Maxwell 13: And Another One Bites the Dust - John is Engaged

[Captain Obvious]

1 hour ago, sparkles said:

The really sad thing is that Sarah DID go to a writers’ workshop not too long ago. It was a Christian workshop but still, you’d think there were some talented folks there leading it. The lessons clearly flew right over Sarah’s head.

It's interesting though - since going to the workshop she seems to have stopped talking about the book altogether. In her Groundhog Day In The Life of Sarah post, she didn't mention working on it either. It seems like it's been shelved (no pun intended).

Could it have been that during the workshop, she actually got the feedback that Steve had been keeping from her: i.e., that her writing is shit?

[divadivine]

23 hours ago, Marian the Librarian said:

J&C's "The Knot's" description of the Bontragers' Dutch Country Inn hotel says that "Cable television is provided for your entertainment." 

I wonder if Stevehova makes the Inn staff remove “The Beast” from their hotel rooms before the family arrives? 

[Captain Obvious]

53 minutes ago, Corntree said:

Could we restructure society so anyone could enter any profession or do any job without needing a degree or having to work for someone else? I don't know. I'm not sure if that would be possible or desirable or the best option in every situation. I have more thoughts on this supposed society, but I can't write that thesis right now and this isn't even the best place to post it. But I do feel that it's unfair for Steve to say everyone should be like him and his family and ignore the complexities of life and not even think about or at least not explain how his plan would work for everyone in the world.

In the fundie vision of the ideal society, there aren't concerns about people not having the skills to be doctors, pilots etc. It's not learning or higher education per se these people object to - it's being exposed to challenging ideas and people who have them.

Presumably in their utopia everyone is their kind of Christian, which means that universities etc would be too. So they'd be able to let their sons attend, while the girls learnt to be wives or maybe nurses/midwives if they were lucky.

And if their ideal society doesn't come to pass because there are still billions of heathens out there, then said heathens can be the ones to prop up the fundie community with pesky things like emergency medical care. Most other things they can do badly themselves.

2 minutes ago, divadivine said:

I wonder if Stevehova makes the Inn staff remove “The Beast” from their hotel rooms before the family arrives? 

I'm sure the family have stayed in hotels with TVs before. I bet he has some kind of family prayer where they passive aggressively shame the TV for existing.

And really - why would any family member have any desire to turn it on? Not only have they been raised to fear it, they're never exposed to anything or anyone that would make them want to watch it. There's really no reason why they would.

[kpmom]

16 hours ago, terranova said:

I guess all the boys could have had failed courtships and we wouldn't know if they didn't want us to. And if John Marie was hanging around all that time, maybe he was a failed courtship of one of the girls too.

You know, I wondered that too about John Marie.  I guess he was visiting the Maxwells ostensibly to teach John the drip irrigation business, but he seemed to be there quite a bit.  And the Maxwells visited his family when they were in John Marie's state. 

I've often wondered if he wanted to court one of the sisters but was turned down (or turned off by Steve).

[Corntree]

Yeah, @Captain Obvious, I agree a lot of fundies seem to have that attitude. Most aren't against college as long as they're in a Christian environment. They seem to have the same attitude about working for someone else. But is Steve stressing forgoing college and working for someone else just b/c those environments are currently un-Christian, or does he disagree with doing those things ever? He came across in the latest Seriously Dads like he was against college in any circumstance, but the reason for that was debt, so if debt wasn't a problem would he be okay with college? And I wonder if he's against working for someone else in any circumstance, too. That's why I was wondering about his ideal society. But I don't know. I don't know if he's ever explained things fully. And maybe he oversimplified his position in the latest Dad's post. But I wonder if Steve is a different beast than most fundies on this subject. He may have his own unique take on things. Just speculating.

[meowfundiecatz]

I follow Sarah (failed courtship) on insta...her husband seems normal enough and they have a daughter and one on the way. She wears pants and works (super part time at a gym daycare) and of course, sells Plexus.

[Ozlsn]

7 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I actually think Steve wouldn't approve most "nice fundie guys." His standards seem to be so high for males that practically none would make the cut. I personally believe Steve's standards for a mate are way higher for men trying to marry into the family as opposed to females. Because he believes males are the head of the household and he knows his girls can be easily taken away in an instant if he chooses wrong. I doubt any fundie male will submit to Steve enough to marry into that family. No guy wants to live in Maxhell and bow down to Steve long enough to marry one of his daughters. 

I totally agree. He sabotages any chance his daughters might have because he requires his potential son-in-laws to be as obedient to him as he has raised his sons to be... and I think most fundie guys are going in with the idea that they (finally) get to be the headship, not subservient to someone else. 

