Jinger and Jeremy: Life with the Soccer Preacher Man

[KelseyAnn]

14 minutes ago, prayawaythefundie said:

@KelseyAnn In theory, I think it's possible but would any of the Duggar boys even be attractive to not-so-fundy girls? Who would want a man trained in nothing, raised to believe that his wife should not work, not use birth control and always joyfully submit to his will? Why invest lots of time and energy in trying to change him when she can have someone wo already acccepts the concept of her being an indepedent human being?

For the not-so-fundy man it's way more attractive to marry a Duggar daughter IMO, whether he wants to "free" her or not. He can either be a hero without having to work hard or he will always get his way without having to work hard.

 

If you're a hungry and starving girl and came from a home that beat you, a Duggar might just seem like a steal. I, for one, moved in with several abusive boyfriends from the time I was 16 just so I didn't have to go home. As long as I got food and warm shelter from the deal, lying on my back for a minutes every now and then didnts eem so bad a deal. 

And that being said, personality does play a factor. You cannot tell me that all the Duggar boys are the same type of garbage as Jim-Bob and Josh. There are still plenty of people who would rather be poor with the one they love than rich with someone they despise. 

[singsingsing]

It may seem crazy, but the Duggars have tons of fangirls. There are definitely plenty of even mainstream Christian girls who would jump at the chance to marry a Duggar boy.

[danni9242]

Statistically one of those kids could be gay.

In Duggar world that's a massive nono and they would probably try to suppress it/get married to someone of the opposite sex anyway. 

I would say that's what JB and Mechelle would be looking out for LEAST because they wouldn't think their 'well raised Godly' children would "choose" that lifestyle. 

If one of them met a friend who was more than a friend of the same sex they would have the least parental assessment of who they liked and much greater freedom (no chaperone for two same sex friends hanging out), and if they decided to leave the family behind they'd have more chance of private conversations and planning of how to get the heck away.

 

[justmy2cents]

35 minutes ago, singsingsing said:

It may seem crazy, but the Duggars have tons of fangirls. There are definitely plenty of even mainstream Christian girls who would jump at the chance to marry a Duggar boy.

Yes. The young woman who runs the 19kidsandcounting blog (not sure of actual name) has met them a few times and has a massive crush on Joe. Given the opportunity she would probably jump at the chance. 

[nickelodeon]

1 hour ago, HarleyQuinn said:

Does anyone know what the Caldwells are like since Joseph is probably courting one? Are they trying to move up the fundie ladder? Are the Duggars even still towards the top of said ladder?

The Caldwell dad is the pastor at Lighthouse Baptist and handed out homophobic pamphlets about how there's no such thing as gay people, just people who engage in "unseemly" activities in order to defy god's holy gender binary or something. The family has joined the Duggs at various anti-choice events and such, too. So they're definitely assholes.

[prayawaythefundie]

2 hours ago, KelseyAnn said:

If you're a hungry and starving girl and came from a home that beat you, a Duggar might just seem like a steal. I, for one, moved in with several abusive boyfriends from the time I was 16 just so I didn't have to go home. As long as I got food and warm shelter from the deal, lying on my back for a minutes every now and then didnts eem so bad a deal. 

I'm sorry to hear that you were stuck in those situations. I guess a girl with just a choice of bad versus worse, like you described, would be attracted to a Duggar boy. However, I doubt she would get him out of the cult or even just convince him to open up. Wouldn't a vulnerable wife try to exceed all helpmeet expectations? Kinda like Anna does?

[socalrules]

3 hours ago, singsingsing said:

It may seem crazy, but the Duggars have tons of fangirls. There are definitely plenty of even mainstream Christian girls who would jump at the chance to marry a Duggar boy.

How long before the mainstream Christian girl is over the whole Duggar thing once she is stuck in it? Mainstream Christian girls pretty much live th same life as atheist girls. They date, go to college, have professional careers, travel the world and are their own accountability buddy. I think any novelty with a Duggar boy will wear off really fast because they are going to want to hug, cuddle and just have real dates without a chaperone. Not to mention that mainstream Christian parents are not going to see the Duggar boys as a viable option for their educated daughters. Mainstream Christians do not raise their daughters in the ways of the Duggars me they aren't courting. Plus, mainstream daughters will likely run back to their parents should they ever be unhappy. The fan girls are no different than those being hot for Justin Bieber. It's a phase that will pass. 

