Zack Bates and Sarah Reith Courtship Kaput

[Jezebel Duggar]

I don't see that comment either.

I believe they read here and know when we say we made or are going to make a comment. So FaeT, she might delete it or she may just approve it to show us how "wrong" we are about her.

Kelly, there will be a TLC board you won't control. And we will be there. :twisted:

[SisiL78]

It's quite telling that the Bateses so clearly censor and block comments, yet they allowed that one through.

Definately. I posted a comment saying that its difficult to expect only the males to find women and that women should have a say in who they'd like to court. I then explained how my Orthodox Jewish friends who don't touch or anything before marriage managed to remain pure but arranged dates themselves with or without intermediaries like matchmakers and friends. That they did not have chaperones ready to report back to family or that they could write emails and texts without having to be censored. Despite the lax oversight most managed to marry as virgins and are very happy in their choices. They have rules like dating only in public but they also didn't feel pressured to marry the first person who asked them out. I also said that its not very nice of people to badmouth either party without knowing the circumstances and Sarah shouldn't be required to marry a guy just because he asked her to court.... she should have the option of choosing her path too.

Nothing I said is negative or controversial. But, I did praise the customs of another religion and said that women should have a choice in who they marry. Honestly they should just cut out the silly formalities. When a guy sees a girl he likes he goes and asks her Dad if Dad says yes the girl is taken to the Church the next day and they get married. Why bother with the "courting" pretense and show it like it is, a forced marriage.

[Jezebel Duggar]

Definately. I posted a comment saying that its difficult to expect only the males to find women and that women should have a say in who they'd like to court. I then explained how my Orthodox Jewish friends who don't touch or anything before marriage managed to remain pure but arranged dates themselves with or without intermediaries like matchmakers and friends. That they did not have chaperones ready to report back to family or that they could write emails and texts without having to be censored. Despite the lax oversight most managed to marry as virgins and are very happy in their choices. They have rules like dating only in public but they also didn't feel pressured to marry the first person who asked them out. I also said that its not very nice of people to badmouth either party without knowing the circumstances and Sarah shouldn't be required to marry a guy just because he asked her to court.... she should have the option of choosing her path too.

Nothing I said is negative or controversial. But, I did praise the customs of another religion and said that women should have a choice in who they marry. Honestly they should just cut out the silly formalities. When a guy sees a girl he likes he goes and asks her Dad if Dad says yes the girl is taken to the Church the next day and they get married. Why bother with the "courting" pretense and show it like it is, a forced marriage.

You expressed a different point of view and she really couldn't come up with a good argument. That's not allowed.

[FJismyheadship]

Yep its gone now.wish I had got a screenshot...

[Witsec7]

It's quite telling that the Bateses so clearly censor and block comments, yet they allowed that one through.

It's gonna be a whole new world for them when they hit TLC. I can't wait to spend some time on their FB fanpage 8-)

[xReems]

They're willing to respond back to those who praise them or have an argument in which they can pull out crap Gothard has twisted from the Bible.

[Deleted07]

Do they have a facebook page? linky please?

[Witsec7]

Do they have a facebook page? linky please?

Well there's this one:

http://www.facebook.com/pages/The-bates ... 097?ref=ts

But it's not a TLC media page.

this is a fan page to support the duggars and their good friends the bates :) only ran by fans

[Deleted07]

ah OK cool, leghumpers galore lol!

[Witsec7]

Crap I think this is the real one.

http://www.facebook.com/fanpage4thebatesfamily

[Deleted07]

it says its a fanpage, and a couple of owner/runners names on the posts.

[Witsec7]

it says its a fanpage, and a couple of owner/runners names on the posts.

I just checked it out, it's another leghumper page. They will probably delete anything they don't like. Prefer the TLC pages since they are free fire zones.

[Deleted07]

hehe yeah! I assume they will create a page once the show starts? or depending on the success? Maybe hound TLC facebook page and ask for a Bates page! mwuahahaha!!!

[Maul the Koala]

I'm going to post the picture of the Patriotic Room at every turn!

[fundyfunland]

I'm going to post the picture of the Patriotic Room at every turn!

:P :twisted: Oh PLEASE PLEASE do! Let's watch them try to weasel their way out of that one. I'm guessing we'll see an episode of SOTDRT history focusing on racism, and they'll spin it as being a part of American history that is unfortunate, but needs to be remembered.

[lilith]

Well there's this one:

http://www.facebook.com/pages/The-bates ... 097?ref=ts

But it's not a TLC media page.

This from the Facebook page linked above:

dear jim bob&michelle it been 4 month since jibliee shalom duggar past awaymiscarrage your baby&since march 2012 how long you&your family to be off the air of tlc channel you can't not punish your self&any body else not even your family or any body in the world i mean so what what people say to you you nuts to have so many children it is your personal religeons respectful they have no right to ask you that question is your personal religeon that your pastor told you to choose but i think you should put 19 kids&counting back on tlc on tuesday night i have to go now please email&facebook back to me your truely special friend pam rand

Can't even start on the spelling, grammar and total lack of punctuation and grammar.

