Josiah Duggar Courting - Part 2

[halcionne]

Marjorie's uncle was involved in organized crime (per Radar online). Yawn, -the "scandal."

I really cannot stand when an entire group of people is made to sound guilty by association. The article tries to stir a "Gasp!, what would the Duggars think?" response. Josiah and Marjorie did not just discover the existence of one another in the last month (Uncle died a month before their courtship announcement). I'm pretty sure this would have come up in conversation along the way. Anyhoo, that's the latest.

Here's the article, so they get fewer clicks. :disgust:

The entire Duggar family is overjoyed that son Josiah is courting the accomplished, squeaky-clean teen Marjorie Jackson. But 19 Kids And Counting fans may not know that the Jackson clan is grieving a very recent, tragic death.

RadarOnline.com can reveal that Marjorie’s uncle Ben Jackson died at just 41 on March 7, less than a month before the 17-year-old published author embarked on her celebrity courtship with the TLC reality star, 18.

Ben, a divorced father of two, passed away after a lifetime of criminal activity that would likely shock the deeply religious Duggar family.

PHOTOS: 19 Scandals & Counting! The Duggar Family’s Biggest Secrets REVEALED

In Collin County court documents obtained by Radar, the Texas native was first arrested at just 17 years old and charged with engaging in organized crime, a felony, on July 1, 1991. One month later, he was arrested again and charged with theft over $20,000, another felony.

SEE THE SHOCKING COURT PAPERS

He was sentenced to eight years of probation.

On October 14, 2001, he was arrested for driving while intoxicated.

PHOTOS: Duggar Critics Launch Campaign To Convince Daughters To Flee The Coop

He was sentenced to 180 days in jail, 80 hours of community service, DWI school and a year of probation.

But less than ten years later, he was arrested for driving while intoxicated again on February 8, 2010.

He spent more than five months in jail for the crime, from November 2010 to April 2011.

According to his obituary, Ben was active in the Men of Nehemiah ministry, a Christian addiction recovery program, in Dallas, Texas. In lieu of flowers, mourners were asked to make a donation to the program.

Marjorie, her father Greg and mother Analucia, and her younger sisters Genevieve, Melody, Harmony and Felicity were listed among the grieving.

smh, Radar. I don't know what the 1991 stuff was, but it happened in 1991. The other items suggest addiction, which is unfortunate. And now he's recently deceased. That's just shitty, Radar. Kudos for doing real journalism, though, and finding actual court documents (I guess--I didn't look at them).

[Ralar]

Here's the article, so they get fewer clicks. :disgust:

smh, Radar. I don't know what the 1991 stuff was, but it happened in 1991. The other items suggest addiction, which is unfortunate. And now he's recently deceased. That's just shitty, Radar. Kudos for doing real journalism, though, and finding actual court documents (I guess--I didn't look at them).

I'm sure the Duggars have prayed for his soul, just like they do for their heathen, lesbian sister/aunt Evelyn.

[halcionne]

Has anyone been able to find out Marjorie's birthday? I'm really curious to know when she turned 17....

....because I just had a thought that she could well have only just turned 17 within the last month, which really makes her younger than she seems.

{L_MESSAGE_HIDDEN}:

I thought I would do more digging on this and fell into an inbred rabbithole of wtf (also, I am seriously distracted with real life stuff, so for all I know I am completely overreacting). I thought I would look up Marjorie stuff starting from the El Salvador mission trips (through SOS Ministries) and found a comment on FJ that SOS guy is the cool pastor who married Benjermin and Jessa????

viewtopic.php?f=87&t=24742&p=864118&hilit=sos+ministries#p864118 from my favorite FJer of the day, artdecades.

{L_MESSAGE_HIDDEN}:

I feel like pieces are falling into place and this preacherman is the keystone that opens/closes/completes a big weird circle of logrolling and kickbacks and everybody getting rich because jesus. Somebody talk me down!

[JuJuBee8]

I never would've picked him to be the next one to go courting. Josiah seemed different from the other Duggar kids. I remember him at Stonehenge. He walked around with a guide, asking questions. He seemed genuinely interested in the history of the place, unlike the others who were mostly running around falling all over each other like a pack of gorillas. Creepy, silent John David was right there dogging Josiah's footsteps, monitoring but not contributing to the conversation. I assume he then reported back to the parents. Not about anything the guide said, but probably every word Josiah said. Just in case he needed to be harangued and hounded for betraying an improper thought. Who can withstand that kind of stifling pressure to just give up, give in, and go along? The kids are encouraged to be informants, there's no privacy, anything you say can and will be used against you.

