Jana Duggar 14: Child Endangerment Charges and Howlers Supporting Her Via Meme

[justoneoftwo]

Jill didn't sue...

[imokit]

25 minutes ago, justoneoftwo said:

Jill didn't sue...

According to Derrick, they threatened to and started going down the legal route.  JB caved before it got that far and handed over the money.  They got a settlement for their (Jill's) work on the show.

[justoneoftwo]

2 minutes ago, imokit said:

According to Derrick, they threatened to and started going down the legal route.  JB caved before it got that far and handed over the money.  They got a settlement for their (Jill's) work on the show.

It's important to note there's no way Jenna could know they would win in fact none of us can know that for sure

[noseybutt]

1 hour ago, HereComesTreble said:

To be fair, none of her sisters have done anything IBLP rebellious prior to being married.  Despite being an actual adult, Jana, (being unmarried) does not have that “adulthood” that marriage provides in DuggarWorld.

My opinion. IBLP is all about shutting down self awareness:  don't think, don't feel. And it takes a lot of energy and external rules to shut it down.

When the Duggar young women marry outside the IBLP fold, that constant bombardment to shut down is removed. Their husbands don't have to be all that great. All they have to do is cease the shutting down process. Stop the constant external voice.

And it gives the women time to think and feel.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

5 minutes ago, justoneoftwo said:

It's important to note there's no way Jenna could know they would win in fact none of us can know that for sure

She knows now, Derek has been open about that for a long time.  

[socalrules]

If Jana wanted to leave, she could go right over to Jill’s house. Jill wouldn’t turn her back on her sister and Derrick would probably love to say he helped get another Duggar woman out of that house. She has options. I don’t see all her siblings turning their back on her if she left. 

I don’t think Jana is stuck, I think she is where she wants to be. I have never believed she was staying behind to protect the other kids. That’s trying to justify her not being in a fundy marriage and/or not leaving the cult. We have to remember that not everyone wants to leave the cult. 

[imokit]

Jana's life is as comfy as its ever been right now.

A lot of prestige as her parents right hand.  Access to hobbies and a far nicer house than she'd likely get if she married.

The permanent littles are all grown up enough to be useful rather need minding.  The young Js need managing, but will be able to do chores themselves and don't need active minding.

Yes little kids are dumped there, but mostly they go home at night.  Young Js are also able to help out with them most of the time.

Even if Anna's moved in, Anna will still ultimately be responsible for the Ms and Anna comes with Mac who is also old enough to be useful.  The Ms have aged into the place where as a newborn is born, a middle kid gains enough age to be useful. 

I suspect that the autumn has been extra chaotic but it will start calming down now that Anna no longer has unlimited access to Josh.

Jana's life is far easier now then it was growing up and there is very little incentive for her to leave.

[Daisy0322]

On 12/12/2021 at 2:29 PM, Anne Of Gray Gables said:

 

A little off topic, but I looked up the ages of the remaining offspring. When Jackson turns 18 in the spring, there will be only five minors in the house, the youngest turning 13 later in the year. Once the few remaining adult sons move on, and assuming JIm Bob doesn't allow Anna and the M's to move in or Anna grows up and moves on, how much longer do they have need for that ghastly building they call a house? I know Michelle is far from a normal woman, but I'd be depressed looking around the vastness of the property and thinking " Fresh start time. Maybe a nice, new four bedroom on private two acre lot far from here would do just fine".  

I could see them moving to JoKens cabin after they fix it up. Then Joken taking the big house and letting Anna stay there potentially. Or maybe sharing it with another brothers family they’re close too. I feel like they took the cabin so they’d be there ready to pounce when it was for the taking lol. 

53 minutes ago, socalrules said:

If Jana wanted to leave, she could go right over to Jill’s house. Jill wouldn’t turn her back on her sister and Derrick would probably love to say he helped get another Duggar woman out of that house. She has options. I don’t see all her siblings turning their back on her if she left. 

I don’t think Jana is stuck, I think she is where she wants to be. I have never believed she was staying behind to protect the other kids. That’s trying to justify her not being in a fundy marriage and/or not leaving the cult. We have to remember that not everyone wants to leave the cult. 

I kind of have to agree. The caged bird sings. She lives very comfortably and is almost done easing her siblings she’s about to coast. I could see her getting married at like 40 to a widowed man with older children maybe but I think she’s just interested in doing what Jana wants for once and isn’t bothered by the cult part. 

1 hour ago, imokit said:

According to Derrick, they threatened to and started going down the legal route.  JB caved before it got that far and handed over the money.  They got a settlement for their (Jill's) work on the show.

