JinJer 2: Courting, she did ride

[Kaylo]

His parents are fundies. I don't think "the zeal of the converted" applies. 

[OrchidBlossom]

1 minute ago, Kaylo said:

His parents are fundies. I don't think "the zeal of the converted" applies. 

This doesn't line up with my experience. I've known people raised by extremeists who strayed and returned, I have found that they too tend to get a "zeal of the converted" type of vibe, although perhaps I would better characterize it as "zeal of the returned". It has less to do with their prior experiences with religion and more to do with guilt, shame, and an "invigoration" or "reinvigoration" that comes with (re)discovering religion, like you think you can be the solution to the world you really think your thoughts on the bible will change everything because to you, it did. Again, this is just my experience but I wouldn't discount his upbringing from giving him the kind of vigor I think I see in him.

Speaking of zeal of the converted, I knew a kid who was raised VERY IFB and then his parents sent him off to college (which, itself, was sort of surprising) and a week after he moved into our dorm he befriended an atheist who explained atheism to him and like literally blew his mind and he was like sign me up I don't believe in god let's go. A week after that first conversion experience he had a massive atheist tattoo on his arm. Which made, I imagine, for an awkward visit home over Christmas. I never asked though because weren't very close.

[nastyhobbitses]

39 minutes ago, infooverload said:

 

So decided to go watch the testimony video. Is it just me or do all these guys turn the normal high school/college experience into some big crisis of faith. Then there is the obligatory crying out from a holding cell or other "seedy" scene one can conjure. I think this guy may have kissed some girls and gone to some parties, but is making it sound like a was this nihilistic hedonistic guy who miraculously was saved. I guess my skeptical meter is always cranked up with these testimonials because inevitably they all have similar elements. I immediately think of the guy who falsely claimed he was a satanist. I am blanking on the name, but he has been discussed on here before and was popular during the 80's. Does anyone know anything about Tim Conway or the sending church. Okay I dipped a toe into the rabbit hole of Tim Conway. You guys are going to love this he has a Facebook post titled "Is Tardiness A Sin. Let's just say I at that considering this guy could be considered Jinger's future husband's boss. So Duggar time may not fly. Why would he be staying with them? He was a grown man with a soccer career. I have this sense there is going to be some interesting connection to the fundie world or some church shenanigans.

Oh and the name of Grace Community is one where I immediately went let me see any arrest recently. As one can imagine there are a crap ton of churches with the name Grace Community. A quick Google search came back with various articles of youth pastors being arrested for sexual abuse. I swear listening to In the Name of God the podcast makes me want to keep my kid away from youth pastors. Oh and maybe him and Josh can be porn accountability buddies because his testimony made me think he is not unfamiliar with porn hub.

They're too wimpy or sheltered to have actual struggles in their lives, and they can't be too threatening/criminal, so watching porn or kissing a girl or getting drunk has to be ratcheted up on the drama meter to the level of, say, being addicted to hard drugs or being involved in human trafficking or grand theft auto.

[fraurosena]

Thankfully his favorite author is David Martyn Lloyd-Jones, so Jinger just might be spared a Spurgeon debacle...

Lloyd-Jones doesn't sound as bad!

[Chach1984i]

3 hours ago, OrchidBlossom said:

This guy sets off my alarm bells in a major way. I can't put my finger on it but just watching that video made my skin crawl. I'm not surprised I feel that way about a dude in a fundie courtship, but at the same time it's different than how Bin or Derick struck me at first. It's decidedly more... bad. Less "bless your heart you have no idea what you are saying do you?" and more "you are trouble and I don't know why yet."

I think it might be his tone or his cadence, like his way of speaking reminds me of really controlling people who are like really tight in how they speak and come off insincere. Maybe I'm off-base, is anyone else getting what I mean?

ETA: I also don't find him attractive at all... maybe that's because hearing him talk puts me in high alert but even before I watched his video, he seemed pretty "eh" to me.