[MadameOvary]

So… does Jinger now have freedom of the internet? Has she googled herself and found Free Jinger yet?

[kinphilly]

18 minutes ago, socalrules said:

How long before the mainstream Christian girl is over the whole Duggar thing once she is stuck in it? Mainstream Christian girls pretty much live th same life as atheist girls. They date, go to college, have professional careers, travel the world and are their own accountability buddy. I think any novelty with a Duggar boy will wear off really fast because they are going to want to hug, cuddle and just have real dates without a chaperone. Not to mention that mainstream Christian parents are not going to see the Duggar boys as a viable option for their educated daughters. Mainstream Christians do not raise their daughters in the ways of the Duggars me they aren't courting. Plus, mainstream daughters will likely run back to their parents should they ever be unhappy. The fan girls are no different than those being hot for Justin Bieber. It's a phase that will pass. 

You are describing an upper middle class mainstream Christian ... plenty of the American working class can't afford college or world travel.     (BTW - there's also NO shame in being a bus driver, hairdresser, waitress, mechanic)

[Gobsmacked]

2 hours ago, nickelodeon said:

The Caldwell dad is the pastor at Lighthouse Baptist and handed out homophobic pamphlets about how there's no such thing as gay people, just people who engage in "unseemly" activities in order to defy god's holy gender binary or something. The family has joined the Duggs at various anti-choice events and such, too. So they're definitely assholes.

Jody Hodnett ( missionary to wicked Scotland) is  somehow involved in the Lighthouse baptist church in Carlisle (England!!).

Is the Lighthouse baptist church a cult church?

He has taken himself away from the spotlight completely after posting that three churches want to support him. No more news though as his Facebook account was closed for some reason.

[Coconut Flan]

I don't think LIghthouse Baptist churches are grouped together as anything, rather it's simply a common IFB church name. 

[nst]

6 hours ago, justmy2cents said:

Pretty much though hot tubs would not be recommended.  Bad for sperm and not good for embryos either.

And that is what I thought.  I just wanted to know if anyone got pregnant that way

[guitar_villain]

6 hours ago, justmy2cents said:

Pretty much though hot tubs would not be recommended.  Bad for sperm and not good for embryos either.

Yes- any guy who's done the infertility shuffle like me probably heard from their doc to avoid hot baths.  The entire reason the testicles are outside the body is because they need to be kept cooler than normal body temperature.  Sperm production goes down with increasing temp- guys wanting to be fathers should also avoid tight clothes.

Note- do not assume hot tubs are a valid form of contraception....

[Bad Wolf]

If a girl wanted to court a Duggar boy, would JB make her fill out a questionnaire? Yes, it should be her dad making the boy do it, but these are the Duggar special snowflakes.

1. Will you joyfully submit at all times, even when throwing up with a fever of 103?

2. Will you let God decide the number of children you have, regardless of whether you can feed them?

3.  Will you help us stamp out evil birth control because it's been proven to cause miscarriages?

4.  Will you promise never to drink, show your knees, or have an independent thought. And lastly,

5. Will you always bow down before me, the great JB?

etc.

[singsingsing]

2 hours ago, socalrules said:

How long before the mainstream Christian girl is over the whole Duggar thing once she is stuck in it? Mainstream Christian girls pretty much live th same life as atheist girls. They date, go to college, have professional careers, travel the world and are their own accountability buddy. I think any novelty with a Duggar boy will wear off really fast because they are going to want to hug, cuddle and just have real dates without a chaperone. Not to mention that mainstream Christian parents are not going to see the Duggar boys as a viable option for their educated daughters. Mainstream Christians do not raise their daughters in the ways of the Duggars me they aren't courting. Plus, mainstream daughters will likely run back to their parents should they ever be unhappy. The fan girls are no different than those being hot for Justin Bieber. It's a phase that will pass. 

Two words: Whitney Bates.

