Real Life Fundie Encounters - Part 4

[EyesOpen]

56 minutes ago, Jana814 said:

I see Orthodox  Jews in the IKEA I go to because it’s located close to a large orthodox community.  They generally have a lot of kids. 

I’m used to seeing Orthodox Jews in my area but these folks looked different. Not Quaker’s either...

[anniebgood]

Yesterday when I walked into my mom's hospital room, my stepbrother and his wife (They go to a  non-denominational; church in Acton, CA  were there and he was reading to her from an article a pastor wrote. It was discussing elect and non-elect, and whether unbaptized children would be allowed into heaven or immediately be thrown into the pit. I said I can't imagine a loving God allowing children to go to hell. I didn't mention that I don't believe in a literal hell.    
They then asked me when I got saved? I said I've always been saved. I didn't have to utter a statement to a group (except for confirmation) to bolster my faith.  Then she asked me I believe in creation. I said not the literal 7-day creation but I believed that God created the universe. That was ok. 
He was reading a John MacArthur book on divorce because he's counseling a guy at church whose wife left him..as did my stepbrother's first wife. He's got experience on that. He's also using a MacArthur Bible. 
So that was an interesting hour or so while sitting in the hospital. 

[Sobeknofret]

51 minutes ago, EyesOpen said:

I’m used to seeing Orthodox Jews in my area but these folks looked different. Not Quaker’s either...

Just a hint- we Quakers don't look any different than anybody else these days  Might dress a little more plainly or modestly, but nothing to really set us apart. 

[BullyJBG]

On 1/3/2018 at 6:29 PM, rosary said:

Oh yeah....nothing big.  The usual stuff like inviting me to church. The daughters have more personality than the internet lets on. I know people that go to their church, mostly because they want to be with their relatives in the care home. Generally not as offensive in person as they are on the computer. Now that I have freejinger, I can make note of the visits. I see them at the dillons grocery store, the thrift stores, the Walmart. I have never seen them at aldis.   I do not go to church like that with non-degreed religious personnel.  I did not know who these people were till I went to freejinger.  I generally try to have a live and let live attitude about strangers I do not know. I tend to leave people alone till they bother me.  I am not going to take pictures with them. I do not want these people to think they are famous.

Interesting. Very interesting. So, how long have you lived in their area? I guess we have yet to see how John and Chelsy do things in the community. Have you seen much of the rest of the family; the other married sons and their families?

[feministxtian]

4 hours ago, Sobeknofret said:

Just a hint- we Quakers don't look any different than anybody else these days  Might dress a little more plainly or modestly, but nothing to really set us apart. 

I have friends that are Quakers...honestly, if you saw them, there's nothing to identify them as Quakers. C is very involved in their local meeting, R (husband) is some sort of attorney and joined the travel ban protest at their airport (they live in a large city with an international airport). Their son J has hair all the way down his back and a full beard. All the children are adults now, well educated with good careers. 

So...AFAIK there's nothing that identifies Quakers by dress or whatever. 

[Sobeknofret]

9 hours ago, feministxtian said:

I have friends that are Quakers...honestly, if you saw them, there's nothing to identify them as Quakers. C is very involved in their local meeting, R (husband) is some sort of attorney and joined the travel ban protest at their airport (they live in a large city with an international airport). Their son J has hair all the way down his back and a full beard. All the children are adults now, well educated with good careers. 

So...AFAIK there's nothing that identifies Quakers by dress or whatever. 

To be fair, I was thinking last night that there are some Plain Quakers, who do dress way differently (think the stereotypical colonial American dress) but there aren't many of them, and they do dress similarly to Old Order Mennonites and some Amish groups.

The vast majority are like me though; standing out isn't something we're looking to do, so we dress pretty much like every one else. Might get the clothes from a thrift store or second hand shop to reduce waste or help with sweatshop slavery by reducing demand for new clothes, but the clothes are the same

[Flossie]

I used to think Quakers were Amish, like it was just another name for Amish.

