Michaela & Brandon 6: She Is an LPN and He Is Boring.....

[Jewels64]

On 10/5/2021 at 3:38 AM, SorenaJ said:

The people that pull their mask down to talk piss me off to no end. 

I do wear a mask everywhere and have my vaccine.  I do however drive my adult daughter nuts.  I have a habit of pulling my mask down when I can't hear.  Its not intentional and not very smart either.  I am not sure why when I can't hear I react that way. 

[Bobology]

My grandson wore a mask when going inside any place that was unavoidable starting before he was two. He's 3 now and still wears his little toddler mask when he must go inside. I wear a 3-layer professional cloth mask and figured his thin, one-layer was pretty worthless. After only 20 minutes his little mask is noticeably damp (not from sweat... his face is dry) which, to me, means the mask is doing its job of catching a lot of his saliva as he talks. Viruses hitch rides on saliva that spew from the mouth, so I'll guess that if he has any viruses, many of them are being trapped in the thin little mask and fewer are getting spewed into the air. 

Trapping viruses and keeping so many from flying freely throughout the surroundings helps keep others safer from the viruses. I think the point of mask-wearing is mostly to protect everyone else in the event the wearer has viruses. My older grandson is incensed that he takes measures to protect others but they are not reciprocating and trying to protect him... because they don't care if he gets sick. (That's the way he says it.)

[AussieKrissy]

4 hours ago, Jewels64 said:

I do wear a mask everywhere and have my vaccine.  I do however drive my adult daughter nuts.  I have a habit of pulling my mask down when I can't hear.  Its not intentional and not very smart either.  I am not sure why when I can't hear I react that way. 

It's like when you turn the radio down in the car so you can see what you are looking for better...

[libgirl2]

27 minutes ago, AussieKrissy said:

It's like when you turn the radio down in the car so you can see what you are looking for better...

always....... 

[SassyPants]

On 10/6/2021 at 9:59 AM, Michiru said:

I don't know if they are available in Canada, but the livinguard cloth masks are certified as medical masks (I am from Germany, maybe that would translate to surgical mask?) and they sit so well that I just know that I am safer with them, then with some "paper"-mask that is not properly fitted!

Thank you. I just ordered 2 on Amazon. I hated throwing all those KN95 masks in the garbage-

[Michiru]

Good that you found them SayyPants - I hope they fit you well.

[Jackie3]

On 10/3/2021 at 10:11 AM, Jackie3 said:

Obesity is absolutely related to infertility. It's a medical fact, look it up.

However, I don't think Michael is obese at all. I don't think being slightly overweight contributes to infertility, though I could be wrong. But obesity, absolutely. Why would anyone "jump" on you for saying that, I thought it was well known?

It's interesting. It's socially acceptable to say that obesity can increase risk for heart disease and diabetes (which it does). But it's not socially acceptable to say that obesity can increase risk for infertility (which it does).

Why is that, I wonder? The science is equally strong in both cases.

 I guess it sounds too mean. But it's a scientific fact, backed by numerous peer-reviewed articles. Is it smart to ignore scientific facts (looking at you, anti-vaxxers)?

What power the word "obese" has!  Maybe it's time to take that power away. Instead of pretending that obesity and infertility are unrelated, take away the cruelty and judgment from the word "obese." Make it simply a scientific term (as it is in medicine). 

I like to follow the science. And that's what the science says. 

None of this applies to Michaela, however, who is not obese.

 

[CaptainFunderpants]

On 10/18/2021 at 2:15 PM, Jackie3 said:

None of this applies to Michaela, however, who is not obese.

 

Medically she's gotta be close. She's not small. I would be very surprised if she wasn't considered obese. Peoples ideas of obesity are very skewed, considering 40% of the population is obese, with another 40% being overweight, and an additional 10% being skinny fat.

[luv2laugh]

On 10/18/2021 at 4:15 PM, Jackie3 said:

...it's not socially acceptable to say that obesity can increase risk for infertility (which it does). Why is that, I wonder? The science is equally strong in both cases. I guess it sounds too mean. But it's a scientific fact, backed by numerous peer-reviewed articles. Is it smart to ignore scientific facts (looking at you, anti-vaxxers)?

