Joy & Austin 20: Baby Gideon is Here

[fluffernutter]

I was a doula for several years, and i never saw forceps in all those births. When there were issues, ob's always used suction (vacuum). I wonder about forceps,  i'm kind of skeptical, as it seemed outdated along with shaving and enemas.  But doulas don't have any kind of official medical training, and the majority of the births i saw were completely normal. If i had to guess  I think maybe she tried a home birth (the birth tub clue), it wasn't a birth center (because I've given birth in one and attended  some and they didn't have an isolette), and baby was so big they went to hospital for some type of assistance to get the big boy out. I haven't been involved in birth since 2009, so really i am just thinking out loud. 

[Otto Titsling]

33 minutes ago, fluffernutter said:

I was a doula for several years, and i never saw forceps in all those births. When there were issues, ob's always used suction (vacuum). I wonder about forceps,  i'm kind of skeptical, as it seemed outdated along with shaving and enemas.  But doulas don't have any kind of official medical training, and the majority of the births i saw were completely normal. If i had to guess  I think maybe she tried a home birth (the birth tub clue), it wasn't a birth center (because I've given birth in one and attended  some and they didn't have an isolette), and baby was so big they went to hospital for some type of assistance to get the big boy out. I haven't been involved in birth since 2009, so really i am just thinking out loud. 

I used to float, so I’ve been in pretty much every department in the hospital except higher order/ super specialized ICUs. I have actually not seen them used many times either (3 times), but I flirted with becoming a CNM. In my many middle of the night chats with the OBs, I learned that they are all still trained in the usage of forceps and they’ve made a bit of a comeback. The issue being nutrition during pregnancy and the trend towards larger babies. 

Most women don’t realize how little it takes to grow a baby. You really only need a spare healthy meal, and a light one at that. But the eating for 2 mentality takes over and it’s produced bigger babies. Big, healthy babies are fine, but our pelvises aren’t keeping up evolutionarily. In fact, one of the OBs that I’m still close with is doing a large research study on this subject right now. 

The vacuum can only be applied so many times and then other methods have to be considered. That has been my professional experience.

I, personally, was delivered by one doctor in my first pregnancy, and then midwives after that for my last three. I adored my midwives. But my biggest baby was only 7lbs 8oz. And I had her in 4 hours flat. 

[Karma]

I tried out the move along emoticon on you, @sapphireslytherin, (and then replaced it with a nicer one) and realised that I hadn’t realised it was a dead parrot either.  It’s much clearer on my iPhone screen in the choice bit than after it’s posted.  I wear multifocals which include a reading script all the time...maybe I need to get my eyes checked.  I thought it was a little shovel and a pile of poo...same effect as the dead parrot!

[nvmbr02]

I have only witnessed one birth that wasn't my own children and it was a forceps delivery. The vacuum could only be applied twice according to hospital policy and it had failed both times. After watching the (failed) vacuum attempts followed by the forceps I feel I personally would prefer the forceps, it just seemed like a more gentle process. It wasn't at all like I had pictured it would be in my mind. But it could have just been that particular birth. I don't really have all that much experience in births.

I will say that I had just found out I was pregnant with my second child the night before. After watching my friend labor for 36 + hours and push for over 4 I was pretty convinced that baby #2 was going to be a scheduled c- section. haha. Thankfully my first labor was my longest at 13 hours and I only pushed for 20 mins. that time. The other two were much shorter (2 hours and just over 5 hours) and hardly any pushing.  My poor friend was not as blessed and her second delivery was worse than the first. I have always felt very, very lucky. I did end up with a whole host of post natal complications with 2 of the births though, so it wasn;t all sunshine and roses. 

[Nargus]

54 minutes ago, Otto Titsling said:

Most women don’t realize how little it takes to grow a baby. You really only need a spare healthy meal, and a light one at that. But the eating for 2 mentality takes over and it’s produced bigger babies. Big, healthy babies are fine, but our pelvises aren’t keeping up evolutionarily. In fact, one of the OBs that I’m still close with is doing a large research study on this subject right now. 

My best friend explained that to me after she had her little one, before I was pregnant with mine.  Like she heavily emphasized it. 

