or non existent. Hospital ER said they were third degree but specialized burn center said severe second but just missed third.

She had no sensation. She was in the kitchen yelling for me to please help her and she was just so sorry. She was running cold tap water over her hand and arm. I pulled her arm out of the water, saw dangling skin, grabbed a clean towel (couldn't find anything sterile fast and knew the ER would clean it aeseptically) and headed for the ER. We were three blocks from the hospital and could get their faster than calling an ambulance.

She only had burns up one arm. She still got skin grafts the next day at the burn center. ER cleaned it, applied sterile dressings and set her up to be seen at the burn center first thing the next morning. Burn center debrieded it, applied skin grafts and covered with a shark skin paper that they then covered with a sterile dressing. We had to leave that on for several days and then change the dressing daily for three weeks. The areas with grafts we put nothing on, and the areas that had been too small for grafting, they have us a sterile ointment to apply.

They said if the burns had been any larger, she would have gone inpatient, and it was only 2% burns.

The level of care and attention and required sterility required for her small burns, compared to the claims this family is making for such massive burns. Either the medical providers are incompetent or these people are idiots. I really don't believe the providers are incompetent. I think they are likely letting the parents be in denial. They do have the right to be in denial so long as the child is actually getting proper care. I absolutely cannot believe they are allowing those burns to be irrigated with essential oils daily.

[DGayle]

ETA: It appears to have been a fireworks accident (surprised it wasn't in the news), and a medic has left a comment on the page:

"Goddard family,

Hello my name is Wade, one of the flight medics with AirMed that airlifted your son to the University of Utah Hospital on that tragic day. I wanted to reach out to you and assure you that myself and my nurse took excellent care of your son as I would have my very own son. I do understand how hard it would be turning son over to someone you have never met before and flying to a different location for treatment. Thank you for trusting us in treating Max, he did great in transport! I am hoping I can stop by for a visit to say hello to you all and Max the next time I am at the U. Thank you for allowing us to take care of Max and please feel free to get ahold of me for anything.

Wade spivey

Flight Medic

University of Utah AirMed"

Is it just me, or does that sound defensive, like the Goddards are complaining that Max received substandard care? Why else would that medic feel any need to assure them?

[DGayle]

I'll be blunt I've called CPS before when I've suspected non-controversial child abuse or neglect. Unfortunately stuff like the Pearls' methods are seen as parenting choices. Not feeding a child (several months ago,I overheard a downstairs neighbor insisting his baby only needed one can of formula a month, and wasn't getting more, so I called, and found out later that the young parents somehow didn't realize that that's not true, but also didn't have the money, and so were set up with resources to help), publicly beating a child, etc., will result in me calling.

I have never had a worker, while I was on the phone, be stunned enough to look up right there, with me on the phone, whether or not someone is already in the system. He was shocked they weren't, and asked if I'm sure they're in that area. I told him 99% sure, and the boy's location is the U of U burn unit, as posted on their blog. The way I understand it is giving any information to a called isn't allowed, but I now know that they're not already in the system.

He asked if I thought the doctor knew about the delay in care, and I told him I didn't know, that they didn't post one way or the other, but presumably didn't tell the doctor that they watched TV first.

"He asked to watch Studio C. In the episode we watched, a man pretended to be covered in flames and put them out. We saw it as a tender mercy that God knew Max."

"We started rubbing Frankincense & Grapefruit on Max’s feet every 5 minutes and applying to pressure points for liver and kidney." BEFORE getting any consent to do this.

Those are the two points I drove home. Critical situation with a delay in care for a child who was literally on fire and who ended up cutting off dangling skin for the sake of a bath and TV, and administering their brand of care without telling anyone.

Reports can be made anonymously, but I gave my contact information when asked, as I always do. I doubt I'll hear anything back since there wouldn't be a reason to inform me directly, so I guess all the rest of us can do now is keep watching the blog in case there's anything new that we need to make sure is brought to CPS's attention, or maybe the Goddards will post a post about how they had a little visit and converted the worker to the magical powers of essential oils.

[Firiel]

Guys, did they edit the blog post? No mention of using scissors to cut off dead skin anymore. No mention of essential oils pre-hospital. And the delay between accident and transport to the hospital is not emphasized anymore. Or am I looking in the wrong place?

[ViolaSebastian]

Guys, did they edit the blog post? No mention of using scissors to cut off dead skin anymore. No mention of essential oils pre-hospital. And the delay between accident and transport to the hospital is not emphasized anymore. Or am I looking in the wrong place?

They most definitely did. I remember it saying that they dumped an entire bottle of lilac essential oil over his head, the bit about the scissors (because that was awful), talking about how he was saying he was 'so sorry, Mom and Dad', and how he asked to watch Studio C, a television show of which I'd never previously heard.

It's highly, highly suspicious to me that the parts that DGayle emphasized (the delay in care) has suddenly been deleted. I certainly hope someone got a screen shot or that CPS had a look before it got edited.

[Firiel]

Well, I posted this comment:

Why did you remove the part of this post about treating his burns with doTerra essential oils initially? It’s clear that your initial dousing of the burns with these oils was integral to saving his life, and you should include that information so that any other family who (God forbid!) faces a similar situation will know what to do!

Praying for a speedy recovery for Max!

It's awaiting moderation, so we'll see if it gets approved...

