Jill, Derick, Israel and the Shower Rack- Part 21

[Imagine20]

As for which way you take to get to S Asia, it really depends. I'm in the middle of the US and when we go to Sri Lanka we can choose the Western route through China or the Eastern route through UAE (usually Dubai.) Is the same way with going to Nepal. 

[PennySycamore]

When my daughter and son-in-law made their two trips to China to pick up their two daughters, they flew out of O'Hare in Chicago once and once out of Newark.  Either way it was about a 12 hour flight to Beijing.

[grandmadugger]

11 hours ago, JesSky03 said:

To many Christians heaven is a reward and is considered "home". A memory just popped up on my facebook the other day for the anniversary of the death of my husband's grandpa. My husband had posted how his grandpa had gone home to the Lord. He was happy that his grandpa was no longer suffering and was now reunited with his wife who had passed about a decade before him. To him death is the end of suffering and the beginning of a reward well deserved after enduring hardships on earth. 

When my mom lost her battle with cancer that's how we all looked at it. It's a temporary separation from our loved ones.  It was comforting for many of us to have the hope to see her again  

 

As someone who lost a loved one to cancer and a Christian some of the comments in this thread have made me really uncomfortable. There has been a lot of judgement about how someone and their loved ones deal with a horrible disease. Some call it a fight, some call it a battle, some keep it to themselves, some turn to others with the same condition to bond over, some turn to religion, and some don't all are valid because in the end it's all about coping with the cancer. We are supposed to be more accepting of different ideas than the fundies but when we turn our noses up at people who handle a stressful situation differently than we would we start to blur the line.  /rant

[HarleyQuinn]

Wouldn't Hawaii be a bit too "nike" for them? SFO is a United Airlines hub, they have a lot of options out of that airport besides Hawaii. 

[ClaraOswin]

10 hours ago, grandmadugger said:

When my mom lost her battle with cancer that's how we all looked at it. It's a temporary separation from our loved ones.  It was comforting for many of us to have the hope to see her again  

 

As someone who lost a loved one to cancer and a Christian some of the comments in this thread have made me really uncomfortable. There has been a lot of judgement about how someone and their loved ones deal with a horrible disease. Some call it a fight, some call it a battle, some keep it to themselves, some turn to others with the same condition to bond over, some turn to religion, and some don't all are valid because in the end it's all about coping with the cancer. We are supposed to be more accepting of different ideas than the fundies but when we turn our noses up at people who handle a stressful situation differently than we would we start to blur the line.  /rant

I don't think anyone has a problem with how someone copes with illness or whatever. It's when some people imply that THEIR loved one was "cured" or whatever by being super Godly and therefore people who die are somehow "less than" in the eyes of God. I don't think all religious people feel that way or mean that when they thank God or anything though. But I have seen things from people in my life that are worded in a way that implies that and it's kind of awful.

[RabbitKM]

In the past couple of months, someone I know was diagnosed with cancer.  My sister also had cancer. It occurred to me, when the newly diagnosed person's wife and I were talking, how damaging the rhetoric and words of "fighting" or "battling" through cancer can be.  When we were talking, she implied that she didn't think he was "strong" enough to "beat" cancer.  I thought about my own sister's experience with cancer, and there were SO many moments where one could say she wasn't "strong" either.  But like others have said, it is just something she had to get through.  I think that the rhetoric around it builds it up like some sort of myth, and only the strong prevail.  I wanted to tell her, it's ok for him to be scared, to feel weak, to have those moments of doubt.  You don't always have to be a "fighter," sometimes all you can do is try to get through it. 

[Jinder Roles]

4 hours ago, RabbitKM said:

In the past couple of months, someone I know was diagnosed with cancer.  My sister also had cancer. It occurred to me, when the newly diagnosed person's wife and I were talking, how damaging the rhetoric and words of "fighting" or "battling" through cancer can be.  When we were talking, she implied that she didn't think he was "strong" enough to "beat" cancer.  I thought about my own sister's experience with cancer, and there were SO many moments where one could say she wasn't "strong" either.  But like others have said, it is just something she had to get through.  I think that the rhetoric around it builds it up like some sort of myth, and only the strong prevail.  I wanted to tell her, it's ok for him to be scared, to feel weak, to have those moments of doubt.  You don't always have to be a "fighter," sometimes all you can do is try to get through it. 

