Alyssa and John 4: SOTDRT Next Generation

[Melissa1977]

12 hours ago, FaithAndReason said:

I thought homeschooling was supposed to be this warm and fuzzy family experience where mothers were educating their children to not only teach them but build these unbreakable family bonds with faith and education?

Fundie homeschooling is just a way to isolate children from heathens and also a way to keep the mothers always inside home. 

Of course, it was why fundies 1st generation did it. The 2nd generation like Alyssa is doing it because it's the only approved way in their families. But it's gonna happen like with pants, workingmoms and birth control: some couples are changing their views and others will imitate. I'm sure we will soon see fundiegrandkids at school. Not all of them (and probably not Alyssa's) but it's going to happen sooner than later.

[rebeccawriter01]

5 hours ago, Melissa1977 said:

Fundie homeschooling is just a way to isolate children from heathens and also a way to keep the mothers always inside home. 

Of course, it was why fundies 1st generation did it. The 2nd generation like Alyssa is doing it because it's the only approved way in their families. But it's gonna happen like with pants, workingmoms and birth control: some couples are changing their views and others will imitate. I'm sure we will soon see fundiegrandkids at school. Not all of them (and probably not Alyssa's) but it's going to happen sooner than later.

I agree we will see it as these newer parents begin to meld their thinking and experiences. Alyssa and John are both influenced by their own families to homeschool. However, some of the other husbands were educated in private schools or even public schools. Their experience may take priority with the couple trying to mimic the Bates family's experience. That being said, it will take a while before someone jumps on that ship.

Zach and Whitney - I think they will try home school at first, but might be the first to break from it. She's going to want to follow the Bates lead, but he may step in to push for at least a co-op to lessen the stress on her. 

Erin and Chad - Erin is more in charge there and will surely insist on home school.

Alyssa and John - John's father is very much pro home school and he's likely to want that for his children too. Even if Alyssa is hesitant, she's going to go with it and him.

Tori and Bobby  - Bobby would not have a problem with public or private school for Kade. However, Tori's degree is going to come into play there. Plus, he's a bit like Chad with his catering to his wife's desires and whims. 

Josie and Kelton - I could see them seeking out a private school that offered religious education too. 

Carlin and Evan - She's going to do whatever her sisters and doing. Home school offers her the chance to be the center of attention again by requiring the children to listen to her. 

 

[JermajestyDuggar]

I definitely see homeschool co-ops becoming very popular amongst the Bates married couples. 

[rebeccawriter01]

On 9/29/2019 at 7:57 AM, mollysmom said:

Wait! What??? That sounds terrifying! (This coming from the girl that went to the chiropractor for the first time in my life a few days ago & started crying when I walked into the room & saw the table they use. It looked like a table of torture!! So, yeah...I'm admittedly a huge baby when it comes to any medical procedures lol) 

That one wasn't too bad. I messed up and moved so they had to move the table more than once. Essentially they strap you to the table and brace your feet on a foot rest. You lie flat for about five minutes. After that they raise you to a standing position. You have to stay in that position (motionless) for 45 minutes and report any issue like nausea, palpitations, dizziness, etc. If you didn't pass out, they will give you meds that make you pass out and they measure your heart rate, etc. 

I had a harder time with the stress test with medication. I had a broken foot so I couldn't do the treadmill. Instead they give you an iv that makes your heart think you're exercising. The technician who put in my IV messed up and gave me the meds early. I kept telling her something was wrong, as they weren't even monitoring me on an ultrasound yet. But she was a know it all and told me it was all in my head. I ended up passing out. I came to with a doctor, the tech, a nurse, and the office manager looking down at me. They got me stable and the office manager walked me out to where my father was waiting so he could drive me home. She had the nerve to say, "We won't charge you for today. Come back next week and try the test again."

[kmachete14]

I teach my 5th graders using Socratic Seminars usually once a week. In high school we always had discussion, back and forth with the teacher or with the other students. College was all seminars, with 8-10 classmates sitting around a table with a professor. 