You're not the only one. I could only watch a few minutes of his testimony because it set of something that made me uncomfortable, I don't know what it is. 

[Kaylo]

1 hour ago, OrchidBlossom said:

This doesn't line up with my experience. I've known people raised by extremeists who strayed and returned, I have found that they too tend to get a "zeal of the converted" type of vibe, although perhaps I would better characterize it as "zeal of the returned". It has less to do with their prior experiences with religion and more to do with guilt, shame, and an "invigoration" or "reinvigoration" that comes with (re)discovering religion, like you think you can be the solution to the world you really think your thoughts on the bible will change everything because to you, it did. Again, this is just my experience but I wouldn't discount his upbringing from giving him the kind of vigor I think I see in him.

Speaking of zeal of the converted, I knew a kid who was raised VERY IFB and then his parents sent him off to college (which, itself, was sort of surprising) and a week after he moved into our dorm he befriended an atheist who explained atheism to him and like literally blew his mind and he was like sign me up I don't believe in god let's go. A week after that first conversion experience he had a massive atheist tattoo on his arm. Which made, I imagine, for an awkward visit home over Christmas. I never asked though because weren't very close.

Totally agree with him being quite over the top, just pointing out that he isn't a newbie

[Kaylo]

There have been a lot of comments about watching his testimony and getting a "bad feeling." Of course you get a bad feeling, he is sharing his fundie testimony!

i didn't find him to be particularly scary or angry, just self-righteous, but they are all self-righteous. The videos where Bin is asking him questions though...my God. I have a particular bias against Bin, I'll admit it, because he is just so, so dumb. Achingly dumb. And his nasal voice - can someone send him some Flonase?!?!  By comparison, I find JerBear to possess unrivaled intelligence. But I'm comparing him to a lamp post. 

[JessaErin]

Long time lurker, first time poster.. I can absolutely see Jessa being very jealous of Jinger (or at least of her courting Jeremy). Firstly, he is an actual adult, not some teenage boy. Second, he's an athlete and a very good looking one too. Thirdly, he just seems 100 times better than Bin in every aspect.. not like that's hard to do though. He's also actually educated, unlike Bin who can't string an educated sentence together! Idk, the moment I saw this I thought jeez he seems way more Jessa's type of man and I wonder if deep down she's lowkey pissed off that she settled for a teenager when she could of had him. 

 

[Percy]

Welcome JessaErin.

We know that Jinger will be leaving home as hubby to be has a parish away from the Duggar compound.  I wonder if she will take a buddy with her?

[CoveredInBees]

I leave for the evening to watch the football (not soccer - football, where a proportion of England fans are secretly wishing they had Welsh ancestry right about now  ) and I come back to a new thread!

I don't know, part of me is hopeful as:

1) They seem to have met in a relatively organic way (yes he asked Pa Duggar permission but that's how it works in their family, not in a 'stalk your church' way or a 'prayer partners with JB' way). That has to be something right?

2) They've known each other for a while, although things will no doubt move quickly from here on in (cos they're probably already engaged) it's no whirlwind romance, chances are ,even if they marry in the next 6 months they will have known each other for over 2 years before they have a child. That's got to be something too right?

3) He has a job (yes, I know - Derrick had a job), he's already a 'certified minister' and doing that job. So the chances of him packing it in to do 'missionary work' or be a 'Christian rapper' has to be reduced because he's already working in that field.

4) I like the fact he has a past, I like that fact he isn't squeaky clean. Just because he got up to shit as a teenager, doesn't mean he's that person now (sure, now he's a preacher in a church that thinks you can pray away the gay but hey, look at these people, he is singing from their songbook. It's probably question 1 on JB's entry exam to 'Courting a Duggar 101')

These are the Duggars, the chances of one of the children running off with a liberal atheist (which is pretty much the only thing we would be cheering for at FJ) is slimmer than me waking up one day and deciding to run the London marathon. Yes, technically it's possible, but likely? no.