[Lucy H]

I never would've picked him to be the next one to go courting. Josiah seemed different from the other Duggar kids. I remember him at Stonehenge. He walked around with a guide, asking questions. He seemed genuinely interested in the history of the place, unlike the others who were mostly running around falling all over each other like a pack of gorillas. Creepy, silent John David was right there dogging Josiah's footsteps, monitoring but not contributing to the conversation. I assume he then reported back to the parents. Not about anything the guide said, but probably every word Josiah said. Just in case he needed to be harangued and hounded for betraying an improper thought. Who can withstand that kind of stifling pressure to just give up, give in, and go along? The kids are encouraged to be informants, there's no privacy, anything you say can and will be used against you.

Reason enough to get married. It's the only way you get any autonomy at all.

[nastyhobbitses]

It's funny because he's an accountant, lmao

Also funny because even though he has a day job, 19KAC is quite the gravy train.

[halcionne]

Also funny because even though he has a day job, 19KAC is quite the gravy train.

It's even funnier when you put it that way, hehe.

[SilentSnark]

Has anyone started taking bets on the date of the engagement announcement?

[jerkit]

Has anyone started taking bets on the date of the engagement announcement?

Right after her 18th birthday, whenever that is.

[veron1que]

Right after her 18th birthday, whenever that is.

Really? I hope not.

You are probably right though. I'm thinking more a VDay engagement in early 2016 and a wedding in May.

[Sweet Fellowship]

I had hopes that Josiah would make a run from the cult. He seems like an intelligent and sweet guy. I wonder if he'll drift away once married? With how the other married Duggars have continued to chug down the Koolaid, I sadly doubt it. As for his girlfriend, I'm not sure what to make of her. It could go either way. She could start drinking the Duggar Koolaid ala Anna.

[eh02]

I don't think they'll get married before she turns 18, but I'm not sure they will necessarily have to wait to get engaged. Was Alyssa Bates under 18 when she got engaged? The child bride thing doesn't seem to bother these people.

It's just the gut feeling, and it could be wrong, but I really think Jim Bob wants Josiah tied down with all of the responsibilities that going along with becoming a husband and father. People have said it here better than me before - it's like Josh 2.0. They might as well be behind him with a hot poker as he walks down the aisle. Anything to keep them from going wild or having premarital sex. And look at Josh now. I think the reality of the life he was pushed into at a young age has really caught up to him. He looks miserable. I hope that does not happen to Josiah.

[antwan]

They have known the Duggars and what they stand for for years now.. if they cared about those considerations they would not have Marjorie in this position in first place.

This ^^^. It's like medieval times, where marriages were often a political move to strengthen a kingdom, etc. Here, the Duggar "kingdom" means fundie power and financial security. How could Marjorie's parents have missed that? Oh, wait. They clearly didn't.

[JillyO]

I don't think they'll get married before she turns 18, but I'm not sure they will necessarily have to wait to get engaged. Was Alyssa Bates under 18 when she got engaged? The child bride thing doesn't seem to bother these people.

No. John and Alyssa actually only started courting three days before her 19th birthday. It was just one of those super-fast fundie relationships: Courtship in November, engagement in January, wedding in May. Kelly has been pretty emphatic in the past that they don't allow their kids to court before they're 18.

[justmy2cents]

No. John and Alyssa actually only started courting three days before her 19th birthday. It was just one of those super-fast fundie relationships: Courtship in November, engagement in January, wedding in May. Kelly has been pretty emphatic in the past that they don't allow their kids to court before they're 18.

It seemed super fast but I think Kelly said they were special friends for a year (maybe more) and that they could have skipped the courting stage and gone straight to engagement but decided they wanted to experience the courting stage officially.

Also, seemed like Jessa and Ben had a special friend stage. When Ben asked her to court, he said something like 'Let's make it official' or 'I would like to ask you to court me officially' or something like that.

[JillyO]

It seemed super fast but I think Kelly said they were special friends for a year (maybe more) and that they could have skipped the courting stage and gone straight to engagement but decided they wanted to experience the courting stage officially.

Oh yeah, Kelly definitely said that. I just never know what to make of that "getting to know you"/"special friends" stage. If they were more or less boyfriend/girlfriend for a year before starting to officially court, then good for them. (IIRC Alyssa called John her "boyfriend" on her Pinterest before they started courting.)

[justmy2cents]

Oh yeah, Kelly definitely said that. I just never know what to make of that "getting to know you"/"special friends" stage. If they were more or less boyfriend/girlfriend for a year before starting to officially court, then good for them. (IIRC Alyssa called John her "boyfriend" on her Pinterest before they started courting.)

Yes, Alyssa and John's relationship seemed more mainstream and not so much like a courtship. They were seen together and decided to marry before they made the courtship official at which point they started holding hands and front hugging immediately. If one of MIchelle's daughters decided to be that physical during courtship she would probably have a coronary.