I think you'd like the book "Pink Ribbon Blues" by Gayle Sulik...it discusses the exclusionary narratives surrounding breast cancer. Interesting read.

[HomeschooledHeartThrob]

On 11/25/2016 at 3:59 PM, alba said:

Did anyone else see this?



I'm not familiar with the organisations tagged, but I'm pleasantly surprised to see Jilly promoting JOBS for women.

Imagine that! A Duggar NOT trying to get free shit....

[NewOrleansLady]

On 12/8/2016 at 8:02 PM, DaniLouisiana said:

@NewOrleansLady, I would LOVE to take GrandGirl to Mardi Gras in NOLA!!! We have a small very family friendly Mardi Gras in a small town near us. This is the first year she gets to go and the question is already can we go to NOLA next time and then to Baton Rouge (LSU). She's fine with cosplayers and general San Francisco weirdness, Bible thumpers not so much.

 

 

On 12/8/2016 at 9:58 PM, PennySycamore said:

@NewOrleansLady and @DaniLouisiana, all this talk about New Orleans and Mardi Gras makes me crave beignets from the Cafe du Monde. 

 

 

On 12/8/2016 at 10:45 PM, PennySycamore said:

Normally, I take my coffee black, but that French market cafe au lait is wonderful!

Come on down--We love to convert the pure coffee drinkers, doughnut eating eaters, what do you mean"pinch the tails and suck the heads?" folks to our kind of debauchery.  You won't want to go home and we'll make sure you make N.O. your new home.

[HomeschooledHeartThrob]

On 11/26/2016 at 0:06 PM, SassyPants said:

And remember this move and lifestyle change was all on top of:

Having had a C-section instead of a drug free home birth

The world knowing what Josh did - both to them and with other women

The show being cancelled

Derick quitting his job

Derick having surgery

The reality of having a newborn baby to care for

 

Jill was ill-prepared for life outside of Duggarville and THIS LIFE (the one in CA) is very different.

Jill would have a hard enough living in Little Rock or OKC, let alone CA.

 

To add on about the C Section, she was also "Midwife Extraordinaire" and probably thought she knew everything there was to having a baby and was proved drastically wrong on national TV. Hell wasn't she in labor something like 3 days? I know nothing about having a baby but that seems bad to me, like I feel if a baby wasn't delivered in about 5 hours I'd be calling the hospital. But I'll never have a baby at home. I can't. Too risky.

[freedom_for_all]

Come on down--We love to convert the pure coffee drinkers, doughnut eating eaters, what do you mean"pinch the tails and suck the heads?" folks to our kind of debauchery.  You won't want to go home and we'll make sure you make N.O. your new home.

As a born and raised New Orleanian I LOVE my city and hope that everyone who comes to visit loves it too. Some people don't like transplants but personally I don't think your family has to have been in Louisiana for generations to be there. Not everyone agrees but I do!

[HomeschooledHeartThrob]

I feel like the way Jill is dressing is what is making people assume she is pregnant.

We ignore a few things;

1. They glorify modesty. The baggier the holier

2. They glorify frugality. Perhaps she's just continually wearing maternity clothes rather than buy new ones? (2 birds 1 stone)

3. Since they intent to continually reproduce maybe she feels as though she should just keep wearing maternity clothes since it's bound to happen at some point (In her mind, given her mother, religion, TV show, fame/fortune ect.)

Many are misinterpreting "Looking pregnant" to mean "Looking fat" but no I believe the picture of her with Derrick at the holidays makes her "look pregnant" because of the large clothes and they way he has the arm draped across her belly and her holding the arm against her belly. Seems like a subconscious thing a pregnant person would do.

But from a personal perspective I have been asked x3 a month since getting married last year if I am pregnant/when am I having kids by friends/family/coworkers  and I find it personally offensive, not because I think people are calling me fat, but it's NONE of their business! Yet for some reason they feel that they have the right to know about my fertility. And x9 out of 10 it's men I BARELY KNOW asking me who are old. It makes my skin crawl, I hate older men so much.

So I see both sides of this argument. However I just feel that these are the Duggars. They talk about sex sex sex sex sex and kids kids kids kids ALL THE DAMN TIME. OF COURSE we are going to speculate if they are pregnant yet because in all honesty THATS WHAT THEY DO. 

[MargaretElliott]

7 minutes ago, HomeschooledHeartThrob said:

-snip- I feel like the way Jill is dressing is what is making people assume she is pregnant.