Im actually glad she got paid for being exploited. Jill has come a long way she should have gotten restitution too 

[noseybutt]

24 minutes ago, Daisy0322 said:

 

Im actually glad she got paid for being exploited. Jill has come a long way she should have gotten restitution too 

I have this mental picture of Derrick, in law school, sitting in his first labor law class and thinking: Daaaaaaaaang.

"Human trafficking" has been the buzzword in evangelical circles for a few years now, but almost no understanding that the phrase covers both labor and sex trafficking. And that both happen within religious circles as much as outside.

[FiveAcres]

6 minutes ago, noseybutt said:

I have this mental picture of Derrick, in law school, sitting in his first labor law class and thinking: Daaaaaaaaang.

"Human trafficking" has been the buzzword in evangelical circles for a few years now, but almost no understanding that the phrase covers both labor and sex trafficking. And that both happen within religious circles as much as outside.

And since he has an accounting background, it might have made it easier to recognise financial abuse as well.

[neuroticcat]

4 hours ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Fwiw that was KJs story from the start, such a bizarre element with no source.   

It seems bizarre to me. I do know that HLDS and other orgs tell homeschoolers how to respond in certain situations and stoke fears about children being taken away. I could see Jana lying if it was something she had been told to do to avoid agency involvement. Kind of like “they are home sick” to avoid truancy charges back in the day.

[neuroticcat]

Projecting here, but I came from a controlling home. Even after I was 18 I still did whatever my parents told me to in the way they told me to. There was emotional and financial control and manipulation - choosing something not permitted was seen as betrayal. Once I was done with college, I finally began saying “no” because of a relationship with a man. It wasn’t until therapy in my thirties that I realized I absolutely could have said “no” all along and legally left at 18. The reality was, though, it would have cost me: cost college tuition, family estrangement, emotional blackmail, resisting the entire family culture I had been raised with, and a difficult entry to adulthood. At 18, staying trapped seemed the only viable option, but it was costing me freedom and agency. Sadly, I didn’t feel I was worth it to pay the other relational costs, but I’m glad I eventually felt it was worth it for a relationship, because that was a stepping stone out.

All that to say, yes, Jana is showing us by staying that what she wants to do is stay. However, she may not have the emotional tools to evaluate the costs of going/staying clearly (I’d say that’s pretty guaranteed given Gothard teachings). As best we can tell, for all the 2nd Gen, marriage was the only real way out of JB’s control and offered them new perspectives and other extended family support. Yes, Jana might believe she could go to Jill, but maybe not. We have no idea what the sibling relationships are like. I remember hearing the weird music box story the older girls told and thinking it was a great way to build resentment and division between siblings.  For all we know Jill may put up a boundaries to not be drawn into sibling drama too. The reality is , yes, Jana can leave, but unless she believes she can, it doesn’t matter.

Edited December 16, 2021 by neuroticcat

[Smee]

Whether Jana understands she can leave the cult or not, she’s a 31yr old woman. I’m 33 and when my sister leaves my nephew with me, you’d better believe I am responsible for his safety. If he wandered onto the road it’s not her fault for leaving him in my care, even if she knew I was really tired that day.

 

But in my fanfic world we’re all wrong and it was Mac who was found trying to hitchhike far away from her horrible life.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

14 minutes ago, neuroticcat said:

Projecting here, but I came from a controlling home. Even after I was 18 I still did whatever my parents told me to in the way they told me to. There was emotional and financial control and manipulation - choosing something not permitted was seen as betrayal. Once I was done with college, I finally began saying “no” because of a relationship with a man. It wasn’t until therapy in my thirties that I realized I absolutely could have said “no” all along and legally left at 18. The reality was, though, it would have cost me: cost college tuition, family estrangement, emotional blackmail, resisting the entire family culture I had been raised with, and a difficult entry to adulthood. At 18, staying trapped seemed the only viable option, but it was costing me freedom and agency. Sadly, I didn’t feel I was worth it to pay the other relational costs, but I’m glad I eventually felt it was worth it for a relationship, because that was a stepping stone out.

All that to say, yes, Jana is showing us by staying that what she wants to do is stay. However, she may not have the emotional tools to evaluate the costs of going/staying clearly (I’d say that’s pretty guaranteed given Gothard teachings). As best we can tell, for all the 2nd Gen, marriage was the only real way out of JB’s control and offered them new perspectives and other extended family support. Yes, Jana might believe she could go to Jill, but maybe not. We have no idea what the sibling relationships are like. I remember hearing the weird music box story the older girls told and thinking it was a great way to build resentment and division between siblings.  For all we know Jill may put up a boundaries to not be drawn into sibling drama too. The reality is , yes, Jana can leave, but unless she believes she can, it doesn’t matter.

