Jessa is Courting! All Things Duggar Family - Part 7

[CannedSoup]

Could someone fill me on on the fundie courting flow chart? TIA

[Cleopatra7]

Regarding the question of whether the Duggar kids are happy, I think that we have to remember that there is such a thing as a fool's paradise. If your life is built on an illusion, then it doesn't matter if you're happy or not. North Koreans are taught that they are the richest, most successful people on earth, and that everyone looks up to and envies them, all of which is objectively false. The Duggars are probably in a similar situation. They may think that everyone envies their huge family and "godly" demeanor, but in reality everyone outside of the ATI/VF/IFB world thinks they're a freak show. As for Jessa, the best we can hope is that she can find contentment with the situation presented before her.

[Coconut Flan]

I didn't find the comment on Amy's instagram congratulating Jessa and Ben, but I did find she's recommending the Mars HIll phone app and listening to the sermons! Yikes.

[Boogalou]

I think the girls have hugged male fans before. All of the other evidence points to a courtship.

Apparently, there is a comment on Amy Duggar's instagram congratulating Jessa and Ben on their engagement. I can't access her page, so I haven't seen the comment.

kylesmom1402 Please tell your Aunt Michelle that I hope her birthday was absolutely wonderful, and please tell Jessa that we are all so incredibly happy for her! Ben looks like a wonderful young man!

Read more at http://web.stagram.com/n/amyduggar/#QxTO65KHPp90vzlI.99

It's on this picture: http://web.stagram.com/p/544232228829675538_8488471

[pega127]

If he wasn't courting Jessa. He wouldn't have his arm around her and his head touching hers. I doubt Jessa would allow it unless he was a close relative.

I don 't know-she strikes me as sly.

[pega127]

Anna's picture of her being pregnant with her 3rd child was posted on Facebook. Though, they did not official announce it on Today Show. Therefore, it is likely she is in a courtship. It possible that they knew Ben for awhile and now allowing a posting of a pic. I am sure Jimbob is not ignorant of the power of the internet and social media from people, like the Bates who use it to share their lives.

It is possible that announcing Erin's courtship has created enough buzz to make Jimbob wonder what would happen if a pic is posted of one of his daughters. At the end of the day, Jimbob is a businessman and he sees his show as a ministry...I mean business.

...and might like to steal some of Erin's attention!!!

[Buzzard]

I doubt this is a real relationship or a courtship. So Ben got a snapshot at a Duggar event with Jessa. She looks uncomfortable. Ben's relatives' comments don't indicate private or personal knowledge. And Josh may be big brother playing with the guy--'I got my eye on you'--and giving him a bit of Joshie's celebrity attention and glow.

The Duggar Family Blog hasn't picked up this story. They're fed pictures and information by the family and are very reliable sources of family information. Yes, it's possible that a Jessa courtship is secret until the new season begins and the Duggar Family Blog wouldn't betray such a secret, but I'd then think that if a Ben/Jessa courtship is legitimate, Ben Seewald wouldn't post such a picture on his Facebook page. And TLC and the Duggars have never been so tabloid tawdry that they'd tease such a picture 'leak' to increase the viewer audience. They playfully tease within the show's episodes but not externally and certainly not in this ungodly way--unless Jessa is breaking from the fold. But, I think Jessa Blessa isn't likely to break loose anytime soon.

I tend to agree. This just doesnt feel right.

1 - Age - Marrying off one of your brood mares to an 18 year old doesnt fit the Duggar mold. They are master media manipulators. Everything they do is designed to either increase fame/standing or money. What the fuck is "love?" The Duggars are actors, planning their lives like a fucking storyline to keep the show going and their standing in fundiedom. Marrying Jessa off to an 18 year old student doesnt fit this. He simply cannot support her, let alone any offspring so long as he is a full time student, which he would be for 4 more years. Classes will also interfere with their filming/touring schedule, which is a "no no." Losing Joshie is bad enough, losing one of your "girls" because hubby is learning isnt acceptable... and we all know that a wimmenz cant go a tourin wit her familee without her headship.

2 - Standing - We've never heard of these people. They are no one in fundieland, a far cry from the royalty Boob considers himself. Fuck, even Prissy married Pecan. He cant have his first daughter married off to a nobody! Josie or Jordyn, sure, but not this early in the game. Unless they own a business that Boob wants to aquire that we havent discovered yet I dont see it.