[sol]

yep, it has definitely been edited. did anyone get a screen shot?

and according to their latest post, they're irrigating the burns with the oil mixture every two hours. :liar:

[feministxtian]

yep, it has definitely been edited. did anyone get a screen shot?

and according to their latest post, they're irrigating the burns with the oil mixture every two hours. :liar:

WHAT????? Ummm....last I remember, most ICUs have definite rules about who can do what to the patient. When the STBX was in ICU there were pretty strict rules as to what I could do for him vs. medical staff. I think I was limited to not much more than changing the tv channel once he was conscious enough to want to watch TV. Everything else had to go through the nurse and much of it went up to the doctor, including a bed bath. He was also in a University medical center but here in Arizona.

[church_of_dog]

The part about Max planning to go on a mission trip in August has been removed too. It was (IIRC) in the "about Max" post.

If this story is true (which I'm very skeptical of), then obviously he/they won't be going. But why remove the information if it was true at the time it was written?

I just can't decide whether I believe these are oblivious/ignorant people to whom this really happened, or whether they are deceitful scammers who made the accident up.

[Firiel]

The part about Max planning to go on a mission trip in August has been removed too. It was (IIRC) in the "about Max" post.

If this story is true (which I'm very skeptical of), then obviously he/they won't be going. But why remove the information if it was true at the time it was written?

I just can't decide whether I believe these are oblivious/ignorant people to whom this really happened, or whether they are deceitful scammers who made the accident up.

They've got their real names, pictures, and a large social/business network attached to the accident, so I can't imagine they are making it up completely. They stand to lose a LOT if they are found out as they are certainly not anonymous. I wonder if they are making up the essential oil stuff in order to sell more products, though. Just to make a quick buck off their son's nearly fatal accident, yaknow.

[nokidsmom]

WHAT????? Ummm....last I remember, most ICUs have definite rules about who can do what to the patient. When the STBX was in ICU there were pretty strict rules as to what I could do for him vs. medical staff. I think I was limited to not much more than changing the tv channel once he was conscious enough to want to watch TV. Everything else had to go through the nurse and much of it went up to the doctor, including a bed bath. He was also in a University medical center but here in Arizona.

No way is any hospital allowing a burn patient's burns to be irrigated with an oil mixture.

And I would think that when he was brought into the ER they would see this oil that was applied and ask questions.

The story is plausible as far as the burns happening but this whole oil business, not sure. Either made up or they are incredibly, incredibly stupid and would think there's probably a social worker already on their case. When my nephew was a baby, he suffered near kidney failure due to a kinked ureter, which they didn't know about until then, they thought it was an infection. My SIL was downright interrogated when she brought him to the hospital because he was in such bad shape and the social worker was wanting to charge her with medical neglect. And she didn't even make the idiotic decisions these people did.

[sol]

WHAT????? Ummm....last I remember, most ICUs have definite rules about who can do what to the patient. When the STBX was in ICU there were pretty strict rules as to what I could do for him vs. medical staff. I think I was limited to not much more than changing the tv channel once he was conscious enough to want to watch TV. Everything else had to go through the nurse and much of it went up to the doctor, including a bed bath. He was also in a University medical center but here in Arizona.

according to the blog:

The burns require an environment that is moist and antibacterial. Up until last night, we would mist his body once a day with a combination of oils (Frankincense, Lavender, Myrrh, and Helichrysum) and then they would apply Silvadene creme with silver in it. We were feeling like Max needed more and wasn’t getting enough for the level of healing that he was ready for. We explored options together. We were both frustrated and couldn’t see another way. Natalie said a silent prayer that angels could work with the doctor and the head nurse to inspire them. The head nurse suddenly blurted out, what if we use the Sulfur irrigation method that we use after skin grafts. This method uses tubes with holes to literally irrigate and carry an antibacterial solution to the burns. So last night, they switched from the dressings being a Silvadene cream to this “irrigation†method. First, they put gauze on the burns, then liquid in rubber tubes with holes in them, then medical bandages. They are allowing us to pour our oil mixture through the rubber tubes every 4 hours (and we just transitioned to every 2 hours!!) instead of applying oils once per day with the Silvadene!

The part about Max planning to go on a mission trip in August has been removed too. It was (IIRC) in the "about Max" post.

i thought that, too, but it turns out that it was/is in the "Give to Healing Hands" section of the blog (the link is in the upper right-hand corner next to the magnifying glass icon).

[church_of_dog]

i thought that, too, but it turns out that it was/is in the "Give to Healing Hands" section of the blog (the link is in the upper right-hand corner next to the magnifying glass icon).

Aha, I should have checked that too before posting that it was missing. Thanks for the catch!

[DGayle]

Guys, did they edit the blog post? No mention of using scissors to cut off dead skin anymore. No mention of essential oils pre-hospital. And the delay between accident and transport to the hospital is not emphasized anymore. Or am I looking in the wrong place?

They edited it.

[ViolaSebastian]

They edited it.

It makes me wonder if a social worker paid them a visit...

[DGayle]

Guys, did they edit the blog post? No mention of using scissors to cut off dead skin anymore. No mention of essential oils pre-hospital. And the delay between accident and transport to the hospital is not emphasized anymore. Or am I looking in the wrong place?

cache:maxgoddard.com/the-accident You'll need to copy/paste that exactly. I left off the http://www. part to make sure it didn't link back, and then copied that link exactly to make sure it works.

The unedited version. Better than screen caps. I'm going through the press-1-press-2 stuff to talk to a social worker again.