Also I have no actual evidence for this and am not a Degreed Mental Health Professional but my gut feeling is that Sarah is really depressed, and possibly doesn't realise it because she has been this way so long it is now normal. Even the thing she could take pride in, the books, has been taken away because someone has pointed out how bad they actually are. 

[nomoxian]

If you want to read about Christophers failed courtship with Sara (no 'h' so I guess that made it okay to use her first name?) here is the blog post. 

HI STEVE! The internet is forever.

[anjulibai]

27 minutes ago, Corntree said:

Yeah, @Captain Obvious, I agree a lot of fundies seem to have that attitude. Most aren't against college as long as they're in a Christian environment. They seem to have the same attitude about working for someone else. But is Steve stressing forgoing college and working for someone else just b/c those environments are currently un-Christian, or does he disagree with doing those things ever? He came across in the latest Seriously Dads like he was against college in any circumstance, but the reason for that was debt, so if debt wasn't a problem would he be okay with college? And I wonder if he's against working for someone else in any circumstance, too. That's why I was wondering about his ideal society. But I don't know. I don't know if he's ever explained things fully. And maybe he oversimplified his position in the latest Dad's post. But I wonder if Steve is a different beast than most fundies on this subject. He may have his own unique take on things. Just speculating.

He has said in the past that he is even against Christian colleges. 

I think in the perfect fundie society, people would pass on professions from father to son and that's it. So if your father is a doctor, you are, too. If your father is an electrician you are, too. And so on. Aptitude be damned, everyone can learn any skill, especially by textbooks. 

[picklepizzas]

2 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

These fundies love to claim their first kiss is at their wedding so I doubt they've kissed. But have they front hugged, caressed, pressed cheeks close, etc? Yes I think so. But there's no doubt in my mind it will be made clear to the world that they saved their first kiss for their wedding day. 

Yeah, especially given her recent obnoxious captioning of her brother's first kiss on the family blog ("FIRST KISS EVER!"). No way is she not planning to brag about that on her own wedding day. 

Also, I kind of doubt chelsy or the bontragers are that miffed that tits2 hasn't mentioned the engagement? I feel like it would be natural for john to say 'hey, this awk thing with joseph happened and it really hurt everyone in my family so they probably won't blog about the engagement until after the wedding. it's nothing personal." doesn't seem like a big deal. 

[terranova]

1 hour ago, kpmom said:

You know, I wondered that too about John Marie.  I guess he was visiting the Maxwells ostensibly to teach John the drip irrigation business, but he seemed to be there quite a bit.  And the Maxwells visited his family when they were in John Marie's state. 

I've often wondered if he wanted to court one of the sisters but was turned down (or turned off by Steve).

I don't recall him visiting the Maxwells or them going to Idaho since he got a girlfriend and apparently went "lite" which to me screams failed courtship. Which baffles me because he seemed like a prime candidate.

[mango_fandango]

Yeah, in Anna's post about whether she was going to college or not she mentioned that even Christian colleges are bad. Does she actually *know* about Christian colleges? Have any of them looked at the guidelines and handbooks of places like Pensacola Christian College or Crown College of the Bible?? 

Actually, I think a lot of it is because you are away from the protection and counsel of your parents. Pensacola and Crown may be religious enough, but because the Maxwells would have to stay on the campuses, that's them verboten. They might make friends. Pensacola and Crown both have sports teams IIRC. 

The Maxwell homeschool philosophy also places a lot of emphasis on self-teaching, which is why Teri is such a big proponent of textbooks. 

[nastyhobbitses]

23 minutes ago, mango_fandango said:

Yeah, in Anna's post about whether she was going to college or not she mentioned that even Christian colleges are bad. Does she actually *know* about Christian colleges? Have any of them looked at the guidelines and handbooks of places like Pensacola Christian College or Crown College of the Bible?? 

Actually, I think a lot of it is because you are away from the protection and counsel of your parents. Pensacola and Crown may be religious enough, but because the Maxwells would have to stay on the campuses, that's them verboten. They might make friends. Pensacola and Crown both have sports teams IIRC. 

The Maxwell homeschool philosophy also places a lot of emphasis on self-teaching, which is why Teri is such a big proponent of textbooks. 

Yeah, I think the core issue is that being at a college where you live on campus and not at home puts you outside of Steve's control. Even if the courses were taken straight out of Managers of their Schools, still no dice, because it would still involve regularly associating with people who are not your family, and cannot control you.

[Howl]

1 hour ago, Ozlsn said:

Also I have no actual evidence for this and am not a Degreed Mental Health Professional but my gut feeling is that Sarah is really depressed, and possibly doesn't realise it because she has been this way so long it is now normal. Even the thing she could take pride in, the books, has been taken away because someone has pointed out how bad they actually are. 

