Dillards 24 - Smug Bible Tweets and Maneaters (Jill/Derick/Israel/Baby Dillard)

[ViolaSebastian]

It seems a little tone deaf to me that they're smiling in a selfie accompanied by words like "execution" and "mourn." I mean, if you believe it's murder, at least post a serious-faced picture.

[anotherone]

55 minutes ago, Mercer said:

I've never really understood the Christianity/anti-choice connection, other than as a way to control female sexuality. God kills (or orders his followers to kill) a massive amount of babies in the Bible, so even if a fetus is an actual baby, it seems like the deity in charge doesn't have a problem with it. *shrug*

You know, I had a miscarriage.  If every pregnancy is a life, does that mean that God murdered my unborn child?  Should I be protesting against God?

[Bad Wolf]

I was the youngest of 4. Sibs were 16, 14 and 9. Mom was 43. No abortion available then. I certainly was in the high risk for Down's. If I'd been aborted, then I wouldn't be here now, so I wouldn't know anyway. Having a hard time phrasing this. If I wasn't here, then Mr. Wolf would have married someone else and had different cubs. I can't get the abortion = murder thing, or mourn a lost life that wasn't viable anyway.

Hope someone understands what I'm saying, because I'm not to sure myself.

[Snarkle Motion]

2 hours ago, BlessaYourHeart said:

It is judgemental and I'll own the fact that it is. Everyone is judgemental about something. 

I just don't see why abortion should be used as a contraception. Especially since in England both abortions and contraception are free on the NHS. But abortions cost more to carry out. Meaning tax payers are paying for someone to abuse the free system as a form of contraception when they could just go to their GP or GUM clinic and get a form of contraception (for free) before it ever gets to the point of pregnancy. 

I also once knew a teacher who had an abortion because she didn't want to get rid of her 2 seat sports car. To me that's just ridiculous. 

I know others think differently and have every right to do so. But that's my outlook on it

If your concern is for the taxpayer's money then the abortion is likely saving the public money in the long term as opposed to the government providing another individual healthcare let alone the costs associated with unwanted child needing placement or raised by parents without appropriate resources. 

I think abortion as contraceptives is rare. But what about the people who's contraceptives failed, teenagers and children who may be assaulted before ever starting on contraceptives, people who have health conditions that maybe they didn't know about when they started the pregnancy (like needing life saving chemo), people with mental illness or drug addiction who maybe aren't the most reliable with contraceptives but recognize that it would be unhealthy to try to raise a child, people who don't have the means or maybe had a sudden change in circumstance such as a losing a job.

I don't think I could personally ever have an abortion or give up my child to adoption but I also recognize that I can't know that until I've walked in someone else's shoes.

[Lurker]

I am strongly pro-choice, even though I have never had one and no longer have to  worry about pregnancy.  I believe some people don't see the difference between abortion and birth control, in response  people are asking why abortion is used as birth control.

I worked with a girl from about 1970 to 1974, after HS then college.  She had two abortions (abortion was legalized in New York in 1970).   I was all why didnt you use birth control and her answer was "its a sin to plan to have sex".  She went with her family to a very conservative southern baptist church Wednesday, Saturday and Sunday, lots of hell and damnation for everything from not tithing, not cleaning the pews, to abortion.  Everything ended up in damnation, so why bother.

The forced birth, no choice people have demonized birth control to such a degree that impressionable women without independence or critical thinking can't seperate out the difference since they are taught everything is murder, from the pill to even condoms since every sperm is sacred.

I beleive that all these restrictive laws and escalated rhetoric increases abortions. 

And accidents happen, to the most diligent users of birth control.  Nothing is absolutely perfect in results.   I know one woman that had a child after a tubal, and another had a miscarriage after hers.

 

 

 

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

2 hours ago, BlessaYourHeart said:

It is judgemental and I'll own the fact that it is. Everyone is judgemental about something. 

I just don't see why abortion should be used as a contraception. Especially since in England both abortions and contraception are free on the NHS. But abortions cost more to carry out. Meaning tax payers are paying for someone to abuse the free system as a form of contraception when they could just go to their GP or GUM clinic and get a form of contraception (for free) before it ever gets to the point of pregnancy. 