I think you're totally right about the majority of mainstream Christian girls. The shine would wear off pretty quick (hopefully before marriage). But I really believe there are plenty that would very willingly push down any doubts and think it was worth it to change themselves and their lives in a major way. People get sucked into fundamentalism for a reason. If Mainstream Christian Girl has stars and dollar signs in her eyes and is disenchanted with her mainstream life for any number of reasons, she could very easily fall under the fundie spell.

[nausicaa]

16 minutes ago, singsingsing said:

Two words: Whitney Bates.

I think you're totally right about the majority of mainstream Christian girls. The shine would wear off pretty quick (hopefully before marriage). But I really believe there are plenty that would very willingly push down any doubts and think it was worth it to change themselves and their lives in a major way. People get sucked into fundamentalism for a reason. If Mainstream Christian Girl has stars and dollar signs in her eyes and is disenchanted with her mainstream life for any number of reasons, she could very easily fall under the fundie spell.

I do think Whitney's tumultuous upbringing made her even more susceptible to the Bates' big ol' happy family charm though.

And while I'm not Team "Pants Mean Someone Has Completely Changed Their Beliefs," (I swear I am not trying to start up that crap again) I do think it's interesting how she was gung ho about skirts only and then began to wear pants again. I'm curious to see how much more she will revert back to her old ways as the novelty of the Bates Fundy Express continues to wear off. (OTOH, I do think we at FJ downplay how conservative her adoptive parents likely were. Her father is a Southern Baptist preacher and I am willing to bet mostly sees eye to eye with Gil on homosexuality, abortion, marriage roles, and feminism.)

[Incognito22]

5 hours ago, justmy2cents said:

Yes. The young woman who runs the 19kidsandcounting blog (not sure of actual name) has met them a few times and has a massive crush on Joe. Given the opportunity she would probably jump at the chance. 

Not the only thing she'd jump.  She's got it bad for him!

[justmy2cents]

6 minutes ago, Incognito22 said:

Not the only thing she'd jump.  She's got it bad for him!

She sure does. I think the tumbler is 19kidsandloving. She thinks Joe is the friendliest and recounted how she was amused when he gave Alyssa Webster the once over when she walked by because that means he's just a regular guy. He's just like us y'all!

[socalrules]

3 hours ago, kinphilly said:

You are describing an upper middle class mainstream Christian ... plenty of the American working class can't afford college or world travel.     (BTW - there's also NO shame in being a bus driver, hairdresser, waitress, mechanic)

Who said there was shame in being a bus driver, hairdresser, waitress or mechanic? I didn't nor did I allude to it. That's your interpretation. The Duggars are none of those things nor would they be because those are reals jobs working for someone else. I was not describing the upper middle class.  I wasn't aware that going to college or traveling was an upper class option only. Traveling will be harder yes but it can be done. College as well. I did both and was never upper middle class growing up. I worked, took out student loans and got it done. It was hard but worth it. Just because someone may not be upper middle class doesn't that they somehow want less for their daughters to the point that becoming a Duggar is attractive. It also doesn't mean that they don't want for their daughters what you think is upper middle class. 

[singsingsing]

If their daughters are adults, they don't get decide for them whether they're going to marry a Duggar or not. That's the irony - if they're mainstream Christians, they have the freedom to decide to join a patriarchal cult and to in turn deny that freedom to their future daughters. Many of the fundies we discuss were once mainstream Christians or even agnostics or atheists.

[calimojo]

15 hours ago, nastyhobbitses said:

Ah, the "but you're one of the good ones" pronouncement of friendship.

exactly.  That is how I would imagine it.  Just like people who are racist often have friends of different races, but they see them as the 'exceptions' rather than the rule. 

 

I mean, I don't envision Jinger being mean to anyone.  So if she was standing in line at the grocery store and there was an obviously gay couple standing in front of her, I think she would be pleasant if they engaged her in small talk about the weather. 

[HideousGreenShirt]

5 hours ago, MadameOvary said:

So… does Jinger now have freedom of the internet? Has she googled herself and found Free Jinger yet?

I have long-suspected some family member found FJ and had brought it to JB and Meechelle years ago. (Perhaps diligent Jessa with her Covenant Eyes creeping). And that it had been used to shame her in some way, hence the unworthy crying speech at Benessa's wedding rehearsal.