 

 

 

58 minutes ago, CaptainFunderpants said:

Medically she's gotta be close. She's not small. I would be very surprised if she wasn't considered obese

Michaela's physique is basically irrelevant in regards to her fertility. Michaela, from what has been publicly announced, has been trying to get pregnant since her wedding (below picture of Michaela on her wedding day under spoiler who does not appear meet the medical definition of obese nor, based on appearance alone, appear in any sort of way that would compromise her fertility).

Spoiler

 

Edited October 20, 2021 by luv2laugh

[MaryOrMartha]

This is not pointed at Michaela or anyone else but I would like to make the following comment.

The term "overweight" is a a social synonym for carrying extra weight and I've heard many folks of many sizes use the term interchangeably for chubby/heavy/fat/obese.

Categorically overweight and obese are different, they are medical terms and based on BMI (which has proven inaccurate if you carry a lot of muscle!).

Please do not be offended if someone makes reference to medical terms as someone calling another fat. Medically, we don't know anyone's BMI unless they share it... which is a crock of shit anyway.

[FrumperedCat]

17 minutes ago, MaryOrMartha said:

The term "overweight" is a a social synonym for carrying extra weight and I've heard many folks of many sizes use the term interchangeably for chubby/heavy/fat/obese.

Categorically overweight and obese are different, they are medical terms and based on BMI (which has proven inaccurate if you carry a lot of muscle!).
 

Thank you for posting this. I've always viewed obese as a step further than overweight, and I'm definitely not seeing Michael looking to be at that stage. We all carry our weight differently so it's impossible to know these things as truth, regardless. I have naturally slim wrists and hands for instance but in fact am classed as overweight. You might not notice that I'm overweight depending on what clothes I wear because of this. 

[just_ordinary]

4 hours ago, MaryOrMartha said:

This is not pointed at Michaela or anyone else but I would like to make the following comment.

The term "overweight" is a a social synonym for carrying extra weight and I've heard many folks of many sizes use the term interchangeably for chubby/heavy/fat/obese.

Categorically overweight and obese are different, they are medical terms and based on BMI (which has proven inaccurate if you carry a lot of muscle!).

Please do not be offended if someone makes reference to medical terms as someone calling another fat. Medically, we don't know anyone's BMI unless they share it... which is a crock of shit anyway.

If you carry LOTS of muscle. If you are just a bit more trained than the general public those muscles are not affecting your BMI to such a degree. If you are on a professional level athlete in a field that requires a big mass of muscle than yes, that can happen. But that’s not the reality for the majority of well trained people.

[16strong]

I feel like it's so easy to get caught up in comparing Michaela to her sisters, as many of them are rail thin. But that's just it. They're rail thin and Michaela is a more average weight with some curves. It doesn't mean that she's fat or overweight. Any discussion about her weight is solely between her and her doctor, IMHO. I've known plenty of women far larger than Michaela that got pregnant easily. Can we please stop insinuating that this is the cause of their infertility?

[Tangy Bee]

I've always considered Michaela, Erin, & Tori on the curvy side. Does anyone know Kelly Jo's size before all the babies?

[JuanitaBanana]

12 hours ago, CaptainFunderpants said:

Medically she's gotta be close. She's not small. I would be very surprised if she wasn't considered obese. Peoples ideas of obesity are very skewed, considering 40% of the population is obese, with another 40% being overweight, and an additional 10% being skinny fat.

Wtf? There's absolutely no way of knowing if Michaela is obese just by looking at her photos. There are plenty of women who aren't "small" (or "trim" as JRod would say) and that doesn't mean they aren't healthy. People ideas of "healthy" are very skewed and based only on what they think looks good.

I'm 14 pounds heavier than I was when I got married and I definitely look fat in photos... Yet, I'm not considered obese based on bmi.

 

[browngrl]

10 hours ago, MaryOrMartha said:

BMI (which has proven inaccurate if you carry a lot of muscle!).