I also once knew a teacher who had an abortion because she didn't want to get rid of her 2 seat sports car. To me that's just ridiculous. 

I know others think differently and have every right to do so. But that's my outlook on it

Who the hell uses abortion as contraceptive? This is right wing bullshit used on people to make them feel abortion is over used and the women having them are horrible people.  I've had this argument with my RWNJ mother, While I'm sure there are a handful of women in the history of the world who've used it in that way but I assure you that number is small, unless anyone on here can name 1 woman who uses abortion as birth control, I don't know a single woman, and I know a lot, who have done this, and I don't know anyone who knows anyone who's done this. 

[Snarkle Motion]

1 hour ago, Mercer said:

I've never really understood the Christianity/anti-choice connection, other than as a way to control female sexuality. God kills (or orders his followers to kill) a massive amount of babies in the Bible, so even if a fetus is an actual baby, it seems like the deity in charge doesn't have a problem with it. *shrug*

This a million times. The bible is totally okay with murder and slavery in the right circumstances. It's the pagan Hippocrates who was against abortion historically.

To me the issue has always really been about controlling women. I think it's telling that abortion and homosexuality were the main issues for the Christian Right. Both of these issues are really about who should be having sex and controlling people through sex. 

[Lurker]

 

5 minutes ago, Snarkle Motion said:

This a million times. The bible is totally okay with murder and slavery in the right circumstances. It's the pagan Hippocrates who was against abortion historically.

To me the issue has always really been about controlling women. I think it's telling that abortion and homosexuality were the main issues for the Christian Right. Both of these issues are really about who should be having sex and controlling people through sex. 

It's also a great way to raise money and live off the proceeds.    Because Jeuses and babies and  non procreative sex makes the cash registers ring.  Think of all those preachers with their mansions and airplanes.

[EmmieJ]

On 1/11/2017 at 4:07 PM, BadMammaJana said:

I would do this, but I wouldn't be able to counter whatever verses he would undoubtedly tweet in defense. I was raised Catholic, so knowing the bible isn't exactly my strong suit.

I know this comment is many pages back, but I had to laugh.  I'm so happy to be a former Catholic,  yet I get the benefits of growing up Catholic, including jokes such as this

[Jinder Roles]

4 hours ago, MargaretElliott said:

Personally I'm pro-choice, but if pro-life people like Jill really wanted to stop abortion, they should promote affordable and accessible birth control, comprehensive sex education, and ending sexual violence against women. Oh, you know, LIKE PLANNED PARENTHOOD DOES. 

I mean I think everyone can agree that if abortion ended because all pregnancies were intentional, safe, and wanted, that would be fantastic. But if it ended because asshats made it illegal and don't care about women's health, then that sucks.

That is because there is such a huge disconnect between reducing abortion rates and practical solutions like health care, safe sex supplies, contraceptives etc. 

I think it's because, among this group, people who get find themselves with unwanted pregnancies are sinful/deserving of their circumstances. It's viewed as a moral issue rather than a social one that can be fixed with improved policies. 

[feministxtian]

I had this argument (that went nowhere) with someone. My position:

If you're going to be "pro-life" then be PRO LIFE. That is, from conception to natural death, ALL individuals have the right to a home, food, education, health care, employment. ALL PEOPLE. Anything less is not pro-life. 

That said...if the powers that be wish to force women to give birth, then the powers that be should step in and support the child they wanted born. In the case of women carrying fetuses with lethal conditions, then the powers that be should be the ones responsible for the care of the child. 

I've never had an abortion...don't know if I ever could. but that's ME. I'm the only one who can make decisions for me. I haven't the knowledge or wisdom to make a choice for someone else. 

[Georgiana]

I always thought I would never have an abortion...until I chose to have my abortion.  

There's really nothing to liken the decision to. When abortion is a serious consideration, well it's obviously not a situation you planned on being in. It's not something you were or even could be prepared for. 