Valid points, no one raised like this suddenly becomes independent when the clock strikes midnight on their 18th birthday.  But she's over 30 - husband or not her brain isn't still cooking the way it does at 18.

Also, unless someone has evidence she's ever shown she wants to leave then it's a moot point.  Not everyone who stays is trapped, some people stay because they want to.

[tsukinokawa]

https://www.crazydaysandnights.net/2021/12/blind-item-5_12.html

 

forgive me for this but I spotted this blind item in cdan and the comments are saying it is about Jana. Do you guys have any thoughts about it ?

frankly speaking, I am still bit hesitant to believe it. 

 

Spoiler

I wonder what the untraditional relationships with men mean ?

 

 

[clueliss]

CDAN makes crap up and it says so on their site.

[gustava]

7 minutes ago, tsukinokawa said:

https://www.crazydaysandnights.net/2021/12/blind-item-5_12.html

 

forgive me for this but I spotted this blind item in cdan and the comments are saying it is about Jana. Do you guys have any thoughts about it ?

frankly speaking, I am still bit hesitant to believe it. 

 

  Hide contents

I wonder what the untraditional relationships with men mean ?

 

 

Kissing.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

16 minutes ago, tsukinokawa said:

https://www.crazydaysandnights.net/2021/12/blind-item-5_12.html

 

forgive me for this but I spotted this blind item in cdan and the comments are saying it is about Jana. Do you guys have any thoughts about it ?

frankly speaking, I am still bit hesitant to believe it. 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

I wonder what the untraditional relationships with men mean ?

 

 

It's fiction.

[patsymae]

4 hours ago, noseybutt said:

My opinion. IBLP is all about shutting down self awareness:  don't think, don't feel. And it takes a lot of energy and external rules to shut it down.

When the Duggar young women marry outside the IBLP fold, that constant bombardment to shut down is removed. Their husbands don't have to be all that great. All they have to do is cease the shutting down process. Stop the constant external voice.

And it gives the women time to think and feel.

This. Plus--and I'm not a fan of Cathy--at least Jill and probably Jinger have gotten to see, if not get close to, women who are way less batshit than Jchelle and don't see enduring abuse as a holy obligation.

[rainbowbabycakes]

On 12/15/2021 at 5:06 PM, GiggleOfGirls said:

It’s very one-of-a-kind! 
 

Putting the description in a spoiler because I’m guessing this is quite off-topic by this point 😂 and this got long.

 

  Hide contents

Okay, I’ll do a description because I think that’ll be easier (it’s complicated to draw — I tried to make a Sims 4 house that looked like it but… well…)

 

When you drive up to the house on the driveway, it looks like a very normal-sized (even on the small side) house. The real estate exterior photos made me completely dismiss the house initially.

 

So, the front of the house doesn’t really have any windows — looking at the front you see the garage on the right with the front door to the left. When you walk inside it looks pretty normal. There’s an entryway leading to an open area with the kitchen/dining room to your right and the living room straight in front of you. Main floor bathroom #1 (the only half bathroom) is next to the kitchen (the kitchen leads out to the garage). 
 

But if you go through a door to your left upon entering, you’ll be in a carpeted closet (normal non-walk-in closet) that’s attached to a bathroom without any door between the two (clearly there used to be a mirrored sliding door there because we still have it and there are tracks on the ceiling for it still). 
 

if you go through the second bathroom door on the opposite side from the entryway, you are suddenly in what used to be a bedroom when the house was built, but the most recent owners before us decided to turn it into a closet. So they made a door from the entryway into the aforementioned bathroom as well as into the master bathroom (on the other side of the bedroom-turned-closet) and then got rid of the door leading from the living room area into the former bedroom (whew!). 
 

If you continue on through the door on the opposite side of the new, ginormous closet room, you’re immediately inside the master bathroom (which has the smaller, original, closet at one end and a door to the master bedroom as well). The master bedroom does have a door back to the main living area of the house. 

 

This layout was SO confusing the first time we walked through the house. 
 

But we have window seats in both the dining room and the master bedroom (yay!) so we overlooked some irregularities… 

 

Okay, so three bathrooms, one bedroom, and two closets on the main (actually the third) floor along with the first garage, the first kitchen, and the main living room.

 

Upstairs (and this is probably the most normal floor) there’s a loft living space (where we watch TV as a family) between a single bedroom on one side and two bedrooms plus a full bathroom on the other side. 
 

The upstairs bedrooms are HUGE (250-330 square feet). I’ve lived in an entire house that was smaller than a couple of these bedrooms. The three youngest children live up there. And most of them remember living in much smaller places so it’s a bit of a change. 
 