3 - Jessa vs. JD - With Joshie in DC the rental house he vacated is prime real estate. JD is ready to go. He has a towing business, is mostly out of the house, carries the Duggar name, and is getting up there in years. How can they marry off to an 18 year old while their 24 (?) year old son is twiddling or diddling? Jessa is an unknown. We dont really "know" her. Sure, all the other older girls have a "thing" (Jill - Midwifery/snitching, Jana - JTTH, Jinger - photography), wtf does Jessa do? Thats not enough to make her a liability to the brand. Yes, its better to marry off a "girl" as far as ratings go - YAY DRESS SHOPPING!!! :headdesk: but we dont really "know" JD or Jessa. We'd get to "meet" them in the lead up to the VSE (christmas definitely) and watch JD's bride finger lace.

With smuggles in DC working for a hate group that house needs to get filled - NOW - for TLC to film more bullshit. JD is a better choice.

4 - Evidence - The picture doesnt do it for me. When I was waiting to meet the Duggars many moons ago there was a fucking scary dude in line behind me. He had driven 11 hours overnight to come get his 25 seconds. He rambled for HOURS about them, knew as much as we do, and almost peed himself when he got to side hug Joy. Obsessed is the understatement of the century. Am I saying Ben is a fanatic? No, but he could be a fan. If he is a FAN and got the pic his family could be "Joshing" him. Speaking of "Joshing..." Josh is a douche. We know that he LOVES to fuck with the internet by posting/commenting and see what happens.

The picture itself actually disproves more than it proves. Lets assume they are dating/courting/whatever. TLC would DEFINITELY have a hand in that. In the same way that they control what the Bateses post, they would control him and his profile pic. THey most definitely would control Joshie and his posts about the courtship. I just dont see it.

[Buzzard]

Oh, and stay tuned for the return of my recaps coming this Tuesday! I'll watch it so you dont have to!

[TheChibi]

Sorry, what is JTTH? It's not in the FJ Dictionary.

[Boogalou]

Sorry, what is JTTH? It's not in the FJ Dictionary.

Journey to the Heart: http://iblp.org/programs/journey-heart

I'll add it to the dictionary now! :)

[TheChibi]

Journey to the Heart: http://iblp.org/programs/journey-heart

I'll add it to the dictionary now! :)

Thanks!

[Kira]

I tend to agree. This just doesnt feel right.

1 - Age - Marrying off one of your brood mares to an 18 year old doesnt fit the Duggar mold. They are master media manipulators. Everything they do is designed to either increase fame/standing or money. What the fuck is "love?" The Duggars are actors, planning their lives like a fucking storyline to keep the show going and their standing in fundiedom. Marrying Jessa off to an 18 year old student doesnt fit this. He simply cannot support her, let alone any offspring so long as he is a full time student, which he would be for 4 more years. Classes will also interfere with their filming/touring schedule, which is a "no no." Losing Joshie is bad enough, losing one of your "girls" because hubby is learning isnt acceptable... and we all know that a wimmenz cant go a tourin wit her familee without her headship.

2 - Standing - We've never heard of these people. They are no one in fundieland, a far cry from the royalty Boob considers himself. Fuck, even Prissy married Pecan. He cant have his first daughter married off to a nobody! Josie or Jordyn, sure, but not this early in the game. Unless they own a business that Boob wants to aquire that we havent discovered yet I dont see it.

3 - Jessa vs. JD - With Joshie in DC the rental house he vacated is prime real estate. JD is ready to go. He has a towing business, is mostly out of the house, carries the Duggar name, and is getting up there in years. How can they marry off to an 18 year old while their 24 (?) year old son is twiddling or diddling? Jessa is an unknown. We dont really "know" her. Sure, all the other older girls have a "thing" (Jill - Midwifery/snitching, Jana - JTTH, Jinger - photography), wtf does Jessa do? Thats not enough to make her a liability to the brand. Yes, its better to marry off a "girl" as far as ratings go - YAY DRESS SHOPPING!!! :headdesk: but we dont really "know" JD or Jessa. We'd get to "meet" them in the lead up to the VSE (christmas definitely) and watch JD's bride finger lace.

