Counting On Season 2 - Part 5

[nst]

Just now, 2manyKidzzz said:

I don't recall hearing of anything else Derick was doing except his twice weekly sermons. Anyone else know more?

The more it is looked at, the crazier it is. They are converting people I guess already have a religious affiliation. Who are spiritually dead because they are not fundies. 

It boggles my mind. If they have a child with microcephaly, it will be beyond reason as they do not have to be there at this time in their marriage, i.e., the reproductive years. Unbelievable. 

who are they to judge if the people they are trying to convert don't agree with them and they call them names. 

doesn't help the cause

makes them look worse than they are imo 

[defraudedbychipendales]

8 hours ago, IReallyAmHopewell said:

 

1. JoyAnna texting--probably with a brother or a Bates or other approved gal-pal. Not a guy. Unless she's next season's sacrificial virgin thrown into the vulcano of the babymaking Gods.

 

That is beautiful wordsmith-ing. 

[DaysAgo]

It seems to me that Jill is headed for an emotional collapse. Something is not right with her, and I agree with some others that perhaps she was was traumatized in some ways while in El Salvador.

I hope she is getting the helps she needs. 

[charmedforsure]

2 hours ago, wandering woman said:

I've never understood why everyone thinks Jessa is so pretty either.  She is an average looking woman with barely average intelligence and a smug, annoying personality.  Joy and Jana are lovely.  Jinger's overuse of eyeliner and spray tan as well as her frozen smile do not make her attractive at all.   Jill is average looking too, and Derrick is looking awful with his man bun.

 

I actually like Derick's man bun. Makes him less haggard looking, and more like "I'm just coming back from my fifth yoga retreat this year which coincided with my ongoing hunger strike in protest of the DAP." Gives him a hipster vibe instead of just the severely malnourished look.

[2manyKidzzz]

But didn't Jill start crying....maybe someone mentioned danger, or am I wrong?

This is beyond my understanding. Truly.

[sansan]

2 hours ago, amandaaries said:

That line in there is actually pretty offensive.  There is an "advanced culture" in El Salvador.  

That's not to say that there isn't a lot of violence going on, and the US is actually pretty connected to that.  We deported a number of Salvadorean gang members there, and MS-13 and Barrio 18 were able to expand in the vacuum left from our earlier interference there.  If they were really out to help people with their religion, dealing with problems which are associated with their own country isn't a bad way to set about trying to make the world a better place.  This isn't too long and covers the basics of the gangs born in the US but sent abroad a couple decades ago. TW: Please note there are some violent images in here: http://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2015/10/05/445382231/how-el-salvador-fell-into-a-web-of-gang-violence

I also wonder if we should slow down on the "Jill was attacked" narrative; the ISB is going pretty fast here.  There's enough violence that she also could have seen some things that shocked her and made her want to stay inside.  And FWIW, there's also a lot of violence in some areas of the US, so she could have also gotten out of her bubble here and seen more things, had she chosen to do so.  She does seem to have gained a bit of awareness about how other people live, but it seems that awareness is now channeled into loving the luxuries she's used to, like air conditioning and hot, regularly running water -- not a burning desire to continue to serve others on the mission field.  

 

Please don't be offended at what I said. They were not in a metropolis, it was the backwoods of wherever they were. I meant more like in a larger town (culture) and safer (not in the wood like place). I have family in a teeny backwoods area of Texas and believe me they would not recognize culture if it came up and pinched them. I did not say she was attacked, just that something must have happened to her. That could have been losing power and water for an extending time to a big snake got in the house, who knows, she just seemed different by the end of the stay in Central America. 

 

[apandaaries]

Please don't be offended at what I said. They were not in a metropolis, it was the backwoods of wherever they were. I meant more like in a larger town (culture) and safer (not in the wood like place). I have family in a teeny backwoods area of Texas and believe me they would not recognize culture if it came up and pinched them. I did not say she was attacked, just that something must have happened to her. That could have been losing power and water for an extending time to a big snake got in the house, who knows, she just seemed different by the end of the stay in Central America. 

 

Gotcha, although I'm not sure precisely where they were located. The comment about the ISB was aimed more generally -- apologies if it didn't come across that way. She does seem different, but that could come from a number of things, as you mentioned above. I had a friend who married a woman from Botswana; he lived in south central LA. Within a year, she'd seen several fights and one car drive by slowly, then throw out a dead body. She was longing for home, too.