The closest I can say is it's like someone pulling a gun on you. Do you know what you would do?  Really? You might think so, but the truth is, you probably don't. Because when you're staring down the barrel of a gun, whether than gun is made of metal or a mass of tissue, it is SO different being there than you ever could imagine. 

What I'm saying is: as a woman who has been there, trust me when I say that when you need this choice, you want this choice. 

And just a caution: people lie all the time about "why" they had their abortion. Because it's not socially acceptable to discuss abortion honestly.  It might be easier for someone to say "I didn't want to switch my car" than "I was alone and scared" or "I didn't know how I would feed both of us if I had to take that level of unpaid leave" or "The father was dangerous, I just barely got out, and I can't give him a reason to come back into my life". 

[apandaaries]

I am not a believer in recreational abortions. I think it's an absurd concept that appeals to an idea of selfish, sexual women needing to be shamed for sex. There are lots of reasons people have abortions, and a flippant excuse they give to you may have nothing to do with the real reasons. Honestly, it strikes me as self-centered to imagine that they owe anyone but their doctor an explanation -- and then only to discuss all the facts of the case, not to be judged.
A good friend worked at PP and started to think that some women are just more fertile than others. Just as tubals don't always work, other often reliable forms of bc fail. Sometimes it's user error, and sometimes it's not. Sometimes it's an abusive situation where reproductive coercion is involved. There's also the issue of financial problems. We have terrible support networks in the U.S. Do you want to tell a mother of four that she must now try to support a fifth child on food stamps and minimum wage? Sometimes women evaluate that situation and decide they need to do what's best for the children they already have.
Then there are people who desperately want a child, but end up needing a D&C to complete a failed pregnancy (sometimes more than once, heartbreakingly enough). To me it's like trying to judge someone else's relationship: you can get a lot of information, but you'll never truly know what all is going on in their individual situation.
TLDR: don't like abortions, don't get one (and pray for a very healthy pregnancy, I guess). Try not to assume that you know everything about what is going on in someone else's situation, regardless of how close you may think you are.

[BlessaYourHeart]

4 hours ago, Snarkle Motion said:

If your concern is for the taxpayer's money then the abortion is likely saving the public money in the long term as opposed to the government providing another individual healthcare let alone the costs associated with unwanted child needing placement or raised by parents without appropriate resources. 

I think abortion as contraceptives is rare. But what about the people who's contraceptives failed, teenagers and children who may be assaulted before ever starting on contraceptives, people who have health conditions that maybe they didn't know about when they started the pregnancy (like needing life saving chemo), people with mental illness or drug addiction who maybe aren't the most reliable with contraceptives but recognize that it would be unhealthy to try to raise a child, people who don't have the means or maybe had a sudden change in circumstance such as a losing a job.

I don't think I could personally ever have an abortion or give up my child to adoption but I also recognize that I can't know that until I've walked in someone else's shoes.

£1million a week is spent on repeat abortions and about 34% of abortions in the U.K. Are women have their 2nd+ abortion. 

I already said in my first post that I was pro-abortion in certain circumstances some of which you listed above. And I in no way said that abortion is always or mostly used as contraception, I simply said I don't agree with it in that circumstance. 

[Toothfairy]

4 hours ago, anotherone said:

You know, I had a miscarriage.  If every pregnancy is a life, does that mean that God murdered my unborn child?  Should I be protesting against God?

I hate their outrage at miscarriages which is an abortion vs abortion. 

 

 

Miscarriage God's will

Abortion- Against God's will. 

 

Miscarriage- Try for another one

Abortion- That child could've cured cancer. 