With smuggles in DC working for a hate group that house needs to get filled - NOW - for TLC to film more bullshit. JD is a better choice.

4 - Evidence - The picture doesnt do it for me. When I was waiting to meet the Duggars many moons ago there was a fucking scary dude in line behind me. He had driven 11 hours overnight to come get his 25 seconds. He rambled for HOURS about them, knew as much as we do, and almost peed himself when he got to side hug Joy. Obsessed is the understatement of the century. Am I saying Ben is a fanatic? No, but he could be a fan. If he is a FAN and got the pic his family could be "Joshing" him. Speaking of "Joshing..." Josh is a douche. We know that he LOVES to fuck with the internet by posting/commenting and see what happens.

The picture itself actually disproves more than it proves. Lets assume they are dating/courting/whatever. TLC would DEFINITELY have a hand in that. In the same way that they control what the Bateses post, they would control him and his profile pic. THey most definitely would control Joshie and his posts about the courtship. I just dont see it.

1. His age works in Jim Bob's favor. Being a student will keep him busy, but I don't think that will interfere with his and Jessa's appearances on the show. He also has a windshield repair business.

2. Maybe the Duggars don't care about standing.

3. It is probably harder to find a wife for your son in the fundie world. Fundies don't seem to let their girls go easily. As for JD, I....don't know, If I was a fundie girl I wouldn't want to marry him. There is something about him that I don't like.

4.Ben's aunt called Jessa his girlfriend. She would know what's going on. The Seewald family has visited the Duggar home, so they seem like more than regular fans.

[OkToBeTakei]

I am also of the camp that believes that the J'slaves are happy. They probably occasionally get pissed over some restriction or another but I don't think they feel they are missing out on much. They have a strong support system and I honestly believe there is tremendous comfort in living the life you feel God wants you to live (source: was raised fundie-lite). I think they feel they are doing the right thing deep down, so that whenever they are unhappy they chalk it up to their sinful human nature that they need to defeat. There is so much brainwashing involved that its hard to undo. Also I don't know of anyone who went on JTTH who left fundiedom, because its that intense. It leaves a mark on you that you can't erase. I've never been on one but its what I read). I think the Duggar parents are more conniving than we give them credit for and will stop at nothing to keep their kids in the fold, even if it means JTTH every year until they are forced into a strict fundie marriage. I think the kids are brainwashed enough to "know" it's "for the best".

The rigidity of strict fundyism soothes a lot of people, including my best friend who recently converted to Islam and went batshit fundie crazy. It's kind of how we feel at a pro-choice rally- a strong sense of indignation that we are doing what is right and fighting for the betterment of the world. These people think pleasing God makes everything better, and the placebo effect is strong. That is why I think they are happy. They simply don't have the critical thinking skills to question it at all. Indoctrination runs deep.

My family gave me way more freedom than them which is how I learned to make my own choices and think critically about everything, especially science and religion. Teh ebil public school definitely helped a bit. My parents got lazy after awhile and I've always been a strong-willed kid so they tired quickly and freedom increased. I still am forced to live with my parents, but I got a scholarship to do a rotation abroad so they couldn't do anything about it. (I'm sooooo freeeee!!!) I think their hope for my soul is dwindling ;P

Am I saying the Duggarlings won't leave? Nope. One or two might much later because spirituality is not for everyone, or the lifestyle might not be compatible with who they feel they are on a fundamental level - which is what happened with me (my money is on Josiah and/or Joy). But seriously, those of you who are speculating ad absurdum with tenuous evidence at best should think more carefully. I know it's wishful thinking - I wish they'd all leave because INDEPENDENCE IS AWESOME!!!! Freedom from religion is the best kind of freedom I've experienced. Like I have no one I'm obligated to submit to but myself. While there may be comfort in submission, I feel more comfort in my lack thereof. I hope that one day the duggars will learn this feeling. But realistically I just don't think that will happen on a large scale. The duggars are indoctrinating like crazy, I bet they even cherrypick fan letters that laud their life choices to affirm their way of life to their kids. The kids are thus honestly made to believe that the world thinks they're god's warriors, and that those that don't are just a crazy and possessed minority.

I just cannot like this post enough. I saw it on my phone at work today and was only at like stage. It is probably what I would like to articulate in probably two years of commenting here really.

