John Kelly -- Bringing Order to the West Wing?

[OtterRuletheWorld]

I would love for an explanation to this too. Why is not being a citizen mean you suddenly aren't bothered with a president who does and says awful things? Not being a citizen didn't keep you from being bothered by Wilson. You aren't a citizen yet you are bothered when you saw people criticize Kelly. What makes Trump different? 
 

My citizenship status absolutely does not absolve the ability for me to have incredible respect for the US military (not limited to the US, but I am speaking of the US in this regard. I respect Kelly's opinion on this, and any Gold Star families opinions on this, including any criticism of Trump or any large support of Trump. Trump happens to be the Commander in Chief, so he has a pretty direct link to the military. Wilson's opinion is different, but knowing her voting history, I don't sense she has a large amount of respect for the military. That isn't to say her opinion doesn't matter, but it is coming from a very different place. She chose to be part of politicizing this and therefore, I am holding her accountable for her words. I can do the same to her that I will Kelly or anyone else.

[mention=19904]fraurosena[/mention], is English your first language?
If not, may I just take a quick moment to congratulate you on your knowledge and use of vocabulary.  [mention=25214]OtterRuletheWorld[/mention] is querulous and fractious indeed.  And I also think they are trolling.

I attended American schools as a child. English is not my first language, but I don't remember not being able to speak English or learning English.

2 hours ago, SilverBeach said:

Please stop using the word attack.

And yes, nothing that fucker says.

Why on earth would I stop using the word attack?

[fraurosena]

Ooooh, I get it now. Otter is blindly adoring of anything related to the military. It's her fetish!

As the presidunce is the commander in chief, (as she so pointedly says) he therefore can do no wrong in her eyes. He's at the very pinnacle of the military, after all, so he's got to be the best of the best. Right?

[Palimpsest]

6 minutes ago, OtterRuletheWorld said:

I attended American schools as a child. English is not my first language, but I don't remember not being able to speak English or learning English.

That question was not for you.

However, I'm sure you did attend American schools.  I'm not so sure about the rest.

Are you a US military spouse as you implied earlier?  Have you moved recently?  Did you spend time in Germany?  And do you still think dirndls are "slave clothing?"

Just wondering ...

[laPapessaGiovanna]

2 hours ago, OtterRuletheWorld said:

2 hours ago, SilverBeach said:

Because he's a gold star patent, don't you get it? Why is Otter so protective of gold star parents when she's not a citizen?

Service members can marry non us citizens. Thanks

What a coincidence! We had another member that was a staunch Trumper and an army wife. She was an US citizen though. A truly charming lady.

[formergothardite]

22 minutes ago, OtterRuletheWorld said:

That isn't to say her opinion doesn't matter, but it is coming from a very different place

It is coming from the place of a close family friend. Seems that should carry a lot of weight.

Anyway, you didn't actually answer my question which was why you couldn't condemn Trump's awful behavior because you aren't an American citizen. Citizenship isn't required to call him out as a racist asshole who makes Gold Star families cry and who also attacks Gold Star families and lies to them. 

You don't happen to have a pregnant friend who works in the porn industry, do you? 

[SilverBeach]

Otter, stop using the word attack because it is hyperbole. Nobody attacked Kelly, Your use of the word is inflammatory and not accurate. 

@formergothardite, I see what you did there! Perhaps someone has come out to play with us...

[OtterRuletheWorld]

7 minutes ago, fraurosena said:

Ooooh, I get it now. Otter is blindly adoring of anything related to the military. It's her fetish!

As the presidunce is the commander in chief, (as she so pointedly says) he therefore can do no wrong in her eyes. He's at the very pinnacle of the military, after all, so he's got to be the best of the best. Right?

Well, okay then. That was EXACTLY what I said. Projecting much?

 

8 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

That question was not for you.

However, I'm sure you did attend American schools.  I'm not so sure about the rest.

Are you a US military spouse as you implied earlier?  Have you moved recently?  Did you spend time in Germany?  And do you still think dirndls are "slave clothing?"

Just wondering ...

 

6 minutes ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

What a coincidence! We had another member that was a staunch Trumper and an army wife. She was an US citizen though. A truly charming lady.

I feel like you are both assuming I am someone else and will certainly make sure to search for the word dirndl at some point here.