So now that I am, I just switched my calorie tracking app to 'maintain my weight' and now that I'm in 2nd trimester, I just aim to be 200-300 over that number.  I definitely don't track closely, but I like to track a day here and there to make sure I'm not going too crazy.  Some days I do (today I had an entire box of Kraft Dinner for lunch), but some days all I want to eat is veggies and cottage cheese.  I'm definitely struggling with carbs though.  Most days, I could happily eat nothing but bread, pasta and rice.  Drives husband CRAZY cause he wants me to eat properly.

[Otto Titsling]

30 minutes ago, Nargus said:

My best friend explained that to me after she had her little one, before I was pregnant with mine.  Like she heavily emphasized it. 

So now that I am, I just switched my calorie tracking app to 'maintain my weight' and now that I'm in 2nd trimester, I just aim to be 200-300 over that number.  I definitely don't track closely, but I like to track a day here and there to make sure I'm not going too crazy.  Some days I do (today I had an entire box of Kraft Dinner for lunch), but some days all I want to eat is veggies and cottage cheese.  I'm definitely struggling with carbs though.  Most days, I could happily eat nothing but bread, pasta and rice.  Drives husband CRAZY cause he wants me to eat properly.

And of course you want to always listen to what your OB or midwives are saying. No certain formula works for every woman, but excess baby weight can be avoided. I was still working 48-56 hours plus at 34 weeks with #3 and was too tired to cook. So more than a few double cheeseburgers and pizzas were consumed. And it’s certainly the time to indulge at times.

That said, I wish I would have been more vigilant about what I was eating. It’s been 11 years since #4, and I guess I’ll have to stop calling it baby weight soon. Maybe next year! Lol!

And the carbs thing, I totally get it!  I craved Little Caesar’s crazy bread in one of my pregnancies. We had one a quarter of a mile away. I indulged often. My son loves crazy bread 

[WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo?]

59 minutes ago, Karma said:

I tried out the move along emoticon on you, @sapphireslytherin, (and then replaced it with a nicer one) and realised that I hadn’t realised it was a dead parrot either.  It’s much clearer on my iPhone screen in the choice bit than after it’s posted.  I wear multifocals which include a reading script all the time...maybe I need to get my eyes checked.  I thought it was a little shovel and a pile of poo...same effect as the dead parrot!

So, I took screenshots of closeups of all the voting options. They might be easier for folks to see. I'm putting the pics under spoilers, because I doubt everyone cares. 

From top to bottom (on my phone):

Angry (-1 reputation)

Spoiler

Disgust (used to be -1 reputation, now 0 or neutral)

Spoiler

Move Along (-1 reputation)

Spoiler

Extra close of the infamous parrot:

Fuck You (-1 reputation)

Spoiler

Downvote (-1 reputation)

Spoiler

Confused (0 or neutral)

Spoiler

Sad (0 or neutral)

Spoiler

Bless Your Heart (0 or neutral)

Spoiler

Extra close:

Rufus Bless (0 or neutral)

Spoiler

WTF (0 or neutral)

Spoiler

The teeth always make me laugh!

Haha (+1 reputation)

Spoiler

I Agree (+1 reputation)

Spoiler

Extra close:

I used to imagine I saw freckles on this one, but I think that illusion has stopped for now. 

Thanks (+1 reputation)

Spoiler

Extra close:

I still respectfully disagree with @HerNameIsBuffy on this one. I do not see a spermoji wearing a chef's hat, even with my glasses off! 

Love (+1 reputation)

Spoiler

Upvote (+1 reputation)

Spoiler

Apparently my unhealthy FJ obsession is posting screenshots, instead of keeping spreadsheets.  

[brogue]

I am trying to catch up on all of this! Just re Jonestown... I know someone has mentioned last podcast on the left, so I’m gonna recommend the podcast casefile, which has done a 3 part episode on Jonestown, it was really interesting! I love that podcast. 

[albireo]

@WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo? so THAT'S what the angry emote looks like!!

[Otto Titsling]

@WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo? I didn’t realize that was a dead parrot. I thought it was an island or hill, as in is this “Your hill/island to die on?”  

My glasses are sadly 4 years old and I need bifocals, so I can’t see up close at this point. I’m typing this by looking under the bottom edge of my current glasses. But somehow, I’ll bet I’m not the only one reading under the edge of their glasses knowing they can’t see shit and in a little bit of denial.

[WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo?]

15 minutes ago, Otto Titsling said:

somehow, I’ll bet I’m not the only one reading under the edge of their glasses knowing they can’t see shit and in a little bit of denial.