There are always stages of homesickness and culture shock, but compounding it with witnessing violence (or whatever, since we don't know anything for sure), would definitely make for a more psychologically challenging time.

[Cassia]

I started to get the feeling that 'something' happened to the Dillards as well but that 'something' could be anything at all. It could have been an innocuous comment from a neighbour ("You'd best keep that blonde baby inside" or something), or an aggressive stranger while they were out as a family. They could have been mugged or threatened in some way. They could have witnessed a shooting or some other crime. Or it could also be nothing but her own amplification of the perceived dangers.

Unless they straight up tell us, we'll never know if Jill had a concrete reason for isolating herself and Izzy while 'missioning'.

[2manyKidzzz]

Jill has also never been so isolated. Think of where she grew up. Fears can be amplified if you are alone a lot when you are not used to it. She is used to always having many people around to talk to. The year she was pregnant, she could go over to the TTh whenever she wanted. So, if even someone was assaulted or there was some other crime nearby, well, it would be hard for her to handle in that new environment.

And, like I said, they are wasting their time anyway. Maybe Jill is not so sure about crusading for Jeebus after she actually did it in Scary Cintrul Merica. 

[holynotfundie]

Is it just me or did Josie seem unusually quiet and calm in this episode? Usually she's just a ball of spunk and energy, but when she was interviewed she just seemed....tired. Like she's just fed up with everything. It just seemed weird to me. 

[alba]

3 hours ago, 2manyKidzzz said:

Jill has also never been so isolated. Think of where she grew up. Fears can be amplified if you are alone a lot when you are not used to it. She is used to always having many people around to talk to. The year she was pregnant, she could go over to the TTh whenever she wanted. So, if even someone was assaulted or there was some other crime nearby, well, it would be hard for her to handle in that new environment.

And, like I said, they are wasting their time anyway. Maybe Jill is not so sure about crusading for Jeebus after she actually did it in Scary Cintrul Merica. 

I suspect this is a huge part of the change in her demeanour. It might not have had anything to do with where she was and everything to do with the fact that she was so far from her family; if the Dullards had moved to New York or Minnesota we might have seen a similar change.

Jill strikes me as an extrovert, but unlike most extroverts, who learn to make friends in preschool, Jill's never had much chance to actually build friendships with strangers, as everyone needs to be vetted by her parents and the children's friendships are mostly with the children of their parents' friends. What this means is that she moved away from everyone she knew, and she was desperate for some social interaction, but she had no clue how to actually build friendships, especially when she's not around other fundies. This would likely be exacerbated by living in a foreign country, where she has no cultural common ground with others, because all her life friendships have been based on a cultural common ground.

[bucket]

On 10/18/2016 at 8:56 PM, marmalade said:

True that Mechelle is totally disconnected from her children, but she's also had 18 pregnancies that have progressed beyond 14 weeks. She knows what a pregnant person looks like. Hell, the entire internet knew from the NYC pics and that was 3 weeks before this manufactured party with a cute momento pic to use in People. 

I think if she really didn't know (which wouldnt surprise me) this just further proves her own myopic narcissism and complete lack of relationship with or even simply interest in her children.

8 hours ago, DaysAgo said:

It seems to me that Jill is headed for an emotional collapse. Something is not right with her, and I agree with some others that perhaps she was was traumatized in some ways while in El Salvador.

I hope she is getting the helps she needs. 

I think that she experienced a major change from her EXTREMELY sheltered upbringing and that she is exhausted and overwhelmed by the experience.

 

Other thoughts:

1. Holy shit Bin is a total fucking idiot.  Also, Jessa seems to openly dislike Bin a lot of the time (however I will admit this could be pregnancy hormones.)

2. Jill and Derrick's relationship seems quite genuine lately. They seem to really love and care for each other and enjoy spending time together.

3. Jill seems to really enjoy parenting Izzy.  Jessa doesn't really appear to like parenting at all and treats her own kid no differently than she did her sibling kids.  

4. I think a main reason the Dillard's are back is because of Zika fear and pregnancy (and the wedding of course.)

5. I wonder if they'll ever be able to marry off another boy after Joshley's bullshit?

 

 

 

[JillyO]

Holy fuck. I'm not above an occasional superficial comment, but can we not rate the Duggar women's attractiveness on a sliding scale, maybe? We're better than that. We should be better than that.

[bucket]

1 minute ago, JillyO said:

Holy fuck. I'm not above an occasional superficial comment, but can we not rate the Duggar women's attractiveness on a sliding scale, maybe? We're better than that. We should be better than that.

