Josh and Anna 54: He's Listed in the BoP Database

[AussieKrissy]

9 minutes ago, Cam said:

One thing Anna would have to do is sell Josh on the idea of her having an ivf baby while he’s in prison. So often I read here how Josh didn’t want a lot of kids, Josh isn’t in to Anna, Josh calls all the shots. These wives are supposed to submit to their husband’s wants and desires, not demand hers be fulfilled. For Anna to say she wants to have an ivf baby and wants Josh to help he make that happen would be akin to her wearing the pants in the family…….oh wait a minute…….

It would be a nightmare to logistically organise (legally) an IVF baby through the prison system (I can only speak for Australia). But I can not see any governing body agreeing to support the ivf adventures of a convicted pedo already with 7 kids. It would be extremely bad optics and way to much hassle and expense. Not gunna happen. 

Realistically all the IVF talk about it happening before and or after his incarnation is borderline fan fiction. 

[Cults-r-us]

2 hours ago, onekidanddone said:

Okay ew never mind. Yea, sometimes I just say the absolute wrong thing 

Me, too.

[Anne Of Gray Gables]

3 hours ago, Giraffe said:

Meh, I don’t see Anna wearing pants as anything other than Anna’s wearing pants. If she gets a job, moves off senior Duggar property and puts her kids in public school then I’ll start thinking she’s growing. As it stands I don’t have any hope she’s any other than the same smug, self-righteous person who’s still digging her heals in about JoshUa’s innocence. 

It's not about the pants themselves. If she'd started wearing them when Josh was around, it would have been mildly interesting for about a minute. But the fact that she waited until Josh was out of the picture, and is wearing snug fitting jeans not starting with loose, wide-legged pull-ons would seem to indicate she's made an independent choice to break what was once a headship rule for her that she's followed since infancy.

There's no way she's going to wake someday in the coming months, get a job and put the kids in school. If she ultimately is going to go down that path, it will probably be a slow process. But that journey of a thousand miles....  

[Giraffe]

1 minute ago, Anne Of Gray Gables said:

It's not about the pants themselves. If she'd started wearing them when Josh was around, it would have been mildly interesting for about a minute. But the fact that she waited until Josh was out of the picture, and is wearing snug fitting jeans not starting with loose, wide-legged pull-ons would seem to indicate she's made an independent choice to break what was once a headship rule for her that she's followed since infancy.

There's no way she's going to wake someday in the coming months, get a job and put the kids in school. If she ultimately is going to go down that path, it will probably be a slow process. But that journey of a thousand miles....  

You are much more optimistic than I. 

[noseybutt]

22 minutes ago, AussieKrissy said:

It would be a nightmare to logistically organise (legally) an IVF baby through the prison system (I can only speak for Australia). But I can not see any governing body agreeing to support the ivf adventures of a convicted pedo already with 7 kids. It would be extremely bad optics and way to much hassle and expense. Not gunna happen. 

Realistically all the IVF talk about it happening before and or after his incarnation is borderline fan fiction. 

There were several high-profile cases in Israel with Palestinian  prisoners who managed to get their wives pregnant while incarcerated and it made international news because it was so bizarre and complicated. I don't think officials ever figured out how they managed it. 

See here.

Money quote:

Spoiler

He said smuggled sperm has arrived at his clinic hidden in all sorts of creative ways — inside medicine containers, the barrels of pens, candy wrappers, chocolate bars and even in the tip of a rubber glove inside a mush of dates. Once at the clinic, the sperm is frozen until the woman ovulates.

 

Edited June 7, 2022 by noseybutt

[Anne Of Gray Gables]

6 minutes ago, Giraffe said:

You are much more optimistic than I. 

I think I'm being realistic rather than optimistic. I don't see her being able to cope with the Duggars long term and this will force the changes. And I can't imagine that hearing about the jeans didn't piss Jim Bob off. 

[waltraute]

12 minutes ago, Anne Of Gray Gables said:

And I can't imagine that hearing about the jeans didn't piss Jim Bob off. 

Speculation Bus: I think that's why she's wearing them now. I think she and Jim Bob are on the outs. I think she is still solidly in Josh's corner but is giving the big FU to JB. And I don't think she is worried about losing his financial support either. I think she knows she has some power here. I get the feeling that Anna is blaming JB for a lot of things.