To answer your other questions, I am a US military spouse, My eldest brother also served in the military, but he no longer does. My younger brother still serves in the US military. Both became US citizens. I have been living where I currently live for what will be two years in December. I am not German.

[SilverBeach]

You too @Palimpsest! Recognizing a certain someone who does not recognize rhetorical questions! A military-worshipping Drumft lover.

Edited October 21, 2017 by SilverBeach

[GrumpyGran]

19 minutes ago, fraurosena said:

Ooooh, I get it now. Otter is blindly adoring of anything related to the military. It's her fetish!

As the presidunce is the commander in chief, (as she so pointedly says) he therefore can do no wrong in her eyes. He's at the very pinnacle of the military, after all, so he's got to be the best of the best. Right?

I have seen and continue to see this. I bet she/he/it wasn't quite as supportive of Barrack Obama. And s/he clearly has a hatred of Congresswoman Wilson, so again I believe this is at the crux of the interaction here. We'll see if there is an explanation of what heinous crime Ms Wilson has committed that proves she is an enemy of the US military.

[formergothardite]

Wilson can be condemned, but the guy who lies to, attacks and makes Gold Star families cry can't be condemned. Something isn't adding up Otter. 

Here are some tweets in response to his "sacred women" comment.

 

 

Edited October 21, 2017 by formergothardite

[fraurosena]

It's simple. Wilson is a woman, is not white, and shock, horror! a democrat to boot. If that isn't worthy of condemnation, nothing is! 

>end sarcasm<

And that's my last contribution for now, folks, as it's past midnight here and I'm off to bed.

[laPapessaGiovanna]

Not only, she's also outspoken, elderly (trump too but he's a man, only elderly women lack stamina, except ehen they have too much like Wilson) and has a quirky sense of fashion. Basically she's a trumpster's version of the Antichrist.

Edited October 21, 2017 by laPapessaGiovanna
Typo

[OtterRuletheWorld]

My feelings on Trump are very likely less loathsome than yours. Whatever.  I am also likely looking at it from a different place than you (my background/citizenship has a lot to do with this). I am defending Kelly in this instance though.  Kelly isn't a bad guy. You are welcome to your opinion regarding Kelly, as am I, and we clearly do not agree.  

Trump's conversation with the gold star family; well, it sucks if a Gold Star family felt bad about the words said. That sucks, but other families were comforted by the same words. You can't take words of comfort back, you can't make a perfect call like that.  I feel really bad that the ANY of these 4 families are being brought into the spotlight over this.  Let the families grieve.

Wilson being a "close friend" or not isn't quite the same as talking with actual military families. Also, her voting record is hardly impressive when it comes to the military.

[SilverBeach]

Halloween nails. I can't do spoilers. I tried.

Edited October 21, 2017 by SilverBeach

[laPapessaGiovanna]

I am a foreigner and I can't think of a citizenship/background that would make Trump look any less disgusting and dangerous. Oh wait, Russian bots love him.

[OtterRuletheWorld]

4 minutes ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

Not only, she's also outspoken, elderly (trump too but he's a man, only elderly women lack stamina, except ehen they have too much like Wilson) and has a quirky sense of fashion. Basically she's a trumpster's version of the Antichrist.

I made note of the right making fun of her fashion choices. Agree that this is absolutely irrelevant in this discussion. I don't care about her fashion choices at all. Her being a black woman also has zero to do with my condemning her.  I support the military and gold star families. Her being willing to be part of politicizing this while having a voting history that highly lacks military/veteran support is hypocritical. Her opinion is now international news.

3 minutes ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

I am a foreigner and I can't think of a citizenship/background that would make Trump look any less disgusting and dangerous. Oh wait, Russian bots love him.

I don't think all foreigners are thinking the same way. I hardly think me being "foreign" completes my ideals, but MY personal background and citizenship likely have much to do with my values.  When I do criticize Trump or any American politician, it isn't going to be because he didn't make a perfect condolence call.  Hardly where I find things to be dangerous or disgusting.  I know many "foreigners" who have wildly differing opinions about American Politics. 

[SilverBeach]

That fucker has done a lot more than not make a perfect condolence call. Stop trolling.

[formergothardite]

5 hours ago, OtterRuletheWorld said:

Wilson has a really awful voting record when it comes to Veterans. This was absolutely opportunistic of her.