Okay, back downstairs to the main (3rd) floor. 
 

There’s a staircase going down to the second garage, which is at the end of the second driveway (the house is built on a steep hill, basically, and it slopes gradually in front), which attaches to a pretty normal-looking apartment on that level with one bedroom, one full bath, a deck, a kitchen, dining room, and living room. 
 

But! If you continue down the stairs (just a few stairs more) instead of going into the garage, you’ll come to a huge unheated room with an unfinished swimming pool underneath the floor.
 

This room also connects to the apartment and someday I want to do something cool with the pool area like turn it into a root cellar or grow mushrooms down there or something. If there is ever an Underground Railroad again, we will most definitely be able to be part of it. A lot of people can fit in a deep end.

 

Okay, so apartment level is slightly (five steps or so) higher than the pool level and if you go downstairs from the pool level (first basement) you get to the first floor (second basement). Straight through the door at the bottom of the stairs takes you into an unheated workshop space attached to a third garage (did I mention that this is a ridiculous house before? Because yeah…) and and there’s a very scary all-concrete room down there in the bowels of the house that we could probably survive some pretty dire environmental disasters by hiding in.

 

If you turn right after going down the stairs, instead of going straight into the workshop, you come into a windowless living room that is attached to two bedrooms, a 3/4 bathroom, has a door to the garage, and has a door to the bottom of the hill/backyard. 

And that’s it!

It’s kind of weird, but there’s a ton of potential and there’s space for everyone to get away from sensory badness and to have time alone (lots of neurodivergence in our family), there’s space for everyone to pursue their interests, and I love how incredibly quirky it is!

 

It is also a gigantic fixer-upper, but we knew that when we bought it.

That sounds fun! I wanted to be an architect in a former life, and would love to look at the floor plans.... Not that I'm asking, because that would be weird and a huge invasion of privacy.... but they would still be fun to see😆😆😆😆

[Mlissmartin]

6 hours ago, Smee said:

Whether Jana understands she can leave the cult or not, she’s a 31yr old woman. I’m 33 and when my sister leaves my nephew with me, you’d better believe I am responsible for his safety. If he wandered onto the road it’s not her fault for leaving him in my care, even if she knew I was really tired that day.

 

But in my fanfic world we’re all wrong and it was Mac who was found trying to hitchhike far away from her horrible life.

Same fanfic going on in my head #FreeMac

[AuntCloud]

@GiggleOfGirls thank you for the description! I’m trying to visualize your house and all I can come up with is the Goonies house!

[Beermeet]

12 hours ago, noseybutt said:

My opinion. IBLP is all about shutting down self awareness:  don't think, don't feel. And it takes a lot of energy and external rules to shut it down.

When the Duggar young women marry outside the IBLP fold, that constant bombardment to shut down is removed. Their husbands don't have to be all that great. All they have to do is cease the shutting down process. Stop the constant external voice.

And it gives the women time to think and feel.

I just re-read Bin's response to his wifes   someone's perceived rudeness and it seemed so IBLP training to erase proper, natural feelings and reactions.  I don't think Jessa got the freedom of a more lenient husband, religious wise.  Ben is trying to get there but not through actual IBLP for some reason.   

[GiggleOfGirls]

4 hours ago, rainbowbabycakes said:

That sounds fun! I wanted to be an architect in a former life, and would love to look at the floor plans.... Not that I'm asking, because that would be weird and a huge invasion of privacy.... but they would still be fun to see😆😆😆😆

Well, if I ever manage to find the floor plans we had (which weren’t that great, but I’d post them if I knew where they were), or draw my own, I’ll try and remember to come here with them. 
 

No guarantees that I’ll remember, but this is the sort of weird thing I tend to eventually manage to follow through with 😂

1 hour ago, AuntCloud said:

@GiggleOfGirls thank you for the description! I’m trying to visualize your house and all I can come up with is the Goonies house!

That isn’t very far off, honestly 😂 I really want to put a climbing wall up to the (top floor) loft from the main living room and also a fire pole for getting back down. I think the Goonies would approve!

[clueliss]

6 hours ago, Beermeet said:

I just re-read Bin's response to his wifes   someone's perceived rudeness and it seemed so IBLP training to erase proper, natural feelings and reactions.  I don't think Jessa got the freedom of a more lenient husband, religious wise.  Ben is trying to get there but not through actual IBLP for some reason.   

Ben wasn’t raised IBLP/ATI.  I seem to recall his family was more VF (aka house of tool).  Which is still fundie crazy cult but of a slightly different not Gothard teaching/leadership.