Probably because the poster can speak from a level of insight I do not possess in some respects.

I totally agree that we some of us look through the lens of our own demographics, upbringings and opinions. Of course that colours our views at times very bizarrely and totally agree at the level of...OH MY GOD her 5th eyelash is pointing slightly different to the 7th so that means ABUSE or HAPPY or BABY or JESUS or whatever :lol: I don't mind folks doing that we all have different pursuits in snarking here. That is not mine but some enjoy it and generally it's harmless and normally sense is reached at some level.

I too believe they are happy. I too think they do not all beat their kids or do not love their courtships or balh de blah or day to day lives. I don't think it is possible to make such generalisations about every person who follows one path. They are all individual.

But as the OP said it IS brainwashing and no matter how comfortable it is ..it is control. One man's hijab is another man's disbelief in allowing your child to attend school. One man's courtship, purity, ideal..is another's culture of control.

What is striking is that if we were to say that this is as restrictive as not allowing Saudi women to wear shorts to run in the Olympics because their culture does not allow it then we all would be ............OMG You name it we would say it. Yet in a Western per se world this is exactly what is going on just more covertly and dressed up more prettily. It is just the same.

Bring up your girls to remain pure, bring them up with such a strong sense that a deity wants this and this will be the most rewarding and make you the happiest and most fulfilled person. Make this your goal and ensure that no outside influence can deviate you from this path (or as the OP said develop critical thinking) To do this, mixing with the rest of the society of your country must be curtailed, by insulation, narrow parameters those that think and live like you. Education is not that important your deity wishes you to serve your men and reproduce.

Never mind the minutiae of who looks like what or who is a Princess. Does it not really scare the Bejaysus out of folks that anybody here can in any way forget that? Are there parts of what they do that are good? I think so. Some of the values are good. Generally absolutely no. These girls are wearing invisible trappings of every religion that wishes to suppress women.

Anyway I just made no sense but wanted to say the quoted post really resonated with me.

[OkToBeTakei]

Oh, and stay tuned for the return of my recaps coming this Tuesday! I'll watch it so you dont have to!

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Nice to see you. Seems like ages. Probs just posting on different threads.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

I think it's interesting when people were asking about it, on that pic, the aunt confirmed it. Like some relative questioned it and the aunt said, "aunt so and so this is bens gf, Jessa" - so why would the aunt want to confuse her family members if it were just a joke?

[singsingsing]

The only explanation I can think of would be that the aunt herself is confused. Some other family members were teasing Ben by saying Jessa was his girlfriend, the aunt fell for it and started spreading the happy news because she thought it was for real. But in that case, why didn't anyone pipe up and say, "Uh, guys, this isn't what it looks like"?

[TheChibi]

1. His age works in Jim Bob's favor. Being a student will keep him busy, but I don't think that will interfere with his and Jessa's appearances on the show. He also has a windshield repair business.

2. Maybe the Duggars don't care about standing.

3. It is probably harder to find a wife for your son in the fundie world. Fundies don't seem to let their girls go easily. As for JD, I....don't know, If I was a fundie girl I wouldn't want to marry him. There is something about him that I don't like.

4.Ben's aunt called Jessa his girlfriend. She would know what's going on. The Seewald family has visited the Duggar home, so they seem like more than regular fans.

His parents?

Honestly, I suspect the show puts off a lot of suitors and potential spouses. If I was a fundie, I wouldn't want to be on tv (heck, I'm not a fundie and I still don't want to be on tv)

[OkToBeTakei]

The only explanation I can think of would be that the aunt herself is confused. Some other family members were teasing Ben by saying Jessa was his girlfriend, the aunt fell for it and started spreading the happy news because she thought it was for real. But in that case, why didn't anyone pipe up and say, "Uh, guys, this isn't what it looks like"?

To for once be on topic not my recent thing :(

I kind of agree. Girlfriend can just mean a girl boy friendship, the Aunt even said she knew no details of how they met etc. Maybe just an Aunty getting excited about her nephew being photographed with a 'Famous' person. Josh commenting because yeah the families know each other play their excuse for volleyfundieball and when he saw the photo said 'DUDE I'm watching you' in a kind of EH? fashion?