If she can just not give birth on camera, I'll probably take that as a win.

[Tim-Tom Biblethumper]

Have they been courting since December, or is that when Jer asked J-Bob if he could "get to know" Jinger?
BTW, what happens during the "get to know you" phase if you find you don't like what you've "gotten to know"?

ETA:  Has anyone actually looked up the church in Laredo on Google maps?  It's a converted house in a neighborhood of homes!  

[Melissa1977]

5 minutes ago, Tim-Tom Biblethumper said:

BTW, what happens during the "get to know you" phase if you find you don't like what you've "gotten to know"?

If you haven't shown the "get to know" in TV or IG, nothing happens.

You know, since you haven't touched the other person, you have not given a piece of your heart away. No matter your feelings or your dreams, it's all about modesty and fake contentment.

[Marissap]

2 hours ago, fraurosena said:

Thankfully his favorite author is David Martyn Lloyd-Jones, so Jinger just might be spared a Spurgeon debacle...

Lloyd-Jones doesn't sound as bad!

I thought the exact same thing!  I'm sure they will come up with something nutty though, it's just ramping up. 

[Apricot]

I saw this last night and was desperate to see what FJ had to say!  Shame he's stepped away from football.  Im reserving judgement on him for now though. Haven't watched his vids yet as Im in work.

[nastyhobbitses]

1 hour ago, Percy said:

Welcome JessaErin.

We know that Jinger will be leaving home as hubby to be has a parish away from the Duggar compound.  I wonder if she will take a buddy with her?

I'm wondering how much histrionics they'll feature when Jinger LEAVES FOREVER. There was some with Jill, but not to the level we saw on BUB when Michael left.

[HarleyQuinn]

8 hours ago, Cleopatra7 said:

Unfortunately, he won't have to do any molding; her spirit was broken a long time ago. Also, I don't understand why everyone says Jeremy is a convent when his father has been a pastor for a while and he was homeschooled. He seems to have been born into Protestant fundamentalism just like Jinger, although he seems to have spent some time in the secular world. By becoming a pastor, it seems like he's just come full-circle back to his upbringing.

I must not have gotten to that part in the old thread yet. It's why I hate being late to the party, I miss so much. lol

[nastyhobbitses]

So now that we've discussed the fact that Jeremy has more giant red flags than a Chinese military parade, let's talk about the most important thing: how much I hope Jinger picks out a fantastic wedding dress for the big moment when she starts the rest of her life with this creepy dude. I think she has the best fashion sense of all the girls (I'm still so mad that Jill didn't go for a modest 1970s hippie/Jane Austen-style dress, which would have suited her so much more than the Frankenstein'd dress she went with), so here's hoping she picks out something awesome.

I'm really, really tempted to make a Pinterest board of ideas.

[CoveredInBees]

52 minutes ago, Tim-Tom Biblethumper said:

Have they been courting since December, or is that when Jer asked J-Bob if he could "get to know" Jinger?
BTW, what happens during the "get to know you" phase if you find you don't like what you've "gotten to know"?

ETA:  Has anyone actually looked up the church in Laredo on Google maps?  It's a converted house in a neighborhood of homes!  

*cough* I'll admit I did  It's very small

(also when I googled the address, it brought up pics on a home valuation site that showed it before it was extended - so it's probably a fairly recent build)

I probably need to get a hobby.

[actuallyjessica]

When I first heard the news, I thought "he's pretty hot, I hope he enriches her life with worldly things" and as I read more and more I lost all hope and now, he is completely unattractive to me. Jinger looks very uncomfortable, maybe because this is relatively new territory to her, and there's little to no turning back once this went public, or maybe just because she's quite shy. He didn't seem all that into her, either. Something about his body language is off putting - not because he's fundie - there are plenty of them that can charm the pants/skirt off (or on - because modesty!). He doesn't give off the vibe Ben or Derrick gave when we first met them. They were goofballs and we seemed to have hope for them and their brides to be. This guy seems sure enough of himself and he comes across as calculated... And this makes me worry for Jinger.