[Father Son Holy Goat]

29 minutes ago, noseybutt said:

There were several high-profile cases in Israel with Palestinian  prisoners who managed to get their wives pregnant while incarcerated and it made international news because it was so bizarre and complicated. I don't think officials ever figured out how they managed it. 

See here.

Money quote:

  Hide contents

He said smuggled sperm has arrived at his clinic hidden in all sorts of creative ways — inside medicine containers, the barrels of pens, candy wrappers, chocolate bars and even in the tip of a rubber glove inside a mush of dates. Once at the clinic, the sperm is frozen until the woman ovulates.

 

Reminds me of Our Lady of Perpetual Exemption

 

[EmCatlyn]

14 hours ago, Knight of Ni said:

That's a weird sentiment for us, but for them it might be a really great compliment. A woman who cleans the house willingly is a great character trait. ….

I think it is a great character trait in a man also.  Anyone who is willing to clean and share the domestic burden is a desirable room mate, spouse, house guest. 😉

[AussieKrissy]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10890005/Josh-Duggars-legal-team-files-notice-appeal-child-pornography-conviction.html

Notice of appeal

TRIGGER WARNING, IT AGAINS MENTIONS PARTICULARS OF THE VIDEO 

1 hour ago, noseybutt said:

There were several high-profile cases in Israel with Palestinian  prisoners who managed to get their wives pregnant while incarcerated and it made international news because it was so bizarre and complicated. I don't think officials ever figured out how they managed it. 

See here.

Money quote:

  Hide contents

He said smuggled sperm has arrived at his clinic hidden in all sorts of creative ways — inside medicine containers, the barrels of pens, candy wrappers, chocolate bars and even in the tip of a rubber glove inside a mush of dates. Once at the clinic, the sperm is frozen until the woman ovulates.

 

Yep it happens and that's why I mentioned legally.

I have seen a woman visitors turn up pregnant and then claim the inmate who was incinerated the whole time is the father and have him listed on the visitors register as such, I am not sure if she had him sign the birth certificate though. There was some talk he duffed her in the loo on a visit but I highly doubt it. more likely they knew it wasnt his and he was just happy to have someone visit him every week and put money in his account 

It did happen once that I know of legally IVF in NSW Australia and it was controversial, bad PR and done incorrectly from memory. I doubt it will ever get approval again. 

[EmCatlyn]

1 hour ago, AussieKrissy said:

It would be a nightmare to logistically organise (legally) an IVF baby through the prison system (I can only speak for Australia). But I can not see any governing body agreeing to support the ivf adventures of a convicted pedo already with 7 kids. It would be extremely bad optics and way to much hassle and expense. Not gunna happen. 

Realistically all the IVF talk about it happening before and or after his incarnation is borderline fan fiction. 

We need to remember, also, that the Duggar believe in natural procreation.  Masturbation is a big no-no.  Collecting sperm requires masturbation.  This is not exactly leaving it up to God.

I agree completely that all this talk borders fan fiction.  The fascination with the fecundity of these people is, perhaps, understanding since part of their weirdness is their glorification of large families, but let’s be real.

[Bastet]

Be real, be real, stuck in my brain. (It’s midnight and the ambien is working.) I say: Let’s not be real. Come—join Bastet in some juicy suppositional spring revelry. At daybreak all that will remain will be our little paw prints in the pollen on their windshields

Edited June 7, 2022 by Bastet

[Mrs Ms]

2 hours ago, waltraute said:

Speculation Bus: I think that's why she's wearing them now. I think she and Jim Bob are on the outs. I think she is still solidly in Josh's corner but is giving the big FU to JB. And I don't think she is worried about losing his financial support either. I think she knows she has some power here. I get the feeling that Anna is blaming JB for a lot of things.

Since the verdict where Anna and JB neither sat with each other inside the court, or walked out and drove away together I have been wondering about this.

Speculation bus time:

Anna knows what was on the computer. Anna “knows” Josh is innocent (insert massive eye roll or worse) and I wonder if Josh didn’t hint heavily that Jim Bob had access to the car lot and computers. 

[Smoochie]

Well, seeing as how she was the perfect little wife, skirts/dresses only, kids dressed well, cute, neat hair, clean and obviously happily available to Josh and everything still went sideways, multiple times, maybe she's over the dress code rules.

Count me as another that thinks something also has gone sideways in the JB & Anna relationship too. So much for an umbrella of protection, hell even pecan thief abandoned her after the verdict!