The sentence "it is your personal religeon that your pastor told you to chose" jumps out. A personal religion that your pastor told you to choose...... These people :?

[slickcat79]

I will kind of give them a pass on "blaming" Sarah for the breakup. Back in the day, when true arranged marriages and courtships were common in the western world, it was considered respectful to tell people that the woman broke things off on the rare occasion that the couple didn't get married. No "gentleman" would ever break his word to a woman under those circumstances. Of course, in those cases the woman would pretty much be ruined either way, so it's not really relevant to relationships today. Given how fundies idolize historic time periods while completely ignoring the reality of living during those times, I wouldn't be surprised if Kelly thought she was doing the right thing in her original post. She really runs into trouble with her double standards on posting comments.

[Mela99]

I wonder how much of the decision was strictly Sarah's -- I assume most of it, because she looked petrified in those courtship photos -- but I wonder if her parents tried to sway her one way or another. I just feel like if it had been totally her decision, she wouldn't have agreed to the courtship in the first place.

I have a feeling that's why they publicly make a fuss over asking someone to court - if they catch you off guard maybe you won't say no :?

[SisiL78]

I wonder how much of the decision was strictly Sarah's -- I assume most of it, because she looked petrified in those courtship photos -- but I wonder if her parents tried to sway her one way or another. I just feel like if it had been totally her decision, she wouldn't have agreed to the courtship in the first place.

I have a feeling that's why they publicly make a fuss over asking someone to court - if they catch you off guard maybe you won't say no :?

She totally didn't know he was going to ask. I don't think she would have been wearing a promo t-shirt if she thought that "today is the day my soul mate will ask me to court". It looked like someone had forced her to wear some pearls at the last minute (maybe to dress her look up?). The whole covering her eyes for a surprise must have been nerve wracking. I wonder if she was thinking it was someone she idolized that was making a guest appearance or something else like that, not some courtship proposal. Even if it wasn't on television these fundies make such a big deal out of it that I can't imagine its easy for any woman to say no. ANd then once you say yes you're bascially saying that you will indeed marry the guy. They should just cut out the middle man and not do any of the courtship stuff. Once the guy decides on a woman all he's go to do is negotiate terms with Daddy and once that is done the girl/woman will be brought down to church and married to her betrothed. Better to do it fast so she won't have time to think.

[ceg045]

Whenever I hear "ask her/me to court," I have an image of an extremely cordial civil trial.

[IReallyAmHopewell]

Whenever I hear "ask her/me to court," I have an image of an extremely cordial civil trial.

Yes, and two lawyers in bespoke suits with nice white shirts and good cuff links....Oh, wait, sorry! This is Duggarland. ok,...cue video of awkward guy with Wal-Mart cheese cake and roses dumping the worst news ever on a sweet, promising blue grass musician....

[Mela99]

Why do fundie guys automatically assume she'll say yes? Why set themselves up for failure?

I think it's the Amish that do this, and yes, there is a Pennsylvania Dutch word for it, but it's escaping me at the moment. When a boy and girl are 'dating', ie, going to singings together or riding home from church in the same buggy, if the boy decides he hopes for marriage, he goes to the "Go Between", a third party and tells him. They talk about responsibility, how he intends to support a wife, a house, etc, and if the Go Between thinks he is serious, he will go to the girl and ask her what her wishes are. If she girl agrees, the boy can ask her to marry him. If she doesn't, they just go on with the way things are or move on. No hurt feelings, no rejections.

[holierthanyou]

I wonder if the 'Bayley' so proud to leghump this page (https://www.facebook.com/fanpage4thebatesfamily) is the same Bayley who comes out over here declaring her 'bestest ever friendship' status and tries to make it sound like she BFFs with the Bates?

[FaeT]

Why do fundie guys automatically assume she'll say yes? Why set themselves up for failure?

I think it's the Amish that do this, and yes, there is a Pennsylvania Dutch word for it, but it's escaping me at the moment. When a boy and girl are 'dating', ie, going to singings together or riding home from church in the same buggy, if the boy decides he hopes for marriage, he goes to the "Go Between", a third party and tells him. They talk about responsibility, how he intends to support a wife, a house, etc, and if the Go Between thinks he is serious, he will go to the girl and ask her what her wishes are. If she girl agrees, the boy can ask her to marry him. If she doesn't, they just go on with the way things are or move on. No hurt feelings, no rejections.

If you ever see a couple in an open buggy (looks more like a chariot thing) that means they are "dating" and not yet married. Some sects even allow a couple to sleep together before marriage. But that's all they do - sleep. They are fully clothed and share the room or bed. These are generally the sects that allow for rumspringa. A lot of elders are against it but they're dying out and the younger generation doesn't a problem with it. Again, Amish and Mennonites have more freedom than fundie families. Oh the irony.

[marmalade]

This from the Facebook page linked above:

Can't even start on the spelling, grammar and total lack of punctuation and grammar.

The sentence "it is your personal religeon that your pastor told you to chose" jumps out. A personal religion that your pastor told you to choose...... These people :?

Dear baby jeebus, I could have written more coherently in the 3rd grade, drunk on my mother's ever-present vodka. My brain officially hurts and it's not even noon.