TBH who knows and who cares, I'm sure as they say it will come out in the wash, I just doubt it is some huge courtship malarkey as was jumped on. I will be happy to eat my words if so. Still probably though not that bothered :lol:

The Duggars though are what introduced me to what I thought was an American anomaly of stupidity/religion. It becomes scarier unfortunately.

[walnut]

The only explanation I can think of would be that the aunt herself is confused. Some other family members were teasing Ben by saying Jessa was his girlfriend, the aunt fell for it and started spreading the happy news because she thought it was for real. But in that case, why didn't anyone pipe up and say, "Uh, guys, this isn't what it looks like"?

That's what I'm thinking too, like, teasing a boy who's never had a girlfriend and finally appears around a girl and some people start teasing him and someone takes it too seriously and congratulate him.

We don't know much about this whole thing, apparently. Too bad.

What I like about that family pic is the little boy's hat and that lady in the background wearing a mini dress. Perfect fundie photobombing : ))

[tuckerphez]

Wow, I've been away for a few days and the thing I never thought would happen happens: A J'slave courtship! Maybe. Hopefully.

Whatever, I'm to be optimistic and hope this is a good thing for Jessa. (Although I was optimistic about J&A&M'kids going to DC and we all see how that's turning out...)

Now since Jessa is a mere 5 months younger than me, I'm feeling protective and I wrote a letter of advice.

Dear Jessa,

You got a sidehug from a man that is not your brother or father! Congrats! In a world like yours, this is an accomplishment.

Now, if you are courting/pre-courting/dating with a purpose, I hope it is what you actually want and not what the people around you want. If it is not what you want, make like a tree and get out of there.

Should you marry Ben (or anyone else), I hope you do two things - get some sort of education/career and go on birth control.

The education/career is in case something goes terribly wrong in the marriage and you need a way to support yourself that doesn't mean going back to your parents. Speaking of your parents, DON'T LET THEM ROPE YOU INTO BABYSITTING YOUR SIBLINGS WHEN YOU'RE MARRIED. Or at least make them pay you for babysitting - lord knows they (and TLC) can afford it.

On birth control - this is so you don't have a ton of kids. You've spent way too much of your life raising kids, and this is a way to get out of it.

You may think birth control is against your religion, but my roommate's fundie cousin (who is about the same age as you and has been married for over a year) told me that life begins at conception, so using the pill is okay because it prevents conception. So you're not killing babies, you are saving your sanity.

Finally, I hope that you wait until at least after your birthday to get married. At the very least, it would mean you were older than your parents, brother, and sister-in-law when they got married. And seeing how their marriages have gone, this could be an advantage.

All in all, I hope if you get married, you use this opportunity to stop your parents from controlling your life, and live a life that you want.

Wishing you the best,

tuckerphez

[snarkykitty]

Agreed. I also did some poking around Ben's family member's FB pages and it appears that Smuggar is friends with many of them. So, there is some "there" there. His sense of humor is calibrated in such a way that I don't think he'd ever make a comment like that without some basis in fact, ie. need of a chaperone.

There are now a more than a few fundies creeping into mutual friend territory on my hubby's side of the family. :shifty-kitty:

[sunshine]

In other news, fake duggar has a point here: http://web.stagram.com/p/544160274175230701_293636535

[singsingsing]

Ben's latest tweet:

That feeling when you can't wait to talk on the phone with that special someone! ;-) #luvphoneconversations #loveher

So basically we're looking at three options:

1. This is the lamest, weirdest joke ever and he's in on it and keeping it going

2. He's in a relationship with someone and it's not Jessa

3. He's in a relationship with someone and it IS Jessa

Option 1 seems pretty far-fetched to me. Option 2 - can't imagine he'd be dating one girl and posting a profile pic on Facebook of him hugging another. I'm thinking it's option 3, people.

Although saying 'love her' seems pretty bold if they just began a courtship. Taking a page out of Chad and Erin's book, or has this been going on longer than we think? Or is this something else entirely?!

I don't know. Have fun speculating. I'm going to bed. :)

[Kira]

How do the Duggars feel about saying "love" in a courtship? I need to re-watch episodes about courtship. I wonder if they're engaged or courting.

I'm still suprised we haven't heard news of a Today Show appearance. They were everywhere before the start of the last season.

[walnut]

Nah... he's pulling our leg. AND, he is oblivious.