[Bluebirdbluebell]

6 hours ago, waltraute said:

Speculation Bus: I think that's why she's wearing them now. I think she and Jim Bob are on the outs. I think she is still solidly in Josh's corner but is giving the big FU to JB. And I don't think she is worried about losing his financial support either. I think she knows she has some power here. I get the feeling that Anna is blaming JB for a lot of things.

I respectfully disagree. I don't think JB cares that much about whether they wear pants. His daughters wore pants on television.

Edited June 7, 2022 by Bluebirdbluebell

[Jrodseyeliner]

I am still curious about Anna and her finances. 
does JB just give her a monthly allowance? How does she go for ice cream? Buy new clothes for her 7 growing kids?? 

[tabitha2]

Their days of big trips and brand name  items are long gone. JB probably gives them enough to survive on but she must be careful as his cheap ass ain’t gonna put out for new clothes when Anna can sew and hand me downs are abundant with Sweet treats are a real treat these days. 

[Anne Of Gray Gables]

1 hour ago, Bluebirdbluebell said:

I respectfully disagree. I don't think JB cares that much about whether they wear pants. His daughters wore pants on television.

I didn't watch full episodes of Counting On, but I don't remember daughters of any age wearing trousers on the show.

While all of the older daughters - including Jana outside the home - have begun wearing them, I do not think JB has dropped his Deuteronomy 22:5 convictions. I don't know about Michelle believes (not that what she thinks matters) but this is the woman whose knees were blurred out on a 19 Kids episode. The younger girls are always seen in long skirts and Josie is probably still wearing "pantaloons". 

Anna has always been told that women in pants are an abomination unto the Lord, and yet here she is along with her girls in a very public setting wearing jeans as soon as Josh is hauled away to serve his time. I'm not sure what it means, but I strongly lean towards some sort of statement directed at someone in her life. Jim Bob is a good guess, but it could be her parents or even Josh. 

[formergothardite]

7 hours ago, waltraute said:

Speculation Bus: I think that's why she's wearing them now. I think she and Jim Bob are on the outs. I think she is still solidly in Josh's corner but is giving the big FU to JB. And I don't think she is worried about losing his financial support either. I think she knows she has some power here. I get the feeling that Anna is blaming JB for a lot of things.

This is how I feel. I think she is flailing around trying to find someone besides Josh to blame and has landed on JB. What is he going to do? Kick her out? The stories she could tell if he did that. Her old Twitter account showed that Anna is hardly a passive, meek woman terrified to stir up drama. She will rabidly defend what she believes. And she seems to believe Josh is innocent. I have no doubt that JB realizes Josh is guilty, and in private he might be saying negative things about Josh. Which would anger Anna who seems to expect people to defend him without question.

 

[Giraffe]

BEC warning! I’m amused reading people’s posts about how Anna wearing pants somehow indicates she’s making major changes. Nothing will convince me Anna wearing pants is anything other than her deciding she doesn’t give af about being photographed in pants. My guess is she’s been wearing pants for a while now but maybe not off Duggar property where people would be able to photograph her. They released the family picture where Mac was wearing pants. If she had such a problem with pants I doubt she’d have allowed Mac to wear them for a public photo. I would love it if I end up eating my words in the future but right now I’m too cynical and bitter to believe pants are evidence of good changes. 

[Cam]

9 hours ago, AussieKrissy said:

 I can not see any governing body agreeing to support the ivf adventures of a convicted pedo already with 7 kids. It would be extremely bad optics….

Realistically all the IVF talk about it happening before and or after his incarnation is borderline fan fiction. 

I agree and fan fiction is a good way to describe the speculation.

 

9 hours ago, waltraute said:

Speculation Bus: I think that's why she's wearing them now. I think she and Jim Bob are on the outs. I think she is still solidly in Josh's corner but is giving the big FU to JB. And I don't think she is worried about losing his financial support either. I think she knows she has some power here. I get the feeling that Anna is blaming JB for a lot of things.

I could believe this speculation. 

 

8 hours ago, EmCatlyn said:

I think it is a great character trait in a man also.  Anyone who is willing to clean and share the domestic burden is a desirable room mate, spouse, house guest. 😉

My spouse shares the domestic burden in spades. I knew before I married him he would, which is one reason I married him and a main reason for the longevity of our marriage. Yet I can still find reasons to bitch. Shame on me.