Did anyone actually read through the list of things she was supposed to voted against that hurt veterans? I just did. She voted against ending a program that is used by some military to assist them in paying a mortgage. 

https://votesmart.org/bill/12988/34229/17319/terminating-the-home-affordable-modification-program#.WevQNVtSyUk

This program helped military that were struggling with this:

Quote

 

In the military, a Permanent Change of Station is the official relocation of a military servicemember and his or her family to a new duty location. This can create a difficult set of circumstances for military homeowners who are underwater (where you owe more than your home is worth). Here are some reasons why.

You may not be able to sell your home at a price that will pay off their mortgage.

You may not be able to rent out your home at a price that will cover the monthly mortgage payments.

You may get a lower housing allowance at your new duty station.

You may have trouble meeting all of your financial obligations while your spouse looks for a new job in your new location.

 

So she voted to save a program that helped military. She clearly hates military. 

One of the other terrible things she was supposed to have voted against is a law that would say vets who are deemed mentally incompetent to purchase guns and ammo should be allowed to do so. 

One of the things listed that is supposed to show her bad voting record, she didn't even vote on. 

One of the things was a budget that wasn't just military, it included things from funding WIC to funding slaughterhouse inspectors. Voting no on this budget is hardly a sign she doesn't respect vets. 

Another one was a budget, again disagreeing with a budget isn't a sign she doesn't respect veterans. 

The accountability acts that she voted against have some odd, sweeping things in them and I can see why someone would vote against them, but it isn't a sign she hates veterans. 

Anyway, this list of "look how she hates veterans" seems to have come right out of Fox news and doesn't actually seem to mean much. 

[OtterRuletheWorld]

1 minute ago, SilverBeach said:

That fucker has done a lot more than not make a perfect condolence call. Stop trolling.

Right, and that is why I am discussing Kelly and wondering wtf THIS was major news. This seems insane to have as international headline news.

But the discussion about what was going on in Niger is hardly interesting? Why are we in Niger, how did they die, who did it... How is that not bigger news than the call?

[formergothardite]

20 minutes ago, OtterRuletheWorld said:

Also, her voting record is hardly impressive when it comes to the military.

I just tackled this. Her voting record isn't as bad as Fox news wants people to think. 

 

22 minutes ago, OtterRuletheWorld said:

My feelings on Trump are very likely less loathsome than yours

Why is calling Mexicans rapists, bragging about sexually assaulting women, attacking a gold star family and lying to another one not loathsome? 

[laPapessaGiovanna]

3 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

Anyway, this list of "look how she hates veterans" seems to have come right out of Fox news and doesn't actually seem to mean much. 

I am shocked! Shocked I tell you!

[SilverBeach]

Yeah Otter, what is it that you like about Dump? Enlighten us.

[laPapessaGiovanna]

5 minutes ago, OtterRuletheWorld said:

How is that not bigger news than the call?

Because the president lied about the call and his chief of staff lied about Wilson. Last time I checked that was a serious problem. Not that Trump cares of course. It was just a couple of alternative facts.

Edited October 21, 2017 by laPapessaGiovanna

[formergothardite]

Wilson apparently hates military so much she wanted to protect military members who were sexually assaulted. How evil is she!!!!!!!!!

1 minute ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

Because the president lied about the call and his chief of staff lied about Wilson.

Yep, Trump and Kelly started lying so it started taking up the spotlight. Of course, the president lying and the chief of staff lying to smear the integrity of a member of Congress does need some light show on it. Right Otter? 

[Palimpsest]

21 minutes ago, OtterRuletheWorld said:

My feelings on Trump are very likely less loathsome than yours. Whatever.  I am also likely looking at it from a different place than you (my background/citizenship has a lot to do with this). I am defending Kelly in this instance though.  Kelly isn't a bad guy. You are welcome to your opinion regarding Kelly, as am I, and we clearly do not agree.  

Just now, OtterRuletheWorld said:

Right, and that is why I am discussing Kelly and wondering wtf THIS was major news. This seems insane to have as international headline news.

Oh, honey bunny.  Don't be so silly. You have been called out.  The signs are all there.  Yes, I'm calling Pregnant Porn Star on this one.  Yet again. 

We may not be able to prove it yet -- but PPS please just stop. 

I don't understand why they are so persistent.

I suppose there is an outside chance that it could be some other deluded Trump troll.  I suppose it is possible that other people are as deluded as PPS.  But to use such old language and methods ...

::yawns::