Then I saw a movie with Lynda Carter where Lynda played a Quaker woman who ran a bank, she was the head of her Quaker group, and she dressed like any other businesswoman of the times.  A young man that her family had fostered in the past showed up and took everyone hostage, demanding the Lynda rob her own bank to save their lives.  Lynda spent a lot of time trying to find nonviolent ways to get everyone to the end of the movie alive.

The only other thing I really remember from the movie was that her daughter was unhappy with the assumption that she and her husband (and future children) would continue to live in the large family home like all the other Quaker kids did when they grew up.  I wondered if that was really how the Quakers lived, and under what circumstances would it be acceptable for someone to move into their own home to avoid having 60 people all crammed into one home.

[Sobeknofret]

1 hour ago, Flossie said:

The only other thing I really remember from the movie was that her daughter was unhappy with the assumption that she and her husband (and future children) would continue to live in the large family home like all the other Quaker kids did when they grew up.  I wondered if that was really how the Quakers lived, and under what circumstances would it be acceptable for someone to move into their own home to avoid having 60 people all crammed into one home.

Nooooo! Not a thing, as far as I know. It might happen in some families, but it's not a general Quaker practice. Personally, I'm looking forward to it being just my husband and I for awhile  I love my kid more than anything, but having just dh and I sounds really good.

[Pammy]

I'm in a lot of social and work settings where fundie-light is normal, and full fundamentalism is identified as, "Pretty conservative, even for us." Lately, the big issue has been a funding application form for charities from the (Canadian) government.

The form requires applicants to check off that the organization "respects the human and other legal rights" of all employees, clients, participants, etc. It lists the various legality rights including reproductive rights.

I hate that it needs to be said! "Yes, Virginia, when people have legal rights, government sanctioned organizations have to respect them. No, nobody thinks you're a martyr for standing up for your "right" to get free money while deciding for yourself that other people's rights are optional!"

[Jigsaw3]

Yes, I read about that. For the Canada Summer Jobs program, right? The fuss is pretty eye-roll-worthy.

It's a little more complicated than that, though. It's not the organization itself, it's the job that the organization is hiring for. Basically, the Canadian government wants to make sure that its money is not directly funding a program that is against the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

So, for example, a religious organization is permitted -- even encouraged -- to apply for government funding to hire students for the summer as counselors for a day camp for underprivileged children. They can honestly tick that checkbox as long as the day camp does not discriminate or teach anything against the Charter. The same religious organization is allowed to campaign against abortion -- no one is stopping them!  -- but they are NOT permitted to use the Summer Jobs funding to hire students for their anti-abortion campaign, because abortion is a right here in Canada. (This is not a hypothetical: in the past, funding from this program has been used for exactly that.)

So some religious organizations are kicking up a fuss, because, as you said, they're not allowed any more to use federal money to decide that other people's rights are optional. UGH.

[Jigsaw3]

Hrm, correction, actually it seems it's a little more complicated: the "core mandate" of the organization can't be against the Charter.

Here's an article about it: http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/summer-jobs-abortion-hajdu-analysis-wherry-1.4499907

 

[Pammy]

Yes, the core mandate is included (and legal rights other than charter rights are included) but the requirement is only that they "respect" those rights.

Overly emotional people think that they are being asked to support, agree with or approve of abortion rights... but they aren't.

They are only being asked whether they are committed to respecting all the rights in any situation that comes up. Not "respect the right" as in "have positive feelings about it" and pat her on the back -- "respect the right" as in "understand that she is free to do it whether you like it or not" and therefore know that there is nothing (legal) that you can do to stand in her way.

(Now I will probably have to decide whether I feel ok sending my kids to a camp where they might have basically declared respecting other people's rights to be optional -- or whether I trust that they wouldn't actually deny people their rights in reality, and they just got caught in the hype.)

[MarblesMom]

OMG you guys.... I was accosted approached by two people from Bethel (you know, the hands on faith healers) in the bread dept at Trader Joes.  I was in a riding cart, and the man asked me if I was having problems with my legs.