We ignore a few things;

1. They glorify modesty. The baggier the holier

2. They glorify frugality. Perhaps she's just continually wearing maternity clothes rather than buy new ones? (2 birds 1 stone)

3. Since they intent to continually reproduce maybe she feels as though she should just keep wearing maternity clothes since it's bound to happen at some point (In her mind, given her mother, religion, TV show, fame/fortune ect.) -snip-

-snip- So I see both sides of this argument. However I just feel that these are the Duggars. They talk about sex sex sex sex sex and kids kids kids kids ALL THE DAMN TIME. OF COURSE we are going to speculate if they are pregnant yet because in all honesty THATS WHAT THEY DO. -snip-

This is why I don't really see the point on speculating on Jill (or any other anti-BC fundie)'s pregnancy. It's Schrodinger's uterus- simultaneously pregnant and not pregnant unless either state is confirmed. However, I do think they intentionally foster speculation, what with the constant "we might get pregnant soon" on the show and whatnot. Which is dumb on their part.

So while I don't like to speculate on pregnancy, I can see why others do, and I can't snark on y'all for doing so.

[HomeschooledHeartThrob]

1 minute ago, MargaretElliott said:

This is why I don't really see the point on speculating on Jill (or any other anti-BC fundie)'s pregnancy. It's Schrodinger's uterus- simultaneously pregnant and not pregnant unless either state is confirmed. However, I do think they intentionally foster speculation, what with the constant "we might get pregnant soon" on the show and whatnot. Which is dumb on their part.

So while I don't like to speculate on pregnancy, I can see why others do, and I can't snark on y'all for doing so.

You raise an excellent point! They really do encourage speculation don't they? 

I also do not like to speculate on pregnancy in my private life, and I personally have lost track of the Duggar babies and do not care to worry with anymore. I think on here the snarking is a fun little way people try to guess before it's announced but this isn't limited to pregnancy people do it with who's dating who who will get married/break up. 

But I am glad for the comments about how rude/inappropriate it is to speculate because it does make us all stop and think twice before doing it. Yet I feel that this is an appropriate place/time to speculate because it is at the end Fundies who feel spiritually led to do so. 

It does tread a thin line between sharing eye rolls and being creepy though. We need to respect that for our own well being regardless of the Duggars we dont want to stoop too low on here. We are to exist to expose the flaws of Fundy world not be haters and make people think we're the bad guys. The occasional snark is always welcome to me but I do appreciate when open minded people pick their words carefully.

[Bad Wolf]

They actually said they were trying? That doesn't seem very modest to me.

[Snarkle Motion]

1 hour ago, Bad Wolf said:

They actually said they were trying? That doesn't seem very modest to me.

They have weird concepts of modesty. They literally talk about sex all the time and Jim Bob humped his wife on tv. They are obsessed with pregnancy and willing to talk about pee sticks. And it confuses me that people so obsessed with skirt length and not showing shoulders would be willing to breast feed a baby while walking around in public and while on tv. Like it's totally natural and I support it but doesn't a woman breast feeding potentially strike up impure thoughts in men? How is that not problematic but a small female child needs to wear skirts lest she arouse impure thoughts among family members?

[Snarkle Motion]

6 hours ago, HomeschooledHeartThrob said:

To add on about the C Section, she was also "Midwife Extraordinaire" and probably thought she knew everything there was to having a baby and was proved drastically wrong on national TV. Hell wasn't she in labor something like 3 days? I know nothing about having a baby but that seems bad to me, like I feel if a baby wasn't delivered in about 5 hours I'd be calling the hospital. But I'll never have a baby at home. I can't. Too risky.

I feel like the weeks leading up to the birth you could see the terror in her eyes. Jill has never done well with pain. I think she's also a perfectionist and a worrier. On top of this she was going to be filmed giving birth! And Anna had done it successfully adding to the pressure. She knew she had a big baby, she knew it was going to be a challenge, and I think as the date drew nearer she could not relax. I think that anxiety may have contributed to her late term and very difficult birth. The quotes from her parents afterward very much made it sound like they were trying to tell her there was nothing to be ashamed of and that she hasn't failed - it made me suspicious that Jill may have been very disappointed by the birth and had been very anxious leading up to it. 

This is why maybe it's not healthy to make motherhood ones soul purpose and identity. It actually may be counterproductive to what fundies want to achieve. It's also why Jessa, who has always had her own spirit, seems to suprisingly take more easily to motherhood. 

