Jessa, Ben, and Spurgeon part 5

[Mothership]

why has the image been removed?

 

[Kira]

Just now, Mothership said:

why has the image been removed?

 

Krista made her IG account private. 

[nastyhobbitses]

1 hour ago, Mercer said:

I agree. While it's true that adolescence as it's defined in the United States is a relatively modern concept, there has almost always been some sort of independence process by which a child becomes an adult through taking on more responsibility and being expected to start making good decisions, however a particular culture defines what good decision-making entails.

The Duggar kids never had that. They were constantly supervised (by another sibling if not by a parent) so they never learned to be accountable for themselves with no one watching. They were never allowed to make independent decisions out of fear they'd make bad ones, so they never learned to make any decisions at all. 

It's not just the rushed adulthood that made the Duggar kids into such floundering adults. It's that combined with the extreme sheltering of their childhoods. Parents have to loosen their grip a little to allow kids to mature into grownups, and the Duggar parents never did that, so the next generation grew into chronological adults who still lacked basic adulthood skills. That's a parenting fail, not just a difference of perspective about the purpose of adolescence.

You hit the nail on the head. By never allowing their children to think for themselves, make mistakes or stupid judgments every once in a while, or hold themselves accountable for stupid or wrong decisions, Michelle and JB stunted their children. But then again, that's exactly what they wanted.

[RabbitKM]

1 hour ago, Kira said:

Some of the comments in this thread(about Ben's education, the Seewalds possbly moving to Chicago and Ben attending a concert) are ....weird    .

We would be so happy if any other fundie attended a concert. We seem so concerned and sad(?) when the Duggars/Dillards/Seewalds do normal things. Good for Ben. He seems to love Christian rap. I think it's great he went to a concert without Jessa.  Christian rap seems to be popular with fundies, including friends of the Duggars. 

I don't think Jessa or JB are upset. I'm sure Jessa knew he was going to attend this concert.  I never believed JB completely controls his sons-in laws or the married couples. Jill and Derick have done normal, secular things. Even the unmarried children have learned some secular music are participate in secular activities.  

 

I don't think people here are sad that Ben did something normal.  What is a little sad is that Jessa can't be normal and do things.  I think people generally think its a big deal that Ben did something with out his wife, because it shows a little independence.  This is a good thing, IMO.

[Kira]

36 minutes ago, RabbitKM said:

I don't think people here are sad that Ben did something normal.  What is a little sad is that Jessa can't be normal and do things.  I think people generally think its a big deal that Ben did something with out his wife, because it shows a little independence.  This is a good thing, IMO.

Peole are saying that this means the marriage is doomed. Ben going to a concert could be a "bad sign" and he should expect ramifications from Jessa(L.O.L.) I just find some of the comments odd. We want the Duggars/Dillards/Seewald to do normal thing and forget Gothard(and Duggar) rules, but we seem upset or unhappy when we get our wish.

 

 

[nst]

48 minutes ago, RabbitKM said:

I don't think people here are sad that Ben did something normal.  What is a little sad is that Jessa can't be normal and do things.  I think people generally think its a big deal that Ben did something with out his wife, because it shows a little independence.  This is a good thing, IMO.

i'm devastated Ben did something normal

 

[Kira]

Sad, unhappy and upset may not be the right words. Comments like "Kelly Bates must be laughing" are very strange. 

 

 

[actuallyjessica]

This is what I never understand about the Duggars - why do they shelter their children so much that it harms them more than it would if they didn't? Why aren't they strong enough in their faith and parenting abilities that they've raised their children to make choices that will make Jesus happy?

The Bates have a looser grip on their kids and their faith is strong - so by the Duggars thoughts and standards, the Bates family are heathens.

And Amy? Well, she doesn't have a chance of going to Heaven. And she's more secular than the Bates!

Fundie logic. It fails.

[Shadoewolf]

Hubby and I spend a LOT of time together, but we do stuff apart now and then. My happiest times are going to the grocery store without him or the kids in tow.  Edited to add:  I found out Highly Suspect is playing a date in my favorite small venue next month.  Knowing its a night Hubby usually has to work, I only bought one ticket. He doesn't know yet, but I don't expect a huge issue out of it.

I probably won't word this very well so bear with me.  If Ben went to the concert, and Krista is considered a "friend' of the Duggars, why wouldn't Jessa have gone? Not like there's not enough J-sibs to watch Spurge for a few hours. And if she's so indoctrinated against the music, then yeah I see major issues in their marriage later on, especially if things go south. The ebil music will be to blame.  But she can't speak at women's only events without him? If she has to have an accountability partner, why not a female sibling and get paid for a dual Duggar girl appearance? Couldn't he, as headship, tell her she had to go?