BMI is not inaccurate. It is a tool like any other in medicine which means it needs to be considered in the context of the patient and false positives and negatives must be considered. So when you see a patient with a high BMI the first thing you do is look at the patient. It is generally very easy to tell the highly muscled athlete from the obese person. When BMI is used the way it was intended it is useful. 

 

[just_ordinary]

5 hours ago, 16strong said:

I feel like it's so easy to get caught up in comparing Michaela to her sisters, as many of them are rail thin. But that's just it. They're rail thin and Michaela is a more average weight with some curves. It doesn't mean that she's fat or overweight. Any discussion about her weight is solely between her and her doctor, IMHO. I've known plenty of women far larger than Michaela that got pregnant easily. Can we please stop insinuating that this is the cause of their infertility?

As we have no idea what the cause of her infertility is, every assumption is as good as the next. So, yeah….. 

[16strong]

9 minutes ago, just_ordinary said:

As we have no idea what the cause of her infertility is, every assumption is as good as the next. So, yeah….. 

I think bringing someone's weight into the mix is just wrong and hurtful. Even if she is a fundie with hurtful beliefs of her own. That's all.

[just_ordinary]

34 minutes ago, 16strong said:

I think bringing someone's weight into the mix is just wrong and hurtful. Even if she is a fundie with hurtful beliefs of her own. That's all.

While I personally think her weight is completely irrelevant, I don’t think discussing her weight or infertility is any more hurtful than other stuff we discuss on this board. I mean we have a thread that needs a CSA trigger warning? We talk at lengths about miscarriages, miscarriage possibilities and related conditions? And I would question who gets hurt by this? If a discussion of a thread hurts you*, even though it’s not about you, maybe it’s time to step out for a moment? I have done that on many occasions.

*general you, not you personally. 

I seriously doubt it is hurtful to Michaela as we are not discussing it with her or in her comment sections. 

[SassyPants]

5 hours ago, Tangy Bee said:

I've always considered Michaela, Erin, & Tori on the curvy side. Does anyone know Kelly Jo's size before all the babies?

Rail skinny on her wedding day. I don’t think the Bates G2 have naturally skinny genes. Frankly, I don’t think many folks do. Just as side note, all the restaurant (date night) meals, fast food and sweet coffee drink consumption will catch up with all of them. You just can’t exercise or burn all those calories off-

[lumpentheologie]

2 hours ago, 16strong said:

I think bringing someone's weight into the mix is just wrong and hurtful. Even if she is a fundie with hurtful beliefs of her own. That's all.

Thank you for saying this. 
 

It’s hurtful to discuss people’s weight because it’s fatphobic and no one has any business judging people’s bodies except for medical professionals (and they don’t even do it that well either). To me it’s as gross and upsetting to discuss Michaela’s weight as it would be to discuss what you think having sex with her would be like. 
 

The BMI is inaccurate and also racist: it was developed and tested solely on white people who were then defined as the standard of health. People of color often have differently proportioned bodies than white people but that doesn’t mean they’re unhealthy. In the US BMI is routinely used to deny medical services to women of color, since health insurance simply won’t pay for certain procedures if you’re over or under a rather arbitrary BMI, no matter what the doctor recommends. 
This article goes into these issues in detail: https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/wellness/healthy-bmi-obesity-race-/2021/05/04/655390f0-ad0d-11eb-acd3-24b44a57093a_story.html

Edited October 20, 2021 by lumpentheologie

[SimplyMe]

8 hours ago, lumpentheologie said:

Thank you for saying this. 
 

It’s hurtful to discuss people’s weight because it’s fatphobic and no one has any business judging people’s bodies except for medical professionals (and they don’t even do it that well either). To me it’s as gross and upsetting to discuss Michaela’s weight as it would be to discuss what you think having sex with her would be like. 
 