Depressed child of depressed mom.  Sad.  But for Stevehovah, that's a plus, because they are too depressed to be rebellious.  I also want to thank whoever came up with "Stevehovah." You're brilliant! 

[Tatar-tot]

28 minutes ago, Howl said:

Depressed child of depressed mom.  Sad.  But for Stevehovah, that's a plus, because they are too depressed to be rebellious.  I also want to thank whoever came up with "Stevehovah." You're brilliant! 

I 100% agree with you that Sarah probably suffers from clinical depression.  I think it is all she can do it get up in the morning and mechanically go thru her day. 

It makes me sick that Teri has never gotten medical treatment.  Depression is a disease like MS or strep throat or any other disease.  There is medical treatment and it will make a huge difference when combined with therapy and other behavioral changes.  Depression cannot be prayed away or Pespied away or Steve awayed.  

Next time Steve is sick they should tell him to have a baby and snap out of it.  Why?  Because Omnifigant Steve knows medical science does not work. 

[WonderingInWA]

3 hours ago, meowfundiecatz said:

I follow Sarah (failed courtship) on insta...her husband seems normal enough and they have a daughter and one on the way. She wears pants and works (super part time at a gym daycare) and of course, sells Plexus.

What is her Instagram?  I'm excited to hear she is expecting again!

[church_of_dog]

5 hours ago, meee said:

OH.  I literally thought "snack in the parking lot of Goldfish" meant "snack in the parking lot of a store called Goldfish" which I wouldn't be familiar with as I don't live in America. And I was like "maybe I don't know grammar either, what's wrong with that sentence?"

Got it. Wow.

(And who wants to bet on how soon that will be corrected?)

And that ambiguity is exactly why that phrasing is bad grammar.  If she had said “a snack of goldfish in the parking lot”, it would still be banal and awkward, but at least clear as to meaning.

[anjulibai]

2 hours ago, terranova said:

I don't recall him visiting the Maxwells or them going to Idaho since he got a girlfriend and apparently went "lite" which to me screams failed courtship. Which baffles me because he seemed like a prime candidate.

He came a couple of times, as I recall. I think he even went Christmas caroling with them once. 

He was around enough that it seemed like he had to be interested in one of the girls. 

[johnhugh]

Looks like Jess is searching for a wife or husband in New Orleans according to his twitter.  @bassplayer_7 

I might have to congratulate him that his ex stud brother is dating an anti-Sodomite......

 

[WonderingInWA]

19 minutes ago, anjulibai said:

He came a couple of times, as I recall. I think he even went Christmas caroling with them once. 

He was around enough that it seemed like he had to be interested in one of the girls. 

John Marie finally married an Idaho girl.  They are expecting a baby in December.  I'm guessing it would be hard for him to be present at the Maxwell/Bontrager wedding.

[CyborgKin]

6 hours ago, sableduck said:

I'm trying to figure out how to invite friend and his wife over for dinner and ask about Chelsy without being creepy.  Also DH grew up IFB(in the same town as J rod, but he says he never met her) and is annoyed by my fundie stalking.  So I'm trying sneakily to get info....

Sorta like how at a homeschool conference I attended last weekend I learned a family had stayed with the Botkins, and wanted to ask them all sorts of questions, but there wasn't a good opportunity.

[SPHASH]

1 hour ago, johnhugh said:

Looks like Jess is searching for a wife or husband in New Orleans according to his twitter.  @bassplayer_7 

I might have to congratulate him that his ex stud brother is dating an anti-Sodomite......

 

Does he have an accountability partner with him?  I think we should all congratulate him on getting a new SIL.

[MamaJunebug]

14 hours ago, Coconutwater said:

I'm sure he had a lot more fun with the Bontragers on holidays than his own overly scheduled family. I'm calling it now, they will fix up the house and eventually flip it and move closer to her family who likes to have fun. 

Can they take at least Poor Sarah along, if not to husband-hunt, just to be herself? Isn’t there a great writers workshop in Iowa?

Meanwhile: 3 DAYS, 18 HOURS OF MAXSILENCE ABOUT THE HAPPY NEWS

Free PS, her sisters & Jana

[FloraDoraDolly]

A thought... What if John DIDN'T TELL his family about the engagement? Wouldn't it be a scream if Steve-o learned about it via the Internet? 

[mango_fandango]

32 minutes ago, FloraDoraDolly said:

A thought... What if John DIDN'T TELL his family about the engagement? Wouldn't it be a scream if Steve-o learned about it via the Internet? 

Oh my Lord... what I would give to be a fly on the wall when that happened...