[nst]

21 minutes ago, Shadoewolf said:

Hubby and I spend a LOT of time together, but we do stuff apart now and then. My happiest times are going to the grocery store without him or the kids in tow.

I probably won't word this very well so bear with me.  If Ben went to the concert, and Krista is considered a "friend' of the Duggars, why wouldn't Jessa have gone? Not like there's not enough J-sibs to watch Spurge for a few hours. And if she's so indoctrinated against the music, then yeah I see major issues in their marriage later on, especially if things go south. The ebil music will be to blame.  But she can't speak at women's only events without him? If she has to have an accountability partner, why not a female sibling and get paid for a dual Duggar girl appearance? Couldn't he, as headship, tell her she had to go?

I think you worded it very well.  I think Krista is considered a prayer person friend maybe. I am still dumbfounded that she would a)post it  b ) Ben actually going to a concert 

Maybe he is her accountability partner.  

Who can understand the mechanics of their marriage. 

[ClaraOswin]

I don't think it was just Krista and Ben. I'm sure it was a group of friends. Pretty normal for the age group. And I am not surprised Jessa didn't go. I doubt she would find it fun.

[SassyPants]

If this was NBD, according to them, why was the photo deleted?

In the real world, as opposed to Fantasyland Duggarville, this is NO BIG DEAL!

[choralcrusader8613]

3 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

If this was NBD, according to them, why was the photo deleted?

In the real world, as opposed to Fantasyland Duggarville, this is NO BIG DEAL!

FreeJinger doesn't allow pictures/video from private IG accounts to be posted here.

[ClaraOswin]

6 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

If this was NBD, according to them, why was the photo deleted?

In the real world, as opposed to Fantasyland Duggarville, this is NO BIG DEAL!

Krista didn't delete them from her account. She just changed it to private (which is why they are no longer allowed here.) I don't think it's a big deal to Krista. I imagine she just didn't like Pickles posting things from her account since tabloids pull stuff from Pickles' page all the time.

[SassyPants]

4 minutes ago, choralcrusader8613 said:

FreeJinger doesn't allow pictures/video from private IG accounts to be posted here.

So the photo didn't actually go poof?

Thanks!

[nst]

Just now, SassyPants said:

So the photo didn't actually go poof?

Thanks!

it did

but it didn't hmmm 

1 minute ago, ClaraOswin said:

Krista didn't delete them from her account. She just changed it to private (which is why they are no longer allowed here.) I don't think it's a big deal to Krista. I imagine she just didn't like Pickles posting things from her account since tabloids pull stuff from Pickles' page all the time.

because as she calls herself a "fundie" 

[Alexa]

I don't think that it is a big deal when someone does something without their partner (it's a sanity saver for me), but I think it is a HUGE deal for the Duggars when of their partners does something without the other. I hope that Ben going out to a concert without Jessa is a good thing for their marriage and means that their relationship is stronger than I thought and that they'll start doing more "worldly" things.

However, based off Jessa's mannerisms and Ben's apparent apathy in the last few episodes, I think there is trouble brewing in their house. Ben just seems so over it all.  Either way, I doubt Ma and Pa Duggar see Ben going to a concert without Jessa and wanting to do hip hop music as a good thing and are probably trying to find a way to stop it. 

Meanwhile, somewhere in Central America Jill is putting Derrick on an even shorter leash. 

[EmCatlyn]

5 hours ago, nastyhobbitses said:

You hit the nail on the head. By never allowing their children to think for themselves, make mistakes or stupid judgments every once in a while, or hold themselves accountable for stupid or wrong decisions, Michelle and JB stunted their children. But then again, that's exactly what they wanted.

They probably weren't consciously trying to stunt their kids. They probably sincerely thought of themselves as protecting.  They confused their own needs (to be in control, to impress everyone with their superiority, to reassure themselves that they weren't going to hell) with their kids' needs. And they raised a bunch of emotionally and intellectually crippled young people.  But that was a side effect, not a goal.  It doesn't make the kids any less the victims of their parents' bad system of raising children.

[Mercer]

I also think some of it was just a concession to high-volume parenting. It takes a lot of effort, attention, and time invested in an individual to shape a young person into an independent moral decision-maker. It takes virtually none to just send another child along to tattle if they misbehave. I think there was some element of frankly just taking the path of least resistance with nineteen children to raise, rather than fully investing in helping each individual child grow into their maximum adult potential.