I'm nearsighted and nearing 50. (In a few years.) I haven't gotten bifocals or progressive lenses yet, so I usually just take off my glasses. 

[Million Children For Jesus]

5 hours ago, gameofunbeknowns said:

All our periods have synced up and I’m loving it.

...but who has the dominant uterus? Anyone remember that thread? 

[JemimaPuddle-Duck]

Haha, oh my. I have perfect vision. How could I clearly see the angry reaction, but think the dead parrot was a train?

[Million Children For Jesus]

3 hours ago, metheglyn said:

This clip of them at the restaurant is followed by a talking head in which Austin says "In Geneva, where we're at, they speak French, and then in other parts of the country they have, uh..." Joy says "Swiss German", and then he says "Swiss with a German dialect".  In a later talking head (clearly filmed at the same time as the previous, since they're in Zermatt for both), he says "In this part of Switzerland they speak Swiss German."  So it does sound like he knows the difference, he just got mixed up in the interview and the editors/TLC left it in.

I’ve said this many times, the producers hate the Duggars. If I were producing a show for someone I liked and wanted to present well, I would absolutely edit out any mistakes the person made that would make them appear uninformed.

How many talking heads have been focused on having the Duggars answer questions that they don’t know the answers to? Is it supposed to be funny? Is the audience supposed to get laughs by feeling superior to an ignorant Duggar? In real life, I don’t laugh at people when they don’t know something. I think the producers are mocking the Duggars, and I have never found it amusing. I could be wrong, maybe the producers love the Duggars and just make them look stupid out of kindness, but that just isn’t how I would present anyone that I respected. I haven’t watched in a couple of seasons, so maybe the “let’s make fun of a Duggar” talking head sessions aren’t a thing anymore. As much as I dislike these people,  I always found it off putting. 

[Million Children For Jesus]

1 hour ago, Otto Titsling said:

I didn’t realize that was a dead parrot. I thought it was an island or hill, as in is this “Your hill/island to die on?”  

That would make perfect sense. I thought it was a golf tee. It can be annoying to get stuck behind slow golfers. I golf, so that’s where my mind went first. Never thought to zoom in and check. 

[Otto Titsling]

Forever stuck at 17 at the TPC Sawgrass island whole. That’s my golfing nightmare. Just continuously hitting balls in to the water till I’m a skeleton there. 

[Sky with diamonds]

2 hours ago, WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo? said:

So, I took screenshots of closeups of all the voting options. They might be easier for folks to see. I'm putting the pics under spoilers, because I doubt everyone cares. 

From top to bottom (on my phone):

Angry (-1 reputation)

  Reveal hidden contents

Disgust (used to be -1 reputation, now 0 or neutral)

  Reveal hidden contents

Move Along (-1 reputation)

  Reveal hidden contents

Extra close of the infamous parrot:

Fuck You (-1 reputation)

  Reveal hidden contents

Downvote (-1 reputation)

  Reveal hidden contents

Confused (0 or neutral)

  Reveal hidden contents

Sad (0 or neutral)

  Reveal hidden contents

Bless Your Heart (0 or neutral)

  Reveal hidden contents

Extra close:

Rufus Bless (0 or neutral)

  Reveal hidden contents

WTF (0 or neutral)

  Reveal hidden contents

The teeth always make me laugh!

Haha (+1 reputation)

  Reveal hidden contents

I Agree (+1 reputation)

  Reveal hidden contents

Extra close:

I used to imagine I saw freckles on this one, but I think that illusion has stopped for now. 

Thanks (+1 reputation)

  Reveal hidden contents

Extra close:

I still respectfully disagree with @HerNameIsBuffy on this one. I do not see a spermoji wearing a chef's hat, even with my glasses off! 

Love (+1 reputation)

  Reveal hidden contents

Upvote (+1 reputation)

  Reveal hidden contents

Apparently my unhealthy FJ obsession is posting screenshots, instead of keeping spreadsheets.  

Thanks for this. Some I could not see very well on my tablet. 

[Million Children For Jesus]

1 hour ago, Otto Titsling said:

Forever stuck at 17 at the TPC Sawgrass island whole. That’s my golfing nightmare. Just continuously hitting balls in to the water till I’m a skeleton there. 