There is always a place for silent reading, independent study, and time to write essays. But to me, an integral part of education is discovering new things through discussion (and Socrates thought the same!).

Of course fundies don't want anyone changing their mind or questioning the status quo. This method of homeschooling is perfect for them. 

I have a feeling the unaccredited Bible colleges teach by lecture only and do not allow for free thought and discussion. Did anyone here attend a Bible college and can confirm/deny?

[HereticHick]

Rep. Daniel Webster and his staff are all excited about meeting the President today in Webster's district. Wonder if Alyssa and John attended as well?

 

[SassyPants]

20 minutes ago, HereticHick said:

Rep. Daniel Webster and his staff are all excited about meeting the President today in Webster's district. Wonder if Alyssa and John attended as well?

 

Power, control and money before country.

Power, control and money before God.

God, God, God until power, control and money enter the equation!

[Audrey2]

7 hours ago, HereticHick said:

Rep. Daniel Webster and his staff are all excited about meeting the President today in Webster's district. Wonder if Alyssa and John attended as well?

 

My guess is yes, Alyssa and John attended, although they may not admit it on social media. Knowing how politicians love to roll out their extended family, I can't believe that Dan Webster would allow any of his children to miss this "opportunity". They don't have to post about it- as I recall, Gil and Kelly Bates are masters of redirection when they are actually attending an ATI event.

[formergothardite]

16 hours ago, SassyPants said:

God, God, God until power, control and money enter the equation!

All those years claiming that morals mattered above all else and they dropped morals the second they had the chance at power. Behaving in a godly manner no longer matters to them. All that matters is power and they give no fucks how they get it or who gets hurt along the way. 

8 hours ago, Audrey2 said:

My guess is yes, Alyssa and John attended, although they may not admit it on social media. Knowing how politicians love to roll out their extended family, I can't believe that Dan Webster would allow any of his children to miss this "opportunity". They don't have to post about it- as I recall, Gil and Kelly Bates are masters of redirection when they are actually attending an ATI event.

I agree. I find it hard to believe that they wouldn't be there.  I think Alyssa knows there would be bad press if she posted about seeing Trump. Her family seems well versed in lying by misdirection. 

[Audrey2]

2 hours ago, formergothardite said:

All those years claiming that morals mattered above all else and they dropped morals the second they had the chance at power. Behaving in a godly manner no longer matters to them. All that matters is power and they give no fucks how they get it or who gets hurt along the way. 

 

The truth is, only abortion, gay issues, and maintaining white supremacy have mattered for years. they like to preach about the morals, but really are just voting for the party that wants to keep them on top. They might use pretty words to try to hide this, but essentially it's been going on for 30 years with talk about the welfare queens and how they're portrayed, the tightening of abortion regulations, and even not doing as much as could be done for AIDS back in the 80s and early 90s.

Edited October 4, 2019 by Audrey2

[HereticHick]

13 hours ago, Audrey2 said:

My guess is yes, Alyssa and John attended, although they may not admit it on social media. Knowing how politicians love to roll out their extended family, I can't believe that Dan Webster would allow any of his children to miss this "opportunity". They don't have to post about it- as I recall, Gil and Kelly Bates are masters of redirection when they are actually attending an ATI event.

3 cute little girls in matching red-white-blue outfits. 

[llg1234]

Alyssa and John may not have gone, as they appear to be watching two of John's nieces. Also:

She says she's done (for now). Is she actually preventing somehow? My guess is they're using NFI or barrier, but I still wouldn't be surprised she ends up with #4 next year. I am surprised she would publicly say she doesn't want any more kids, for now.

[JermajestyDuggar]

8 hours ago, llg1234 said:

Alyssa and John may not have gone, as they appear to be watching two of John's nieces. Also:

She says she's done (for now). Is she actually preventing somehow? My guess is they're using NFI or barrier, but I still wouldn't be surprised she ends up with #4 next year. I am surprised she would publicly say she doesn't want any more kids, for now.