The BMI is inaccurate and also racist: it was developed and tested solely on white people who were then defined as the standard of health. People of color often have differently proportioned bodies than white people but that doesn’t mean they’re unhealthy. In the US BMI is routinely used to deny medical services to women of color, since health insurance simply won’t pay for certain procedures if you’re over or under a rather arbitrary BMI, no matter what the doctor recommends. 
This article goes into these issues in detail: https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/wellness/healthy-bmi-obesity-race-/2021/05/04/655390f0-ad0d-11eb-acd3-24b44a57093a_story.html

Thank you!!  Someone on here who has a damn clue what they’re talking about.  Reading through this thread just now had me on edge with all of the uneducated and fat-phobic comments.  BMI is an absolutely inaccurate measure of health and was never intended to be that.  The reliance on BMI in healthcare leads to weight stigma / fat phobia amongst healthcare providers that has a profoundly harmful affect on people in larger bodies.  
 

To those who are so hell bent on the BMI being an accurate measure of health - do you know which category places a person at highest risk for death?  Hint - it’s not obese, it’s actually underweight.  And the one that places you at lowest risk?  “Normal”?  Nope, it’s Overweight.  Which, by the way means what?  Over what weight?  A person’s weight is largely based on genetics, which can vary from one demographic and family to another, so what exactly makes a person “overweight”?  

Weight is a very poor predictor of health outcomes.  Better predictors are genetics first and foremost and things like socioeconomic status (which includes access to healthcare and quality food) as well as childhood traumas.  Oh, and one of the best predictors of higher adult body weight, insulin resistance and heart disease is…. DIETING!  
 

Some of you may wish to evaluate why you’ve fallen so hard for the diet culture bullshit narrative - it’s a multi-billion dollar industry that preys on your insecurities and vulnerabilities and sells you on the idea that skinny = healthy and fat = unhealthy.  You know you’ve played right into their hands when you’re sitting here guessing at a person’s BMI category and blaming their weight for their infertility issues.  
 

I hope you’ll take the time to read this paper on the topic and open your mind up to the possibility that your fat phobic rhetoric is harmful and as disgusting as some of the horrible beliefs we all rally against on this board.  And FFS quit talking about this young  woman’s body and health - that’s between her and her doctors.   

- Says a mama who almost lost her daughter to anorexia and will spend the rest of my life fighting our diet culture which has caused an alarmingly dramatic increase in eating disorders.  Oh, and I’d give my right arm if my daughter would eat fast food and “sugary drinks” like the Bates kids do.  If it “catches up” with them someday, who gives a fuck.  There are way worse things to be than fat.  Like judgmental jerks speculating about a person’s health and fertility based on photos.  

https://nutritionj.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1475-2891-10-9

[SassyPants]

OK…Putting on my medical professional hat here. Also acknowledging if you have had up close and personal experience with an eating disorder or associated death, or a premature death of a close family member d/t an obesity related illness, I realize that you are approaching this topic from a more sensitive POV- I am talking science, common sense and dollars and cents.

So why should others be concerned if other folks make dietary choices that are known risk factors for obesity that DO PREDISPOSE PEOPLE TO chronic diseases and early death? 1) we care about our fellow citizens and community members. When you know better, and we do know that consuming fast food and sugary drinks do negatively impact health care outcomes, so we make better choices. 2) Healthcare costs, plain and simple. When so many people are affected by chronic health conditions associated with obesity related diabetes (as an example), healthcare rates for ALL OF US (in US) rise. Basically this is a common sense issue.

[lumpentheologie]

26 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

OK…Putting on my medical professional hat here. Also acknowledging if you have had up close and personal experience with an eating disorder or associated death, or a premature death of a close family member d/t an obesity related illness, I realize that you are approaching this topic from a more sensitive POV- I am talking science, common sense and dollars and cents.

The paper linked to by the OP is from a peer-reviewed scientific journal. As expected, it cites randomized controlled clinical trials to support its case. It’s hard for something to be more science than that. 
 

Science and “common sense” are at odds about a lot of things. If common sense were usually right about the world, we wouldn’t even need science — its whole purpose is to explain things that common sense can’t. 

[SassyPants]

Admittedly, this is a ten year old article. It would take a great deal more to convince me that people eating the SAD and who are obese score significantly better (in large numbers) on health screening indicators vs those eating a healthy, lower fat diet and maintaining a healthy weight/lifestyle. Are there outliers, sure, but those are likely the exception and not the rule.