[newyorkgirl52]

5 hours ago, ClaraOswin said:

Krista didn't delete them from her account. She just changed it to private (which is why they are no longer allowed here.) I don't think it's a big deal to Krista. I imagine she just didn't like Pickles posting things from her account since tabloids pull stuff from Pickles' page all the time.

A lady named Sharon on Pickles asked her about it. She said that she accepted a substitute teaching position and had to make her instagram private so that no students started following her due to the school's rules where she is subbing. This is pretty common. If there was scandal I think she would have taken it down. 

Also, I think they went int a group. There was a group picture. 

Married people SHOULD have interests apart from each other. That's normal and healthy. Good for them for not being awkwardly enmeshed like the rest of the couples in the family. lol

Maybe Spud was sick? Maybe Jessa is doing attachment parenting? Maybe she wasn't feeling well or had a headache, or didn't want to go. You know all the reasons why married people don't tag along with their spouses. 

[nastyhobbitses]

2 hours ago, EmCatlyn said:

They probably weren't consciously trying to stunt their kids. They probably sincerely thought of themselves as protecting.  They confused their own needs (to be in control, to impress everyone with their superiority, to reassure themselves that they weren't going to hell) with their kids' needs. And they raised a bunch of emotionally and intellectually crippled young people.  But that was a side effect, not a goal.  It doesn't make the kids any less the victims of their parents' bad system of raising children.

I mean, perhaps they weren't thinking "muahahaha let's make our children completely unable to function in the real world", but I get the impression that they wanted their children to be ignorant, pliable, and dependent so they'd be easier to control and keep in essentially the Cult of Jim Bob.

[Ungodly Grandma]

8 hours ago, Kira said:

Sad, unhappy and upset may not be the right words. Comments like "Kelly Bates must be laughing" are very strange. 

 

 

This IS a snark site.

[Casserole]

I thought headships (married men) are allowed to do what they want and don't need permission or an accountability partner? I don't see this causing marital problems because she was raised to believe he can do whatever he wants and she needs permission and a chaperone to do anything. Yes, Jessa was raised to think of dancing as a one way ticket to hell, but her headship disagrees and she must listen to him. 

Other than that logic being ass-backwards, I still don't see the issue here. 

[foreign fundie]

43 minutes ago, nastyhobbitses said:

I mean, perhaps they weren't thinking "muahahaha let's make our children completely unable to function in the real world", but I get the impression that they wanted their children to be ignorant, pliable, and dependent so they'd be easier to control and keep in essentially the Cult of Jim Bob.

I could imagine that the 'accountability partner' thing for the kiddults, especially the girls, has a lot to do with the show. I suppose they get a quite a bit of unsollicited attention when outside, both positive and negative. That could be intimidating when you are alone.

Another possibility, what if a J slave would go out alone and a stranger at the bus stop asks her some really thought provoking questions about her family? There needs to be someone else to prevent this happening, or to prevent a real discussion from developing or to remind her of the party line. None of them would last long in an honest, rational debate, without the regime's robots backing them up.(understatement alert!)

I doubt JB and M would think the girls would go do something sinful like buying a magazine with dirty pictures. I think they want to protect them against strangers (even strangers that would be good from our perspective).

Now the boys are a different story. They need 24/7 policing because we know they cannot control themselves. Only after their wedding night can they be trusted to roam the streets alone. That's the part I don't quite get yet. Because even fundies don't seem to think other women magically loose their appeal once a guy has a legitimate outlet. Or at least not post-Joshly.

[nst]

2 hours ago, Ungodly Grandma said:

This IS a snark site.

are you sure ?  because I was under the impression we all love Ben and Jessa and wanted them to be happy all the time.  At least that is what michelle told me when we she last talked to me about my spreading the gospel

 

4 hours ago, newyorkgirl52 said:

A lady named Sharon on Pickles asked her about it. She said that she accepted a substitute teaching position and had to make her instagram private so that no students started following her due to the school's rules where she is subbing. This is pretty common. If there was scandal I think she would have taken it down. 

Also, I think they went int a group. There was a group picture. 

Married people SHOULD have interests apart from each other. That's normal and healthy. Good for them for not being awkwardly enmeshed like the rest of the couples in the family. lol

Maybe Spud was sick? Maybe Jessa is doing attachment parenting? Maybe she wasn't feeling well or had a headache, or didn't want to go. You know all the reasons why married people don't tag along with their spouses. 

before it went down - she posted a picture that she was going to Law School

- maybe that had to something with it