Alyssa has hinted at possibly preventing before. They have said they wanted only 6 kids at the beginning of their marriage. The other quiverful fundies always answer with that stupid quiverful way by saying, “as many as god wants to give us.” I’m not surprised by them preventing. Like you, I’m surprised that she would admit it on instagram. 

[llg1234]

2 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Alyssa has hinted at possibly preventing before. They have said they wanted only 6 kids at the beginning of their marriage. The other quiverful fundies always answer with that stupid quiverful way by saying, “as many as god wants to give us.” I’m not surprised by them preventing. Like you, I’m surprised that she would admit it on instagram. 

When Alyssa was having her heart problems, I could see them preventing due to the possibly of complications. Now though? They seem to think Alyssa is 'healed' and she might not be taking any heart meds atm (I'm not a medical professional though, so I could be wrong). Yet, she seems to have made it clear she doesn't plan on having another kid anytime soon. 

I'm always super skeptical of fundies who say they're happy with the number of kids they have. Alyssa comes off as "fundie lite," but I don't trust a word she says about anything.

Basically, I'm agreeing with everything you said. I just have more thoughts on the matter, lol.

[lumpentheologie]

She said after Lexi that they were happy with two for now, and then a few months later announced Zoey.  I believed her then, but never again, lol. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

I wonder what a doctor would tell her about waiting. Maybe there is a suggested amount of time to wait before she should get pregnant again. Just in case it comes back. 

[Italiangirl]

1 hour ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I wonder what a doctor would tell her about waiting. Maybe there is a suggested amount of time to wait before she should get pregnant again. Just in case it comes back. 

In the post after her I think second visit with the doc, Alyssa said that the problem could come back in six months from that visit, but after those six months If she hasn't any symptoms she will be considered fully healed. So I think we could expect #4 around mid 2020

[nelliebelle1197]

8 hours ago, llg1234 said:

When Alyssa was having her heart problems, I could see them preventing due to the possibly of complications. Now though? They seem to think Alyssa is 'healed' and she might not be taking any heart meds atm (I'm not a medical professional though, so I could be wrong). Yet, she seems to have made it clear she doesn't plan on having another kid anytime soon. 

I'm always super skeptical of fundies who say they're happy with the number of kids they have. Alyssa comes off as "fundie lite," but I don't trust a word she says about anything.

Basically, I'm agreeing with everything you said. I just have more thoughts on the matter, lol.

Alyssa is not “ lite” anything. I have been thinking through Crissy Stroop’s thoughts on fundamentalism. Her thought is that all of these people are fundamentalists period. There is not much daylight despite surface differences. I think she right. It is all surface; most evangelicals are fundies and equally damaged.

[llg1234]

56 minutes ago, nelliebelle1197 said:

Alyssa is not “ lite” anything. I have been thinking through Crissy Stroop’s thoughts on fundamentalism. Her thought is that all of these people are fundamentalists period. There is not much daylight despite surface differences. I think she right. It is all surface; most evangelicals are fundies and equally damaged.

Spare me your condescension. It put fundie lite in quotes bc I don’t agree in that she’s anything less than a fundamentalist.   Fundie lite gets thrown around a lot and I think it’s a contradictory term that means nothing. 

https://www.grammarly.com/blog/quotation-marks-around-a-single-word/
 

Since you’re so well researched, maybe learn what scare quotes are. 

[SassyPants]

In light of her recent 9 hour cardiac surgery, I would hope that they’d wait at least a year before announcing another gestating Webster. Pregnancy is taxing to a woman’s body and the additional weight and blood volume puts added strain and work on the heart. Let the woman heal. If I were her, I would take this as a message that God thinks I have enough children, period.

[nelliebelle1197]

1 hour ago, llg1234 said:

Spare me your condescension. It put fundie lite in quotes bc I don’t agree in that she’s anything less than a fundamentalist.   Fundie lite gets thrown around a lot and I think it’s a contradictory term that means nothing. 

https://www.grammarly.com/blog/quotation-marks-around-a-single-word/
 

Since you’re so well researched, maybe learn what scare quotes are. 