If she remains in the cult, the best we could hope for would be an Alyssa Webster style - distancing herself enough from an overbearing family and making some small choices. At worst (ha!) she could end up an Esther Shrader....

Not feeling too optimistic. I do agree with the posters who say Jessa is probably seething. I always pictured her with an ambitious tanned athletic guy, not a faux-intellectual with a comb over like Bin.

I also agree that they are likely engaged. Boob wouldn't risk another Josiah/Marg.

So now that we've discussed the fact that Jeremy has more giant red flags than a Chinese military parade, let's talk about the most important thing: how much I hope Jinger picks out a fantastic wedding dress for the big moment when she starts the rest of her life with this creepy dude. I think she has the best fashion sense of all the girls (I'm still so mad that Jill didn't go for a modest 1970s hippie/Jane Austen-style dress, which would have suited her so much more than the Frankenstein'd dress she went with), so here's hoping she picks out something awesome.

I'm really, really tempted to make a Pinterest board of ideas.

If you do, be sure to let me know. I think Jinger has really come into her own within the last year or so. It's always fun to ponder over the superficial details of their lives and weddings.

[nastyhobbitses]

14 minutes ago, actuallyjessica said:

If you do, be sure to let me know. I think Jinger has really come into her own within the last year or so. It's always fun to ponder over the superficial details of their lives and weddings.

I feel bad about how fun I find it, but that's what TLC's been marketing to us for years. Also, I just love a good, snark-worthy wedding. What will Sierra probably-purposefully fuck up for drama points? What drudgery will Jana be subjected to? Will Jinger have to go to a wedding dress shop full of Harlot Dresses and be attended to by a gay stylist? How will Michelle attempt to steal everyone else's thunder? Will Erin come and curb-stomp the church's piano?

[Fundie Bunny]

http://www.dhresource.com/0x0s/f2-albu-g3-M01-D9-EF-rBVaHVWLvXyAAliYAAQ5qw-fljE170.jpg/bohemian-ivory-hippie-wedding-dresses-lace.jpg

I see Jinger with something like this, but with more fabric.

[nastyhobbitses]

4 minutes ago, Fundie Bunny said:

http://www.dhresource.com/0x0s/f2-albu-g3-M01-D9-EF-rBVaHVWLvXyAAliYAAQ5qw-fljE170.jpg/bohemian-ivory-hippie-wedding-dresses-lace.jpg

I see Jinger with something like this, but with more fabric.

No lie, I'd wear that and I'm practically the Whore of Babylon by Duggar standards.

[VelociRapture]

6 minutes ago, nastyhobbitses said:

I feel bad about how fun I find it, but that's what TLC's been marketing to us for years. Also, I just love a good, snark-worthy wedding. What will Sierra probably-purposefully fuck up for drama points? What drudgery will Jana be subjected to? Will Jinger have to go to a wedding dress shop full of Harlot Dresses and be attended to by a gay stylist? How will Michelle attempt to steal everyone else's thunder? Will Erin come and curb-stomp the church's piano?

I'm so hoping Sierra does the wedding. Think of the possibilities!!!

- A beautiful outdoor reception in October. Suddenly, the weather reports say it's going to rain - and there's no tents available to rent! Panic ensues, but it's totes cool cause the rain ends before the ceremony starts.

- A lovely Coffee/Soccer/Jesus hybrid theme.

- Multi-colored plastic flamingoes decorate the altar. No explanation will be given. It'll be weird.

- Crazy eyes will be on full display. For no reason at all.

- Erin Bates Paine will be banging those piano keys so hard it'll make you wonder if the piano insulted her honor somehow.

- Jinger decides there will only be cupcakes served. Sierra, and her new side kick Joy, scramble to make replacements after Josie licks the tops of half of them the morning of the wedding.

- JB fake cries before the ceremony. Michelle makes that pained looking smile. Jinger and Jessa make heart signs with their hands. 