[elliha]

As a mom of two post date pregnancies I don't think anxiety played a part. They don't exactly know why some women have longer or shorter pregnancies but they believe part of it is from the dad. My husband came via c-section after his due date so we don't know just how long he planned to stay (c-section because he was post date and because my mother in law had already lost a baby post date due to placenta abruption) but his family history is full of long pregnancies, his paternal aunt carried a baby over 43 weeks. I had my daughter at 42+4 (induction started 42+3) and my son at 41+5 (induction prep scheduled on that day and it would probably have happened on Monday, he was born Friday). I would like to know Derrick's family history and see if he has a similar to my husband.

As to trying for a baby. I believe them when they say they are trying now but I do 100% believe they have subconsciously or consciously tried to avoid having a baby previously. I hope it was a calculated decision to give Jill the best situation possible to be able to have a VBAC and avoid more c-sections but my guess is that it was more subconscious thing because of being tired and in a place they did not feel safe in. I am still glad for them because I think that not rushing into a big family is good for them and might make they just that little bit more appreciative of their children.

[BlessingsVonFundiePants]

11 hours ago, MargaretElliott said:

Schrodinger's uterus-

Please, someone make this a thread title!!! 

[Flossie]

9 hours ago, Snarkle Motion said:

They have weird concepts of modesty. They literally talk about sex all the time and Jim Bob humped his wife on tv.

<snip>

...it confuses me that people so obsessed with skirt length and not showing shoulders would be willing to breast feed a baby while walking around in public and while on tv. 

Regarding the golf course humping, don't forget it was over the clothes, so it doesn't count.

As to the nursing, you must have missed the pics of Michelle riding on a parade float with her baby's legs dangling out of the monstrosity of a nursing cover she always wore so she could nurse modestly.  It also afforded her the ability to make sure everyone knew she was nursing, and at the same time avoid paying any attention to the baby.

[nastyhobbitses]

On 12/9/2016 at 11:38 AM, JesSky03 said:

To many Christians heaven is a reward and is considered "home". A memory just popped up on my facebook the other day for the anniversary of the death of my husband's grandpa. My husband had posted how his grandpa had gone home to the Lord. He was happy that his grandpa was no longer suffering and was now reunited with his wife who had passed about a decade before him. To him death is the end of suffering and the beginning of a reward well deserved after enduring hardships on earth. 

I think that's a pretty healthy way to look at death: as liberation from suffering and pain. Though of course in my family, being the cynical, dark-humored drunkards we are, when my (much beloved) grandpa died, some of my family members joked that he was "smiling up" at all of us.

[2manyKidzzz]

8 hours ago, Flossie said:

Regarding the golf course humping, don't forget it was over the clothes, so it doesn't count.

As to the nursing, you must have missed the pics of Michelle riding on a parade float with her baby's legs dangling out of the monstrosity of a nursing cover she always wore so she could nurse modestly.  It also afforded her the ability to make sure everyone knew she was nursing, and at the same time avoid paying any attention to the baby.

The picture of Meeechelle nursing on that float in the parade stuck with me. I couldn't believe. And how comfortable and relaxing for said baby, of course, why would that matter?? I thought it was bad, and well, just creepy. 

[Bad Wolf]

She also nursed when they visited a public school. Some people on FJ thought it was OK, some didn't. That was the time one of the students asked what was their favorite book........Waiting for Prince Charming.

[missegeno]

When my mom lost her battle with cancer that's how we all looked at it. It's a temporary separation from our loved ones.  It was comforting for many of us to have the hope to see her again  
 
As someone who lost a loved one to cancer and a Christian some of the comments in this thread have made me really uncomfortable. There has been a lot of judgement about how someone and their loved ones deal with a horrible disease. Some call it a fight, some call it a battle, some keep it to themselves, some turn to others with the same condition to bond over, some turn to religion, and some don't all are valid because in the end it's all about coping with the cancer. We are supposed to be more accepting of different ideas than the fundies but when we turn our noses up at people who handle a stressful situation differently than we would we start to blur the line.  /rant

I don't think anyone here intends to say you have to cope one way or another. It's when you take away from other people in doing so that we take issue with. There are ways to cope that don't make it harder for others to cope.

[nst]

jill posted that she misses jubliee because today is her birthday 

then she showed a picture