Excuse me?  There was no condescension in involved until you replied. I was pointing out that Crissy Stroop has an interesting take on what fundamentalism really is. If you do not like the phrasing I used, that is your own problem and maybe you need to work on that a little bit before you fly off the handle.

Edited October 5, 2019 by nelliebelle1197

[Palimpsest]

3 hours ago, llg1234 said:

Spare me your condescension. It put fundie lite in quotes bc I don’t agree in that she’s anything less than a fundamentalist.   Fundie lite gets thrown around a lot and I think it’s a contradictory term that means nothing. 

https://www.grammarly.com/blog/quotation-marks-around-a-single-word/
 

Since you’re so well researched, maybe learn what scare quotes are. 

Nellie was actually agreeing with you but adding to the thought.  And I agree with the bolded.  "Fundie lite" is a meaningless term and I wish people would stop using it.   I occasionally say "Fungelical" because I think there is so much overlap that many so-called "Evangelicals" are indistinguishable from "Fundamentalists"  in their toxic beliefs.  But even that doesn't satisfy me.

Have I used enough scare quotes to satisfy you?

Chrissy Stroop is very interesting if you have not come across them yet.  Here's one article.

https://rewire.news/religion-dispatches/2019/06/13/when-fundamentalism-follows-you-out-the-door-transphobic-statement-exposes-exvangelical-trauma/

 

Edited October 5, 2019 by Palimpsest

[Curious]

9 hours ago, nelliebelle1197 said:

Alyssa is not “ lite” anything. I have been thinking through Crissy Stroop’s thoughts on fundamentalism. Her thought is that all of these people are fundamentalists period. There is not much daylight despite surface differences. I think she right. It is all surface; most evangelicals are fundies and equally damaged.

I love Crissy Stroop.  I should see if she will do another talk with us. 

8 hours ago, llg1234 said:

Spare me your condescension. It put fundie lite in quotes bc I don’t agree in that she’s anything less than a fundamentalist.   Fundie lite gets thrown around a lot and I think it’s a contradictory term that means nothing. 

https://www.grammarly.com/blog/quotation-marks-around-a-single-word/
 

Since you’re so well researched, maybe learn what scare quotes are. 

Someone got up with me on the grumpy side of the bed this morning

11 hours ago, Italiangirl said:

In the post after her I think second visit with the doc, Alyssa said that the problem could come back in six months from that visit, but after those six months If she hasn't any symptoms she will be considered fully healed. So I think we could expect #4 around mid 2020

That's the impression I got as well.  It looks like the 3 she has now are relatively close together.  They might wait a little on the 4th and then have 3 more very close together for their 6.

4 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

Chrissy Stroop is very interesting if you have not come across them yet.  Here's one article.

https://rewire.news/religion-dispatches/2019/06/13/when-fundamentalism-follows-you-out-the-door-transphobic-statement-exposes-exvangelical-trauma/

Crissy (then Chris) did a Q&A with us a couple of years ago.  I need to update the bio.

https://www.freejinger.org/forum/493-chris-stroop-12617/

[WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo?]

1 hour ago, Curious said:

Crissy (then Chris) did a Q&A with us a couple of years ago.  I need to update the bio.

https://www.freejinger.org/forum/493-chris-stroop-12617/

Thank you! I couldn't remember why the name sounded familiar. ?

[Melissa1977]

On 10/5/2019 at 10:44 AM, lumpentheologie said:

She said after Lexi that they were happy with two for now, and then a few months later announced Zoey.  I believed her then, but never again, lol. 

As Alyssa does not breastfeed, and she got pregnant with Lexi just when Allie turned 1, I think (speculation 100%) that she was using some kind of natural family planning for that first year. And that planning clearly failed after Lexi (she was posting that she wasn't in a rush for more kids, that she was ok with two, etc, so I think she was confident that she wasn't going to get pregnant so soon).

 It's pretty obvious that they have been preventing in a more safe way recently, probably due to the heart problems. So they know how it works.

At this point, I see them trying for the boy, but stopping at 4 kids, no matter the sex of #4. John's siblings are not quiverful.