33 minutes ago, amandaaries said:

I am not a believer in recreational abortions. I think it's an absurd concept that appeals to an idea of selfish, sexual women needing to be shamed for sex. There are lots of reasons people have abortions, and a flippant excuse they give to you may have nothing to do with the real reasons. Honestly, it strikes me as self-centered to imagine that they owe anyone but their doctor an explanation -- and then only to discuss all the facts of the case, not to be judged.
A good friend worked at PP and started to think that some women are just more fertile than others. Just as tubals don't always work, other often reliable forms of bc fail. Sometimes it's user error, and sometimes it's not. Sometimes it's an abusive situation where reproductive coercion is involved. There's also the issue of financial problems. We have terrible support networks in the U.S. Do you want to tell a mother of four that she must now try to support a fifth child on food stamps and minimum wage? Sometimes women evaluate that situation and decide they need to do what's best for the children they already have.
Then there are people who desperately want a child, but end up needing a D&C to complete a failed pregnancy (sometimes more than once, heartbreakingly enough). To me it's like trying to judge someone else's relationship: you can get a lot of information, but you'll never truly know what all is going on in their individual situation.
TLDR: don't like abortions, don't get one (and pray for a very healthy pregnancy, I guess). Try not to assume that you know everything about what is going on in someone else's situation, regardless of how close you may think you are.

Maybe if we were like Sweden a lot of women wouldn't abort or wouldn't get pregnant. Seriously my friendhas four kids. She's married. Unfortunately her husband lost his job. So now they're on one income. She got pregnant. She aborted because she needed to work. Jobs in America doesn't offer paid leave for women. 

[Shadoewolf]

One of my childhood friends does use abortion for contraception, I hit my breaking point with her while my ex and I were struggling with repeat miscarriages and she was about to have her 4th or 5th abortion in the same amount of years. One oops or maybe even 2 I get, after that the rest is excuses. With her, once was because the guy didn't like condoms, to which I promptly told her to do something about protection herself or keep her legs closed. Last I talked to her over the summer, she'd just had another one. (Its costly, but she always gets the guy to pay, better a one time clinic fee than 18 years of child support, the men tend to agree!) She has 3 kids with 3 different guys.

Do I begrudge her the choice? No. I considered having one 2 years ago. Thankfully Mother Earth took care of it for me. Do I think after so many maybe there should be a mandatory tubal or something? Yeah. If you prove over and over to be casual about sex knowing you can just terminate without a second thought...that I have a problem with. 

[Imagine20]

Until pro- lifers also become pro-social safety net to give single mothers and struggling families a hand up, they will stay pro-birth to me. The few pro-lifers that I know don't believe in welfare, so once the child is born they really don't care if it has food to eat or a comfortable place to sleep or is able to go to the doctor. It's infuriating. 

[Kak]

10 hours ago, BlessaYourHeart said:

 

10 hours ago, Kak said:

 That comes across as very judgemental. 

It is judgemental and I'll own the fact that it is. Everyone is judgemental about something. 

 

 

I don't know how to respond to this. Any POV on any subject can be justified if you believe this.

[nastyhobbitses]

On 1/23/2017 at 4:06 PM, December said:

And that's what too many people don't understand -- that women want the right to choose what to do with their bodies, their pregnancies (intentional and non-intentional). They don't want someone else to decide for them, either way. It's awesome you were able to weigh your options and decide what was right for you personally.

I think a lot of the confusion may stem from the fact that most -- though not all -- pro-lifers assert there should only be one acceptable and legal option, so they assume that the other side is equally hardline about making decisions for the pregnant woman.

From watching a few PureFlix and Kirk Cameron movies, I think that in general, fundamentalists tend to assume that the "other side" thinks exactly like they do. We want to make abortion completely illegal and have only one choice? They want all women to get abortions all the time! We want to teach only Christianity in school? They want to make students sign statements saying that God is dead and teach them S&M techniques in kindergarten!

[BlessaYourHeart]

1 hour ago, Kak said:

I don't know how to respond to this. Any POV on any subject can be justified if you believe this.

 

Everyone uses their experience and knowledge to judge things and form their own opinions and views on things. 

My judgements and opinions are different from yours and others but it doesn't mean my opinion makes me any less than anyone else 

[Lurky]

4 hours ago, BlessaYourHeart said:

£1million a week is spent on repeat abortions and about 34% of abortions in the U.K. Are women have their 2nd+ abortion. 

I already said in my first post that I was pro-abortion in certain circumstances some of which you listed above. And I in no way said that abortion is always or mostly used as contraception, I simply said I don't agree with it in that circumstance. 