Oh my gosh, I had to look it up, and now I have that anxious feeling of kindof wanting to do it, but the same way I kindof want to watch a movie about exorcisms when I’m alone at 3AM. I know I shouldn’t, but... 

[Chocolatecheesecake]

9 hours ago, thinandfit said:

Sorry for the derail but this is my pet peeve and I have to clarify- he isn't being an idiot- he clearly says Swiss with a German DIALECT which is true, they speak German, French and Italian as the national languages.

Maybe I am misunderstanding, because English is not my first language but even if he said Swiss with a German DIALECT it would be wrong. Because it would be German with a Swiss dialect, right? There is no such thing as a swiss language, they only speak German, French and Italian, each with a Swiss dialect. And I speak German with an Austrian dialect. Am I missing something here?  

[Karma]

Thankyou @WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo?, I can see the dead parrot clearly now, and also the angry face, which I hadn’t really noticed before (I cannot blame not wearing glasses since I’ve had reading glasses for over 30 years).  

And yes, you might not be the keeper of the lists or spreadsheets, but you are a very reliable and much appreciated source of screenshots and always have the curiosity to consult google on unfamiliar terms and share them with those of us too lazy to do so ourselves!  Thankyou 

[thinandfit]

16 minutes ago, Chocolatecheesecake said:

Maybe I am misunderstanding, because English is not my first language but even if he said Swiss with a German DIALECT it would be wrong. Because it would be German with a Swiss dialect, right? There is no such thing as a swiss language, they only speak German, French and Italian, each with a Swiss dialect. And I speak German with an Austrian dialect. Am I missing something here?  

I wrote this at 2AM so my wording wasn't ideal but yeah-my main point was that he clearly knows what he is trying to say, it's just the way people had misquoted him that annoyed me. I am all for criticising him (and lets be real he makes it too easy with some of the things he has actually said) but I would rather we were criticising him for what he had said unlike the original poster whom I was replying to who had taken what he had said and made it their own in order to fit the "look how uncultured fundies are" narrative. I will say that as has already been mentioned above I feel like the producers seem to exaggerate this quality.  

[AprilQuilt]

11 hours ago, fluffernutter said:

I was a doula for several years, and i never saw forceps in all those births. When there were issues, ob's always used suction (vacuum). I wonder about forceps,  i'm kind of skeptical, as it seemed outdated along with shaving and enemas.  But doulas don't have any kind of official medical training, and the majority of the births i saw were completely normal. If i had to guess  I think maybe she tried a home birth (the birth tub clue), it wasn't a birth center (because I've given birth in one and attended  some and they didn't have an isolette), and baby was so big they went to hospital for some type of assistance to get the big boy out. I haven't been involved in birth since 2009, so really i am just thinking out loud. 

I've just watched an episode of One Born Every Minute (UK - do they have it in the US? if not, why not?) and a woman had a forceps delivery. She was in hospital having been induced; her labour had been going well until it slowed down and the baby's heartbeat started to drop. Naturally I thought of FJ  because that's how cool I am.

I got a screengrab of the newborn with the forcep mark on his cheek. This is similar placement to the mark on Gideon, no?

Spoiler

 

 

Spoiler

 

[SapphireSlytherin]

THANK you for the extra-large reaction graphics. 

I.AM.DYING. at some of those.

I wish the "thank you" could also mean "You need a flower." hahaha

[Edhelfin]

23 hours ago, gameofunbeknowns said:

So what’s the alternative? Falsely painting human beings in a uniformly negative light? Pretending that they can’t have cute babies while holding hateful beliefs? The most effective criticism requires more thought and is more nuanced than that.

Also, it seems to me that spreadsheets aid in criticism. They are a source that can be referenced when discussing the harm of the quiverful ideology. The most useful criticism is an accurate one.

It is not 'falsely' done if criticism is based on what Duggars actually said or did. And of course they can have cute babies while holding harmful beliefs. Who said anything about the babies not being cute?

I am still curious about what I asked in my post though. Do you really want the hype about the Duggars to die down? Do you honestly want their show to be cancelled and them to disappear from public eye? 

(I know this may lead to the younger ones having more sheltered lives away from the eyes of the media. I am interested in reasons apart from that.) 

I think I should make another thread and stop hacking this one.

 

[HarleyQuinn]

I really thought that parrot was a tractor  I'm a bit shook right now. 

re: the forceps, now that I see that other photo, they do kind of look like forceps marks.