[IReallyAmHopewell]

I don't think they'll get married before she turns 18, but I'm not sure they will necessarily have to wait to get engaged. Was Alyssa Bates under 18 when she got engaged? The child bride thing doesn't seem to bother these people.

It's just the gut feeling, and it could be wrong, but I really think Jim Bob wants Josiah tied down with all of the responsibilities that going along with becoming a husband and father. People have said it here better than me before - it's like Josh 2.0. They might as well be behind him with a hot poker as he walks down the aisle. Anything to keep them from going wild or having premarital sex. And look at Josh now. I think the reality of the life he was pushed into at a young age has really caught up to him. He looks miserable. I hope that does not happen to Josiah.

18 is not a "child bride." Lots of people who skip college still get married or cohabit at that age. They don't all end in divorce. It's not ideal, but if you have no interest in college then that's perfectly normal.

I can't say that I've seen Josh looking miserable. He seems to genuinely love Anna and the kids. He's old enough to be a father and husband. Most people get fed up at some point and that's even without tv crews in your life. Remember, Josh didn't choose it--Daddy did.

[HarleyQuinn]

When did we figure she turns 18? Between Dec-Feb? If so, I expect an engagement soon after and a summer wedding. As much as I'd like these two to wait, I don't see it happening.

[nausicaa]

18 is not a "child bride." Lots of people who skip college still get married or cohabit at that age. They don't all end in divorce. It's not ideal, but if you have no interest in college then that's perfectly normal.

It looks like the average age at first marriage for non-college graduates is 23.6. So 18 is still pretty young (at least in the mainstream, not Quiverfull necessarily). I certainly wouldn't say it's "perfectly normal."

bls.gov/opub/mlr/2013/article/pdf/marriage-and-divorce-patterns-by-gender-race-and-educational-attainment.pdf

[IReallyAmHopewell]

It looks like the average age at first marriage for non-college graduates is 23.6. So 18 is still pretty young (at least in the mainstream, not Quiverfull necessarily). I certainly wouldn't say it's "perfectly normal."

bls.gov/opub/mlr/2013/article/pdf/marriage-and-divorce-patterns-by-gender-race-and-educational-attainment.pdf

How many does it say live together without marriage? I can name plenty. I think given that they have grown up knowing that as soon as you are married you are an adult and not until then, I'm sure they see it as a very acceptable age.

[JenniferJuniper]

How many does it say live together without marriage? I can name plenty. I think given that they have grown up knowing that as soon as you are married you are an adult and not until then, I'm sure they see it as a very acceptable age.

There is a big difference between acceptable and sensible.

Living together is not a lifetime commitment. (unless you have kids and then things get more complicated.) Marriage is supposed to be for life and in Duggarland this is ironclad. I don't think it's remotely sensible for two completely unworldly teenagers who've never dated anyone else or held down jobs. And while he seems a bright lad, the future headship is woefully under-educated. If his teenage bride starts birthing babies immediately, they could have a half dozen kids by the time they are in their mid-20's.

It's more than not sensible, it's stupid. And if Jim Bob is pushing this to gain or increase his control over his son or, worse still, for the sake of the show, he's more evil than I even imagined.

I hope I'm still around when JB and Michelle finally get their comeuppance. Because it will come someday.

[IReallyAmHopewell]

"I hope I'm still around when JB and Michelle finally get their comeuppance. Because it will come someday."

JenniferJuniper--you and me both! I'm praying for a tell-all book from AT LEAST one kid. Preferably Jana.

[SnazzyNazzy]

The only thing that I keep thinking is:

Is that it has got to suck, that you have to get married, before you can even make out.

[littlesparklingflame]

I don't think they'll get married before she turns 18, but I'm not sure they will necessarily have to wait to get engaged. Was Alyssa Bates under 18 when she got engaged? The child bride thing doesn't seem to bother these people.

It's just the gut feeling, and it could be wrong, but I really think Jim Bob wants Josiah tied down with all of the responsibilities that going along with becoming a husband and father. People have said it here better than me before - it's like Josh 2.0. They might as well be behind him with a hot poker as he walks down the aisle. Anything to keep them from going wild or having premarital sex. And look at Josh now. I think the reality of the life he was pushed into at a young age has really caught up to him. He looks miserable. I hope that does not happen to Josiah.

I agree with every word.

And Josh does look miserable. He is just worn out.

When Anna announced him that she was pregnant with baby n.4 he was like "duh...oh...really? oh...ok". No enthusiasm at all. That's not a normal reaction to a news that is supposed to be thrilling for all the family. And then he made those considerations on how "different" (=difficult) it will be to have this child in Washington, with already three to be taken care of...

He sounded overwhelmed more than overjoyed.