- Jana loses her shit completely after altering twenty dresses and sewing twenty ties. A rampage ensues, during which a small village is sadly trampled.

- Awkward camera shots to hide Joshley from view.

- Half the ceremony won't be shown because it'll be too over the top Fundie for the speshul snowflakes that are TLC viewers.

- Derick tries to joke about something, but only succeeds in looking Douchey. 

- Bin tries to speak, but is so congested that no one can understand a word he says.

- Jill does something relatively harmless (like being obviously pregnant or having Derick paint her nails); everyone claims she's an attention stealing whore. 

- Cousin Amy does something Cousin Amyish. It'll be phenomenal. 

[foreign fundie]

I asked DH how I initially caught his attention and he said it was because I had opinions and I didn't hide them (though I thought I was being meek, humble and modest). 

So although I am late to the party, I will put in my digital tithe in the big FJ offering box.

I am always ready to be positive. So I hoped he would like her for who she was and was not heavy into patriachy. But his dad's sermons on this topic make my skin crawl. The family seems right up the Duggar ally. His courtship story dashed any further hopes. It is what any fundie guy could have written about any fundie girl. Humblemeekservantheartmodest. Nothing unique about her or him at all. No funny anecdotes. Just the usual 'wow -godly- girl- lets- ask- a-bunch-of- other -godly- people -what -they -think- and -become -friends -with -her -godly-dad' routine. 

They are cookie cutter boys looking for cookie cutter girls, with incredably predictable testimonies, who tell their cookie cutter love stories on their cookie cutter webpages full of cookie cutter pictures with cookie cutter in-laws. 

Of course, since they are real people, somehow they have real feelings, which will be surpressed by fundie expectations and the happy show front until they surface in some ugly way. 

And that is the first thing I thought of when I heard he was a football player. Muscle power and the levels of testosterone and aggression necessary to be a prof, in combination with extreme patriarchy, and a 'meek, humble' girl with a background of abuse, that is not a combination I feel comfortable with. Really hope he will only use those muscles to protect her.

Then he asked for councel from Ben and Jessa. Really??? 28 yo pastor with education and prof background askes Ben for relationship guidance? Or should I read that as 'I asked Ben how bribe/ blackmail JB into consenting to courtship'.

He is a PASTOR. Someone who has to give marriage counseling, guides people through grieve and crises, and he asks Ben for advice on a girl? He may be 28. But when I met my DH, who was much younger then, he did not need any such advice. 

If he would have courted her without jumping on the Counting On band wagon, would have kept his real digital life visible and showed some authenticity, I may have had hope. So far, he checks all the wrong boxes.

[trisprefect]

I'm not quite willing to paint him as an abusive sociopath from some pictures and a few videos. There definitely is something a little off about a 28 year old into a very immature 22 year old, and the potential for a power imbalance is a very legitimate concern. But I guess I think that we're jumping the gun a little on being convinced that Jinger is about to step into a nightmare.

As someone said above (thread is moving too fast for me to bother quoting), the way that they met is probably the most organic we've seen from the Duggars. Meeting through a friend is legitimate, and it gives me hope that maybe Jeremy likes her for the same reason that so many of us have a soft spot for Jinger. I doubt they're deeply in love, and I'm sure a huge part of his interest has to do with her being a good fit for the life he is intent on leading, but people have made happy marriages out of shakier beginnings.

I don't see something inherently suspect in his background either. He was a mid-level soccer player who couldn't hack it in the majors and got dropped down through the leagues until he likely didn't have any offers, and went with his fall back option: religion. Knowing soccer pretty well, I don't think for one second that he quit to pursue ministry, I think he lost his position and went with the next best thing. Which says that he's ambitious and pragmatic, but not the idiot (looking at you Derick) who would leave a semi-lucrative job to go panhandling for Jesus.

I don't know, maybe I'm wrong and this guy is terrible, but I'm willing to give it some time before I make any serious prognostications about their future happiness.