I assumed, since I appear healthy on the outside, that he was challenging my use of the cart.  I told him, yes, I need a new kneecap.  He then asked if he could pray for a new kneecap and IF HE COULD TOUCH MY KNEE.  Hey, even my PT and Dr cannot touch my knee without sedating me LOL.... so that was a NO.  He prayed anyway.

Pretty sure Jesus was not going to replace my kneecap next to the baguettes at Trader Joes... I might have appreciated a prayer for the university-educated surgeons who will provide my care... 

Anyway, when they were done, I said "Oh, look, BEER!" and zipped off.

Now sipping a La Crema Chard and wishing the Bethel freaks into the cornfield.

[Fascinated]

Haha.  I can picture it perfectly @MarblesMom.  

[EowynW]

Got a random instagram follow request tonight from a fundie I do not know. 

[LeftCoastLurker]

Trying to take my mind off politics so I'd thought I'd finally share my story. This happened probably 15 years ago.

Our across the street neighbors are your typical, conservative, right-wing "christians". Homeschooled their children up until high school, church goers, homophobic, etc... We have managed a cordial relationship over the year. 

So, their eldest, a daughter, went off to a christian college. They still had two sons at home. 

Early, early one morning (3 am?) someone starts pounding on our front door. DH and I run downstairs and look out the window and it is the daughter from across the street. My first thoughts were, oh shit, her dad lost it and did something bad. We let her in and asked what was going on.

Well..it turns out she had finally had her first taste of freedom, met a boy (at church) and got pregnant. When she told her folks (via email!) they drove to college to "take her out to lunch and talk". What they did was kidnap her (she was 18, so legally an adult) and brought her home. They took her ID and cellphone and kept her in a room in their house. After a few days she managed to slip out of the house by raising the garage door a few inches when the furnace kicked on. She came to our house since she knew we wouldn't snitch on her.

She contacted her boyfriend and arranged to meet him later that day. As her dad was combing the neighborhood looking for her, we hid her in the backseat of my husband's truck and covered her with a blanket, gave her some cash and drove her 4.5 hours (each way!) back to her boyfriend. Mind you, we had a long conversation with the boyfriend before letting her reunite!

We have NO idea if they are aware that we did this, and we've only spoken to her once since then. We do know she has since married and divorced and has at least three kids.

[EowynW]

Remember my sister in law, the one who bought thousands in camera, lenses and drone equipment, despite a "poor family" with three kids under 3 and being on government assistance, and then decided overnight to start a professional videography business, even though she had no experience making videos or even portfolio building? 

In a bizarre turn of events for a fundie lite couple, Mr EW's brother has decided to be a stay at home Dad "because he doesn't believe in working" (I fully support stay at home Dads, btw)  and SIL is going to fully support the family and buy a house with her "professional business." 

This couple doesnt even pay rent or utilities right now. Plus on full assistance for 3 kids under 3. They don't even know what it's like to stay one step ahead of bills! 

 

[hollyandivy]

@EowynW Wow, that is unbelievable.... maybe suggest to her to take some lessons from the Arndts, she might be able to pick up some skills.

 

And I can't believe someone is staying home because they "don't believe in working" -  people like that should nit get any government assistance, it should be reserved for people who really need it!

[EowynW]

7 minutes ago, hollyandivy said:

@EowynW Wow, that is unbelievable.... maybe suggest to her to take some lessons from the Arndts, she might be able to pick up some skills.

 

And I can't believe someone is staying home because they "don't believe in working" -  people like that should nit get any government assistance, it should be reserved for people who really need it!

Yes. It's very frustrating. She thinks she's all that now and keeps asking if I'll be her second shooter since I dabble in photography with my old camera, but I've never made a video in my life and have zero desire to wreck someone's wedding by doing it for the first time. 

Not believing in working is a scary attitude to have when you have kids to feed. 

[Jana814]

Can I ask why doesn't he believe in working?  