 

8 hours ago, EmCatlyn said:

We need to remember, also, that the Duggar believe in natural procreation.  Masturbation is a big no-no.  Collecting sperm requires masturbation.  This is not exactly leaving it up to God.

That’s what I thought when the talk of ivf started. 
 

When I saw Anna in jeans, the lyrics to Beyonce’s “Crazy in Love” came to mind:
Tennis shoes, don't even need to buy a new dress
If you ain't there, ain't nobody else to impress

Yet I’m thinking the jeans may hint at other things. If JB could alienate his own daughter Jill by lying and being verbally abusive, he could do it with Anna, too. If he’s demanding she handle things one way and she is tired of his control, she may be quietly rebelling. I also have to wonder if the women working with Josh’s legal team influenced her in any way. They looked strong and capable working in what Anna would consider a man’s domain. Did she comprehend that the fundie version of being a woman isn’t the only way?

Anna has some power over JB in that she could spill lots of secrets if she wants. They may be playing a game of chess now seeing what kind of moves each other is going to make.

Edited June 7, 2022 by Cam

[tabitha2]

I mean for years she has been surrounded by Female TLC personnel and female Doctors and all the different female professions she has seen in her travels abroad so observing female lawyers certainly is not going to be some liberating revelation to her.  Most likely she believes these women are misguided and only need to become “real” Christians to realize there misery in not being godly wives and mothers  And  she is going to make sure Her girls are going being trained in her model not theirs. 

[Cam]

I saw the female side of the legal team specifically tending to Anna in a way she was not catered to by other professionals. It wasn’t her and Josh wrapped in the Duggar cocoon of 19KAC where fundie image was of utmost importance. This time it was only her, on a different playing field. I’m of the opinion Anna appreciated the support and confidence they had in doing what they do and that she wasn’t judging their lifestyle choices. It might be too much to hope that maybe she was questioning her own choices but I’m just saying maybe a seed of doubt was planted.

Speaking of which, FatherSonandHolyGoat, the John Oliver/Rachel Dratch video was a hoot!
 

Here’s who else may have some influence on Anna. Her own kids. Not that they’ll run the show. But sometimes a kid says the right thing at the right time and can change the way a parent thinks.

A woman I knew lived with a worthless, freeloading man named Mike (not her children’s father). One day while he was gone from the house, she started flipping out about overdue utility bills. Her teenage son put his hands on her shoulders and said, “Mom, Mike is your biggest utility!” Yep, that sunk in and she got rid of Mike. I’m not saying Anna’s kids will tell her to dump Josh. But they might present questions about some of Anna’s choices, make observations, give Anna food for thought, other ways, new ways  of looking at situations.

Edited June 7, 2022 by Cam

[Jackie3]

10 hours ago, AussieKrissy said:

I have seen a woman visitors turn up pregnant and then claim the inmate who was incinerated the whole time is the father and have him listed on the visitors register as such, I

Incinerated! That really is a miracle, lol!

26 minutes ago, Cam said:

A woman I knew lived with a worthless, freeloading man named Mike (not her children’s father). One day while he was gone from the house, she started flipping out about overdue utility bills. Her teenage son put his hands on her shoulders and said, “Mom, Mike is your biggest utility!” Yep, that sunk in and she got rid of Mike. I’m not saying Anna’s kids will tell her to dump Josh. But they might present questions about some of Anna’s choices, make observations, give Anna food for thought, other ways, new ways  of looking at situations.

The difference is, the kids can't say, "Josh is your biggest utility." They will say, "Dad" The fact he is their father, and not their stepfather, will make them far more loyal to him. Especially since their grandparents will be talking about how he was innocent, was framed, etc.

[Giraffe]

34 minutes ago, Cam said:

I saw the female side of the legal team specifically tending to Anna in a way she was not catered to by other professionals. It wasn’t her and Josh wrapped in the Duggar cocoon of 19KAC where fundie image was of utmost importance. This time it was only her, on a different playing field. I’m of the opinion Anna appreciated the support and confidence they had in doing what they do and that she wasn’t judging their lifestyle choices. It might be too much to hope that maybe she was questioning her own choices but I’m just saying maybe a seed of doubt was planted.

This is an interesting take on things. Rufus bless Anna’s at the beginning of a good journey.

Edited June 7, 2022 by Giraffe