I totally agree, that made me SUPER uncomfortable and I'd also like for it to stop.

[Lurky]

11 hours ago, amandaaries said:

I also wonder if we should slow down on the "Jill was attacked" narrative; the ISB is going pretty fast here.

I agree so much with this.  And regardless of the danger of the area, they were living in a compound with guards, so the idea of someone coming into their house and attacking her is low - plus do we REALLY believe that Jill would have been threatened, without them shilling the story to People ("I was in fear of my life!") and using it as testimony to appease the criticisms of their mission??

[charmedforsure]

24 minutes ago, bucket said:

I think if she really didn't know (which wouldnt surprise me) this just further proves her own myopic narcissism and complete lack of relationship with or even simply interest in her children.

I think that she experienced a major change from her EXTREMELY sheltered upbringing and that she is exhausted and overwhelmed by the experience.

 

Other thoughts:

1. Holy shit Bin is a total fucking idiot.  Also, Jessa seems to openly dislike Bin a lot of the time (however I will admit this could be pregnancy hormones.)

2. Jill and Derrick's relationship seems quite genuine lately. They seem to really love and care for each other and enjoy spending time together.

3. Jill seems to really enjoy parenting Izzy.  Jessa doesn't really appear to like parenting at all and treats her own kid no differently than she did her sibling kids.  

4. I think a main reason the Dillard's are back is because of Zika fear and pregnancy (and the wedding of course.)

5. I wonder if they'll ever be able to marry off another boy after Joshley's bullshit?

 

 

 

In regards to #5, I'm thinking the next Duggar boy we see married off will be Jed. He turns 18 on December 30 and since he didn't attend ALERT basic training with his twin to get the spirit beaten out of him, I think he's prime courting material that hasn't been overexposed to the media. 

I think if Joe would have stayed at Crown College, he would have found a wife that wasn't Tori or Carlin Bates.  Of course poor beaten spirit Josiah managed to get caught in a snag with his courtship with a fame-hungry Marjorie... and his role model of an eldest brother ruined his chances with her. JD? I think he needs to delve into the world of eHarmony or Christian Mingle to broaden his potential bridepool. He has some pretty marketable skills. I mean, he even has his own house already... I think JD has a real shot finding a good Godly woman, but he needs to make the initial effort to find and get to know a possible future partner, and not wait for his momma or his sisters to suggest someone. That can/will take some time. 

I suppose if Josh's molestation scandal had gone public before Ben proposed to Jessa, he would have dropped her like a rock just like Marjorie did with Josiah. Ben and Jessa have no compatibility personality-wise, except for being money-grubbin' lazy bones. It's pretty obvious when Ben can't come up with a reason he wanted to be with Jessa (see 19KAC ep Wedding Bells when Boob grills Ben on the bus ride to TN) other than the party line of a Godly woman, who is also pretty. 

 

*don't mind me... I'm typing this as my ambien kicks in. Makes for loopy truthy observations. 

[mdatca]

12 hours ago, wandering woman said:

They are living in El Salvador, and that is a very dangerous country.  I remember Anna blurting out the name of the country on Season 1 of Counting On.  Jill seems traumatized, and I wonder if she was attacked.  

If something happened I think it is why they did first return visit to home.   IIRC that return was unplanned and caused some problems regarding donations and people thinking they were scammed.  

 

[Lurky]

59 minutes ago, charmedforsure said:

Of course poor beaten spirit Josiah managed to get caught in a snag with his courtship with a fame-hungry Marjorie... and his role model of an eldest brother ruined his chances with her.

I disagree with this reading of Marjorie and Josiah.  The fact she's gone on to get a part time job, write a book, and start college makes me think that she realised none of that would be available to her as a teenaged wife and mother, and while the fame may have attracted her, she wanted more than to just pump out babies and keep sweet.  And who can blame her? 

(Plus, she's still very much a friend of the family - if Josh was the reason she broke the courtship, I don't think she'd still be hanging out at their house, where Josh is)

I will never ever be sorry that Josiah's courtship ended, because I want a lot more than him that being a dad at 20, relying on daddy to be able to support his own quiver - and I hope with all my heart that none of the Duggar men get married before they have independent means to support themselves a family.  I want a lot more for them all of course (freedom, being able to explore any education/career they want etc etc ), but that's my minimum.