[Red Hair, Black Dress]

Isn't their house provided by the ranch your BIL works for?  So I assume they will have to move somewhere?  And pay rent with...... whatever your SIL is making, assuming she is making any money?

I'm going to throw this suggestion out.  If the BIL is silly enough to give up his ranch job, and they have to move from the job-provided house --  Why don't you or Mr. EW apply for the job? I seem to remember it pays more than Mr. EW's current job.  Or maybe the job is perfect for you -- outdoors, with animals, free (cheap?) housing.  Sounds perfect for you two.

If the BIL/SIL are going to throw away such a great opportunity, there is No reason you and Mr. EW can't scoop it up.  It's not taking advantage of them since they are willingly walking away.

I say go for it!  It's a good opportunity that has landed in your lap.

Adding -- if you and Mr EW decide to go for it, don't let anyone in the family know until it's a done deal.  That way you won't have to hear any possible objections from your parents, Mr EW's parents or sour grapes squawking from BIL/SIL.   

 

[EowynW]

22 minutes ago, Jana814 said:

Can I ask why doesn't he believe in working?  

I don't know. He's talked about not wanting to be part of the "system" and would rather stay home and sell his art on the side. He says he isn't motivated enough for running his own business though, and he doesn't believe in working for others. 

10 minutes ago, Red Hair, Black Dress said:

Isn't their house provided by the ranch your BIL works for?  So I assume they will have to move somewhere?  And pay rent with...... whatever your SIL is making, assuming she is making any money?

I'm going to throw this suggestion out.  If the BIL is silly enough to give up his ranch job, and they have to move from the job-provided house --  Why don't you or Mr. EW apply for the job? I seem to remember it pays more than Mr. EW's current job.  Or maybe the job is perfect for you -- outdoors, with animals, free (cheap?) housing.  Sounds perfect for you two.

If the BIL/SIL are going to throw away such a great opportunity, there is No reason you and Mr. EW can't scoop it up.  It's not taking advantage of them since they are willingly walking away.

I say go for it!  It's a good opportunity that has landed in your lap.

Adding -- if you and Mr EW decide to go for it, don't let anyone in the family know until it's a done deal.  That way you won't have to hear any possible objections from your parents, Mr EW's parents or sour grapes squawking from BIL/SIL.   

 

It would be a fun job!  But it does pay quite a bit less than what Mr. EW currently makes. And there are no benefits at all. Mr. EW's job has fairly good insurance and benefits, and with his severe asthma we have to keep that insurance. 

[Red Hair, Black Dress]

5 minutes ago, EowynW said:

isn't motivated enough for running his own business though, and he doesn't believe in working for others

 So.......... basically  ..... he's just lazy and want someone, anyone else to support him? 

Totally understand about the benefits -- let Mr. EW keep his job and you go for it.   Free housing means your expenses will be less.  Besides you're a great fit for an outdoor job.

[Jana814]

I wouldn't really call this a fundie encounter, but this is mine. Last Saturday I was getting my dinner delivery in my building when I noticed a group of Mormon girls. All dressed in long dresses with their Bible's.  They waited for me to get on the elevator, I thought they were going to try and minister to me but they didn't, they were actually quite sweet. 

[nastyhobbitses]

On 1/22/2018 at 4:39 AM, feministxtian said:

I have friends that are Quakers...honestly, if you saw them, there's nothing to identify them as Quakers. C is very involved in their local meeting, R (husband) is some sort of attorney and joined the travel ban protest at their airport (they live in a large city with an international airport). Their son J has hair all the way down his back and a full beard. All the children are adults now, well educated with good careers. 

So...AFAIK there's nothing that identifies Quakers by dress or whatever. 

My good friend from college is a Quaker. He's very involved in social justice causes and studies economics. He's also famous among our group of friends for an incident where two of our female friends were discussing male genitalia, and jokingly, one said to him "Hey, Phil (not his real name), drop your pants real quick!" Seconds later, he waddled over to them with his pants around his ankles, asking "why?"

I'm assuming not every Quaker is so nonchalant about whipping it out on command, but there you go.