[Tangy Bee]

35 minutes ago, HideousGreenShirt said:

I have long-suspected some family member found FJ and had brought it to JB and Meechelle years ago. (Perhaps diligent Jessa with her Covenant Eyes creeping). And that it had been used to shame her in some way, hence the unworthy crying speech at Benessa's wedding rehearsal.

Hmm...wonder if she's had a chance to peek at us. Is she actually considered "free" yet? Bet Jeremy has lurked around to check things out.

[calimojo]

I always wonder about this.  When I first joined FJ,  it felt like we had somewhat of a mission to encourage these poor kids to break free.  Once the kids entered adulthood and we began to see extent of the brainwashing on the adult kids,  the board got progressively critical of the kids.  And we have all be pretty critical of their spouses. 

 

I always worry that someone like Jinger could come here out of curiosity and start to read the threads.  She might at first enjoy them, but if she read some of the comments made about her new hubby,  it might really be distressing.  I could see them reading on here and instead of it inspiring them to leave,  it would just cement their worst fears about 'outsiders' to their cult. 

I remember when Faith Pendleton first left her cultish family,  she stopped in here and was overwhelmingly met with support and encouragement.  Still,  There was no shortage of threads and posts about her bat shit crazy momma and even though Faith was leaving the cult, I wonder if that was really hard for her to read. 

 

We can get very personal on her, making fun of Jinger's fake tan, racoon eyes, etc.  I am not calling anyone out, as I have done it just as much as anyone.  But I also have always hoped that if one of the oppressed fundie kids found their way to this place that underneath the snark,  they would see the genuine concern for their well being and they would know that if possible we would help them. 

 

So, while I know it is very unlikely that Jinger is reading on here,  If she is I would like to say:  Jinger, you are not responsible for the reprehensible way you were raised.  You were not born a terrible and worthless sinner who had to repent as a young child for sins imagined by your parents.  You were born, as we all are, perfect.  You should have been encouraged to dream, and to pursue your happiness.  You may not see it now,  but your parents raised you in a restricted and limited way.  And while they likely loved you,  Their blind following of a twisted version of Christianity led them to  abandon common sense and normal parenting.    We all hope you can spread your wings and grow.  We have skepticism about any man who courts a Duggar girl, only because  we fear that they will only continue your oppression rather than free you from it.  But, we all hope we are wrong about that.  We see the affection between you and Jeremy and we hope that the love you share is long and persistent.  And we hope that you have a happy and blessed life. 

 

Sorry about that silly indulgence, but I just don't want to lose sight on here.  For me, I would love to see JB and M taken down.  I would like for their terrible life choices to be exposed to the point that only the most die hard and delusional fans would stand by.  But for the children, even the adult kids,  I really do hope that they can break free of their life that was chosen for them.  It won't happen over night and it may not be for 20 or more years before it happens.  Right now,  we may have to contend with them being assholes like their role models have been, but I also think we shouldn't give up hope.  There are slight sparks of encouragement here and there.  They are trivial on their own, but collectively,  they are tiny little holes in the dike and eventually they will erode away the rigidity and barriers.  I think some of the kids will remain in the cult like their parents, Some may even be worse than the parents and some will loosen up and probably a couple of them will gradually move away completely from the cult. 

 

 

 

[Audrey2]

Thank you, @calimojo.

I've read both this thread and others when the idea of fundies changing has been discussed. For me, seeing the offspring in the families we follow (not the parents- I have no sympathy or empathy for them. Most were raised differently and they know better.) makes me think of that friend or family member that we know is in a terrible relationship. I know I'm not always able to talk to them about it directly (thinking about one friend in particular, as I know he'd be embarrassed and humiliated by what I've observed and suspect in his marriage. I do speak up when I see a sibling treat him poorly, as this sibling is known to me.), but I still hold out hope that one day, things will get bad enough that they get brave enough to escape. You just keep hoping that your friend/family member will escape, and look for any sign, no matter how little, to indicate that your family member or friend is thinking about getting out of the relationship. I think this hope is what motivates some on Free Jinger to mention changes in dress or slight changes in behavior. Most of these posters aren't minimizing the horrors of fundamentalism, or the abuse it heaps on its followers but they are focusing on the hope instead, that desperate hope that those who are raised in this awful disease in the name of religion will someday live a freer life.