I'm confused - I don't really what your point about repeat abortions is supposed to prove.  Are you suggesting that women can't get pregnant by accident, from abuse, in terrible circumstances twice?   Could you elaborate please?

And unless I'm misunderstanding, when you are saying you don't agree with women using abortion as contraception, you are implying that it's something that's regularly happening, and so needs disagreeing with.  Can you show us the evidence that this is something that's going on?

[usedtobenice]

I've had an abortion. I despise prolifers. When I went to the clinic, myself and the other women were forced to hide behind the front of the pickup of the security guard in order for other guards to make sure the clinic, doctors and nurses were safe.

That's fucked up.

I am not one of those who had a "heart wrenching" decision. The moment I found out I was pregnant, I felt like an animal caught in a trap. I would've done anything to get that parasite out of me!!!!!

No, I was not using birth control. I was uneducated. I assumed because my periods were irregular that I could not get pregnant.

I could list a litany of reasons why I had my abortion, and many of you probirthers would nod your heads. "Oh, she's the exception."

No, no I'm not. I didn't want to be a mother then, and I don't want to be a mother now.

My body is mine. No one has any authority over it except me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Snarkle Motion]

5 hours ago, BlessaYourHeart said:

£1million a week is spent on repeat abortions and about 34% of abortions in the U.K. Are women have their 2nd+ abortion. 

I already said in my first post that I was pro-abortion in certain circumstances some of which you listed above. And I in no way said that abortion is always or mostly used as contraception, I simply said I don't agree with it in that circumstance. 

So these people getting repeat abortions, do you think they would make good parents? What is going on with them that they need a repeat abortion? Because who is going to pay for services for those kids raised by parents who have some sort of issues going on? 

Here is a quote from the aclu: "Will it cost taxpayers money to fund abortion? No.  Because the costs associated with childbirth, neonatal and pediatric care greatly exceed the costs of abortion, public funding for abortion neither costs the taxpayer money nor drains resources from other services."

https://www.aclu.org/other/public-funding-abortion

[BlessaYourHeart]

2 hours ago, Lurky said:

I'm confused - I don't really what your point about repeat abortions is supposed to prove.  Are you suggesting that women can't get pregnant by accident, from abuse, in terrible circumstances twice?   Could you elaborate please?

And unless I'm misunderstanding, when you are saying you don't agree with women using abortion as contraception, you are implying that it's something that's regularly happening, and so needs disagreeing with.  Can you show us the evidence that this is something that's going on?

Lord Steel who brought in the abortion act in England has spoken of the growing problem may times. 

Some articles: 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2344225/Abortion-used-contraceptive-says-Lord-Steel-father-1967-act-legalised-practice.html

http://www.counselling-directory.org.uk/blog/2014/07/11/abortion-increasingly-used-as-contraception/

2 hours ago, Snarkle Motion said:

So these people getting repeat abortions, do you think they would make good parents? What is going on with them that they need a repeat abortion? Because who is going to pay for services for those kids raised by parents who have some sort of issues going on? 

Here is a quote from the aclu: "Will it cost taxpayers money to fund abortion? No.  Because the costs associated with childbirth, neonatal and pediatric care greatly exceed the costs of abortion, public funding for abortion neither costs the taxpayer money nor drains resources from other services."

https://www.aclu.org/other/public-funding-abortion

That link refers to the US. I'm referring to the UK where the NHS is funded through taxes and the NHS provides free abortions 

[HarleyQuinn]

I feel like "abortion used as a contraceptive" is kind of a myth, or it happens in very small cases. Having an abortion is not an easy thing, I can't believe many would want them multiple times unless they really needed it. Are these people including plan B in their studies?

FWIW, I do know someone that had two abortions. Once when she was in high school because she was uneducated about sex and got pregnant at 13. No one wants a 13 year old for a mom, her parents were justified and getting her one there. I didn't know her then, but I know her as an adult getting a 2nd one. In this case, she was in an abusive relationship where her partner was threatening her, hitting her, and continuously said if they had children he was bringing said child back to his home country and forcing her and the child into his religion. Justified #2 and that one broke her because she wants children but couldn't put her child in a dangerous position like that.