[Jana814]

54 minutes ago, Lurky said:

I disagree with this reading of Marjorie and Josiah.  The fact she's gone on to get a part time job, write a book, and start college makes me think that she realised none of that would be available to her as a teenaged wife and mother, and while the fame may have attracted her, she wanted more than to just pump out babies and keep sweet.  And who can blame her? 

(Plus, she's still very much a friend of the family - if Josh was the reason she broke the courtship, I don't think she'd still be hanging out at their house, where Josh is)

I will never ever be sorry that Josiah's courtship ended, because I want a lot more than him that being a dad at 20, relying on daddy to be able to support his own quiver - and I hope with all my heart that none of the Duggar men get married before they have independent means to support themselves a family.  I want a lot more for them all of course (freedom, being able to explore any education/career they want etc etc ), but that's my minimum.

That's so great about Marijore getting a job and going to college. She probably really liked Josiah but maybe she realize what she was expected to become she realize it was not for her. 

[Purrl]

Haven't caught up yet, but I did watch some of the show. My thoughts & questions:

Did I hear Joy say Izzy speaks "Spanglish"? How would she know about that?

If I were Jinger I'd be really concerned about a man who can be that sneaky & keep secrets from her that well... Also, it's no wonder Jeremy might not think it's a big deal to have lots of kids close in age. His friend had 2 with another due soon and the oldest only looked about 4.

If Joy is courting I hope it's with Nathan Bates. They both want to be missionaries who fly planes. (I forget how they both put it, but it was the same wording.)

 

 

[nst]

4 hours ago, bucket said:

I think if she really didn't know (which wouldnt surprise me) this just further proves her own myopic narcissism and complete lack of relationship with or even simply interest in her children.

Other thoughts:

1. Holy shit Bin is a total fucking idiot.  Also, Jessa seems to openly dislike Bin a lot of the time (however I will admit this could be pregnancy hormones.)

 

3. Jill seems to really enjoy parenting Izzy.  Jessa doesn't really appear to like parenting at all and treats her own kid no differently than she did her sibling kids.  

 

considering that in those 100 days Jess was always at TTH so again it doesn't make sense.  

# 3 - I saw that for the first time.  And the way she handles him constantly like he is a sack of potatoes. I get the impression she is over it.   

[VooDooChild]

8 minutes ago, nst said:

considering that in those 100 days Jess was always at TTH so again it doesn't make sense.  

# 3 - I saw that for the first time.  And the way she handles him constantly like he is a sack of potatoes. I get the impression she is over it.   

I thought she handled him roughly too when she was dressing him.  My husband (FSM help him.  he now watches to snark) remarked about her asking Bin to hold Spurge while she finished dressing him.  He thought it made her look inept because in our experience with dressing our super squirmy babies neither of us had to elicit the other's help.   Maybe hubs and I are just BEC or maybe it's her lazy princess syndrome.  And after watching all the effort she didn't put into "babysitting" Izzy, I'm going with the latter.

[Jana814]

1 minute ago, VooDooChild said:

I thought she handled him roughly too when she was dressing him.  My husband (FSM help him.  he now watches to snark) remarked about her asking Bin to hold Spurge while she finished dressing him.  He thought it made her look inept because in our experience with dressing our super squirmy babies neither of us had to elicit the other's help.   Maybe hubs and I are just BEC or maybe it's her lazy princess syndrome.  And after watching all the effort she didn't put into "babysitting" Izzy, I'm going with the latter.

They probably brought the younger kids along so they didn't have to chase after the kids. 

[nst]

2 minutes ago, VooDooChild said:

I thought she handled him roughly too when she was dressing him.  My husband (FSM help him.  he now watches to snark) remarked about her asking Bin to hold Spurge while she finished dressing him.  He thought it made her look inept because in our experience with dressing our super squirmy babies neither of us had to elicit the other's help.   Maybe hubs and I are just BEC or maybe it's her lazy princess syndrome.  And after watching all the effort she didn't put into "babysitting" Izzy, I'm going with the latter.

Now I am BEC - it's her lazy princess syndrome combined with pregnancy and smug hormones. She truly has slid down a rabbit hole....

All she did was sit down when she was babysitting 

[HarleyQuinn]

If Jill saw any shooting or was threatened in any way, they'd talk about it on their blog to up the we're in DANGEROUS Central America story. They wouldn't keep quiet. Jill likely just can't cope with being by herself. We already knew that with how she turned into a stage 5 clinger when Derick was on his lunch breaks at Walmart.